ok what ever OP means? i call it an evil because that's my opinion nothing more then an opinion im entitled to my opinion same as everyone else . are we inhaling a heated substance into our lungs that hasn't been 100% proven safe well yes we are . is there any concrete solid long term evidence that exists ........no there isn't . hence in my opinion agree or not i consider it the lesser of 2 evils . period .
the lesser of 2 evils
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Okay. I can accept that. I am addicted to nicotine, caffeine, the foods I eat, exercise, money, women, good whiskey, and many other things. Are they good for my health? Maybe in that list, only the foods and exercise, so maybe they are not addictions. I just don't care too much if its and addiction or not. I like them.
Is my use of caffeine and nicotine to control my ADHD evil in your mind? I won't be offended by your response.
I view neither activity as evil. In vein of quote above, I don't see smoking as evil and will disagree with anyone who states that it is evil.
Thus, perhaps the discussion needs to visit the term of 'what makes for evil?' And as I haven't read entire thread, perhaps it already has and I can be pointed to that post that presumably we all agree on as best definition of evil.
Frankly, I don't even know why we need that explosive term in this sort of discussion. I dislike the idea that ex-smokers see smoking as evil, but I'm sure I won't change minds that are already made up on this, and filter that view through emotional perceptions.
As one who currently chooses to do both activities, while also having experience of being smoke free in my adult life for a significant period of time, I clearly understand vaping to be less harmful than smoking. I don't understand vaping to be harmless.
I don't see vaping as a fad. I believe it'll be around in some form 100 years from now. FDA/government could declare "War on Vaping" and I'm sure it'll be around 100 years from now. My proof for this will be found in the time period of 2113.
OP = Original Poster. I see you are new. I was not trying to throw confusing jargon at you.
The absence of "concrete solid long term evidence" does not make a thing evil in most people's minds. You are totally free to hold that rather unique opinion.
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that's great im happy to hear of your sucess , so far in my 50+ days of vaping from what i have personally experienced . what ive seen different side effects etc i haven't had such an easy go of it trying new things and experimenting so to speak but im still trying so i apologize if i come across as alittle skeptical and you don't agree with my terms .
I can understand it Wv and I applaud and well, admire, how passionate you are about what vaping does for people.
On the whole I agree with you so ya know I have no problem with what you're saying here, it did just seem a little strong though lol. However you admit that of yourself and a person that can admit something less than perfect to themselves and to others deserves admiration in my opinion!..
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Ditto!
(Except for the 'Women'
... and Whiskey 
part of your post... I'm right on board with you EdDardinWinter!) In my previous post on this thread, I alluded, (tongue in cheek), to my vaping choice as the lesser of two evils.
I honestly believe most of you that know me are aware that I was being facetious, and in no way shape or form honestly believe vaping to be evil... and THAT is my OFFICIAL position on it.
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is your use of caffeine and nicotine to control ADHD an evil Hell no !!!!! its better then some of the garbage on the the market out there you go man ,,,,, whatever gets you through the day .
me personally i am in a high stress job , i love my coffee and my nicotine . i pull 13 hr days 6 day some times 7 a week i sometimes forget what day it is . im in my office right now give that schedule a whirl and see if your not pounding coffee and nicotine im sitting here right next to ya .
A couple of suggestions:
Have you tried VG only e-liquids? PG allergies are rare, but I know a couple of people who have them.
Have you used liquids from several different vendors? Some people have allergies to certain food coloring or flavor. So it could just be the brand you are using.
I have been vaping solely for over 4 years, if I cannot vape I will smoke...
I am addicted to nicotine, and caffeine, red meat and a whole lot of things that are not "good" for me, but I have found that by vaping I have stopped the intake of the vast amount of harmful chemicals added into commercial cigarettes and filtered cigars.
I do not suffer from shortness of breath as I did, or have bronchitis 3 times a year at least! I do not wheeze when I breathe and I feel better.
I do exercise regularly and working out is easier, so in my opinion vaping has been my relief.
I did experience a sensitivity to PG based fluids in the beginning, but that went away very quickly.
I personally feel that vaping will be better for me, and will be proved to be "healthier" if there is such a thing in comparison to any combustion type of inhalation of tobacco.
One has to remember we are inhaling food grade components that are deemed "safe", if they are safe to ingest which of course they are digested, but none the less considered safe from the get go, then inhaling said components are just as safe.
Of course nicotine is a highly addictive drug and can be deadly in its undiluted or concentrated form, but I am not trying to stop my nicotine intake, just change my method of delivery.
For me vaping is a great way to deal with what smoking used to.....
No to mention my desire to terminate idiots is also put at bay LOL
I am addicted to nicotine, and caffeine, red meat and a whole lot of things that are not "good" for me, but I have found that by vaping I have stopped the intake of the vast amount of harmful chemicals added into commercial cigarettes and filtered cigars.
I do not suffer from shortness of breath as I did, or have bronchitis 3 times a year at least! I do not wheeze when I breathe and I feel better.
I do exercise regularly and working out is easier, so in my opinion vaping has been my relief.
I did experience a sensitivity to PG based fluids in the beginning, but that went away very quickly.
I personally feel that vaping will be better for me, and will be proved to be "healthier" if there is such a thing in comparison to any combustion type of inhalation of tobacco.
One has to remember we are inhaling food grade components that are deemed "safe", if they are safe to ingest which of course they are digested, but none the less considered safe from the get go, then inhaling said components are just as safe.
Of course nicotine is a highly addictive drug and can be deadly in its undiluted or concentrated form, but I am not trying to stop my nicotine intake, just change my method of delivery.
For me vaping is a great way to deal with what smoking used to.....
No to mention my desire to terminate idiots is also put at bay LOL
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Ditto!
(Except for the 'Women'
In my previous post on this thread, I alluded, (tongue in cheek), to my vaping choice as the lesser of two evils.
I honestly believe most of you that know me are aware that I was being facetious, and in no way shape or form honestly believe vaping to be evil... and THAT is my OFFICIAL position on it.
Well I would not expect you to be addicted to either of those things. Although, I know more than a few women who appreciate a good single malt or blended whiskey just as much as I do. To each their own, yes?
Everything is evil, nothing is evil. "Good" and "evil" are convenient extreme black and white labels people like to place on things which because of their extreme tend to not be accurate.
Are the biologic drugs I could go on that can cause lymphoma evil? I think so at this time.
Is Advil, which can cause a flare but works for my migraines an evil? It depends, did I miss the window to take Imitrex? Do the heart risks of Imitrex make it an evil or does the fact that I can't blindly pop Advil making Imitrex a good?
Maybe Imitrex is good for me but evil for someone else, like situational ethics.
It's just a saying.
Vaping is a good for us because it is the lesser risk. Vaping could be an evil for a non-smoker because it's not replacing a known harm for a lesser risk.
Define long term. There have been people vaping for at least 8 years. Many 4 and 5 years. If it takes 50 years for a problem to show it's probably not a huge risk.
All of the ingredients (sans some flavorings) have been well tested long term. There are no known synergistic reactions with the ingredients. It may not be solid and long term but it sure does come as close as it can for a new product.
yes i have tried several different types of liquids , etc
and im still on the curb about all of this so if you can help or anyone else can by all mean please share .....because it has been a hard last 50+ days and im honestly getting discouraged .
ok let me respond to this so you guys aren't confused , i define evil or use the term " lesser there of " about anything that causes me pain or discomfort in some way .
now keeping in mind many of you vets on ecf have prob found the perfect vape i have seen it called but i haven't , some of the stuff i have used has burned my throat , gave me nose bleeds , tore my mouth up etc etc im still experimenting ....hence making it hard and discouraging and well skeptical .
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YES indeed!
Wellllllllllll, to be perfectly honest, every now and then I indulge in an ice cold Whiskey sour myself....
Don't be discouraged Skinr, you're right that some of us have already found our perfect vape but it took some time. Stick it out and keep looking here for answers, there will be one.
For me it was all down to the device itself, I found the MVP 2 a week or so ago with an iclear 30 I've finally come across something that works well for me, it's gonna be up to your preference, unfortunately you'll only find what's right for you by trial, check out some recommendations and reviews and work from there.
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YES indeed!
Wellllllllllll, to be perfectly honest, every now and then I indulge in an ice cold Whiskey sour myself....
Nothing wrong with that!
I never (almost never) over indulge with whiskey. A couple to relax is my usual consumption. I have mine with just a couple ice cubes, however.
Tapped out
Speaking honestly, but philosophically, I know of nothing on this planet then that is not evil, by your definition of that term.
Water can drown people.
Food can cause discomforts, in some way.
Air we breath can cause discomforts, in some way.
Too much exercise, or the wrong kind of exercise, can cause pain.
With your use of that term, I am willing to tolerate a whole bunch of 'evil' even while it is plausible that being dead is the escape from all evil.
ok let me ask you all something ,
im hurting everyday , my mouth my throat is raw no matter how much liquids i consume , nose bleeds out of no where , i have been checked by a doctor ,
im feeling pain and discouragement ,some things im feeling i have read posts from others that say oh it will go away well its not .... if the proper title to this tread isn't " the lesser of 2 evils "
what should i have used ?
im hurting everyday , my mouth my throat is raw no matter how much liquids i consume , nose bleeds out of no where , i have been checked by a doctor ,
im feeling pain and discouragement ,some things im feeling i have read posts from others that say oh it will go away well its not .... if the proper title to this tread isn't " the lesser of 2 evils "
what should i have used ?
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