Yeah, I realize that. So is there an "Optimum" number of wraps? Is this why 8 wrap coils seem to be the norm.?
Tensioned Micro Coils. The next step.
- Thread starter super_X_drifter
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
Yeah, I realize that. So is there an "Optimum" number of wraps? Is this why 8 wrap coils seem to be the norm.?
Yes as you're spreading the power over nominally double the surface area. And…if the coils aren't efficient you will diffuse a good part of that gain. Ergo, the t.m.c.
Now you can throw more power on (with a var) or target lower res with multi-wire. But how about take Subtank 7 turns 26 t.m.c. @ 15W resembles a twisted or dual at double the power (30W to be clear). Next try that trick with the duals.
Just sayin'.
Good luck W.
p.s. And btw now that I haven't wasted all those watts I blow out that density with a flow drip tip!
p.s.s. Easy to wind…8-turns 24awg on 2.mm @ ~.3Ω is my fav all around t.m.c. (mech) vape.
Last edited:
That's good news ether. Keepin' tension and rotation up is hard for some of us. Thicker wire can make it a challenge. Trick is learning to detect the level of strain pulling the wire off the spool. Or, if you use a needle nose or such. Fingers are far more sensitive than the wrist.
If we really look at our coils, learn to distinguish the subtle differences in coil color temperature you will see exactly why your micro's not goin' full t.m.c. from the jump. It may be imperfections in the wire but often it's just a subtle variation in our wind. Imperfections are often cured with just the right level of strain. They'll show up in the set if tension's not consistent (inconsistent turn-to-turn pull). Not only does this make it tedious to square away but it may never operate at the best resistance. And you'll see the result in the smoothness of the vape.
Even if you're not using fat wire, if you're having problems with variation switching off to the gizmo can help.
Thx E.
Good luck.
Exactly Mac,
I've been playing with weight for a consistent benchmark of strain and teasing it a bit with my fingers for slight variation and so i can feel the tension applied by the weight. At this point I can almost duplicate it with vise grips on the end of the wire as an anchor.
Hope to be able to get it right soon.
It's all muscle memory and the learning curve varies with every technique, every hand hold. It's what we call style that makes every dance (and every dancer) different. It's an astonishingly amazing thing the human brain.
Good luck all.
Just a quick note, if you have wire that gets less than straight, consider this:
Works like magic even up to 20 ga wire.
Works like magic even up to 20 ga wire.
Right on etherealink. I have a pair of needle nose vise grips and you're right with them on the loose end of the wire it is easy to put the strain on the wire while winding on the gizmo. I use the vise grip for my twisted coil. It just seems easier since I'm dealing with shorter lengths of wire.
My only modification to the coil gizmo, it makes setting the initial turn simple.
Today's challenge, parallels.
My only modification to the coil gizmo, it makes setting the initial turn simple.
Today's challenge, parallels.
Hmmmm... is that JB Weld or epoxy?
I just bent the handle inwards until the thumbscrew was directly under where my first turn usually starts, it also prevents the leg from angling outwards from that initial turn.
Oh thank God, I thought the internet was broken lol!
It's JB weld, the original 3mm rod broke when i started playing with the thumbscrew so this keeps everything solid even with 20ga ni80 and 15lbs of weight for static resistance.
Hey M..., thanks for the post. Handn't seen it and was wondering what all the fuss was about.
A pretty hot coil without any oxidation insulation of the wire in an already very diffuse and quite warm tank design. Bears no resemblance in form, function, stability or flavor result to what I posted above.
But thanks, it's informative. He did a better job on his original OCC build. I would not recommend the above coil to a beginner vaper or rebuilder without expecting some frustration (as noted by a number of the posters).
A 28 gauge, 7-wrap on 3/32" will give ya 25% more surface area an a thicker wick (more flow, density potential) on a 3.44 amp draw (vs. 5.48 for a very atypically neat hand 5-wrap) for better battery service and vapor production. A tension wind on a screw driver or pin vise will yield this very predictable repeatable wind in under a minute. How many will duplicate Ripp's wind exactly and hit that 5.4Ω mark? Or even be able to calculate the wind spacing? We can do things the hard way of course if that's our preference.
It's correct to conclude that the Subtank is not a tank capable of providing a fuller vapor density. It can't. Not with the open wind designs in use until the microcoil two years ago. I vape extremely dense and complex juices particularly tobacco and have no issues reaching the density target I require. Definitely not difficult on as well engineered a tank as this, to Kanger's credit (for the exceptional airflow and tight fitment).
Not a criticism bro. A comparison. I'm struggling to see how this video benefits newcomers.
Good luck M.
I haven't seen the video yet, but damn fine comparison Mac. We need more critical analysis that we can use to compare build efficiency with that gives a common language.Hey M..., thanks for the post. Handn't seen it and was wondering what all the fuss was about.
A pretty hot coil without any oxidation insulation of the wire in an already very diffuse and quite warm tank design. Bears no resemblance in form, function, stability or flavor result to what I posted above.
But thanks, it's informative. He did a better job on his original OCC build. I would not recommend the above coil to a beginner vaper or rebuilder without expecting some frustration (as noted by a number of the posters).
A 28 gauge, 7-wrap on 3/32" will give ya 25% more surface area an a thicker wick (more flow, density potential) on a 3.44 amp draw (vs. 5.48 for a very atypically neat hand 5-wrap) for better battery service and vapor production. A tension wind on a screw driver or pin vise will yield this very predictable repeatable wind in under a minute. How many will duplicate Ripp's wind exactly and hit that 5.4Ω mark? Or even be able to calculate the wind spacing? We can do things the hard way of course if that's our preference.
It's correct to conclude that the Subtank is not a tank capable of providing a fuller vapor density. It can't. Not with the open wind designs in use until the microcoil two years ago. I vape extremely dense and complex juices particularly tobacco and have no issues reaching the density target I require. Definitely not difficult on as well engineered a tank as this, to Kanger's credit (for the exceptional airflow and tight fitment).
Not a criticism bro. A comparison. I'm struggling to see how this video benefits newcomers.
Good luck M.
Tension is the light and the way on the path to a heavenly vape folks... I am so sold on it!
Thanks to mac and drifter for this thread and their contributions to it!
I'm going on near a month with my last tmc stm rba coil build, and I am also getting exceptional life from my wicks. I have not HAD to change a wick yet, nor have I burnt one. I'm really only changing wicks because I needed to clean the coil. Upon inspection of the wicks, there's only a very minor light tan color at the choke points (end turn area of my wicks).
Unfortunately the mass producing/marketing coil manufacturers would never go to a tensioned coil... they'd lose too much of their consumables profits! <--- Even though it would be the environmentally sane thing to do!
Thanks to mac and drifter for this thread and their contributions to it!
I'm going on near a month with my last tmc stm rba coil build, and I am also getting exceptional life from my wicks. I have not HAD to change a wick yet, nor have I burnt one. I'm really only changing wicks because I needed to clean the coil. Upon inspection of the wicks, there's only a very minor light tan color at the choke points (end turn area of my wicks).
Unfortunately the mass producing/marketing coil manufacturers would never go to a tensioned coil... they'd lose too much of their consumables profits! <--- Even though it would be the environmentally sane thing to do!
Thanks for the ack D.
Strain is an important tool in all human endeavor. A fundamental part of physics. No reason it shouldn't be applied here. It's the means to optimize most everything that we do to it's potential…as I keep trying to explain. Why drive with the spare when you can put good rubber in all four?
Producing something that resembles a microcoil is easy. Generating something that consistently preserves the electrical functions of a tensioned micro coil represents some very interesting and formidable technical challenges. For any machine, including the human variety. One of the most wonderful discoveries, the revelation of our human ability to apply strain mechanically as if we're hard wired to assume such adaptations, like we learn to cook and use fire. This was one of my most rewarding and empowering realizations.
Translation…we can learn to tension wind almost intuitively. It's a wonderful thing.
Now perfecting the outcome, reaping the benefits of alumina insulation and closest proximity requires some understanding of the science. It's a recipe in its own right. But it gets us to firing that barbecue at just the right conditions to get our steak just the way we like it, each and every time.
I wouldn't fault anyone being reticent to invest in large scale production of any mere machine to accomplish that. Especially when you and I, all of us, are so marvelously adapted to getting there ourselves.
That's why I'm committed to the premise here.
Good luck all.
So I'm looking at building my own whatchamajigit and have a couple of questions..
I can get brass rods in the sizes I want relatively cheap.
Is brass good enough for the jig or should I look at copper or steel?
Is there a reason for bending the rod 90 degrees one direction and 180 back over the centerpoint before bending another 90 out for the handle?
Is this an overtension prevention concept?
A picture may describe it better..
I can get brass rods in the sizes I want relatively cheap.
Is brass good enough for the jig or should I look at copper or steel?
Is there a reason for bending the rod 90 degrees one direction and 180 back over the centerpoint before bending another 90 out for the handle?
Is this an overtension prevention concept?
A picture may describe it better..
Last edited:
Brass is too soft for the tension needed IMO. It will bend. You wanna use music wire - it's steel.
The reason the jig comes with those shape rods is to loop the wire around for jewelry making. But us vapers demand more. We want straight legs and tension. So that shape works well to install a thumbscrew, washers and a wingnut to trap wire.
I just ordered a wire bender from Amazon and will hit hobby lobby to pick up some music wire to try some different bends but for now it works pretty kick ayuss as is.
I had bent some smaller music wire a while back into the shape and it wasn't terrible with pliers but the handle part, if off of the fulcrum much from the authentic rods make it a sketchy wind. That's why I'm getting a bender and Ima bend me up some stuff more professionally than I could with pliers
I have been looking at those wire benders myself, and wondering how it would work. When you get it down, I wanna see a video.
Thank you for that.
I didn't mention I'm going for 2mm 2.5mm & 3mm rods.
It seems music wire gets close to 2mm at it's largest, I'll try to source some steel in the right sizes
Brass breaks too easily, tried it, I do use it as s matching size mandrel in my travel rebuild kit though.
most of my coils will be 2.5mm ID for now, just a little thicker than 3/32"
For the price I'm gonna give brass a shot if for nothing else to get this rij-a-ma-jig functional.. I can always upgrade to steel if I can find the right sizes, found something very close to the right size music wire at grainger but it's kind of spendy..
For the price I'm gonna give brass a shot if for nothing else to get this rij-a-ma-jig functional.. I can always upgrade to steel if I can find the right sizes, found something very close to the right size music wire at grainger but it's kind of spendy..
- Status
Similar threads
