Trolls...?

[Ansah]

As far as trolls, spies and other miscreants are concerned at ECF, a little of that is inevitable. Like many here, I have other interests and am a forum member at some other places, but this has a much, much larger membership than any I've joined before. So it's like comparing a big city to a small town. In big cities, you have a certain amount of hustling going on at all times, and all you can do is accept reality and become streetwise in terms of recognizing the kinds of stuff you don't want to become involved with.

I'm actually impressed and amazed at how friendly, helpful and upright this place is considering its size.

 

[Rachy_B]

<begin rant>

I would like an FDA, if it wasn't HEAVILY influenced by BP and other issues that have nothing to do with consumer safety. Do not kid yourself, the level of protection we receive from the FDA is not particularly strong. They regularly approve drugs due to outside pressures before proper studies have been done. How many drugs have been put on the market and then removed when the medium and long term study results come in? Yet, they selectively cite "lack of long term studies" to damn some products "unknown" safety, like they have with e-cigarettes.

They know that patches represent a very strong hazard to your skin if used in the long term. This is never mentioned by the FDA, and BP gets around mentioning it by providing instructions that do not include long-term use. Why do they not have to provide a specific warning to users like other products? Because the FDA is bought and paid for on this issue. Do your own research on any new drug or product before you take it. Do not count on these bureaucrats to protect you or your family. <end of rant>

So it's like an early spring day here in Virginia! Warm and breezy. Ah, spring will be here before we know it!

If it were an entirely independent body, it would be different, but it isn't. How the heck something like Chantix got passed, I'll never know!

I would love to see some independent and objective research take place into the use of PVs- who wouldn't?! Of course it is an issue of funding- even if someone was funded, where would it come from? But I know the triumphant moment of 'I told you so' would be a joy! We all know the benefits vaping has brought to our lives, I just wish others could understand that too :-( . That said, maybe its because people understand the benefits that they're trying to beat it down... but that sucks too... :-(

Please don't let them take away my pv! I wouldn't have gotten this far without it and without ECF! :-(

 

[Rachy_B]

As far as trolls, spies and other miscreants are concerned at ECF, a little of that is inevitable. Like many here, I have other interests and am a forum member at some other places, but this has a much, much larger membership than any I've joined before. So it's like comparing a big city to a small town. In big cities, you have a certain amount of hustling going on at all times, and all you can do is accept reality and become streetwise in terms of recognizing the kinds of stuff you don't want to become involved with.

I'm actually impressed and amazed at how friendly, helpful and upright this place is considering its size.

Yes, tis AWESOME! I should spend less time here but I end up in conversations about music and all other manners of crazy things! It's so nice to know that you're not alone and there's somebody with a word of wisdom that will either pick you up and dust you off, or set you on the right track for you, or both. I think you know you spend too much time here when you start recognising people's avatars and usernames!

I think I may have chosen the wrong word in 'troll'. In fact, I know I did. I think 'spy' is a better word. Forgive me, I appear to have lost about 90% of my vocabulary after writing a rubbish 5k word paper for my supervisor last week...I ended up writing a paragraph about how informal society has become e.g. the role/emancipation of women has led to SATC and 50 Shades... I hope he had a good giggle but I hang my head in shame...I've not even read 50 Shades! You should have seen me on Friday after I handed it in... I was a wreck!

Maybe I read too much dystopian literature for my own good but I took a module the other year about being 'critical'. That's not being critical as in 'that's a load of rubbish' but as in critical of 'power' and those who wield it. My favourite question as a child was 'why?' but now, I question EVERYTHING!

I'm getting more and more angry the more I think about it! ECCA meetings on the 2nd Tuesday of the month, you say? Must make a note in my calendar and I shall be there!x

 

[EddardinWinter]

If it were an entirely independent body, it would be different, but it isn't. How the heck something like Chantix got passed, I'll never know!

I would love to see some independent and objective research take place into the use of PVs- who wouldn't?! Of course it is an issue of funding- even if someone was funded, where would it come from? But I know the triumphant moment of 'I told you so' would be a joy! We all know the benefits vaping has brought to our lives, I just wish others could understand that too :-( . That said, maybe its because people understand the benefits that they're trying to beat it down... but that sucks too... :-(

Please don't let them take away my pv! I wouldn't have gotten this far without it and without ECF! :-(

Uh, Rachy, you forgot to mark off your rant with the brackets. You know, like this...

<begin rant>

They pick and choose the safety issues they go after and with mind-boggling pecksniffian hypocrisy. They ignore many real threats and then fail to admit their incompetence when their mistakes cost lives! When are those SOB's gonna come clean <end of rant>

When you use the rant brackets, you are forgiven more quickly if you get carried away.

I applaud your ability to recognize that spy is the better word. Trolls simply go after drama for their own amusement. Spies seek to find incriminating evidence by surreptitious means to further their partisan cause.

 

[Scoop224]

I troll....therefore I am.

(Even though I am an actual vaper, and a happily converted ex-smoker and e-cig advocate...)

 

[Rachy_B]

When you use the rant brackets, you are forgiven more quickly if you get carried away.

Ooops... thanks for the heads-up although I don't think I even got close to getting carried away! Shaking fists, stamping my feet and weeping softly in a corner are yet to come ;-) . But I'll remember to bracket this when it happens!

I wish I could rename the thread...I feel silly now!

Having said all this, I've mentioned before a thread about being watched by an undergraduate and this thread began just as I came back into vaping in November and back onto the forum. It has stuck with me and has certainly made me quite measured in my responses to some threads.x

 

[DawnBella]

I agree with Rachy_B. I sense many a troll about. Just my feeling is all.

 

[Unc1987]

Atomizer coil pop shoot down throat?

the likelihood of that happening is slim to none and the likelihood it happens while someone is filming a video to put on youtube, almost impossible. sounds like the FDA wants one person to be affirmative so they can label PVs as choking hazards

 

[Thucydides]

<begin rant>

I would like an FDA, if it wasn't HEAVILY influenced by BP and other issues that have nothing to do with consumer safety. Do not kid yourself, the level of protection we receive from the FDA is not particularly strong. They regularly approve drugs due to outside pressures before proper studies have been done. How many drugs have been put on the market and then removed when the medium and long term study results come in? Yet, they selectively cite "lack of long term studies" to damn some products "unknown" safety, like they have with e-cigarettes.

They know that patches represent a very strong hazard to your skin if used in the long term. This is never mentioned by the FDA, and BP gets around mentioning it by providing instructions that do not include long-term use. Why do they not have to provide a specific warning to users like other products? Because the FDA is bought and paid for on this issue. Do your own research on any new drug or product before you take it. Do not count on these bureaucrats to protect you or your family. <end of rant>

Well said.

Unfortunately, the only real way to take away the power of BP and BT is to take the power out of the FDA. The more power the FDA has, the more value it provides to the highest bidder.

 

[Berylanna]

Actually, there is another way, but it would be unpopular. Outbid BP. Current laws REQUIRE BP to fund the FDA. That makes BP their bosses and customer. If we funded it, there could be bribery but the customer relationship would switch to us.

Not sure if I want to pay for that but I wanted to point it out.

Another way is to issue a clue-by-4 to each President as he/she takes office to not appoint anybody that doesn't "get" that we're the boss. It is probably EXTREMELY low priority compared to all the other national and international stuff going on, so it's probably not even on a new president's radar.

 

[Unc1987]

Actually, there is another way, but it would be unpopular. Outbid BP. Current laws REQUIRE BP to fund the FDA. That makes BP their bosses and customer. If we funded it, there could be bribery but the customer relationship would switch to us.

Not sure if I want to pay for that but I wanted to point it out.

Another way is to issue a clue-by-4 to each President as he/she takes office to not appoint anybody that doesn't "get" that we're the boss. It is probably EXTREMELY low priority compared to all the other national and international stuff going on, so it's probably not even on a new president's radar.

the latest tobacco control law also gets BT to fund the FDA through tobacco user fees. not sure if this is part of the federal excise tax on tobacco or not, but surely this is why the FDA has set their sights on ecigs, so they can collect user fees and have more $$$

 

[Leatherneck]

Actually, there is another way, but it would be unpopular. Outbid BP. Current laws REQUIRE BP to fund the FDA. That makes BP their bosses and customer. If we funded it, there could be bribery but the customer relationship would switch to us.

Not sure if I want to pay for that but I wanted to point it out.

Another way is to issue a clue-by-4 to each President as he/she takes office to not appoint anybody that doesn't "get" that we're the boss. It is probably EXTREMELY low priority compared to all the other national and international stuff going on, so it's probably not even on a new president's radar.

I don't think there's that much American money in the vaping industry right now.

 

[Berylanna]

I did not mean "we vapers" I meant "we US citizens"

And I see the point about them wanting ecig user fees for multi-million-dollar tests. This means there is NO WAY to convince the FDA to do the right thing, period. We'll have to go through Congress, ick.

 

[meli.]

I don't think there's that much American money in the vaping industry right now.

I'm not so sure, NJoy project their market will increase from $300M in 2012 to 1 Billion Dollars within the next 3 years. Renyolds American Inc are announcing the release of their new digital cigarette 'The Vuse' later this year which is currently being trialled in a couple of American states. The Renyolds President was recently quoted saying:
"We're not looking to make a little splash in the category, we're looking to make a big splash in the category."
And Altria is rumoured to be looking closer at this market and seeking a possible takeover.

So for me if these guys are so confident about the future, be there trolls or spies on ECF, they'll need to pull their fingers out and look to infiltrate the Multinationals rather than tackling forum users for incriminating or damning information on e-cigs.