The Final Count Down -- Are You Ready?

[UncLeJunkLe]

A XX-year vaping veteran said recently on another thread that basically it's a myth that vaping is cheap. Yet admitted to buying expensive juices.

I was feeling pretty smug until the doc points out my blood pressure and blood sugar are too high. So the next challenge was fixing those without pills (pills don't actually fix them). So it's about diet and exercise which I couldn't have done without stopping smoking first.

I'm in that same exact boat. However my PCP is a little crazy about my "high" blood pressure. He wants to treat with meds, I refused because I'm just only slightly higher than normal what is considered normal at this point in time (it changes ever 3-5 years). Looking for a more reasonable PCP now, but it's hard to do because all the doctors in my area are basically employed by one large "health system". So chances are they will all follow the same protocol for suggested treatment .

I digress.

 

[UncLeJunkLe]

$270/month for ciggies

It was approx $400 for me - generic brands at 2.5 PAD.
RYO decreased that considerably. IIRC, it was about $10/WEEK using the bulk Criss Cross pipe tobacco that comes in the big sacks.

 

[Alexander Mundy]

Saving my marriage was my motivator. I was hopelessly addicted. (and I kicked other drug addictions so I rate cigarettes on top of the heap) I resigned myself of dying alone and early. Cig-alikes of the time (2011-2012) didn't do it completely for me. The day I got my first mod and tank I mail ordered (no B&M's here at the time) was the last day I had a cig. I am a born tinkerer so it became a hobby for me as well as an alternative. I really think I could kick nicotine now that I haven't had all the MAOI's in cigs for so long but I would be a crotchety fart for some time till the habit part subsided. I become that way below 18mg MTL, I've tried slowly reducing. My Son vaped for 2 years or so after I switched him over and 1 day just quit vaping also. Anyway, pertinent to the thread I am nic stocked till I would reach the age of 105, assuming my storage method works that long. I build 3D printers, have a lathe, mill, and almost done with a CNC mini mill so hardware isn't a worry. My biological Grandmother made it to 102 and Grandfather to 97. She smoked, chewed, drank, and ran a still and sold it in the day. He never smoked or drank so go figure. (Reading this makes me think of Anna for some reason)

 

[somdcomputerguy]

So the next challenge was fixing those without pills (pills don't actually fix them).

BP doesn't make cures, they make customers.

 

[sofarsogood]

BP doesn't make cures, they make customers.

Medical insurance has no incentives for prevention. Vaping controversy reveals the powers that be act to keep us unhealthy. Same goes for government diet recommendations. When it's obvious they are wrong they push back even harder so here we are stocking up on healthy stuff because the government is trying to take it away from us.

 

[muth]

@sofarsogood @UncleJunkle I'm in the same boat. I refused medication for my hypertension for years. It runs in my family. I was already eating a healthy diet and at a normal weight so I lowered my sodium intake. I started walking uphill everyday and I also practice yoga. Nothing! My blood pressure was stubborn and my doctor said it's in my genes. She even said something she shouldn't have. That some people experience alpha wave stimulation when they smoke causing them to relax. So I should start smoking again?

Fast forward to now, I finally caved in to meds and the first ones didn't work and caused horrible side effects. I told my doctor (a different one this time) that I didn't want them. She then informed me of a simple kidney diuretic I might want to try. No side effects just stay hydrated and get enough potassium. I acquiesced. Why didn't she inform me of this in the first place? Maybe because it's an old cheap generic not making big pharma rich? Anyway, it does seem to work......however.......it's not perfect and I discovered something else. Call it dna, call it whatever but I started thinking that there had to be another way. I realized that deep down my base condition was high strung, anxious and hot tempered, much like the rest of my family. Could this be constricting my blood flow? And how do I change that?!!!

This is all hypothetical and I'm not implying that no one should take medication but when I was able to change my "baseline of being", my fundamental life condition, my blood pressure declined. Sure, I have days where I'm all tight with fear and worry but it's within my power to change that.

Again, I don't want to encourage dropping medication. I still take my silly little small dose of diuretic pills but wonder what would happen if I didn't. Maybe nothing. Most likely less .......

 

[muth]

Saving my marriage was my motivator. I was hopelessly addicted. (and I kicked other drug addictions so I rate cigarettes on top of the heap) I resigned myself of dying alone and early. Cig-alikes of the time (2011-2012) didn't do it completely for me. The day I got my first mod and tank I mail ordered (no B&M's here at the time) was the last day I had a cig. I am a born tinkerer so it became a hobby for me as well as an alternative. I really think I could kick nicotine now that I haven't had all the MAOI's in cigs for so long but I would be a crotchety fart for some time till the habit part subsided. I become that way below 18mg MTL, I've tried slowly reducing. My Son vaped for 2 years or so after I switched him over and 1 day just quit vaping also. Anyway, pertinent to the thread I am nic stocked till I would reach the age of 105, assuming my storage method works that long. I build 3D printers, have a lathe, mill, and almost done with a CNC mini mill so hardware isn't a worry. My biological Grandmother made it to 102 and Grandfather to 97. She smoked, chewed, drank, and ran a still and sold it in the day. He never smoked or drank so go figure. (Reading this makes me think of Anna for some reason)

Loved your story, AM. I have longevity in my family as well.

I'm not sure where I stand on the nic pile up. I have some stocked away. One litre is already a few years old and unopened (from the first vapocalypse). I only use 3mg and sometimes none when I'm testing new recipes. I still have a couple of commercial juices I buy and get my nic hit from them. From what I understand I shouldn't have problems ordering them in the future. Unless you know different? If so, do tell.

 

[muth]

It was approx $400 for me - generic brands at 2.5 PAD.
RYO decreased that considerably. IIRC, it was about $10/WEEK using the bulk Criss Cross pipe tobacco that comes in the big sacks.

I was spending about $300 a month when I quit. Before that and in between my cigarette habits, I started smoking a lady pipe. My teeth were brown, my dentist appalled and I was inhaling it! Switched back to cigs after about 2 yrs.

 

[Alexander Mundy]

I still have a couple of commercial juices I buy and get my nic hit from them. From what I understand I shouldn't have problems ordering them in the future. Unless you know different? If so, do tell

Call it "prepper syndrome". It is quite possible that eliquid will be available, but political winds change. Without getting into politics or motivations, there is already a considerable amount of political clout in DC that would outright ban them now. There are many countries where ecigs are banned completely, and some of those bans came with little or no warning. Nic is the linchpin and if the powers that be at some point in the future wanted to ban or tightly control ecigs that is the one thing I would have difficulty getting or making. As I understand it EU has a 20mg/ml IIRC limit and you can only buy that in limited quantities. If ecigs do survive on the market (as I certainly hope they do), at some point a federal sin tax is an almost certainty, as well as the numerous state taxes already enacted with more surely to come. The current Senate and House bills being considered would add a ludicrous amount of tax to a liter of 100mg/ml. Without looking them back up $2,700 comes to mind. That would be over $54,000 federal tax for my long term nic stash that I paid less than $800 for.

 

[susieqz]

wanna know what happens when you stop your bp meds?
you have a stroke.

 

[BigPappa]

I still have a couple of commercial juices I buy and get my nic hit from them. From what I understand I shouldn't have problems ordering them in the future. Unless you know different? If so, do tell.

Odds are you will have trouble getting them post-May 2020. If they pass their PMTA you might be ok, but have they submitted one? And as mentioned there are bills on the floor for a $2750/100mg liter of nic.

Your best bet is to DIY and stock up on 100mg nic, enough to last a lifetime. (You will always be able to get PG/VG/Flavorings, they won't ban those or tax them as they are used in things other than vaping).

 

[englishmick]

This final countdown was scary and annoying. But now it's all getting fuzzy. It's looking less likely that we will have an abrupt cutoff of everything. More like a slow unpredictable shut down at the Fed level and random clampdown's in the States and more taxes everywhere. Some stuff still available for a while but more expensive and less choice. Death by a thousand cuts instead of decapitation.

I've stopped buying anyway except for the occasional indulgence. I suspect vape buying 6 months from now will be very frustrating.

 

[Brewdawg1181]

This final countdown was scary and annoying. But now it's all getting fuzzy. It's looking less likely that we will have an abrupt cutoff of everything.

That's what I believe, and have been saying...at least since Trump got involved. I think the backlash, calls to White House, legislators etc. woke up some people that a serious number of votes were at stake. Prior to that, it seemed politicians believed that they would only gain votes with anti legislation, but at least a few now might realize they stand to lose some as well. Maybe.

But at least January's Final Guidance document puts overall shutdown at the bottom of their list.

Not talking all rainbows & butterflies here, but it does seem a little less like total certain death for vaping in May.

 

[BigPappa]

This final countdown was scary and annoying. But now it's all getting fuzzy. It's looking less likely that we will have an abrupt cutoff of everything. More like a slow unpredictable shut down at the Fed level and random clampdown's in the States and more taxes everywhere. Some stuff still available for a while but more expensive and less choice. Death by a thousand cuts instead of decapitation.

I've stopped buying anyway except for the occasional indulgence. I suspect vape buying 6 months from now will be very frustrating.

Some of the stuff going on at the state level in some states almost seems more frightening than May 2020... It's almost like a dictatorship and there is reason to worry that things might happen so swiftly that you barely see it coming.

In my state of Florida they are working on a number of things that are just nuts... And it is bi-partisan which is scary. Our Governor on the other hand has had a hands off approach, which at first gave me a feeling of comfort, but not when I got wind of some of the things in the state senate.

 

[stols001]

BTW, Obamacare was not healthcare; it was a plan for health insurance

That is not how it started out as, it started out as universal health insurance. What we "have " now is most assuredly not what Obama wanted. He was far more ambitious.

I hope they name my local library after him.

I will stop, there are parallelisms to ecigss but I am off topic.

Anna

 

[zoiDman]

“
If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles.
If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat.
If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

 

[Bronze]

That's what I believe, and have been saying...at least since Trump got involved. I think the backlash, calls to White House, legislators etc. woke up some people that a serious number of votes were at stake. Prior to that, it seemed politicians believed that they would only gain votes with anti legislation, but at least a few now might realize they stand to lose some as well. Maybe.

But at least January's Final Guidance document puts overall shutdown at the bottom of their list.
View attachment 869875

Not talking all rainbows & butterflies here, but it does seem a little less like total certain death for vaping in May.

And I go back to my response to, "I vape and I vote". If one votes, who do they vote for? Who has come out in favor of vaping? Don't like what the current administration has done with vaping? Then who is better? Anyone know of any candidate? One could say Trump is not doing enuf to get us out of the gloomy predicament we vapers find ourselves in so vote him out. But remember, if left to the previous administration (who wrote Deeming), vaping would have vanished two years ago.

I vape, I vote. For who? Maybe it should be, I vape and wont vote.

 

[Brewdawg1181]

Some of the stuff going on at the state level in some states almost seems more frightening than May 2020... It's almost like a dictatorship and there is reason to worry that things might happen so swiftly that you barely see it coming.

In my state of Florida they are working on a number of things that are just nuts... And it is bi-partisan which is scary. Our Governor on the other hand has had a hands off approach, which at first gave me a feeling of comfort, but not when I got wind of some of the things in the state senate.

Agreed, state action has looked scary. But at least with state measures, you can find ways to circumvent those. If the total US vape market is throttled, well...

 

[Don29palms]

And I go back to my response to, "I vape and I vote". If one votes, who do they vote for? Who has come out in favor of vaping? Don't like what the current administration has done with vaping? Then who is better? Anyone know of any candidate? One could say Trump is not doing enuf to get us out of the gloomy predicament we vapers find ourselves in so vote him out. But remember, if left to the previous administration (who wrote Deeming), vaping would have vanished two years ago.

I vape, I vote. For who? Maybe it should be, I vape and wont vote.

Again I will say that single issue voting is insane. Vaping is the least of the problems when it comes to the candidates running right now. Yes voting is your choice but elections have consequences. Serious consequences.

 

[Brewdawg1181]

Again I will say that single issue voting is insane. Vaping is the least of the problems when it comes to the candidates running right now. Yes voting is your choice but elections have consequences. Serious consequences.

Absolutely. Unless your single issue is Constitutional Originalism vs. Activism.

But I don't think he was implying anyone should choose candidates based on vaping only- but that one should consider when voting which candidates will be less likely to infringe on rights to vaping and other liberties.