The Really Big RY4 Roundup (long)

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passerbyeus

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Vermiillion base is good even though it may be like the others, that base may be the kicker for me. I won a free sample :laugh: cant wait to try it.

Anyway, VR4: Custom, not classic. Has the signature VermillionRiver base tobacco flavor. More like another of the seemingly endless variations on Kentucky Premium than a standalone RY4.[/QUOTE]
 

thehangdude

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Well, I got a PM from Vermillion Rivers. They chose KY4, so I won 60ml of KY4. I asked for 30 of the KY4 and 30I of the Blend no7. I would like to try both.

I do have plenty of Vanilla (not as much as bill) and the Cherry. Love those and the Premium and the Applewood.

I will post a review when I get my KY4.
 

billherbst

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Well, I got a PM from Vermillion Rivers. They chose KY4, so I won 60ml of KY4. I asked for 30 of the KY4 and 30I of the Blend no7. I would like to try both.

hangdude: Apparently my seconding your name selection on the VR-naming thread was a lucky post, since I also got a PM from VermillionRiver informing me that I had won a "random 10ml bottle." Hope they send me Kentucky Premium, as I'm down to only my not-all-that-close DIY facsimile. LOL. Murphy's Law says that they'll send me more Kentucky Vanilla. Double LOL.
 

kademic

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Help! Help! Help! I haven't been vaping long, but found a juice i love. Been trying to get my dad off analogs, with no luck, till i happen to get a bottle of BB RY4 and he put the anologs down till he had vaped the whole bottle. Now back to the analogs. Could anyone recommend any flavor, from Don or anywhere else, that is somewhat like bb RY4. Possibly another RY4 or maybe just something you feel i might have a chance of getting him to like.
 

thehangdude

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Help! Help! Help! I haven't been vaping long, but found a juice i love. Been trying to get my dad off analogs, with no luck, till i happen to get a bottle of BB RY4 and he put the anologs down till he had vaped the whole bottle. Now back to the analogs. Could anyone recommend any flavor, from Don or anywhere else, that is somewhat like bb RY4. Possibly another RY4 or maybe just something you feel i might have a chance of getting him to like.

Wow, tough call. I would say Applewood from Don is good fresh. Casablanca is good after about 4 weeks steeping. But neither one is like BWB's RY4.

You might try Mom and Pop Vapor Shop's RY4v2 or Goodejuice's GJ4. Both of these are universally liked (if there is such a thing). Or maybe DK Tab.

Finding that perfect juice is very hard. Add to that, after you find it, vendors tend to change something or even kill the juice off (like Don did with his RY4).

If money is not an option, I suggest Turkish Blend with WTA from Aroma Ejuice. It is about the best tasting stuff I have tried! Add to that, WTA helps to kill the ciggy craving.
 

passerbyeus

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So you not asking for a bigger bottle of the KY4 is not a good thing? Hope you do a review on this one.


hangdude: Apparently my seconding your name selection on the VR-naming thread was a lucky post, since I also got a PM from VermillionRiver informing me that I had won a "random 10ml bottle." Hope they send me Kentucky Premium, as I'm down to only my not-all-that-close DIY facsimile. LOL. Murphy's Law says that they'll send me more Kentucky Vanilla. Double LOL.
 

billherbst

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So you not asking for a bigger bottle of the KY4 is not a good thing? Hope you do a review on this one.

Passerbyeus,

Yes, I'll review KY4 soon, after it steeps. But why would I want a bigger bottle of it? I have a cabinet full of RY4s! 76 of them. I have so much RY4 that it's coming out of my ears---1400ml of the stuff. The only reason I vape RY4 at all anymore is for this thread. I have vague recollections of actually liking RY4 at some point in the far distant past. Now, though, I'm just an RY4 scientist/researcher/critic/commentator. Detached. Dispassionate. Jaded. LOL.

But I'm just exaggerating... (No, I'm not) (Yes, I am) (No, I'm not) (Yes, I am).
 

sandybeach

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Question for you guys that have tried Hangsen. I'm a lightweight; I only vape 6 mg. I used to get most of my 6 mg. Dekang RY4 from Mad Vapes. They don't have it anymore. They have Hangsen. Is that the same as Dekang in flavor? Or even any good?

If not, do you know where to get 6 mg. Dekang RY4 other than ordering from China?
Thanks!
Sandy
 

billherbst

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Question for you guys that have tried Hangsen. I'm a lightweight; I only vape 6 mg. I used to get most of my 6 mg. Dekang RY4 from Mad Vapes. They don't have it anymore. They have Hangsen. Is that the same as Dekang in flavor? Or even any good? If not, do you know where to get 6 mg. Dekang RY4 other than ordering from China?
Thanks!
Sandy

Sandy,

Dekang and Hangsen are often quite different. Buying one as a substitute for the other would be a roll of the dice. Maybe OK, maybe not. Same applies to JoyeTech liquid. The various Hangsen juices I've tried have been more interesting to me than the many Dekang juices I've vaped, but that may be just my bias, based on Dekang's being ubiquitous and an easy target at which to take pot shots, sometimes unfairly.

VaporLeaf is the only U.S. vendor I could find with 6mg Dekang, but they have only nine flavors, so ptooey on that. Guess it's China only. HealthCabin has 6mg Dekang and is the most obvious choice, but other less well-known (on ECF) Chinese vendors carry Dekang 6mg as well---E-Liquid.cn is an example. That site will sell you a truckload of any Dekang in any size or nic strength you want (including the handy 40-gallon drum size).

Or you could go straight to the horse's mouth and buy your juice direct from Dekang.
 

IVapus

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Question for you guys that have tried Hangsen. I'm a lightweight; I only vape 6 mg. I used to get most of my 6 mg. Dekang RY4 from Mad Vapes. They don't have it anymore. They have Hangsen. Is that the same as Dekang in flavor? Or even any good?

If not, do you know where to get 6 mg. Dekang RY4 other than ordering from China?
Thanks!
Sandy

Allegedly, based on what I've read in more than one place, the Hangsen RY4 is a return to the old or an old(I won't say original, because I'm not sure it's meaningful) Dekang RY4 formula from a couple of years ago. That's the first e-liquid I really liked a lot but by the time I had finished my first bottle it had forever changed, much to my chagrin. I found the subsequent Dekang version(s) just okay but not even close to the same thing. There's a whole drama you can read about the original Dekang chemist quitting and defecting to Hangsen in early 2010 taking with him the secret recipes for many of their flavors and triggering some of the Dekang flavor changes you see complaints about around that time. Of course if you're used to the more recent Dekang version you may prefer it over the older version. I've been meaning to try the Hangsen RY4 one of these days to see if it really is a return to the old Dekang. With some exceptions, I've read more positive feedback on the Hangsen juices in general vs. the Dekang lately, but have yet to try them myself.
 

billherbst

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Allegedly, based on what I've read in more than one place, the Hangsen RY4 is a return to the old or an old(I won't say original, because I'm not sure it's meaningful) Dekang RY4 formula from a couple of years ago. That's the first e-liquid I really liked a lot but by the time I had finished my first bottle it had forever changed, much to my chagrin. I found the subsequent Dekang version(s) just okay but not even close to the same thing. There's a whole drama you can read about the original Dekang chemist quitting and defecting to Hangsen in early 2010 taking with him the secret recipes for many of their flavors and triggering some of the Dekang flavor changes you see complaints about around that time. Of course if you're used to the more recent Dekang version you may prefer it over the older version. I've been meaning to try the Hangsen RY4 one of these days to see if it really is a return to the old Dekang. With some exceptions, I've read more positive feedback on the Hangsen juices in general vs. the Dekang lately, but have yet to try them myself.

IVapus,

Woven throughout this long thread are discussions---including speculation, opinion, gossip, and even some very interesting revelations---concerning both the origins of RY4 itself in 2007 and the history of what happened when and after the fabled Dekang RY4 was "lost" (stolen) in 2009.

The shortest synopsis I can offer is that apparently Ludo, one of the owners of Janty, and a Chinese flavor chemist (presumably working for Dekang) "invented" RY4 in an impromptu session in the lab of a Chinese juice manufacturing facility one day in 2007. They called their creation Ruyan #4 (ruyan being Chinese slang for "cigarette-like" and #4 since it was the fourth flavoring recipe formula revision they tried in the session that day), then shortened that name to the acronym "RY4." So, at least according to the story we got from Ludo, Janty Classic RY4 is the original RY4---and remains so today---with Elixir RY4 being nearly identical.

As for the "lost" Dekang, our story here matches yours with minor differences. For instance, we didn't know that Hangsen was the company for which that flavor chemist (who may or may not have been the co-creator of RY4) quit Dekang. I read that he left to form a new start-up juice company. But maybe that was Hangsen. We also discovered documents online confirming that this chemist was subsequently arrested for industrial theft of intellectual property, tried and convicted, and imprisoned in China. (The Chinese are notoriously harsh on punishing law-breakers.) He may still be in prison to this day, but that's unconfirmed. And, of course, the whereabouts of the "secret RY4 formula" remain unknown.

I have some 2011 Hangsen RY4 from Liberty-Flights that I reviewed on this thread (post #755). I wasn't terribly impressed at first, but lately I find it quite pleasing---milder and more laid-back than many classic RY4 formulations, but very good. Whether it's a replica of the lost Dekang I can't say, since I didn't start vaping until autumn 2010 and never had any of that now-mythic Dekang RY4.

I would hazard a guess, though, that the Hangsen RY4 I've got is probably not the same as the lost Dekang. That's just my uninformed opinion, but my particular bottle of Hangsen RY4 is a very easy-going, pleasant vape. By contrast, I conclude from reading posts by veteran vapers that the 2009 Dekang must have been spectacular. Hard to imagine that the Hangsen I'm vaping right now would fit that bill or be the source of such fierce loyalty even years later. I mean, it's pretty good, but the Hangsen RY4 (and Hangsen RY1, 2, and 3, as well) are hardly the nectar of the gods.
 
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revolver

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Sharing Yesterday's Dream...

I went online and there was a new store called "RY4 Emporium" which included every availabe version of RY4... I was very excited, of course, and I left this page with the intention to post about it here, only to find out there was a post by Bill about another similar fashion store called "Everything RY4"... Some replied there were others; "RY4 Ware-house" and "4" were other names I remember.

This thread really got into my subconscious...

Huuuuuuaaah !!!
 

IVapus

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Bill, thanks for the additional info and clarification. I got into a zone a few months ago after first hearing about Hangsen and googled everything I could find about their origins and as a side-effect got sidetracked into the story of the original Dekang RY4. In fact, that search led me to your thread here which I read in it's entirety. I didn't remember what exactly I'd read where though. I do know that I picked up some of it from the forums at Liberty Flights who were among the first to shift from Dekang to Hangsen after the drama, but I know I picked up some of the story from other forums as well that I don't recall, including one where a representative from Hangsen was posting directly when all of this was going down and was being accused of all sorts of dirty underhanded business practices by other forum posters in the aftermath. I don't recall seeing anything about anyone being prosecuted and going to jail though. I have read reviews that say the Hangsen tastes like the original Dekang but can't vouch for it myself.

I started vaping in the Spring of 2010 and I think what I had the first time was the fabled Dekang. The fact that I was never able to get a hold of it again only enhanced the mythical and legendary aspects of it in my mind, lol. What I remember clearly is that it was more tobacco than anything, a fairly mild pleasant one. The very lightly sweet caramel aspect was just barely perceptible on the exhale only. It was so subtle that I didn't even detect it the first few times I vaped it. Of course my tastebuds at the time were only just recovering from 20+ years of smoking, so that may have been a factor. In general though, I seem to be in the minority in that I like subtle flavors that you sort of discover nuances of gradually more so than the in your face flavors that seems to be all the rage with many vapers, particularly new ones. I don't subscribe to the principle that if full flavor is good, double flavor is better. I enjoy some of the flavors that overwhelm the senses but only in short bursts, and then I tend to get burned out on them for a while.

I'm in complete agreement with you that the quality of that original Dekang RY4 is probably greatly exaggerated and came about more so because it disappeared unexpectedly. Kind of like an artist or rock star dying young and suddenly becoming a legend without equal in the process.

Thanks for this thread btw. I've learned a lot reading through it and enjoy keeping up with it.
 

billherbst

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I started vaping in the Spring of 2010 and I think what I had the first time was the fabled Dekang. The fact that I was never able to get a hold of it again only enhanced the mythical and legendary aspects of it in my mind, lol. What I remember clearly is that it was more tobacco than anything, a fairly mild pleasant one. The very lightly sweet caramel aspect was just barely perceptible on the exhale only. It was so subtle that I didn't even detect it the first few times I vaped it. Of course my tastebuds at the time were only just recovering from 20+ years of smoking, so that may have been a factor.

Well, then perhaps Hangsen RY4 is based on the fabled Dekang recipe. Your description of the 2009-early 2010 Dekang certainly matches my experience of the 2011 Hangsen.

In general though, I seem to be in the minority in that I like subtle flavors that you sort of discover nuances of gradually more so than the in your face flavors that seems to be all the rage with many vapers, particularly new ones. I don't subscribe to the principle that if full flavor is good, double flavor is better. I enjoy some of the flavors that overwhelm the senses but only in short bursts, and then I tend to get burned out on them for a while.

Me too. Extra bold, intensely-flavored juices do have that OMG Wow factor. Their raw power can knock me on my keister, but it also blows out my taste buds very quickly. I find that the most longstanding and durable of the 25-or-so juices that comprise my "stable" of daily vapes seem to be smoother and more subtle. Certain new In-Your-Face juices I try join the stable during my infatuated courtships with them, but those tend to get moved out to pasture after awhile.

Even with my long-term faves, though, my taste buds wax and wane. I marvel at people who vape one juice for a year. Amazing. I never vape just a single juice in a day, but I usually have one that I vape more of than any others. I'll do a lot of Bounty Hunter for a month, then find myself drawn back to Kentucky Premium or Boba's the next month. Many juices, such as Mapacho Tobacco or Kona Coffee Milkshake, are guest stars who get one or two days a month in the limelight. My current daily winner is a 40-60 mix of GoodEJuice Vita Bella with a haphazard diy blend of seven different vanillas.

I'm in complete agreement with you that the quality of that original Dekang RY4 is probably greatly exaggerated and came about more so because it disappeared unexpectedly. Kind of like an artist or rock star dying young and suddenly becoming a legend without equal in the process.

Yes, everything we know confirms that human memory is notoriously malleable, altered sometimes wildly by sentiment, attitude, and belief.

Thanks for this thread btw. I've learned a lot reading through it and enjoy keeping up with it.

You're very welcome. I soldier on as the combination overseer and janitor of the Really Big RY4 Roundup thread, but it would die tomorrow without the folks who share and contribute. So thank you!
 

Zombitedesade

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RY4's on test:
Today I'm going to have a look at two juices from relatively new uk vender: vapistvapours. These guys and girls started out over on the uk Vapers forum and whilst I'm not a regular poster over there, i became aware of their juices thanks to Scott over on ECR (YouTube name: igetcha69)

First up an unusual sounding RY4 variant known as Doctor Why For? (Dr-Y4)
It's 16mg nic and a nice and simple 50/50 PG/VG mix


This juice is, frankly weird. I still don't really know if I like it. Blinding buying 30mls of the stuff (it's pretty cheap though) as I did I don't know if I'm trying to convince myself I like it or if, in fact I geuinely do.

The first unmistakable quality to me, is its exceedingly heavy vanilla tones. This is a very heavy vanilla mix but one which manages to not come across as a burnt custard or too sweet on the high end as is often the case with vanilla heavy mixes. This mix retains an earthy Tobacoo bass with vanilla flourishes on the exhale. It's almost a heavy Tobacoo and vanilla mix all in one. It's difficult to describe and is certianly among the most unusual Ry4 mixes I've ever vaped.

It's not classic Ry4 at all. If there is caramel here it's so background and drowned by sweet vanilla and earthy Tobacoo it's presence is near absent entirely. For a mix which sits in with Ry4 variants it perhapes deserves its own little section outside of this labelling because, in the strictest sense, this isn't RY4 by any measure we'd know it as. I'd class this as a Tobacoo juice with a sweet but actually quite pleasent vanilla (if you like vanilla, if you don't, you'll hate this juice).

Final notes: oddly this juice is incredibly red looking. It looks very artificial and is certianly the only RY4 mix I've ever had that was near bright red in colour. Anyone who has tried janty vanilla elixir will know the red I mean here, it's the same.

The Tobacoo is earthy, nutty but also has an rather unmistakable and slightly unfortunate sense of sweat or staleness to it. It's not over powering or strong, but it's there. Hints of it mix with the earthy Tobacoo leaf and linger slightly to long on the exhale.

I don't dislike this juice (i think!) but it's not something I could vape all day. The signature vanilla heavy nature of it gets rather boring over extended periods and I got a little sick of it after filling my reo grand with it, I was happy to see it replaced out for something else come the end. I'll vape it again, but I can't in good faith recommend to fellow Ry4 fans, unless, you like a vanilla heavy Tobacoo blend. Odd juice, almost works then, but not quite.

Next from vapistvapours:
RY4. 50/50. 16mg

This mix I expected to be quite different from the above juice. Yes it's the same vendor and yes most vendors have signature tobaccos which are used across multiple juices, but, at the end of the day they are two seperate products and so I thought, two different flavours would be apparent.

Selling this as an Ry4, one rightly has some expectations of a classic Ry4 flavour notes.There are hints of it, but with that oddly vanilla heavy, earthy stale tobacoo (which must be vapistvapours signature Tobacoo) this Ry4 dosent really work for me. It's incredibly similar to the doctor mix above. It's perhapes a sweeter mix and the vanilla is slightly less pronounced here, but it's cut from the same cloth.

I don't get much caramel from this Ry4. Whilst lessoned over the doctor variety, it's a vanilla heavy Tobacoo blend Ry4 and again, like the doctor mix, one where the strong vanilla flavour out stays its welcome and makes the juice pretty hard to recommend as an all day vape or really as one wrth considering over other superior RY4 blends.

Final notes: These are unique Ry4's. The Tobacoo base is like none other I've ever tried (though closest I suppose to a red label Totally Wicked mix) and whilst I found it out stayed its welcome in both mixes here, the vanilla is actually a success in the sense it avoids a burnt dessert / custard flavour so many vanilla heavy blends suffer from. Try only if you like vanilla then, but otherwise I'd say maybe give them a miss if you really only want classic Ry4 flavours without compromise.
 
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STILLSMOK9

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Well, then perhaps Hangsen RY4 is based on the fabled Dekang recipe. Your description of the 2009-early 2010 Dekang certainly matches my experience of the 2011 Hangsen.

Bill,

There is no comparison between Hangsen and the 'Lost' RY4! Hangsen is decent at best, while the 'Lost Formula WAS the Holy Grail........:)
 

billherbst

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There is no comparison between Hangsen and the 'Lost' RY4! Hangsen is decent at best, while the 'Lost Formula WAS the Holy Grail........:)

Still,

Howdy. I was waiting for you to join this particular conversation. I figured you'd be miles away from Ivapus in regarding Hangsen RY4 as even vaguely similar to the lost 2009 Dekang. LOL.
 
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