Right of entitlement?

[zoiDman]

From what I consider a Reputable Source of Information....

Food Flavorings

Artificial food flavorings are often called “the great unknown” when it comes to electronic cigarettes. While all flavorings
are FDA‐approved for human consumption, very little is known about the short or long‐term health effects of the
inhalation of the ingredients in artificial flavors.

Perhaps Inhalation of Sweeteners and Colorants could be added to the Above Paragraph?

 

[Berylanna]

Does cooking food produce nicotine in the air? I'm not trying to be respectful, but I'm not clear what you are saying.

Yes, if the food contains potatoes, tomatoes, or eggplant.

Making coffee puts an equivalent poison (caffeine) into the air. Cooking puts much MORE smoke into the air. Most of the rest of what is in vapor that is iffy for breathing is the food flavorings.

There are almost NO deaths EVER from nicotine, it is not carcinogenic, it is a stimulant. So is caffeine. But nicotine overdoses, though very very rare except in people who work unprotected making cigars with their bare hands, almost always cause enough vomiting to prevent death. Recovery from stimulants tends to be all-or-nothing, there is no antidote but if you recover, you're recovered.

Death from cigarettes is from smoke inhalation. Even the heart damage turns out to be more from the carbon monoxide than from nicotine.

 

[JudeD]

My daddy always told me, "Don't walk into a room swinging a baseball bat unless you're looking for a fight."

The OP could have started her thread with, "I worry that ..." or "Aren't you guys afraid that..." and she probably would have gotten a reasoned, calm discussion weighing the merits of being discreet about vaping to keep the ANTZ from getting riled up versus vaping loud and proud to make vaping more recognized and accepted. There are good points to be made on both sides of the subject.

If she was genuinely concerned about the very few people who have extreme reactions to scents of any kind, she could have simply reminded us that these people exist and asked that we be considerate of them when out in public.

But since the OP came in swinging the verbal baseball bat by accusing vapers of feeling entitled and telling us we aren't welcome except out with the smelly smokers, she got the fight she was either hoping for or at least, should have expected.

There are thousands and thousands of vapers. If out of all the success stories of people quitting smoking after 10, 20, 30, 40 years and how much their health has improved, how proud their family is of them, how much happier they are, three examples of bad behavior (gas station, kid with battery, cigar extraction) are all that have been cited in this thread, I don't think I'll lie awake worrying tonight.

 

[wv2win]

So you are basically saying that I am not using experience, education, or intelligence. Your passion is admirable, but isn't your goal to gain membership in your cause? I hope that you are not a recruiter for their organization.

Believe it or not, I too read up on subjects in an unbiased manner and make my own decisions. Every organization has an agenda and will state facts that directly support their opinion. To believe otherwise is foolish. If you are telling me that you are 100% confident of blowing vapor directly into your child's mouth based on the studies of two doctors, then more power to you.

Having said that, I posted earlier about recent articles by Business Insider, Citi, and others that show continued growth within the industry. Citi has a pretty good track record on trends. If there is money to be made, then rest assured that vaping will continue (I am speaking for the US here, not other countries). Big tobacco is already involved (Lorillard owns Blu) and others will follow this trend. Big tobacco has a strong hold on the government.

You really seem to miss the big picture. I obviously don't know who you are or what expertise you have on this subject. But from what you have posted, you have no more expertise than any other average vaper. Unlike you, I have found from my own experience that not everyone has an "agenda", at least not one that is not good for people in general. The experts that I have sited, as well as several others, are not "biased" but instead actually tell the truth and back it up with unbiased studies and facts. Waiting for your "utopia" study just means we will all be long gone before that ever happens.

Secondly, reading the financial section of the newspaper really doesn't tell more than about 1% of the story. So just because the vaping business is growing does not mean there will not be restrictions along the lines I already detailed. In fact, it is more likely there will be those type of restrictions if BT gets their way as that would create a big financial gain for them.

Third, as you well know, I never suggested blowing big plumbs of vapor into any child's face. But if I did, I would be safe in knowing that I would not cause them any harm because the facts show there is nothing harmful in vapor. You implying otherwise is just disingenous at best.

 

[aubergine]

So glad you're here, Berylanna...

 

[aussiedog61]

Aussiedog, I really do understand your mistrust and anxiety. When I began vaping a lot was going on with legislative issues and I really wasn't up to speed at all on a lot of things that concerned me: from big things like a potential all-out ban, health concerns and controversies and ongoing studies concerning those to all of the confusing (but much more fun) info about gear.
What I did was stay up at night reading hundreds of pages of back-story on the big things (there were some HUGE threads, and regular reporting on all aspects of what was going on) - that's just my nature, I read. That didn't position me to know what was going to happen - no one did, and no one does now - but it did give me a sense of what was valid and what wasn't and of the terrain on which the battle was and is being waged.
I CAN tell you that if it weren't for CASAA and others who have been holding ground for a long time out there, neither you nor I would likely be having this conversation. You have to figure out for yourself what's just scare tactics and what's not, and one of the functions of this forum is to provide you with with the ability to make an educated decision on that.

My thoughts after reading this thread:
Someone said earlier that if we in-fight we give ammunition to people and institutions who are interested in making it more difficult or impossible to use this remarkable product as an alternative to harmful cigarettes. I believe that's correct.

There are Republicans and Democrats, tea-party people and libertarians and liberals and progressives and centrists who tilt one way or another, and probably anarchists, and with these numbers, probably a ........ or two in here. And apolitical people, too.
People who naturally divide and quarrel, each certain that the other wants to take away whatever they hold dear. That's the political context.
But we all do hold vaping dear, and although we might have differences regarding if and how it should be regulated, and to what particular larger political issues the problem connects, we'd all like to protect some portion of our right to continue. Best if we do that without attacking and alienating one another.

Thank you for that post. Please don't get me wrong, I love vaping and will not let anyone take away my right to do so and I will continue to promote it's benefits to anyone that is willing to listen. I applaud CASAA's efforts and I actually do keep abreast to what is happening in my state in regards to regulation. I also spend a lot of time reading on this forum and on other sites in regards to e-cigs legislation, health risks, etc.

Your thoughts on reading this thread are the same as mine.

 

[zoiDman]

...

Third, as you well know, I never suggested blowing big plumbs of vapor into any child's face. But if I did, I would be safe in knowing that I would not cause them any harm because the facts show there is nothing harmful in vapor. You implying otherwise is just disingenous at best.

Read post #202

 

[SharonMM]

You know.. I'm getting REAL tired of hearing the argument that "ecigs aren't
proven 100% safe" so therefore we need should be feeling some sort of civic responsibility to fund for this proof, or something..

BULL. Cuz big pharma gets away with not proving their products are safe ALL THE TIME. My father is currently battling stage 4 bladder cancer, which the likely cause of it is from the prescription drug Actos, considering he is a non smoker and fairly young at 59. This was prescribed to him by a doctor. So why is this ok, that people can be prescribed unsafe, potentially life threatening medication, but ecigs while the preliminary experimenting has demonstrated it is safe, it will be YEARS before it is safe enough to be safetly deemed safe, by whomever it is that is so cautious to put their stamp of approval on it...

God it just makes me so MAD. The hypocrisy, corruption, politics...

Screw it all, I'm going to do my vape until they throw me in jail and that's the end of it.

 

[The Ocelot]

...

I like weird. Why did you change it?

 

[aussiedog61]

Yes, if the food contains potatoes, tomatoes, or eggplant.

Making coffee puts an equivalent poison (caffeine) into the air. Cooking puts much MORE smoke into the air. Most of the rest of what is in vapor that is iffy for breathing is the food flavorings.

There are almost NO deaths EVER from nicotine, it is not carcinogenic, it is a stimulant. So is caffeine. But nicotine overdoses, though very very rare except in people who work unprotected making cigars with their bare hands, almost always cause enough vomiting to prevent death. Recovery from stimulants tends to be all-or-nothing, there is no antidote but if you recover, you're recovered.

Death from cigarettes is from smoke inhalation. Even the heart damage turns out to be more from the carbon monoxide than from nicotine.

 

[zoiDman]

I like weird. Why did you change it?

Dang... Doesn't that Cat Ever Get Tired?

 

[NancyR]

My daddy always told me, "Don't walk into a room swinging a baseball bat unless you're looking for a fight."

The OP could have started her thread with, "I worry that ..." or "Aren't you guys afraid that..." and she probably would have gotten a reasoned, calm discussion weighing the merits of being discreet about vaping to keep the ANTZ from getting riled up versus vaping loud and proud to make vaping more recognized and accepted. There are good points to be made on both sides of the subject.

If she was genuinely concerned about the very few people who have extreme reactions to scents of any kind, she could have simply reminded us that these people exist and asked that we be considerate of them when out in public.

But since the OP came in swinging the verbal baseball bat by accusing vapers of feeling entitled and telling us we aren't welcome except out with the smelly smokers, she got the fight she was either hoping for or at least, should have expected.

There are thousands and thousands of vapers. If out of all the success stories of people quitting smoking after 10, 20, 30, 40 years and how much their health has improved, how proud their family is of them, how much happier they are, three examples of bad behavior (gas station, kid with battery, cigar extraction) are all that have been cited in this thread, I don't think I'll lie awake worrying tonight.

And out of all the studies done, which one always gets quoted for antz even tho proven wrong, it is those few bad examples people will remember.

 

[The Ocelot]

Dang... Doesn't that Cat Ever Get Tired?

And now for something completely different...

 

[aubergine]

I like weird. Why did you change it?

It's a fast thread. Berylana arrived and somewhat de-weirded it.

What did I say? That this thread has migrated from contentious to chaotic to weird.

Have I earned my like back?

I'm always glad when you show up, too, Ocelot.

 

[Unforeseen]

Think that this thread has run it's course. Seen the continuance of posts that are not proving helpful and therefore, have decided to close this thread.