Silica wick?

[PeterKay]

Hi,
I'm posting because I just encountered some silica wick on ebay while looking for pre-built coils and different kinds of pre-built wire.
I've only used cotton so far- gonna get some rayon eventually but I think I'll order some from USA, people here in UK buy the rayon in bulk from US and resell it by meter for ridiculous price. And whatever material smok supplies with their RBA heads for TFV12 tank (I must say this material was pretty good, used it both in smok tfv12 rta and berserker mini rta, wicked well, tasted fine and lasted slightly longer than my normal muji cotton. It's gone now so I can't post a picture.).

Anyway- I tried to research here about silica wick but the latest posts were from 2013. Same on youtube- bunch of old videos. Found a thread with a few posts on reddit from like 3 years ago with some folks saying they still use silica wick, claiming the taste is cleaner, you can't physically burn it, you can dry burn it, lasts longer etc.
Why is it not popular anymore, why has it disappeared? Is it worth giving a shot? What are the disadvantages, as clearly there were some advantages I found, but there must have been a reason for folks to abandon this material (other than the one mention below)?

Wicking the coil itself is not a big concern for me, I've read about trouble to get it through a coil and I think I know how to deal with it.

Thanks

 

[Rossum]

It doesn't wick (move/transport juice) as well as cotton, much less rayon. All else being kept equal, this will result in higher coil temperatures, which may not be desirable due to the potential for VG and PG to decompose into less healthy substances at too high a temperature. Or if you're using a temperature-controlled device, it will result in less vapor production.

There were also some concerns that small bits of the material might come off get inhaled (which would be bad), but I'm not sure how much credence I'd give that.

Then there's the building hassle. With cotton or rayon, you make a coil and then you wick it; it's very straightforward to use. If you get the wick wrong, you yank it out and try again. With silica, it's quite difficult to get a wick into a coil after the coil is built, so what many people did was to wind the their coil around the wick, which presents its own challenges.

Bottom line: Very few people still use the stuff.

 

[440BB]

I think silica wick fell out of favor for a number of reasons. Here are the ones that come to mind:

As higher wattage vaping emerged, the need for faster wicking made cotton and rayon more effective.

Silica wick is easier to coil by wrapping wire around the wick versus pulling the wick through the wire. As people began using larger and more exotic coils in rebuildable tanks and atomizers silica wasn't as workable as pulling cotton or rayon through the coil.

There were rumors that silica wicking was dangerous and could cause silicosis, which I believe was debunked.

Silica is best used in lower wattage setups with at least 50% PG IMO. As the market went to thicker, high or MAX VG styles of liquids, silica didn't fit.

I also think manufacturers realized that premade cotton coils, with a somewhat shorter life, are more profitable.

That said, I'm using silica wicks at low wattage with 2/3 PG, replacing a prebuilt coil every three weeks or so. Very forgiving wicking in my application, no burnt wicks. I do use cotton and cotton/ceramic wicks when lounging with flavors at home.

At this point in the vaping industry you would be hard pressed to find much available though and I don't see it making a comeback.

 

[PeterKay]

It doesn't wick (move/transport juice) as well as cotton, much less rayon. All else being kept equal, this will result in higher coil temperatures, which may not be desirable due to the potential for VG and PG to decompose into less healthy substances at too high a temperature. Or if you're using a temperature-controlled device, it will result in less vapor production.

There were also some concerns that small bits of the material might come off get inhaled (which would be bad), but I'm not sure how much credence I'd give that.

Then there's the building hassle. With cotton or rayon, you make a coil and then you wick it; it's very straightforward to use. If you get the wick wrong, you yank it out and try again. With silica, it's quite difficult to get a wick into a coil after the coil is built, so what many people did was to wind the their coil around the wick, which presents its own challenges.

Bottom line: Very few people still use the stuff.

Thank you. So I'm probably going to save myself experimenting with it.

However, I just found another thing. Ceramic XC-116 wick- what about that one?

 

[Rossum]

Ceramic XC-116 wick- what about that one?

I have not tried it. I switched from silica to cotton to rayon in a matter of a few months during the first half of 2014 and haven't looked back.

However, the XC-116 does have some very ardent fans.

 

[PeterKay]

Silica is best used in lower wattage setups with at least 50% PG IMO. As the market went to thicker, high or MAX VG styles of liquids, silica didn't fit.

I often use 50/50 in my lower wattage tanks, as well as 60VG/40PG with 5% distilled water. Just saw your reply and it made me think again, hmmm... The guy I found on ebay has loads, he sells tons of different types of coils and wire so I imagine the stuff he has is proper vaping material.

 

[PeterKay]

I have not tried it. I switched from silica to cotton to rayon in a matter of a few months during the first half of 2014 and haven't looked back.

However, the XC-116 does have some very ardent fans.

I guess I'm gonna have to try for myself. Cotton is alright but I noticed that one dry hit and the flavor is, maybe not ruined, but I can feel the slight off notes afterwards. Also initially, for like a third of the tank, the cotton I used so far has some slight weird taste to it. It goes away after a while. Haven't tried rayon. But If there's some wicking material out there that can provide 100% flavor from first hit, I'd like to try it.

 

[SupplyDaddy]

However, all these single use pod (not meant for refill) devices like JUUL, use silica wicks....

 

[PeterKay]

However, all these single use pod (not meant for refill) devices like JUUL, use silica wicks....

Interesting. I had no idea, I go nowhere near disposable pods. I looked at the prices of shortfills, diy juices, and disposable pods. Quick maths was enough to determine my choices

 

[440BB]

Interesting. I had no idea, I go nowhere near disposable pods. I looked at the prices of shortfills, diy juices, and disposable pods. Quick maths was enough to determine my choices

I think most refillable pods use cotton wicking. Pods designed for nic salts are typically good with 50/50 liquid too. My mix works great in the Justfog Minifit, for example. Long coil life and no leaks.

 

[AngeNZ]

I guess I'm gonna have to try for myself. Cotton is alright but I noticed that one dry hit and the flavor is, maybe not ruined, but I can feel the slight off notes afterwards. Also initially, for like a third of the tank, the cotton I used so far has some slight weird taste to it. It goes away after a while. Haven't tried rayon. But If there's some wicking material out there that can provide 100% flavor from first hit, I'd like to try it.

What cotton have you tried? With Muji pads I got a cotton taste/break in period. But with cotton targetted at vapers like Cotton Bacon Prime, Cotn, Kendo Gold (my favourite) etc, there's absolutely no cotton taste. It's pure flavour from the first puff

 

[Katya]

Found a thread with a few posts on reddit from like 3 years ago with some folks saying they still use silica wick, claiming the taste is cleaner, you can't physically burn it, you can dry burn it, lasts longer etc.
Why is it not popular anymore, why has it disappeared? Is it worth giving a shot? What are the disadvantages, as clearly there were some advantages I found, but there must have been a reason for folks to abandon this material (other than the one mention below)?

The main advantage of silica wicks (amorphous silica rope) is that it doesn't burn. In the early days of vaping, with small atomizers, poor airflow and thin-coil wires that overheated rapidly, silica rope was the only option.

Why is it not popular anymore, why has it disappeared?

As vaping changed (RBAs, more airflow, larger coils, higher wattages, temperature control etc.), the search for better and more efficient wicking materials began.

Also, silica (general term) gat a bad wrap when one e-cig manufacturer suddenly decided to use an unsuitable for inhalation crystalline silica in their atomizers. The silica fibers hit the fan, the company switched to cotton and that was the end of silica. Not many vapers today even realize that there are two kinds of silica fibers--one (amorphous) is perfectly safe and useful, the other (crystalline) is potentially dangerous.

Is it worth giving a shot? Wicking the coil itself is not a big concern for me, I've read about trouble to get it through a coil and I think I know how to deal with it.

Yeah, trying to fit a piece of silica rope into a premade coil is a struggle--you really have to make sure that the coils fits snuggly so you don't develop any hot spots. And your coil's ID is always limited to the diameter of your rope. Honestly, I wouldn't bother. But if you're curious, buy a couple of feet (or a meter) of silica rope and play with it. Just make sure you get the right size of the rope.

And whatever material Smok supplies with their RBA heads for TFV12 tank (I must say this material was pretty good, used it both in smok tfv12 rta and berserker mini rta, wicked well, tasted fine and lasted slightly longer than my normal muji cotton. It's gone now so I can't post a picture.).

Most Chinese manufacturers use some kind of organic cotton (or so they claim)--probably not Muji, because Muji is not organic, no matter what the resellers say--it's just unbleached, but not organic and not pesticide-free, if it matters to you.

I've used Muji, Koh Gen Do, Labo and Cotton bacon. And rayon. KGD is still my favorite, but their prices went through the roof lately-- $20 for 60 pads. Labo is an organic cotton for a much more reasonable price than KGD:

https://www.amazon.com/Selena-Organ...83709&s=beauty&sprefix=muji,beauty,208&sr=1-6

 

[Katya]

I've only used cotton so far- gonna get some rayon eventually but I think I'll order some from USA, people here in UK buy the rayon in bulk from US and resell it by meter for ridiculous price.

Have you tried eBay? I know that they sell (or used to) small quantities or Rayon for reasonable prices. Or ask @Rossum for his German (European?) sources of very good rayon balls. I almost bought some, years ago, but I'm so used to cotton that I never did. I only have 1 foot or so of Rayon left (from a small sample I once acquired) or I would send you some to try. Sorry.

However, I just found another thing. Ceramic XC-116 wick- what about that one?

Let me page our resident expert @MacTechVpr on ceramic wicks--he'll tell you everything you need to know on the subject. If he gets my page.

 

[PeterKay]

What cotton have you tried? With Muji pads I got a cotton taste/break in period. But with cotton targetted at vapers like Cotton Bacon Prime, Cotn, Kendo Gold (my favourite) etc, there's absolutely no cotton taste. It's pure flavour from the first puff

Ive used this stuff:
Full Pack 180 Pad Muji Japanese Organic Cotton, , Discount for Two, Vape, RBA | eBay
And Pro Cotton by Coil Master.
The latter seemed to give less of the cotton taste. I haven't tried the ones you mentioned, maybe it's the right time to experiment

 

[PeterKay]

Have you tried eBay? I know that they sell (or used to) small quantities or Rayon for reasonable prices. Or ask @Rossum for his German (European?) sources of very good rayon balls. I almost bought some, years ago, but I'm so used to cotton that I never did. I only have 1 foot or so of Rayon left (from a small sample I once acquired) or I would send you some to try. Sorry.

Yeah I did, people resell the graham celucotton for 8£/10m, while 152m costs around 10$ on ebay in USA. So pretty much 15x the original price. I know 8£ is not a lot and 10m will probably last me a long time but why would I pay 15x more than something is wort? I'd rather get a full pack and give away the extra that I don't need to my brother or friends. I'll find it somewhere eventually at a reasonable price, I'm sure of that

 

[UncLeJunkLe]

Yeah I did, people resell the graham celucotton for 8£/10m, while 152m costs around 10$ on ebay in USA. So pretty much 15x the original price. I know 8£ is not a lot and 10m will probably last me a long time but why would I pay 15x more than something is wort? I'd rather get a full pack and give away the extra that I don't need to my brother or friends. I'll find it somewhere eventually at a reasonable price, I'm sure of that

After shipping and any customs taxes, wow much would it cost you per meter to buy it from a USA store/ebay seller?

 

[PeterKay]

After shipping and any customs taxes, wow much would it cost you per meter to buy it from a USA store/ebay seller?

I have no way of telling. Usually when I buy from US sellers, the postage and customs appear in the checkout, with this seller it asks me to pay the basic price right away but states that it will be subject to customs and postage... There's only one seller with it now, a month ago when I checked there were 3 different ones, I should have checked and ordered back then... my bad

CelluCotton Beauty Coil 500ft. 100% Rayon Fibers #44060 Graham Beauty | eBay

 

[PeterKay]

After shipping and any customs taxes, wow much would it cost you per meter to buy it from a USA store/ebay seller?

I take it back instantly, I just fixed my search and found the other sellers, I made a typo when searching haha. Let me check the price

 

[JCinFLA]

@PeterKay - Another reason there are so few vendors who still have silica wicking...is because most long ago clearanced out what stock they had. Since about 2016, the vendors I happened upon who still had it were selling it for $.10-$.25 per 10 feet, depending on which diameter it was. One vendor I used to pretty regularly buy from...even included several free baggies of it in my package, every time I placed an order for other things. I never used any of it though. Even when she closed her website, she told me she still had a whole bunch of it left. There are still a few very rare vendors though, who have small amounts on their websites.

 

[Rossum]

Yeah I did, people resell the graham celucotton for 8£/10m, while 152m costs around 10$ on ebay in USA. So pretty much 15x the original price.

I'm a dedicated rayon user, but not a huge fan of the Graham "beauty coil". I prefer medical-grade rayon balls. I think the main reason so many people in the US use the "beauty coil" is because it's so ubiquitously available at any Sally's Beauty Supply shop, and those shops are everywhere. Medical grade balls are harder to get; you have to order a big batch of them, and be willing to spend about double what a big box of beauty coil would cost.

In Germany, this stuff has a really good reputation:
dm-drogerie markt - dauerhaft günstig online kaufen
But I don't know if they'll ship to the UK.