Searching Mech Mod (Parallel or Series)

[Baditude]

Mooch has his own safety regulations. The only really dangerous thing is the temperature. So whats his max temperature?

Your wrong. Mooch goes by the manufacturer's continuous discharge rating. The exception is when the manufacturer (usually an aftermarket manufacturer) exaggerates their ridiculous discharge rating, and then he estimates what the real CDR should be.

 

[Ammonarrow]

You go by the true continuous discharge rating. Not the pulse rating, which is useless. I've presented that you can generally trust the amp ratings by Lg, Samsung, and Sony batteries.

On the other hand, the aftermarket batteries almost always exaggerate their amp rating, so someone like Battery Mooch is invaluable as a source of finding any battery's true continuous discharge rating from meticulous bench testing. List of Battery Tests

• AWT Red/Black 50A 2600mAn 18650 Bench Retest Results...preposterously overrated, now lower grade
• AWT Red 35A 3000mAh 18650...ridiculously overrated, not IMR
• AWT Red 40A 3000mAh 18650...enough is enough, just don’t buy it.Brillipower Green 40A 2600mAh 18650...an absurdly overrated, low grade, non-IMR battery
• Brillipower Pink 45A 2600mAh 18650...ludicrously overrated, lower grade, not IMR
• Brillipower Green 3100mAh 40A 18650...preposterously overrated, not IMRBrillipower Blue 3100mAh 50A 18650...grotesquely overrated by 250%, not IMR
• Imren 40A 3000mAh 18650 Bench Retest Results...only a 17A battery, damaged at 30A
• Imren Gold 30A 3000mAh 18650 Bench Test Results...a ridiculously overrated battery
• Imren Green 40A 3200mAh 18650 Bench Retest Results...now 10A, shame on you Imren!
• MXJO Yellow 30A 2900mAh 18650 Bench Test Results...a preposterously overrated 10A/2700mAh battery
• MXJO Yellow/Silver 35A 3000mAh 18650 Bench Retest Results...a dangerously overrated 20A battery!

You know, all of this information was in the blog links that I have already posted in this thread, and you either didn't read it or chose to ignore it. I'm glad that you have stuck around and still asking questions. There may be hope for you yet.

I know that manufacturers rate their batteries sometimes unsafe, I know that.
That is why I use Sony VTC5A ONLY (ofc original).
How about the pulse rating of Samsung 25R at 100 Amps?

 

[papergoblin]

M

Mooch has his own safety regulations. The only really dangerous thing is the temperature. So whats his max temperature?

You are wrong here, temperature is not the only dangerous thing. Temperature is a sign of how hard the battery may be working.

 

[Ammonarrow]

On a dual 18650 mod in parallel the battery voltage begins at 4.2 volts (at full charge). On a dual 18650 mod in series the volts are double 4.2x2= 8.4 volts.

Batteries will hang in the 3.7v range but always begin at 4.2v and you will get so many puffs at that level first. So you measure at the highest volt rating for safety reasons. So for safety in a series mod, one must count double voltage on a parallel do NOT double amp rating, only capacity (mah) which is run time.

Parallel: 2- 20A CDR 2500mah batteries should be looked at as 30A CDR MAX with 5000mah with start voltage of 4.2

Series: 2- 20A CDR 2500mah batteries should be looked at as 20A CDR MAX with 2500mah with start voltage of 8.4

I recommend going to youtube and watching Mooch episode 1 and 2, it will explain everything very simply, much easier than reading/writing it. He is the battery guru we all listen to for safety and such.

You will not get 4.2 above like .5 Amps of load. A 2 Amp load will give you 150mah at 4 Volts and then it drops down to 3.9 and so on

 

[Ammonarrow]

Your wrong. Mooch goes by the manufacturer's continuous discharge rating. The exception is when the manufacturer (usually an aftermarket manufacturer) exaggerates their ridiculoua discharge rating, and then he estimates what the real CDR should be.

BUT he wont put 60 Amps continuously on a battery does he? I guess he starts slowly, and if it gets too hot, he will break the test and put down resistance

 

[Ammonarrow]

Again, what do you (everyone asked) recommend as a safe, fast hitting build?

 

[Ralph_K]

In series you're doubling the voltage so ohms have to be twice as high as a single battery. For .5 ohm coil 7.2/.5 = 14.4A where 3.6/.5=7.2A I wouldn't go under .5 ohms in series because I don't want to over stress my batteries

 

[Baditude]

How about the pulse rating of Samsung 25R at 100 Amps?

I'm starting to get tired of repeating myself...

Battery pulse ratings are useless! | E-Cigarette Forum
There are no 18650 batteries with a genuine rating over 30A!

The Samsung 25R has a 20 amp CDR. Don't even consider whatever pulse rating you may find, its useless.

 

[Ammonarrow]

I'm starting to get tired of repeating myself...

Battery pulse ratings are useless! | E-Cigarette Forum
There are no 18650 batteries with a genuine rating over 30A!

Those are made by the manufacturer themself (Samsung)...

 

[papergoblin]

You will not get 4.2 above like .5 Amps of load. A 2 Amp load will give you 150mah at 4 Volts and then it drops down to 3.9 and so on

You aren't listening. The battery (18650) fully charged is 4.2 volts, PERIOD (unless you have bad batteries or charger). Your build resistance has nothing to do with voltage, it determines what the load will be on the battery (AMPS).

.25 coil at 4.2v is 16.80 amps
.40 coil at 4.2v is 10.50 amps

.25 coil at 8.4v is 33.60 amps
.40 coil at 8.4v is 21 amps

I suggest you read up on how a vaping calculator works as well as ohms law, you clearly do not understand how the equations are done.

 

[papergoblin]

Those are made by the manufacturer themself (Samsung)...

Yeah watch the first video like we told you, that is explained. It is for electronic pack building, it's saying the batteries can take a surge/pulse of whatever amps BUT....They won't like it and will never be the same afterwards aka----DAMAGED!

 

[Ammonarrow]

You aren't listening. The battery (18650) fully charged is 4.2 volts, PERIOD (unless you have bad batteries or charger). Your build resistance has nothing to do with voltage, it determines what the load will be on the battery (AMPS).

.25 coil at 4.2v is 16.80 amps
.40 coil at 4.2v is 10.50 amps

.25 coil at 8.4v is 33.60 amps
.40 coil at 8.4v is 21 amps

I suggest you read up on how a vaping calculator works as well as ohms law, you clearly do not understand how the equations are done.

Of course resistance has to do with voltage. If you have a Coil Master Tab, then put in a fully charged battery and a 1 Ohm Build. And start firing it and look at the voltage its showing (I know not accurate but enough for the purpose so no real meter needed). Then put in a .3 Build and look at voltage again (charge battery between tests).

Oh and I know the Ohms Law. Plus I have a calc on my phone.

 

[Ammonarrow]

Yeah watch the first video like we told you, that is explained. It is for electronic pack building, it's saying the batteries can take a surge/pulse of whatever amps BUT....They won't like it and will never be the same afterwards aka----DAMAGED!

I know that 100amps is ridiculous, just wanted to point this out, cause it is rated by Samsung themselfes.

 

[Baditude]

Those are made by the manufacturer themself (Samsung)...
I know that 100amps is ridiculous, just wanted to point this out, cause it is rated by Samsung themselfes.

If Samsung lists a pulse rating, then they are assuming their batteries are going to be used in a battery pack with a battery management system. You don't have that in your mech, so the pulse rating is useless as far as you are concerned.

Samsung, Lg, Sony et al are not making batteries for end users like us, they design their batteries to be used in battery packs with battery management systems.

Again, use only the CDR of the battery. The CDR is the standard spec used throughout the legitimate battery industry.

 

[Ammonarrow]

If Samsung lists a pulse rating, then they are assuming their batteries are being used in a battery pack with a battery management system. You don't have that in your mech, so the pulse rating is useless as far as you are concerned.

Okay. Wasnt informed about that. Thanks. Lets end this fckin argument. I will be more concerned about my batteries.

 

[papergoblin]

Of course resistance has to do with voltage. If you have a Coil Master Tab, then put in a fully charged battery and a 1 Ohm Build. And start firing it and look at the voltage its showing (I know not accurate but enough for the purpose so no real meter needed). Then put in a .3 Build and look at voltage again (charge battery between tests).

Oh and I know the Ohms Law. Plus I have a calc on my phone.

The voltage is what your coil tab has, not your mod. A mechanical mod works with what power the battery has, no electronics (your meter has electronics) and may limit to 3.7 volts. Changing a coil resistance does not change how much power (voltage) a battery has stored in it or can out put.

So no you don't understand ohms law and/or how mechs work vs regulated devices (coil tab is regulated).

I know that 100amps is ridiculous, just wanted to point this out, cause it is rated by Samsung themselfes.

That rating is not for end users like us nor for our application of the batteries. That rating is for equipment in event of a power loss or surge, just meaning the battery can take a hit 1 time and 1 time only, then should be destroyed.

 

[Ammonarrow]

The voltage is what your coil tab has, not your mod. A mechanical mod works with what power the battery has, no electronics (your meter has electronics) and may limit to 3.7 volts. Changing a coil resistance does not change how much power (voltage) a battery has stored in it or can out put.

So no you don't understand ohms law and/or how mechs work vs regulated devices (coil tab is regulated).



That rating is not for end users like us nor for our application of the batteries. That rating is for equipment in event of a power loss or surge, just meaning the battery can take a hit 1 time and 1 time only, then should be destroyed.

Ever heard of hard hitting mods? Thats because it has a little voltage drop. Copper or Silver are the best ones. However there is nothing perfect, thats ehy you wont get 4.2 Volt

 

[bombastinator]

There is a voltage drop on your mod and battery.

Yes but unless something is very very wrong it’s measured in microvolts and is generally not worth doing the math for it might maybe take a tenth of an ohm in a really severe situation bad enough to spontaneously drain batteries in a day or so

 

[entropy1049]

Again, what do you (everyone asked) recommend as a safe, fast hitting build?

To answer your question without delving into the guts of this thread? A single 18650 tube mod, with your healthy VTC5A Sony cell can support an atomizer resistance build of 0.17 ohms.

Understand how to use a Kelvin Bridge to accurately determine resistances below one ohm to the hundredth place? If not, the answer is “0.2” on your resistance measuring device.

 

[Ammonarrow]

To answer your question without delving into the guts of this thread? A single 18650 tube mod, with your healthy VTC5A Sony cell can support an atomizer resistance build of 0.17 ohms.

Understand how to use a Kelvin Bridge to accurately determine resistances below one ohm to the hundredth place? If not, the answer is “0.2” on your resistance measuring device.

Meant fast ramp up, sorry.
I have to admit that I dont have any plan about coils. Which are good (Clapton, Alien and so on) and which arent so... I know that less wire means faster ramp up