Were not looking for a technical review just your opinion and if it met your expections.
Steeping Times and an Ultrasonic Cleaner Part III
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Were not looking for a technical review just your opinion and if it met your expections.
FYI - One of the members of this UK thread is running his juices through two 168 min sessions (21x8min cycles, one session one day, sitting overnight, then another session) to equate to two weeks of steeping time, which comes out to 5.6 hours total in the UC. I think earlier on in this thread someone was making the comparison of 1 hour of UC time = 1 week of steep. Anybody have anything to verify either? I've been going off the 1hour/1week but finding it not quite right. They may be overshooting it over there, maybe it's somewhere in the middle?
I made that comment based on my own juice mix. It takes a good 5 weeks to steep if just waiting. I steep in my UC for 5 hours and it taste as good as what I steeped naturally. But as in any mix your milage may vary.
Do you steep yours in glass or plastic to get those results?
I've been (UC) steeping in glass and it seems to take way longer than an hour to = a week.
When I first started the UC thing I ran the bottles somewhere between 2-3 hours. At the time I had a UC with a 3 minute cycle so it was hard to keep track of how many times I jumped up and turned the dang thing back on. When I upgraded to my current 8 minute max cycle UC I still lose track but generally I keep it running consistently for 2 - 3 hours. I started the last batch I made a couple of days ago at 12:15 pm and stopped around 3:30 - 4:00 pm. There were gaps in there (laundry day) but I kept turning it on as I passed the UC in the kitchen on my way to one household chore after another. That evening I was happily vaping away with the new juice.
I don't think one hour = one week is an accurate hard rule to go by for a couple of reasons I'm making up on the spot. I think the rate of "steeping" might accelerate after the first hour or so. It's like it takes awhile to get going but then as the flavoring gets more mixed in with the nic and PG (or VG) the results happen faster and faster. I don't think the "mix" happens at the same speed throughout the UC process. There's a difference in flavor after one hour in the UC, a huge difference after the second hour, but there's not so much flavor distance to cover for the 3rd or 4th hour. The flavor just becomes "fuller." And there comes a time when further UC "steeping" probably won't discernibly change the flavor at all. Once you're there ... you're there.
Does that make any sense?
I don't have the patience to do a perfect real time steeping comparison to UC steeping. I'll leave that to the lab coat guys. I just want to make the juice as fast as I can and vape it when it tastes good. The UC enabled me to do that in hours instead of weeks. So does 2 and a half hours in the UC exactly equal 2 weeks and 3 days and 12 hours on the shelf?
I don't care.
All I know is I don't have to wait to vape juice I made 3 weeks ago. I think the only real "rule" is to run e-liquid through the UC until it tastes good. It takes 5 hours for dannyv45's juice and it takes somewhere between 2 - 3 hours for my juice to be ready. The whole point of using the UC is to get the results you want in a matter of hours instead of weeks.
Thinking/planning ahead is definitely not my strong suit. I'm a checkers guy ... not a chess guy. I'm always surprised when my battery goes blinky. And I've always got 2-3 all charged up and ready to go. But when my juice supllies get low ... I know I don't have 3 weeks to wait before I run out.
Discoveries are made every day by responsible methodical people who plan and experiment their way towards the Eureka! moment. Some discoveries are made by lazy people hooked on instant gratification.
That would be me.
I've been using glass bottles to UC steep.
I jiggled my butterscotch for 5-6 hours over 3 days (I'm guessing but it could have been more)
I left the cap off for at least 1/2 that time.
It has darkened some but not much.
It tastes way better than fresh but nowhere near as good as the premixed +1 that I got from MBV made 4/29
Mine is 70/30 18mg @ 12.5% and the MBV is +1 80/20 18mg
I even use a ml or 3 of the steeped juice to help seed steep it.
Someone mentioned UC will effect juice in plastic faster then in glass.
I'm wondering if I'm wasting my time using glass in the UC.
I jiggled my butterscotch for 5-6 hours over 3 days (I'm guessing but it could have been more)
I left the cap off for at least 1/2 that time.
It has darkened some but not much.
It tastes way better than fresh but nowhere near as good as the premixed +1 that I got from MBV made 4/29
Mine is 70/30 18mg @ 12.5% and the MBV is +1 80/20 18mg
I even use a ml or 3 of the steeped juice to help seed steep it.
Someone mentioned UC will effect juice in plastic faster then in glass.
I'm wondering if I'm wasting my time using glass in the UC.
Hey Mowgli,
I heard the opposite. Plastic is supposed to deaden the UC waves/VooDoo. I imagine the thickness of the bottles might have something to do with it using glass or plastic. I haven't noticed a big difference after switching to glass. But then again I'm using super cheap bottles I picked up locally up here in Vancouver.
The plastic bottles I used before were from a set of four I picked up in a Walgreens. They were for transporting shampoo 'n stuff when you travel by air. Homeland Security approved I guess. They have different colored caps and since I make 4 flavors ... it worked out perfectly.
Here's the weirdest thing I've read to improve the UC's efficacy. Boil the water (and let it cool) before you pour it in the tank. Supposedly you're boiling some of the air out of the water so the UC waves work more efficiently. I have no idea if that's true or not. I was going to try it for my next batch, forgot about it, so I'll guess I'll wait until this batch is all gone and then try it. If I don't forget again.
I can't imagine using boiled water in the tank will shave off enough time to make boiling the water and waiting for it to cool down worthwhile. But who knows? Here's hoping some GUCE-er from here tries it out and lets us know if it's a go or no-go.
The boiled water has merit. Better units costing a few hundred and up often have a "degasing" mode to accomplish this. You degas before you run your cleaning cycle. See this for more on degasing.
BTW, if you want to test your UC, an industry standard test is to put a piece of aluminum foil in and run a cycle. If it is working correctly you should see little holes in the tin-foil starting to form.
Also it was I who mentioned the glass vs plastic thing. In one of the many articles I read about UC, and unfortunately I dont remember the link, it mentioned that plastics and other "soft" materials will absorb or dampen the UC waves. Hence glass being better than plastic because glass resonates better. I did 2 batches of strawberry juice that I know darkens with steeping. I split it in half between glass and plastic and placed them both in the bath at the same time. The glass was noticeably darker.
BTW, if you want to test your UC, an industry standard test is to put a piece of aluminum foil in and run a cycle. If it is working correctly you should see little holes in the tin-foil starting to form.
Also it was I who mentioned the glass vs plastic thing. In one of the many articles I read about UC, and unfortunately I dont remember the link, it mentioned that plastics and other "soft" materials will absorb or dampen the UC waves. Hence glass being better than plastic because glass resonates better. I did 2 batches of strawberry juice that I know darkens with steeping. I split it in half between glass and plastic and placed them both in the bath at the same time. The glass was noticeably darker.
Thanks for that info. I'm currently testing using a batch of butterscotch that I split in half
Product testing is such a hardship...strawberry, butterscotch...lol
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Found it:
A lot of the cheap UCs come with plastic baskets but it flys in the face of proper operation. We have 4 huge BlueWave brand UCs at work, about 100 gallons each, and this is the same info the BlueWave folks told us when they trained us.
Q - Are there rules for racking parts- material, coating, or part orientation?
Yes. Never put the parts on the bottom of an ultrasonic tank. You will prevent the correct movement of the diaphragm and interfere with the creation of ultrasonic energy. You can also subject the parts to damage. Parts should be racked in a basket or work holder designed to handle your specific part. This is very important in high end cleaning systems where you want the cleanest part possible. You should always use a stainless steel basket, as softer materials will absorb the ultrasonic energy. Never use plastic or other soft materials. If your part is easily damaged or scratched, stainless steel racks with Nylobond or Teflon coatings are available. Parts should be arranged in a single layer, this gives the cleaning fluid an opportunity to circulate and remove particulate from the immediate area of the part. When removing the parts from the cleaning solution a single layer prevents the upper parts from shedding particles on the lower parts. Never put the parts on the bottom of an ultrasonic tank. This is like putting your thumb on a speaker diaphragm in a radio. You will prevent the correct movement of the diaphragm [bottom or side of the tank] and interfere with the creation of ultrasonic energy.
Yes. Never put the parts on the bottom of an ultrasonic tank. You will prevent the correct movement of the diaphragm and interfere with the creation of ultrasonic energy. You can also subject the parts to damage. Parts should be racked in a basket or work holder designed to handle your specific part. This is very important in high end cleaning systems where you want the cleanest part possible. You should always use a stainless steel basket, as softer materials will absorb the ultrasonic energy. Never use plastic or other soft materials. If your part is easily damaged or scratched, stainless steel racks with Nylobond or Teflon coatings are available. Parts should be arranged in a single layer, this gives the cleaning fluid an opportunity to circulate and remove particulate from the immediate area of the part. When removing the parts from the cleaning solution a single layer prevents the upper parts from shedding particles on the lower parts. Never put the parts on the bottom of an ultrasonic tank. This is like putting your thumb on a speaker diaphragm in a radio. You will prevent the correct movement of the diaphragm [bottom or side of the tank] and interfere with the creation of ultrasonic energy.
A lot of the cheap UCs come with plastic baskets but it flys in the face of proper operation. We have 4 huge BlueWave brand UCs at work, about 100 gallons each, and this is the same info the BlueWave folks told us when they trained us.
So if you're like me and have one of the cheap ones that came with a plastic basket, is it still better to use that than place the bottles directly on the bottom of the unit?
I would say yes, though only an educated guess. Placing articles on the bottom dampens the waves more than the plastic does.
The thing that most proves the effectiveness of ultrasonic cleaners for me is that my tobacco absolute stays in solution now, seemingly permanently. Not just in my finished e-liquid mixes but even in the fairly concentrated initial PG dilution I make prior to using in mixes.
Before using the UC there would always be that nasty green oily ring at the top of the bottle, but now after a couple hours in the UC the stuff has stayed in solution for over two months with no additional mixing required. That's freaking amazing, man!
Before using the UC there would always be that nasty green oily ring at the top of the bottle, but now after a couple hours in the UC the stuff has stayed in solution for over two months with no additional mixing required. That's freaking amazing, man!
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I'm steeping in 30ml boston round bottles. I've done as many as 5 bottles at a time all with the same results in the same amount of time. What's the power on your UC mine is 42,000Hz.
It's that cheap lil one that's rebadged everywhere for $22-$30.
Doesn't say in the manual or on the specs label. just says 35w
It's listed as 42,000Hz at HF's website.
I load it with as many as it can hold.
yesterday - (2) 120ml & (2) 30ml glass & (2) small dropper bottles banded to a biggie
I would say that this may be the reason your seeing different results then others. My UC is a monster 2.5 quart 42,000 hz commercial model with some power behind it. Has a 30 minute timer and heater. Naturally smaller less powerful models will take longer.
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42khz is actually the ultrasonic frequency that is produced (I think anything over 20khz is ultrasonic). The power would be measured in Watts...but a larger industrial unit's ultrasonic generator would probably produce more Watts too. It would be like the difference between a small 2 Watt radio and a 300 Watt home system...they can both produce a 261.626hz middle C tone, but the 300 Watt amp can move a lot more air.
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