The whole "Kids!" thing...

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Richard75

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Chester Copperpot.

I heard he never came back from his treasure hunt. Something about One-Eyed Willy?

Anyway, the fact of the matter is that vaping is currently a "trend". Zumiez were a trend too, but any damages incurred by them were not attributed to the roller skate industry. Also, are these kids vaping with a Provari and Kayfun, or is it one of those hookah pens? My sister, who is well below the legal smoking age, has tons of hookah pens.

This is a hard topic. vaping has so many potential benefits outside of quitting smoking, like dieting (want a chocolate bar? Vape some chocolate flavoring instead! Or vape soda pop instead of drinking it), or even a bit of medicinal uses (drying out the lungs and such). Sure, the first should be kept away from kids, but what about the second? I think they'd be hits for teens a few weeks before prom, or photo day. Vaping doesn't, and shouldn't, belong to the e-cig industry. It's unfortunate that any vaporizer is viewed as inherent to e-cig's. With obesity such an issue, especially in America, I think we're missing a huge opportunity here. Kids don't want the nicotine, they want the cool factor. Let them have the technology, we'll keep the nicotine. ;)
 

kslice917

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I would still say that people under 18 should not be allowed to vape. There's a simple reason for it: respect. Most of the younger generation today do not have the respect that's expected of an adult. If somebody doesn't want me to vape around them, I don't - no questions asked. In return, I would ask that people don't smoke around me - I don't like second-hand smoke.

Another problem(s) is temptation, normality, and peer pressure. I never smoked cigarettes in high-school. But then I graduated, I moved on, I made new friends, and everybody around me smoked. Nobody pressured me into doing it. But being around it day after day, it become "normal" which tempted me to try it. Well this "normal" behavior carried on for years, until I realized that I was doing it on my own.

So in my opinion, if kids start vaping in school, they don't need to pressure others into trying it. Others will see them doing it on a daily basis and then it becomes "the norm". Sure, leave it to the parents to make sure their kids aren't doing it - but how well has that worked in the past? Fact of the matter is that a lot of parents are just as irresponsible as the children they govern. Not to mention the fact that kids have friends, their friends do things that they shouldn't, and when they hang out with those friends - so do they.
 

Jman8

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Vaping does have limits? I'm curious what limits you see vaping having.
Children can't vape in school, for instance. A business has a right to say "no vaping allowed". (And we have a right to do business elsewhere if we wish). A person can not allow vaping in their own car or home if they choose. That's a few to get you started, and I'm sure I could come up with more.

But these aren't limits inherent to vaping. By your logic, ANTZ aren't doing anything extraordinary / wrong. Instead they are just setting reasonable limits to something that needs to be limited. Usage bans become reasonable under this logic. Flavor bans become reasonable under this logic. Limiting the amount of nicotine in a vape becomes reasonable. So on and so forth.

I'm a fan of vaping in public, and I do it daily. But it's silly to call someone an ANTZ (I hate that term) because they don't think kids should be vaping in school during class.

I would say it depends on their reasoning / justification.

Thus far in this thread, I could easily come up with counter examples to those who are saying never vape in a class. Ever. Period. I could bring forth rationale that would (easily) challenge this, and suddenly have these people question and/or stipulate their assertions, thus making the "ever, period" thing appear silly. Or as silly as it appears to me right now. Am glad to do this, but feel the larger point needs to be said.

And that is that these reasons for not vaping in class can and will be used for why not to vape anywhere regardless of your age or status in life. So, I'll just revisit earlier post that gave reason for not vaping in class, not cite which post I'm alluding to, but re-adapt the same logic to apply to where adults should never vape and why (using same logic).

Adults should never vape in a car while driving. Never. It is absolutely ridiculous to conclude otherwise. It's not about whether the vapor itself is deemed harmful, not harmful, has nic or not, etc. It's about the fact that you are in a CAR. It's a distraction to drivers around you, who are also there to DRIVE. Keep both hands on the wheel and think about safety rather than get your nic fix or looking cool with your latest eCig device.

I do agree with you in general about how people should be allowed to vape starting at 14. I don't think it should be encouraged, but I don't think that a law against it will help anything. Personally, I'd put no age rule on it and leave it to parents to deal with. That doesn't mean that kids suddenly get control of the classroom and can do anything they want.

I would say we agree more than we disagree. Especially if you would say outside of classrooms, but still inside of school, these same people could vape, and it would be perfectly acceptable.
 

AndriaD

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It may turn out not to be. The truth is the makers of the artificial flavors don't reveal what's in their flavors. So there is no way an ejuice vendor can know. Until that gets proven one way or the other,I will play it safe and anything that MIGHT contain nut oils will stay at home. I will only take my strawberry or orange flavors out.

That's no answer; my son is 25 and still throws up strawberries, always, and goes completely anaphylactic with coconut -- even the coconut body scrub I (used to) keep in the shower, with the lid fastened, and tub rinsed out.

And no, I have no earthly idea how he got so allergy-sensitive; I nursed him for 3 months, hoping to avoid allergies, but apparently it didn't work, or didn't work *enough*.

I also think those who won't even vape in their own homes are stupid and completely brainwashed and obviously lacking in self-esteem if they won't do it even in their own homes -- but this thing with vaping in public, allergies, etc.... *sigh* I really really hate to say it, but I think I have to come down on the side of the *ANTZ* on that one, and it pains me more than you know.

Andria
 

Dusif

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I would almost bet my favorit apv that we all either bought beer, cogarettes or some other age limited thing before we were supposed to when we were teens... I can still remember how it was not being old enough to do stuff... I couldnt care less to be honest, and if i couldnt buy what i wanted i would find another way of getting it...

So you can sit here and discuss pros and cons and how its wrong and so on... But in the end nothing can keep the kids and teens from picking up vaping if they want to

Bans and restriction makes it fun and cool... Education is the only way to avoid the problem...


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AndriaD

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"We don't need no education. We don't need no thought control."

That was a hit when I graduated. The song was played at our graduation assembly. Kids stood up on their seats and started jumping up and down and breaking them. Looked around at some of my peers and thought, "Damn, you do need some education, and a little bit of thought control wouldn't hurt you big babies either."

Edit: Just want to point out, I am a huge Pink Floyd fan and was absolutely disgusted at the way most others who were into them totally missed the whole concept of the album. The reason Roger Waters "built The Wall" was partly because of stupid fans. :)

ROFL... that came out right after (the winter after) I graduated, but I've always edited it to be.. "we don't need no education... we just need some GRAMMAR LESSONS..." Because clearly whoever wrote that lyric DOES need grammar lessons!!! :D

Andria
 

Elizabeth Baldwin

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This thread only proves you can't please the masses!

:)

The gov can regulate til their blue in the face but kids will still do things. For example...alcohol is regulated... And yet we have underage drinkers all over.

You can take all the nice flavors away and guess what... Kids will still do it!
 

AndriaD

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Adults should never vape in a car while driving. Never. It is absolutely ridiculous to conclude otherwise. It's not about whether the vapor itself is deemed harmful, not harmful, has nic or not, etc. It's about the fact that you are in a CAR. It's a distraction to drivers around you, who are also there to DRIVE. Keep both hands on the wheel and think about safety rather than get your nic fix or looking cool with your latest eCig device.

Damn, I'm sure glad you're not the boss of me! I always smoke while driving, so I expect I'll be vaping while driving too. The benefits of cig-a-likes... you don't have to do anything but suck on it... just like a cigarette!

Sheesh!

Andria
 

Elizabeth Baldwin

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Damn, I'm sure glad you're not the boss of me! I always smoke while driving, so I expect I'll be vaping while driving too. The benefits of cig-a-likes... you don't have to do anything but suck on it... just like a cigarette!

Sheesh!

Andria


I second that! I Vape while driving! How is it a distraction? My eyes are on the road the entire time, unlike when I smoked cigs, I was always digging for a lighter or distracted by ashes or fire falling! Much safer vaping.
 

AndriaD

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This thread only proves you can't please the masses!

:)

The gov can regulate til their blue in the face but kids will still do things. For example...alcohol is regulated... And yet we have underage drinkers all over.

You can take all the nice flavors away and guess what... Kids will still do it!

Not sure why the "like" button isn't on your post... I was going to "like" it because it's so true. And forbidding them to do it makes it even MORE fun! ;)

Andria
 

Jman8

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Damn, I'm sure glad you're not the boss of me! I always smoke while driving, so I expect I'll be vaping while driving too. The benefits of cig-a-likes... you don't have to do anything but suck on it... just like a cigarette!

Sheesh!

Andria

That's what she said.

I mean, um, I vape when I drive and enjoy every minute of it.
 

AndriaD

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I second that! I Vape while driving! How is it a distraction? My eyes are on the road the entire time, unlike when I smoked cigs, I was always digging for a lighter or distracted by ashes or fire falling! Much safer vaping.

Yeah, I was just thinking that... I drop ashes over myself on a regular basis, but I don't worry about it, unless they're HOT... now, that gets my attention, and surely makes me a hazard -- or when you throw the .... out the window, and it comes back, and goes between your back and the seat... I've ruined more shirts that way!

And yep again, I once had a wreck that totalled two cars, trying to find my lighter. Vaping has GOT to be safer than that!!!

Andria
 

Ohms Lawbreaker

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ROFL... that came out right after (the winter after) I graduated, but I've always edited it to be.. "we don't need no education... we just need some GRAMMAR LESSONS..." Because clearly whoever wrote that lyric DOES need grammar lessons!!! :D

Andria

Actually, I believe he may have been with us on this one, And. Think he was being ironic. Roger Waters is a brilliant lyricist and no fool, he knew the song would sell and be a hit, but taken as a whole, it is a mockery of ignorance and bad behavior. More of a Dark Side of the Moon fan myself, but The Wall makes some good points. Why be a fan of the group and go to their concert if you're only going to jump around and scream and blow off fireworks and not listen to the music? :confused:
 

Jman8

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this thing with vaping in public, allergies, etc.... *sigh* I really really hate to say it, but I think I have to come down on the side of the *ANTZ* on that one, and it pains me more than you know.

Appreciate the honesty. And do have compassion for what is obviously not an easy position for you to take. Especially knowing, as a vaper, that you could be contributing to laws that seek to restrict vaping freedoms.

I do think us respectful vapers, who do vape openly (everywhere) can get around your concerns and thus not show up as offensive to the position you hold. At same time, I realize not all vapers will be respectful when in public and so your position will continue to appear threatened and/or disrespected when people on my side (vape everywhere) are putting forth their position.
 

Elizabeth Baldwin

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Yeah, I was just thinking that... I drop ashes over myself on a regular basis, but I don't worry about it, unless they're HOT... now, that gets my attention, and surely makes me a hazard -- or when you throw the .... out the window, and it comes back, and goes between your back and the seat... I've ruined more shirts that way!

And yep again, I once had a wreck that totalled two cars, trying to find my lighter. Vaping has GOT to be safer than that!!!

Andria

I've almost wrecked several times trying to find where smoke is coming from... Cause I threw a cig out and somehow it ended up in my backseat! Vaping is much safer in every aspect! Most people realize this but like drama! They want to stir the pot because they "look" sort of like a cig and Vape looks sort of like smoke, so therefore it has to be dangerous. Crazy people!
 

AndriaD

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Actually, I believe he may have been with us on this one, And. Think he was being ironic. Roger Waters is a brilliant lyricist and no fool, he knew the song would sell and be a hit, but taken as a whole, it is a mockery of ignorance and bad behavior. More of a Dark Side of the Moon fan myself, but The Wall makes some good points. Why be a fan of the group and go to their concert if you're only going to jump around and scream and blow off fireworks and not listen to the music? :confused:

Heh... I feel that way NOW... which is why I don't go to concerts (also don't want some drunk barfing on me). But in '76? On the front row of the Elton John concert, all I could do was SCREAM!! I have no earthly idea WHY, but it seemed like the right thing to do at the time. ;)

I'm more of a Gilmour fan, myself; I dearly love The Wall, and know probably 99% of the lyrics, but Momentary Lapse of Reason... that's just brilliant from start to finish. "Terminal Frost" is the music I want played at my obsequies...

Andria
 

Ohms Lawbreaker

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Another Kid In The Hall:

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AndriaD

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Appreciate the honesty. And do have compassion for what is obviously not an easy position for you to take. Especially knowing, as a vaper, that you could be contributing to laws that seek to restrict vaping freedoms.

I do think us respectful vapers, who do vape openly (everywhere) can get around your concerns and thus not show up as offensive to the position you hold. At same time, I realize not all vapers will be respectful when in public and so your position will continue to appear threatened and/or disrespected when people on my side (vape everywhere) are putting forth their position.

Yeah, the only thing that opened my eyes to the dangers of 2nd hand smoke was that I once had a friend who was *deathly* allergic to tobacco, in all forms - solid, smoke, etc. He loved to drink, but couldn't even go in a bar. At first I thought he was just being a whiner, but he really did suffer with that allergy, when smoking was everywhere. So I have to figure the same applies to vaping; people can be allergic to so many diff things, and some of those allergies are life-threatening, like my son's with coconut. I might feel put-upon to stop, or go elsewhere, but the truth is that I wouldn't want to actually harm anyone, with something I did that was completely volitional. I *can* choose to vape, not vape, or move farther away... people like that, with allergies, they don't have the luxury of choice.

Andria
 
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bluecat

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Children can't vape in school, for instance. A business has a right to say "no vaping allowed". (And we have a right to do business elsewhere if we wish). A person can not allow vaping in their own car or home if they choose. That's a few to get you started, and I'm sure I could come up with more.

There isn't anything that has no limits at all. Everyone eats, for instance. There is nothing wrong with eating. But there are places where you are not allowed to eat, too.

I'm a fan of vaping in public, and I do it daily. But it's silly to call someone an ANTZ (I hate that term) because they don't think kids should be vaping in school during class.

I do agree with you in general about how people should be allowed to vape starting at 14. I don't think it should be encouraged, but I don't think that a law against it will help anything. Personally, I'd put no age rule on it and leave it to parents to deal with. That doesn't mean that kids suddenly get control of the classroom and can do anything they want.

I offered my eldest her first sip of champagne at 14. She declined. It was on a New Year's eve. My wife had a glass. I had a glass of apple juice with my 10 year old.

Like you said, let parents deal with it. The sad part of this new world we live in? Most parents want the government to deal with it instead of them.
 
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