SXmini M Class (TEMP CONTROL)

[TheBloke]

@Vlad1 you're of course absolutely right that the vast majority just want to "fire and forget". But also don't over-estimate the complexity of vaping with a different wire.

With a TCR mod such as the Dicodes and Smok, it means going into a menu and changing a figure of 0.006 (or 600) down to, let's say, 0.004 (or 400.) On the Smok XCube 2, this can even be done on your phone.

With the DNA 200, you have to connect to the PC, but then you can download a file from a website without needing to understand its content.

The technical stuff more comes in working out what these values are in the first place, and in trying new wires no-one, or few people have tried before. Once a wire is established, changing to use them is no more complicated than setting your temperature. And in future wires could have the figure to use printed on the spool/packaging - as Dicodes already do with their Resistherm NiFe30.

I'm not saying the majority of people will ever do either of those things. TCR adjusting is, and I think probably always will be, a more advanced/knowledgeable user function. But that doesn't mean it's complicated or hard. Really the only cost of entry is readership of a forum like this, or watching a YouTube video that explains it.

We've been told that a US vaping vendor will soon stock NiFe52. I assume that they will print on its packaging, and on the website, clear mention of the TCR figure, and hopefully also how to enter it, along with a a DNA 200 TCR file. If they're smart, they'll also include screenshots on the website showing how to change the TCR on a couple of example mods, along with a couple of tables showing the target temperatures to use on the DNA 40 and the Yihi chips.

While you're right that the mainstream won't use these features, I don't think we should assume that therefore they are exclusively the occupation of a tiny niche of tweakers. Once it's widely available, any vaping user can see NiFe52 on a website, buy it and vape it in minutes on his or her TCR-adjusting mod, and get the benefits of it. And the more that do that, the more likely it'll be that the next mods and FW updates will include a mode for it to make it more widely accessible. Titanium started out as the preserve of the highly knowledgeable, and is now sweeping the TC world. Other wires can do that too, and TCR adjustment makes it that much easier for them to gain popularity.

So I do think there are big benefits to be had from mods having TCR adjustment, even if it remains a feature used only by a few % of vapers. Maybe Yihi will add it; I hope so. If so that will make the SXM the only first gen TC mod that can claim to have kept updated with the latest and greatest vaping technology. It will also keep it fully competitive with the DNA 200.

 

[crxess]

It's just discussion and assumption. Everyone has their own opinions and that's great.
Saying I'd never touch one is an opinion.
You are risking your live is an Assumption.

I know and understand Quality. I Did the Automotive industry for almost 40 years.

Americans still over pay for Mercedes and there are those that feel Value lies elsewhere.

I very much admire the Quality of my SXM, but that does not deter my use of several of my sub $50 Regulated mods. Each has a purpose and none have had issues. Not One.

Be happy with what you have and leave others to decide for themselves.

 

[Vlad1]

@Vlad1 you're of course absolutely right that the vast majority just want to "fire and forget". But also don't over-estimate the complexity of vaping with a different wire.

With a TCR mod such as the Dicodes and Smok, it means going into a menu and changing a figure of 0.006 (or 600) down to, let's say, 0.004 (or 400.) On the Smok XCube 2, this can even be done on your phone.

With the DNA 200, you have to connect to the PC, but then you can download a file from a website without needing to understand its content.

The technical stuff more comes in working out what these values are in the first place, and in trying new wires no-one, or few people have tried before. Once a wire is established, changing to use them is no more complicated than setting your temperature. And in future wires could have the figure to use printed on the spool/packaging - as Dicodes already do with their Resistherm NiFe30.

I'm not saying the majority of people will ever do either of those things. TCR adjusting is, and I think probably always will be, a more advanced/knowledgeable user function. But that doesn't mean it's complicated or hard. Really the only cost of entry is readership of a forum like this, or watching a YouTube video that explains it.

We've been told that a US vaping vendor will soon stock NiFe52. I assume that they will print on its packaging, and on the website, clear mention of the TCR figure, and hopefully also how to enter it, along with a a DNA 200 TCR file. If they're smart, they'll also include screenshots on the website showing how to change the TCR on a couple of example mods, along with a couple of tables showing the target temperatures to use on the DNA 40 and the Yihi chips.

While you're right that the mainstream won't use these features, I don't think we should assume that therefore they are exclusively the occupation of a tiny niche of tweakers. Once it's widely available, any vaping user can see NiFe52 on a website, buy it and vape it in minutes on his or her TCR-adjusting mod, and get the benefits of it. And the more that do that, the more likely it'll be that the next mods and FW updates will include a mode for it to make it more widely accessible. Titanium started out as the preserve of the highly knowledgeable, and is now sweeping the TC world. Other wires can do that too, and TCR adjustment makes it that much easier for them to gain popularity.

So I do think there are big benefits to be had from mods having TCR adjustment, even if it remains a feature used only by a few % of vapers. Maybe Yihi will add it; I hope so. If so that will make the SXM the only first gen TC mod that can claim to have kept updated with the latest and greatest vaping technology. It will also keep it fully competitive with the DNA 200.

I was answering GeorgeS question from a personal perspective since that's what he was asking not an industry perspective. While I see benefit of the industry in trying, testing and using other materials, methods, approaches I think the R&D is best suited for the engineers, chemists, metalurgist & manufacturers rather than a forum, youtube or hobbyist's. Sure if there's something new works better it will become the industry standard, manufactures will follow suit and a user set TCR would be great in that scenario. It also removes some liability from the manufacturer when the next best thing turns out to be hazardous. I do have a DNA 200 on order that will have user definable TCR but that was not even a consideration in why I ordered it.

 

[druckle]

II think the R&D is best suited for the engineers, chemists, metalurgist & manufacturers rather than a forum

I personally see the manufacturers as being far behind the investigation being done on the forums with respect to alternative coil or wick materials. Titanium wasn't even considered as a serious coil material until folks on the forums began to investigate it and it's momentum began to build. Evolv definitely pushed the boundaries with the DNA 40 and Ni 200 but since then I think it's been the serious interest of forum folks that have pushed the technology. the rest has been mostly "follow the leader". Innokin appears to be trying with new temp control technologies and that's good but where else are manufacturers moving the goal posts? Not many places that I know of.

Duane

 

[Vlad1]

I personally see the manufacturers as being far behind the investigation being done on the forums with respect to alternative coil or wick materials. Titanium wasn't even considered as a serious coil material until folks on the forums began to investigate it and it's momentum began to build. Evolv definitely pushed the boundaries with the DNA 40 and Ni 200 but since then I think it's been the serious interest of forum folks that have pushed the technology. the rest has been mostly "follow the leader". Innokin appears to be trying with new temp control technologies and that's good but where else are manufacturers moving the goal posts? Not many places that I know of.

Duane

There is a good use of forums and other areas involved for any industry to advance. Thinking outside the box ideas often come from such places then some manufacturer picks up the idea and runs with it, enhances it, polishes it off and makes it into a marketable product. Why I said

if there's something new works better it will become the industry standard, manufactures will follow suit

but I'm not sitting in the manufactures labs to really know what they're working on or their trade secrets if there are any. But yea Innokin, Ijoy are a couple that seem to be doing their own thing thinking outside the box. But back to GeorgeS question which was more to do with user defined TCR. No I don't feel limited or restricted not having a user definable TCR setting on the SXmini M and it's not a deal breaker. For all I know Yihi is working on that for their next firmware release.

 

[TheBloke]

Yeah, absolutely @druckle and I'm afraid I couldn't disagree more @Vlad1 .

I see no benefit to sitting around waiting/hoping for manufacturers to improve the state of the art. Sometimes they will, sometimes they won't, but either way - why wait? What I want is for the manufacturers to give us the tools with which we can achieve the vape we want, and which ideally allow us to try as many new things as possible. TCR is a great example, it frees up the user to easily try any TC wire, rather than waiting around to see if a a manufacturer will or won't ever add a specific mode for a specific wire. And manufacturers won't add a mode for a specific wire if people aren't using it, so there's an element of chicken/egg in there too.

R&D is suited to whomever has the time and inclination to do it. This is true in most industries but especially ours, which is still relatively speaking extremely small and undefined. And especially so as the market is now disproportionately Chinese. China have come into vaping because they have the manufacturing facilities, technology and experience to produce products, and above all because they can do it very cheaply and thus profitably. They have not, by and large, come into it because they love vaping. Vaping is not a big thing in China, because cigarettes are still so popular.

The result is it it's very much up to us to tell them what we want and what works and does not. There are exceptions of course - Innokin currently being a clear example. But by and large the more proactive we can be, the more we will get. I already know this from personal experience, working with SXK to resolve issues in their mods and even to help them understand how their own features work (the TCR scale they added to their mods without seeming to understand its capabilities; hence it being called only 'nickel purity'.)

Of course it's entirely personal as to whether someone does or does not want to conduct such research, and what features a given person wants/needs or will use. But I can't agree that we are near the point where we can as a community sit back and wait for manufacturers to bring us the best products; or at least, that there's no value to be found in our own R&D when we are able to conduct it. Certainly the manufacturers think so, as they reach out to those who do do this sort of research.

 

[Vlad1]

Yeah, absolutely @druckle and I'm afraid I couldn't disagree more @Vlad1 .

I see no benefit to sitting around waiting/hoping for manufacturers to improve the state of the art. Sometimes they will, sometimes they won't, but either way - why wait? What I want is for the manufacturers to give us the tools with which we can achieve the vape we want, and which ideally allow us to try as many new things as possible. TCR is a great example, it frees up the user to easily try any TC wire, rather than waiting around to see if a a manufacturer will or won't ever add a specific mode for a specific wire. And manufacturers won't add a mode for a specific wire if people aren't using it, so there's an element of chicken/egg in there too.

R&D is suited to whomever has the time and inclination to do it. This is true in most industries but especially ours, which is still relatively speaking extremely small and undefined. And especially so as the market is now disproportionately Chinese. China have come into vaping because they have the manufacturing facilities, technology and experience to produce products, and above all because they can do it very cheaply and thus profitably. They have not, by and large, come into it because they love vaping. Vaping is not a big thing in China, because cigarettes are still so popular.

The result is it it's very much up to us to tell them what we want and what works and does not. There are exceptions of course - Innokin currently being a clear example. But by and large the more proactive we can be, the more we will get. I already know this from personal experience, working with SXK to resolve issues in their mods and even to help them understand how their own features work (the TCR scale they added to their mods without seeming to understand its capabilities; hence it being called only 'nickel purity'.)

Of course it's entirely personal as to whether someone does or does not want to conduct such research, and what features a given person wants/needs or will use. But I can't agree that we are near the point where we can as a community sit back and wait for manufacturers to bring us the best products; or at least, that there's no value to be found in our own R&D when we are able to conduct it. Certainly the manufacturers think so, as they reach out to those who do do this sort of research.

It's perfectly alright for you to disagree with me, my wife does on a regular basis but we're still together after 20+ yrs

I think our standards are quite different in what we consider R&D. At any rate I wasn't looking for a debate about how the development or R&D of vaping alloy's is coming along when I answered GeorgeS TCR question.... It's just not an important factor for me and isn't a determining factor in my devices at present.

 

[JimScotty0]

@Vlad1 you're of course absolutely right that the vast majority just want to "fire and forget". But also don't over-estimate the complexity of vaping with a different wire.

With a TCR mod such as the Dicodes and Smok, it means going into a menu and changing a figure of 0.006 (or 600) down to, let's say, 0.004 (or 400.) On the Smok XCube 2, this can even be done on your phone.

With the DNA 200, you have to connect to the PC, but then you can download a file from a website without needing to understand its content.

The technical stuff more comes in working out what these values are in the first place, and in trying new wires no-one, or few people have tried before. Once a wire is established, changing to use them is no more complicated than setting your temperature. And in future wires could have the figure to use printed on the spool/packaging - as Dicodes already do with their Resistherm NiFe30.

I'm not saying the majority of people will ever do either of those things. TCR adjusting is, and I think probably always will be, a more advanced/knowledgeable user function. But that doesn't mean it's complicated or hard. Really the only cost of entry is readership of a forum like this, or watching a YouTube video that explains it.

We've been told that a US vaping vendor will soon stock NiFe52. I assume that they will print on its packaging, and on the website, clear mention of the TCR figure, and hopefully also how to enter it, along with a a DNA 200 TCR file. If they're smart, they'll also include screenshots on the website showing how to change the TCR on a couple of example mods, along with a couple of tables showing the target temperatures to use on the DNA 40 and the Yihi chips.

While you're right that the mainstream won't use these features, I don't think we should assume that therefore they are exclusively the occupation of a tiny niche of tweakers. Once it's widely available, any vaping user can see NiFe52 on a website, buy it and vape it in minutes on his or her TCR-adjusting mod, and get the benefits of it. And the more that do that, the more likely it'll be that the next mods and FW updates will include a mode for it to make it more widely accessible. Titanium started out as the preserve of the highly knowledgeable, and is now sweeping the TC world. Other wires can do that too, and TCR adjustment makes it that much easier for them to gain popularity.

So I do think there are big benefits to be had from mods having TCR adjustment, even if it remains a feature used only by a few % of vapers. Maybe Yihi will add it; I hope so. If so that will make the SXM the only first gen TC mod that can claim to have kept updated with the latest and greatest vaping technology. It will also keep it fully competitive with the DNA 200.

I love my SXM, but I would also love to have Yihi add a TCR function on a future update since I love to tinker and play with such things. Being a technology nut and always looking for ways to push the envelope and make things work better, that feature would be very much welcome. NI200 was cool when I first started using it, but now I prefer Ti. NiFe52 would seem like a nice wire to test and compare for TC so I will probably give it a try as you guys put it to the test.

It was about a year ago I was probably what you would call a tootie puffer and then the Atlantis tank came out and then I became a direct lung hitter. It was a major step for me and now I can't go back. Several months then passed and then TC hit the market with the DNA40 board. I watched and waited not convinced it was mature enough but when I saw the SXM S class and the preview of the M class, I felt it was time and preordered about 2 months before it was released. Now I can't even conceive of any reason why I would vape without using TC. I am spoiled and want more. Better wire, better wicking, better ejuice, etc. So now I make my own ejuice. Soon after enjoying the qualities of my own premium ejuice, I felt I wanted better wicking material so I am now using Pima Cotton which I feel is a step up from the KGD I have been using.

So do you see where this is going for me and many of us here? Not all of us will go down this path, but for many of us it is a hobby and fun as well as keeping us away from the stinkies. For others they will just pick up a mod, tank, or even a cigalike and be happy which is perfectly fine too.

 

[nic_fix]

I did not want to say this in the snow wolf thread. I love the dual batteries. it does not hold a candle to 350j. in fact I can't stand dna200 lipo either. 350j is it for me as of now. I was wondering if there are any custom dual battery 350j mods I could actually get without a waiting list or vip entry. I feel the boxer is just cheap feeling 3d printed. want something nice like top hat with 350j and dual batteries. wishes......

I have the tube. that honestly sucks. need side by side in the box. anything? I guess I might have to wait for vapor flask to hit the shelves. still not nice wood panels. other than that the sx mini now sans paint is still my ultimate one battery mod. has the 350j and fits my hand like a glove. meanwhile I need to air brush the latest one. I do not know why I keep buying them thinking they have fixed the paint. looks ugly but performs and that is what really counts.

the ti function was also welcome. updatable is also great other mods lack. however, their sxi program is a pita. try for hours each time to get it to work. this time said incompatible update. had to get same update from another one of their sites and worked fine. strange that. otherwise this thing is still 5 stars in my mind. they came out with dna200 which has vast functionality but tethered to limited battery power. killed it for me. may the sx mini reign supreme!

 

[ThunderDan]

I love my SXM, but I would also love to have Yihi add a TCR function on a future update since I love to tinker and play with such things. Being a technology nut and always looking for ways to push the envelope and make things work better, that feature would be very much welcome. NI200 was cool when I first started using it, but now I prefer Ti. NiFe52 would seem like a nice wire to test and compare for TC so I will probably give it a try as you guys put it to the test.

It was about a year ago I was probably what you would call a tootie puffer and then the Atlantis tank came out and then I became a direct lung hitter. It was a major step for me and now I can't go back. Several months then passed and then TC hit the market with the DNA40 board. I watched and waited not convinced it was mature enough but when I saw the SXM S class and the preview of the M class, I felt it was time and preordered about 2 months before it was released. Now I can't even conceive of any reason why I would vape without using TC. I am spoiled and want more. Better wire, better wicking, better ejuice, etc. So now I make my own ejuice. Soon after enjoying the qualities of my own premium ejuice, I felt I wanted better wicking material so I am now using Pima Cotton which I feel is a step up from the KGD I have been using.

So do you see where this is going for me and many of us here? Not all of us will go down this path, but for many of us it is a hobby and fun as well as keeping us away from the stinkies. For others they will just pick up a mod, tank, or even a cigalike and be happy which is perfectly fine too.

Where did you order the pima cotton from? I have been wanting to try some myself.

 

[JimScotty0]

Where did you order the pima cotton from? I have been wanting to try some myself.

The item I purchased is no longer on Amazon but it was very good. Here is another that appears to be the same.

Amazon.com : Nick's Wicks 100% Pima Cotton Atomizer Wick : Everything Else

 

[ThunderDan]

The item I purchased is no longer on Amazon but it was very good. Here is another that appears to be the same.

Amazon.com : Nick's Wicks 100% Pima Cotton Atomizer Wick : Everything Else

That's a tiny ... bag for $8, lol. Hmm.

 

[JimScotty0]

That's a tiny ... bag for $8, lol. Hmm.

Yes it is. You can find it elsewhere too if you search for it at a lower price but it is on the expensive side. My bag cost me about $8 but will probably last me several months so if you want to try something exotic, then it will cost a bit. I think it is worth a try. Just put about 10 tanks of ejuice on my Zephyrus wicking 80 VG and it is still going but now needing to be changed or maybe just washed. This stuff is super straight and doesn't cling together. Think of it like grabbing a bunch of strands and twisting it a little wet to get it through the coil. A different animal but it works very well. Worth giving it a try IMHO.

 

[ThunderDan]

Yes it is. You can find it elsewhere too if you search for it at a lower price but it is on the expensive side. My bag cost me about $8 but will probably last me several months so if you want to try something exotic, then it will cost a bit. I think it is worth a try. Just put about 10 tanks of ejuice on my Zephyrus wicking 80 VG and it is still going but now needing to be changed or maybe just washed. This stuff is super straight and doesn't cling together. Think of it like grabbing a bunch of strands and twisting it a little wet to get it through the coil. A different animal but it works very well. Worth giving it a try IMHO.

I can find all sorts of Pima Cotton sheets for my bed, not so much for my RDA.

BTW, finally got my Goliath v2 in on Friday. Used one of the ROCCs over the weekend, and then last night rebuilt it as a single macro coil, 3.6 mm ID. I think its almost too airy for single coil, which is a first for me, with the ROCC. Going to try the RBA base tonight with some Ti.

 

[JimScotty0]

I can find all sorts of Pima Cotton sheets for my bed, not so much for my RDA.

BTW, finally got my Goliath v2 in on Friday. Used one of the ROCCs over the weekend, and then last night rebuilt it as a single macro coil, 3.6 mm ID. I think its almost too airy for single coil, which is a first for me, with the ROCC. Going to try the RBA base tonight with some Ti.

You will love the Goliath v2 but I have only done duals on them. Yes it is an airy tank for sure. I have found 2-2.5mm coils work best giving you more room for wicking and air flow around the coils. 3mm can work, but I find it just too tight and not worth all the extra fussing to get it all to fit and then enough airflow.

As far as Pima Cotton, it is also known as Egyptian cotton and it is well known for being the best cotton used in bed sheets. Vaping with it is not as well known. Yet!

 

[ThunderDan]

You will love the Goliath v2 but I have only done duals on them. Yes it is an airy tank for sure. I have found 2-2.5mm coils work best giving you more room for wicking and air flow around the coils. 3mm can work, but I find it just too tight and not worth all the extra fussing to get it all to fit and then enough airflow.

As far as Pima Cotton, it is also known as Egyptian cotton and it is well known for being the best cotton used in bed sheets. Vaping with it is not as well known. Yet!

Ended up ordering some off ebay. Vape Dojo has some too, they are only about 10 minutes from my work, so I could go pick some up at B&M prices if I wanted to.

 

[2legsshrt]

The SX Mini in 3fvape are clones. Yihi mentioned that the SX Mini would not be sold by China retailers.

For online stores like fasttech or 3fvape, if there's no 'authentic' in front, it's a clone.

Just as I suspected.

 

[TheBloke]

Have you tried Rayon, @ThunderDan ? Cheap and easily available in the US. Look for Graham's Cellucotton, available from, amongst other places, a store called something like Sally's. Probably lots on eBay as well, which is where I got my most recent bag.

I also bought some Fibre Freaks on a whim when I saw it on a site I was buying wire from. That's nice too, and perhaps a bit more convenient to deal with, though I think it's more or less just Rayon re-packaged for vapers at 4x the price. Although in absolute terms it's still pretty cheap, $0.06 a wick or thereabouts.

 

[tony7432]

i finally ordered some ni200 coils for my RDA and had it all set up but i kept getting a low resistance warning..it had slipped my mind 0.02 was too low for this..very sad..lol now i need to go and invest in another TC mod that can fire that low

 

[ThunderDan]

Have you tried Rayon, @ThunderDan ? Cheap and easily available in the US. Look for Graham's Cellucotton, available from, amongst other places, a store called something like Sally's. Probably lots on eBay as well, which is where I got my most recent bag.

I also bought some Fibre Freaks on a whim when I saw it on a site I was buying wire from. That's nice too, and perhaps a bit more convenient to deal with, though I think it's more or less just Rayon re-packaged for vapers at 4x the price. Although in absolute terms it's still pretty cheap, $0.06 a wick or thereabouts.

Yeah, I have some rayon, the huge Graham's box from Sally's. Its OK, I still prefer cotton for most applications, but it does work well, and I use it for a change of pace here and there.

i finally ordered some ni200 coils for my RDA and had it all set up but i kept getting a low resistance warning..it had slipped my mind 0.02 was too low for this..very sad..lol now i need to go and invest in another TC mod that can fire that low

0.02 is too low for any TC mod.