FDA So what might really happen with regulations/bans? Should we be stocking up?

[Racehorse]

My 10 year old daughter could walk into CVS and buy an unlimited amount of nicotine gum in all manner of "kid-friendly" flavors, yet I don't hear any elected officials or public health bureaucrats uttering one word of protest about it.

I don't know of any state in the US where it is legal to sell nicotine gum to anyone under the age of 18. Although it is over the counter in some places, when you get to check out they will not sell to a minor, as in the US it is subject to the same restrictions on underage purchases as tobacco.

If CVS were doing that they would be in violation of the law, and I'm sure huge fines brought down on their head.

 

[dragonpuff]

^^^ This. ^^^ I find myself getting more and more annoyed with hardcore vaping aficionados who look down their noses with self-righteous disdain at anyone who doesn't use the same uber-fancy gear that they do. I happen to like my eGo. It works perfectly fine for my needs, and I have neither the need nor the desire to buy some ridiculous $200 mech mod to impress my friends with. I also happen to prefer using cartos/cigalikes when I'm away from home. It's not because I'm ignorant or uninformed or "not a real vaper." It's just what I prefer, and I don't need some snot-nosed twenty-something year old cloud chaser getting up in my face thinking he's going to educate me about the error of my ways. Step off and mind your own damn business, kid.

Right on! And get off my lawn too! Darn kids

Yeah I love my mod, but I prefer to take an ego or evod when I go out because it fits in my purse better. So sue me

 

[KiMB00P]

Sometimes I forget that nicotine gum/patches still require a prescription in some states. Here in California it's been about 10 years since they went OTC, and there are no age restrictions or anything. Which makes it rather screamingly ironic that we've got all these state legislators demanding onerous restrictions on the sale of e-cigs and vaping supplies, on the grounds that nicotine is an insipid public health menace that must be kept out of the hands of children at any and all costs. My 10 year old daughter could walk into CVS and buy an unlimited amount of nicotine gum in all manner of "kid-friendly" flavors, yet I don't hear any elected officials or public health bureaucrats uttering one word of protest about it.

They are otc but many doctors write scripts for them so that insurance can pay a portion or all of the cost. In WA state, they can only be sold to 18+ without a prescription.

 

[DC2]

And while nicotine can have many benefits, if you're not actually deriving a benefit from it there is no use in continuing to inhale it.

Given that nicotine improves memory, concentration, and attention (even in non-smokers) I would argue that there is benefit.
And that's not even considering the fact that nicotine may help prevent Alzheimers and Parkinsons.

I've been vaping the same nicotine strength since I started vaping 5 years ago, and I have no plans to ever reduce.
But it is getting to the point where I sometimes have to remind myself to vape.

 

[zoiDman]

...

But it is getting to the point where I sometimes have to remind myself to vape.

I thought it was Supped to Improve Memory?

LOL

 

[dragonpuff]

Given that nicotine improves memory, concentration, and attention (even in non-smokers) I would argue that there is benefit.
And that's not even considering the fact that nicotine may help prevent Alzheimers and Parkinsons.

I've been vaping the same nicotine strength since I started vaping 5 years ago, and I have no plans to ever reduce.
But it is getting to the point where I sometimes have to remind myself to vape.

Apples contain nicotine - maybe that's why an apple a day keeps the doctor away

 

[DC2]

I thought it was Supped to Improve Memory?

LOL

Yes indeed, which is how I remember to remind myself.

 

[Myrany]

With all due respect, this is almost certainly a psychosomatic reaction. There just isn't enough of a difference between 24mg and 18mg for physiological symptoms to manifest themselves just because you switched from the former to the latter. If you put each one in an unmarked bottle and didn't keep track of which you were vaping on a given day, I'd be willing to bet my life savings you wouldn't notice any difference whatsoever.

For some of us you would be wrong. I made the mistake of going down to 0 nic. The depression and anxiety were ridiculous. After a fair bit of experimentation and working with my doctor we discovered that 3-4 mg nic and the depression/anxiety become manageable. It is not psychosomatic. If it were any nic level would have done it but it didn't. I have had a very rough summer trying to get this sorted out. It is not fun

 

[aikanae1]

^^^ This. ^^^ I find myself getting more and more annoyed with hardcore vaping aficionados who look down their noses with self-righteous disdain at anyone who doesn't use the same uber-fancy gear that they do. I happen to like my eGo. It works perfectly fine for my needs, and I have neither the need nor the desire to buy some ridiculous $200 mech mod to impress my friends with. I also happen to prefer using cartos/cigalikes when I'm away from home. It's not because I'm ignorant or uninformed or "not a real vaper." It's just what I prefer, and I don't need some snot-nosed twenty-something year old cloud chaser getting up in my face thinking he's going to educate me about the error of my ways. Step off and mind your own damn business, kid.

I think it's important to remember "to each their own". Just because someone is congradulating themselves for dropping down a nic level or excited about their new steel tube/ weapon/ box or frustrated with the lack of VG eliquid doesn't mean they are extending the same thing to you.

One of the reasons ecigs are so successful now is that they are so customizable. This is frequently cited as a flaw by FDA / BT and BP who view standardization as the holy grail and IMO, a primary reason why any product they develop will more than likely fail for the vast majority (as if BT or BP really wanted success).

I am one of those guilty of ragging on "cig-a-likes" and when I do, i'm not discounting the form factor but the producer, i.e. most are BT products. I don't like tobacco companies getting into vaping, buying 'placeholder' companies and waiting for regulations to hand them the rights to be the only ones profiting from ecigs while doing aboslutely nothing to research and develop a product that actually HELPS smokers quit. I never have liked them and I want to seperate the vaping industry from tobacco companies as much as possible.

I do not believe for one second cig-a-likes will go away or that they do help some people. Certainly their availablity is a starting point for many and so far, they seem to be immune from many of the restrictions and taxes being put into place by state governments.

So don't take it personally.

I'm also surrounded by some really good b&m's where I live and I understand what you mean by emphasis with mech mods and rebuildables. I still like my ego and spinners even if I also use mods. I like colors, polished metals are boring and if I had spare time, messing with coils wouldn't be on my top thousand things I'd want to be doing on a Saturday afternoon. I'm glad others find it fun and it's human nature that growth for this industry also requires a certain amount of "cool factor". It'll wear off or evolve into something else eventually. How many more watts can they do without developing a nuclear battery? It just is.

 

[aikanae1]

So what might really happen with regulations/bans? Should we be stocking up?

I keep heatring about this "black market" and this week's BBC Ch2 Horizon spoke directly about the black market in the final quarter of the program. However the entire program is good - and really questions how "easy" it'll be or not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTjNkbLBEqg

 

[rico942]

nicotine may help prevent Alzheimers and Parkinsons.

I have recently been diagnosed with Parkinson's. No surprise, there is a family history, and I started seeing symptoms over 10 years ago ...

For years, smoking masked my symptoms as they progressed. When I quit smoking, the tremors became very pronounced, and cost me my job 4 years before I had planned to retire ...

Now, I chain vape before I can sign my name legibly, after which I have an hour or two of steadiness ...

I'm fortunate to have a young and progressive neurologist, who privately encourages me to continue using nicotine to control my symptoms, since the available pharmaceuticals are ineffective for long-term use, and have severe side effects. Of course, she cannot officially advocate self-treatment ...

Having a DAT scan next week to determine the extent of the disease. I'm not worried, as my own experience has convinced me that I can moderate the hand tremors as necessary by vaping ...

And my short-term memory is improved as well ...

 

[GrandPapa]

Hi,
Sorry to hear of you illness...but glad to see that vaping is helping with the problem (if I may call it that)...I guess some things can't be avoided health wise...but learning how to cope with them or have some control of them is a blessing...
Jim

 

[dragonpuff]

I have recently been diagnosed with Parkinson's. No surprise, there is a family history, and I started seeing symptoms over 10 years ago ...

For years, smoking masked my symptoms as they progressed. When I quit smoking, the tremors became very pronounced, and cost me my job 4 years before I had planned to retire ...

Now, I chain vape before I can sign my name legibly, after which I have an hour or two of steadiness ...

I'm fortunate to have a young and progressive neurologist, who privately encourages me to continue using nicotine to control my symptoms, since the available pharmaceuticals are ineffective for long-term use, and have severe side effects. Of course, she cannot officially advocate self-treatment ...

Having a DAT scan next week to determine the extent of the disease. I'm not worried, as my own experience has convinced me that I can moderate the hand tremors as necessary by vaping ...

And my short-term memory is improved as well ...

I'm glad you've been able to use vaping to improve your Parkinsons symptoms. Good luck to you Rico

 

[sonicdsl]

I have recently been diagnosed with Parkinson's. No surprise, there is a family history, and I started seeing symptoms over 10 years ago ...

For years, smoking masked my symptoms as they progressed. When I quit smoking, the tremors became very pronounced, and cost me my job 4 years before I had planned to retire ...

Now, I chain vape before I can sign my name legibly, after which I have an hour or two of steadiness ...

I'm fortunate to have a young and progressive neurologist, who privately encourages me to continue using nicotine to control my symptoms, since the available pharmaceuticals are ineffective for long-term use, and have severe side effects. Of course, she cannot officially advocate self-treatment ...

Having a DAT scan next week to determine the extent of the disease. I'm not worried, as my own experience has convinced me that I can moderate the hand tremors as necessary by vaping ...

And my short-term memory is improved as well ...

So sorry to hear this rico, even though I don't know you, that's a tough one, to say the least.. I hope that the nicotine continues to help mitigate the symptoms, and pray for a cure!

 

[DrMA]

@rico942 - Let me echo the sentiments of the others who posted here, wishing you best results with the control of the symptoms. My family also has a history of Parkinson's, so I can imagine what you're going thru. Good news is that my grandfather lived to the ripe old age of 92, having been a chain smoker for 30 years in his youth (quit in his 40s), and diagnosed with Parkison's in his early 60s. Now I'm thinking that if he continued to smoke or get nicotine some other way, his quality of life may have been better.

 

[rico942]

My understanding is that Parkinson's itself is not life threatening, but complications can be, as it was with family members ...

One of the things they asked me was about depression, as with Robin Williams. Can't say I've experienced that, my quality of life is good, and I've found very effective temporary relief from the symptoms with vaping ...

It saddens me to think that nicotine therapy could benefit others with neurological disorders, but the medical industry in the US might never acknowledge this, due to the stigma of smoking, and the campaign to demonize all things related to tobacco ...

 

[PuffTheMagicKanthal]

A problem I have come across is this: there are a few, not just 1 or 2, a few local stores and market stalls where I live that sells not what I would call clones, but outright counterfeit products, be that fake kanger clearomizers or fake ejuice.

Here's the deal, and this is how I first started out. I put a lot of money into buying such "things" as a "ce4" or whatever I was told it was I was buying. I knew no different, I was a vape virgin, a newbie, innocent. I thought this was the legit world of vaping. I knew no different.

My point? Juice would leak, into my mouth. All over my hands. Juice would taste weird. I was told by the vendor THIS WAS NORMAL! ALL CARTOMIZERS LEAKED to some degree. Just me with this experience? No. Many other people I spoke to were actually put off with this vaping concept that was all the rage. When I recommended vaping over smoking to them they said they had tried, but didn't understand what all the fuss was about as all they experienced was leaking juice everywhere, in their purse, in their pocket, etc, etc. They went back to smoking.

Was this just the deal back in the day? Nope. These very same local businesses are the exact same today as they were back then. Nothing has change and the vaping clientele are none the wiser. These vendors dont do it for the love of the vaping community, they are in it for the money. They see the gold rush that it is right now. These vendors I see on their Facebook go on extravagant vacations, and all the conventions across the country.
Jealous? Sort of. But only for obvious reasons. It was the Internet that saved me. The YouTube videos, THIS and other forums, Fasttech, other websites that all sell LEGIT products. I mean the legit products are in a league of their own. The craftsmanship and heart that goes into producing such products is mind blowing!

My point? After having said what I just have, one can clearly see where regulations coming into play are viable, and even to our benefit. It has been these "dirty dealers", the already existing black market, and that's what it is, has ruined a lot of the legitimacy and integrity that we genuine vapers are accustomed to.

Makes sense?

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk

 

[Ian444]

Makes sense?

No, not really. Nice rant though. Lots of passion.

 

[DC2]

My point? After having said what I just have, one can clearly see where regulations coming into play are viable, and even to our benefit. It has been these "dirty dealers", the already existing black market, and that's what it is, has ruined a lot of the legitimacy and integrity that we genuine vapers are accustomed to.

While it is quite true that some "dirty dealers" have poisoned the well for some smokers/potential vapers...
And while it is quite true that some "legitimate" regulations could help in that regard...

The coming regulations are not looking very "legitimate" at all.

They are not aimed at creating a solid and trustworthy electronic cigarette market.
That are aimed at decimating it, and leaving behind only the types of products that will not help most smokers make the switch.

Supporting the current set of proposed regulations is a very bad thing, and no vaper should be doing so.

 

[Nate760]

While it is quite true that some "dirty dealers" have poisoned the well for some smokers/potential vapers...
And while it is quite true that some "legitimate" regulations could help in that regard...

Better enforcement of existing copyright/trademark law would help a lot more. I'm sure FTC complaints have been filed by legitimate vendors whose trademarks are appearing on unauthorized knockoff products. But the continuing status quo would indicate the government hasn't seen fit to take action on any of them as yet.