Thoughts after upgrading from the 510 to the ego

[Whistle_Pig]

Dont want to switch the topic on this thread but i would have to disagree. On the fact that you can get different amps at the same voltage. Yes it does have to do with ohms law you cant get around that.

Of course, all you have to do is change the resistance of the load.

But for example a eGo fast charger charges at 4.2 volts and 420mA a 510 battery charger charges at 4.2 volts and delivers 150mA to 200mA. Same voltage different amps and also the reason you will fry a 510 battery on a eGo charger.

Charging a LiIon battery isn't quite such a simple operation. And your argument assumes that the 510 and eGo battery present the same load during charging. Do they? I don't know. What I do know, from reading at Battery University, is that larger batteries can be charged at a faster rate. Also, are you sure that the actual voltage supplied by both chargers is constant at 4.2VDC? Or is that just the rated voltage? Or is that the voltage that battery is charged to? There's good info at Battery University -- Charging Lithium Ion Batteries, which should enlighten on the question of why the std. 510 charger has a lower current.

I could very well be wrong i am not saying i am right but what the Surprise battery voltages leaves out is a Amp readings on the different batteries. I think it would be interesting to see what the results would be on amp readings on those batteries.

The amperage readings will be exactly what Ohm's Law dictates for the resistive loads. In the case of the eGo, since it's using a PWM circuit, the amperage readings will show pulses as well. I suspect that if you reply to that thread with your questions, you might get some answers. As you say, it's a bit OT here. But higher maH doesn't matter. It's the voltage and resistance that do.

The difference in eGo vaping performance lies in the airflow management provided by the cone.

 

[Java_Az]

Yeah already posted on the thread. Still trying to wrap my head around it. Was looking at 3.7 volt batteries some have a direct draw rate of .5mA then others have 1.5mA. But that seems like it goes against ohms law. Going to have to ponder this some more another day. I guess i could build a little something and prove myself wrong with my amp meter and 510 and ego batteries.

 

[Whistle_Pig]

Yeah already posted on the thread. Still trying to wrap my head around it. Was looking at 3.7 volt batteries some have a direct draw rate of .5mA then others have 1.5mA.

Oh, well I don't know that term, specifically, but it sounds like it's the max current the battery can supply without degraded performance. Typically, what happens is the voltage sags if you exceed the battery's max current draw capacity. Then there's overheating, and I don't know what else.

 

[jimho]

Guys- spend some time on batteryuniversity.com ... also take a look at Rick Moquin's comprehensive guide to Aw batteries on ikenvape.com- what you need to look at is:

1) drain rate aka discharge rate (labeled C and explained very well by Rick) is the amount of time that a battery can provide current in terms of its maximum current rating PER HOUR. Combining it with the battery capacity (expressed in amp hours) gives you the maximum current a battery can deliver. Dividing the capacity by the maximum current tells you how long a battery can provide that current.... If you draw less than maximum current you can draw current for more time at nominal voltage but the opposite is not true.... see below...

2) understand that nominal voltage varies/degrades over time with different batteries and with different chemical makeup- batteries are NOT constant voltage sources, though they are frequently approximated as such.

3) batteries are charged at one voltage and have nominal output under load that is different than the charging voltage. Same applies to charging current and discharge current.

4) Both the eGo and the standard 510 batteries have additional circuitry between the battery and the atty- we know that the eGo is pulse width modulated meaning it generates pulses, not steady voltage- but the eGo also has a cone that serves a purpose of restricting draw and raising temperature of your juice sort of like a choke on a motor.
​

1,2 and 3 are real important to understand when you discuss batteries, attys and charging. If you're still confused and really want to know what's going on go back and read the links above a few more times....

Otherwise correct that you can't get around Ohm's law - but there's more going on here than that.

Whistle Pig - you posted while I was writing this- 1+ the voltage will sag if you exceed the current rating but potentially worse you will be exceeding the battery's ability to drive the circuit and over time either fry the protection circuit or worse.....

P.S. for more info, also look at the battery discussions here on ECF and at battery discussions on CandlePowerForums

 

[Garnoch]

If you're interested, here are more battery options for your 510 attys. I use the 902 low ohm SS attys from here though. Good luck!
Buy 902 Atomizers for Your Electronic Cigarette from Modern Vapor

 

[ukeman]

I just got 2 of the Tornado 1000 something batts; the bigger ones. First time using a Tornego...

I figured I wouldn't need the cone as I was told they were for looks only....?
Am I missing something?

I got the Titan 510's they said work with it for dripping. .. are they any different from say a Joye 510?
I have some Joye 510's that seem to just gurgle and don't give a good vape on any voltage ( i have a wall unit that has variables for another mod I have - the BB). So i only use LR 510's or LR 306.

So far the Titan 510's work darn well, and the LR 510's too, but a little harsher vape unless fully juiced.

 

[jimho]

I just got 2 of the Tornado 1000 something batts; the bigger ones. First time using a Tornego...

I figured I wouldn't need the cone as I was told they were for looks only....?
Am I missing something?

Yes- you were told wrong..... most people find a difference - more noticeable when the atty heats up- especially with LR attys.... at first all I noticed was that the draw was tighter, but after a bit of use with the cone on, you notice when it's missing... There's a whole thread somewhere about this topic....

I got the Titan 510's they said work with it for dripping. .. are they any different from say a Joye 510?
I have some Joye 510's that seem to just gurgle and don't give a good vape on any voltage ( i have a wall unit that has variables for another mod I have - the BB). So i only use LR 510's or LR 306.

So far the Titan 510's work darn well, and the LR 510's too, but a little harsher vape unless fully juiced.

Maybe someone else can comment on the Titan attys in particular- not sure if there's anything special about them. Nothing wrong with standard 510 attys for dripping- you may be flooding them.... I prefer the LR's with the eGo as well as true 3.7V, once you go there it's hard to go back unless you go up to 5V ... it's important that you keep LR attys wet or you will blow them quickly. Once you get the hang of it though, your taste buds will tell you when to add more juice- kind of like smoking towards the filter tended to heat up your fingers......

 

[ukeman]

thanks jimho, i just ordered a cone... and some Joye lr 510's (gotta be stocked up).

I find with the reg 510's even with 5 volts, it takes so long to get the vape going man, you talk about getting hot!
With the lr 510's, which fire "hot", it doesn't take as long and you're getting vapor right off the bat.

My favorite vape is using my Enercell power amp set at 3v (not sure exactly what, but it's probably lower than 3.7) with my PassThru and a lr510. smooth and vaporful. i use a VG blend juice too, so that may be factor.

 

[jimho]

Juice is definitely a factor....
I don't have a 5V setup but at 6V I find standard attys too hot- I've been running 3.5 and 4.2 ohms at 6V and LR 1.5 Ohm with 3.7 and eGo...

Are you using LR attys at 5V?

 

[DC2]

I have some Joye 510's that seem to just gurgle and don't give a good vape on any voltage.

I find with the reg 510's even with 5 volts, it takes so long to get the vape going man, you talk about getting hot!
With the lr 510's, which fire "hot", it doesn't take as long and you're getting vapor right off the bat.

I'm thinking the same thing as jimho, you may be flooding those regular 510 atomizers.
The symptoms you described in the quotes above sound exactly like what happens when you flood an atomizer.

If you are putting the same number of drops in the regular 510s as you are putting in the LR 510s, you will definitely flood them.
The regular 510s can't handle anywhere near the same number of drops as the LRs without flooding.

 

[ukeman]

I use the LR's at 5 volts occasionally with no problems so far.. the TH is stronger, and you need to drip more often before it gets that burnt taste. Not my norm, but i find it doable. My Enercell doesn't have a setting between 3 and 5v which would probably be even better for the LR's, but in a pinch when i want a "killer" vape that does it.
Actually the Tornego at 3.7 is probably the way for me to get more of the same than the 3v setting on the PT.
I will be getting VV (Big Brother) very soon.. I got on Ken's list at least a month ago and made payment yesterday!

 

[ukeman]

I'll give that a try.... DC2; thanks.

 

[djmatteo]

A lot of good reviews on this bat. I currently am using a standard 510 settup and am always getting the burnt taste, happy with throat hit and vapor I get (when its working good) though I am about to try a PTB method I read about here and if that doesnt work try one of these eGos perhaps.

Guess what I was wondering is if I use my old attys and carts I still will be faced with the nasty atty taste wont I and wont I potentially get it faster due to it drying up so fast because its burning hotter?

Whats a good rig with the Ego for flavor if im already happy with the vapor and TH i can get from my 510?

 

[DC2]

I currently am using a standard 510 settup and am always getting the burnt taste, happy with throat hit and vapor I get (when its working good) though I am about to try a PTB method I read about here and if that doesnt work try one of these eGos perhaps.

Guess what I was wondering is if I use my old attys and carts I still will be faced with the nasty atty taste wont I and wont I potentially get it faster due to it drying up so fast because its burning hotter?

That is correct, check this out...


Dry atomizers, flooded atomizers, and wicking
Basically, you want to keep your atomizer happy with plenty of juice, but not too much as to flood it.

A good sign that it's flooded is that it gets a little harder to draw on and you get little or no vapor.
Flooding it, however, won't hurt it at all, and you can just blow out the extra juice.

Letting it get too dry, on the other hand, is not good for the atomizer supposedly.
But regardless of whether it is bad for the atomizer or not, you still don't want to do it.

You can tell it is too dry when it starts to taste like crap.
A nasty sort of burnt plastic type of taste.

One reason it might get too dry is if you burn through the juice faster than it can wick up more.
That is why people experiment with different kinds of filler materials to use in their cartridges.

If you take only a drag or two every now and then, you should be fine.
But if you use these like a cigarette, the wicking process will have trouble keeping up.
There are ways to deal with this, and people have different methods that work better for them.

And of course, when the cartridge is running low on juice, it needs topping off for this reason.

 

[jmofaustin]

I purchased my eGo from china so I bought a few extra to make it worth waiting the extra days (and in case I could get some friends to quit smoking). So if any of you are interested in trying one out but don't want to buy the whole kit, I am willing to part with a couple (charger included). PM me interested.

 

[djmatteo]

Im not figuring out how to PM you (could be lack of message count) jimofaustin.. but I am interested. Perhaps you can pm me and I can reply?

 

[jimho]

I use the LR's at 5 volts occasionally with no problems so far.. the TH is stronger, and you need to drip more often before it gets that burnt taste. Not my norm, but i find it doable. My Enercell doesn't have a setting between 3 and 5v which would probably be even better for the LR's, but in a pinch when i want a "killer" vape that does it.
Actually the Tornego at 3.7 is probably the way for me to get more of the same than the 3v setting on the PT.
I will be getting VV (Big Brother) very soon.. I got on Ken's list at least a month ago and made payment yesterday!

LR's at 5V are pushing 15Watts and 2.5+ Amps- Tends to pop them quickly... if you aren't burning them out, I suspect it's not supplying what you think it is ... I'm not familiar with the Enercell setup - are you referring to an enercell USB power supply hooked up to a USB mod? Check the output rating on the power supply.

A lot of good reviews on this bat. I currently am using a standard 510 settup and am always getting the burnt taste, happy with throat hit and vapor I get (when its working good) though I am about to try a PTB method I read about here and if that doesnt work try one of these eGos perhaps.

Guess what I was wondering is if I use my old attys and carts I still will be faced with the nasty atty taste wont I and wont I potentially get it faster due to it drying up so fast because its burning hotter?

Whats a good rig with the Ego for flavor if im already happy with the vapor and TH i can get from my 510?

Everything DC2 said and then some.....
I think your problem might be more basic. Sounds like you have a few things going on... I suspect you aren't lining up your atty with the tip properly. Are any of your tips melted on the inside? One of the reasons (there are several) that I switched to dripping was that I didn't like cartos and I always had issues buring the filler and/or inside edges of the juice well in the tip.... PTB didn't work well for me (I tried the straw too) so I tried the blue foam mod- with both, I found myself topping off frequently and still had issues aligning the tips properly. Read some of the stickys on dripping....

Another possible issue is that you aren't cleaning your attys properly. There are some stickies on that as well. Blow them out, rinse them in whatever soup (alcholol, citric acid, coke etc), quick dry burn etc..... keep them clean.

If you're happy with the vapor you have now, I'd wait a bit..... reasons for going to an eGo from standard 510 would be to increase vapor and throat hit a bit, run LR atties (more vapor/TH) or to get longer battery life. Flavor is a whole different discussion and highly subjective... most recommend you buy sample sizes and experiment - lots of us end up with things we never thought we'd like...

 

[ukeman]

yeah jimho, i did lose the atty afterall... no sense pushing it,,, attys are the most important part of the equation, imo...

My enercell 273 333 power amp is for an altsmoke BB mod passthru. the settings are 3, 5, 6, 6,5, 7, 7.5.
I don't know what the 3 or 5 setting is actually putting out; i suspect less...
I'll have to find the voltage range for LR's....
Do you know the lower and upper limits?

 

[ukeman]

I feel that the Ego/Tornado that i have, the big batt one, has too much power for the LR510's. it may just be me, but unless it is full and very wet, it gets my juice burnt too quickly; maybe the first few tokes are great, then the flavor gets altered.
It may be the juice; mostly VG.

When i use the 3 setting on my Enercell amp to PT, it is smooth mellow and vaporful. It does take more of a longer draw though.

 

[djmatteo]

I found myself topping off frequently and still had issues aligning the tips properly.

Where can I get more info on that, google failed me.