US shipping cutoff dates - USPS, Fedex & UPS

[DaveP]

Ever since I started vaping there have been scares of one kind or another, and somehow they never quite landed. Often felt like it would never actually happen. Now it's really here. Dates just a few weeks away. The PMTA deal hasn't even happened yet but this one will sink vaping with a stroke of the pen.

Agree. I bought up kayfun V2 clones a couple of years ago. Since then, I've used a couple of my previous V2 clones and left the backup stock in the boxes they came in. Still, I'm looking right now to order a few more just in case Congress gets crazy(er). I've ordered and used a lot of the latest and greatest atomizers over the years and I keep coming back to the standard Kayfun V2 every time.

I'm looking right now at buying a few more for the "I got mine" stash.

 

[Katmar]

Buried in the Covid relief bill passed and signed in December, business to consumer mailing of anything vape related is banned from the USPS, i.e. US mail. FedEx and UPS have jumped on the bandwagon and will stop handling those items as well. This is over and above the PMTA (and much sooner!) Business to business shipping is, for now, not affected, but the PMTA will likely eliminate it's usefulness.

What good does business to business do us little old ladies????
These are sad times.

 

[Bronze]

It is my understanding that UPS and Fedex are not banning vape product shipments for some altruistic reason but rather because the federal regulations to continue shipping vape products makes it not worth continuing. I have never seen such regulations much less the language of those regulations (if they exist). Truthfully, I don't know if this is the case. However, if it is, I suspect these same regulations (whatever they are) would apply to all delivery companies and, hence, make it effectively impossible for anyone to ship vape products.

 

[MacTechVpr]

What good does business to business do us little old ladies????
These are sad times.

Death by a thousand dissimilating cuts for in the end, de facto prohibition…that is all. And not a hand raised in anger for taxation without representation beyond the comment period, the semblance of process. We who no longer count in this equation could once discuss anything in a vape shop with just about anyone to our heart's content. That was a taste of real freedom.

Good luck.

 

[CAAB]

Vape shoes may have limited inventory after September and may not survive

In the words of Elvis:

You can take my mods, you can take my nic, but don't step on my blue vape shoes.
Well you can do anything but lay off my blue vape shoes.

 

[YoursTruli]

In the words of the Elvis:

You can take my mods, you can take my nic, but don'ts step on my blue vape shoes.
Well you can do anything but lay off my blue vape shoes.

I'm afraid many vape shops won't survive the mail ban and If they do will they survive the PACT Act and/or deeming?
And... If your Local vape shop DOES miraculously survive everything what are the chances they will have what you want/need?!
And... if they actually happen to have what you want/need how much is it going to cost you?

Government, Health care organization and zealot groups have gotten this far in the war on vaping do you think they are really going to leave us alone post mail ban? I mean there are some state and local to governments that haven't banned flavors or taxed it to death yet... Heck they are just getting started they haven't declared victory yet.

 

[Bronze]

I'm afraid many vape shops won't survive the mail ban and If they do will they survive the PACT Act and/or deeming?
And... If your Local vape shop DOES miraculously survive everything what are the chances they will have what you want/need?!
And... if they actually happen to have what you want/need how much is it going to cost you?

Government, Health care organization and zealot groups have gotten this far in the war on vaping do you think they are really going to leave us alone post mail ban? I mean there are some state and local to governments that haven't banned flavors or taxed it to death yet... Heck they are just getting started they haven't declared victory yet.

i.e., the gov't will do whatever they need to do to vanquish vaping...now or in the near future.

 

[BillW50]

Vape Shipping and the PACT Act: What We Know So Far - Vaping360

 

[zoiDman]

Vape Shipping and the PACT Act: What We Know So Far - Vaping360

From the Linked 360 Article...

"... The PACT Act reporting requirements will open a new playing field for states that want to squeeze money from out-of-state vendors, especially when combined with economic nexus laws that mandate sales tax collection.

The tax compliance requirements alone will probably convince many small online retailers to throw in the towel. Unless a company ships just a few packages to a couple of states, the tax collection, reporting, filing and follow-up will require trained, dedicated staff, as well as a lot of time and energy, legal advice, tax expertise, and an automated—and expensive—tax compliance solution."

Somewhere, on the 47 Floor of a Business High-rise, a BT Exec is Smiling. As well as a State Government Tax Assessor.

They Might even both be sitting around the Same conference table.

 

[UncLeJunkLe]

"... The PACT Act reporting requirements will open a new playing field for states that want to squeeze money from out-of-state vendors, especially when combined with economic nexus laws that mandate sales tax collection.
"

But that's nothing new and isn't exclusive to the vape/tobacco industry. It affects all ecommerce/mail order retailers.

 

[zoiDman]

But that's nothing new and isn't exclusive to the vape/tobacco industry. It affects all ecommerce/mail order retailers.

If it was Only Sales Taxes, I could Almost see it for a Company with No Nexus in a State.

But Excise Taxes also? With only Vague Definitions of what is a "Tobacco Product"? And when I can have Johnnie Walker Black shipped to my door?

Or Flavored Vodka.

 

[Skeebo]

And when I can have Johnnie Walker Black shipped to my door?

Or Flavored Vodka.

Just sign up for a monthly subscription to any of these below, and you too can have your "purple drank" delivered right to your door.

• Wine Club. ...
• Firstleaf. ...
• Martha Stewart Wine Club. ...
• Usual Wines. ...
• Vinley Market. ...
• Plonk Wine Club. ...
• Vinesse Wines. ...
• Bright Cellars.

The UPS or FedEx driver will simply ask to see your ID upon delivery. Things that make you go hmmmm.

 

[Territoo]

Just sign up for a monthly subscription to any of these below, and you too can have your "purple drank" delivered right to your door.

• Wine Club. ...
• Firstleaf. ...
• Martha Stewart Wine Club. ...
• Usual Wines. ...
• Vinley Market. ...
• Plonk Wine Club. ...
• Vinesse Wines. ...
• Bright Cellars.

The UPS or FedEx driver will simply ask to see your ID upon delivery. Things that make you go hmmmm.

Maybe we should create a vape club? Think that'll work?

 

[UncLeJunkLe]

If it was Only Sales Taxes, I could Almost see it for a Company with No Nexus in a State.

But Excise Taxes also? With only Vague Definitions of what is a "Tobacco Product"? And when I can have Johnny Walker Black shipped to my door?

I do agree about the delivery of liquor and wine. I see no reason why delivery of vape products has to be more strict than alcohol such that UPS/FedEx say "screw that". That's more of an issue than the tax issue because the taxes (sales or excise) were to be expected if you are in this business and have half a brain. I honestly don't have much sympathy for vape shops that go under because they let themselves be blindsided by the tax issue and/or went this whole time without or with poor legal representation.

 

[UncLeJunkLe]

Maybe we should create a vape club? Think that'll work?

Zamplebox?

 

[zoiDman]

Just sign up for a monthly subscription to any of these below, and you too can have your "purple drank" delivered right to your door.

• Wine Club. ...
• Firstleaf. ...
• Martha Stewart Wine Club. ...
• Usual Wines. ...
• Vinley Market. ...
• Plonk Wine Club. ...
• Vinesse Wines. ...
• Bright Cellars.

The UPS or FedEx driver will simply ask to see your ID upon delivery. Things that make you go hmmmm.

Yeah... I Don't Drink anymore. Haven't coming up on 9 Years.

It just Blows My Mind that an Adult can buy Any type of Hooch they want from Amazon.com

But if they want to Buy something to Keep them From Smoking, or to Help them Quit Smoking after trying everything else, they are going to be SOL.

 

[zoiDman]

I do agree about the delivery of liquor and wine. I see no reason why delivery of vape products has to be more strict than alcohol such that UPS/FedEx say "screw that". That's more of an issue than the tax issue because the taxes (sales or excise) were to be expected if you are in this business and have half a brain. I honestly don't have much sympathy for vape shops that go under because they let themselves be blindsided by the tax issue and/or went this whole time without or with poor legal representation.

I think tonight the Totality of the Entire e-Cigarette era is just getting to me.

And my Inner Laissez-Faire beliefs are feeling like they are under Assault.

 

[Taberu]

I would think liquid-nicotine is a raw-ingredient and not really a "vaping product" nor a "tobacco product." It's used in other products and industries.

I just searched "nicotine" on Amazon & eBay, and it is widely and openly sold (and shipped, obviously) on there as gum, patches, lozenges, etc., etc. And, I don't think that will ever stop.

So, I would think the raw-ingredient liquid-nicotine we use in diy, can be used/considered for other products on the market that will always be legal to ship (gum, lozenges, etc.).

If they made nicotine itself illegal to ship... then that would mean all those gums, patches, etc. too.


As far as raw flavors... obviously, it's used in many other industries too - beer/wine/drink, candy/baking/food/cooking, soaps/shampoos, perfumes, air fresheners, etc.


Perhaps nicotine and flavor selling companies just need to change their info and website to not include vaping as its' intended market/demographic... or even, make customers sign/click on a disclaimer that the products they are about to buy is not intended for vaping/tobacco use

 

[YoursTruli]

I will agree with you on the shipping of flavors but disagree on the shipping of nicotine. I have seen/ read too much information (including from the nicotine companies themselves) to the contrary.

 

[Territoo]

I would think liquid-nicotine is a raw-ingredient and not really a "vaping product" nor a "tobacco product." It's used in other products and industries.

I just searched "nicotine" on Amazon & eBay, and it is widely and openly sold (and shipped, obviously) on there as gum, patches, lozenges, etc., etc. And, I don't think that will ever stop.

So, I would think the raw-ingredient liquid-nicotine we use in diy, can be used/considered for other products on the market that will always be legal to ship (gum, lozenges, etc.).

If they made nicotine itself illegal to ship... then that would mean all those gums, patches, etc. too.


As far as raw flavors... obviously, it's used in many other industries too - beer/wine/drink, candy/baking/food/cooking, soaps/shampoos, perfumes, air fresheners, etc.


Perhaps nicotine and flavor selling companies just need to change their info and website to not include vaping as its' intended market/demographic... or even, make customers sign/click on a disclaimer that the products they are about to buy is not intended for vaping/tobacco use

What you are proposing will work for flavors. Many of the vendors are redoing their websites to remove any reference of vaping. Nicotine, on the other hand, is too closely tied to vaping. The other nicotine products you referenced, are pharmaceutical NRT for smoking cessation and are exempt. That's why they are allowed to be sold on Amazon, which prohibits smoking and vaping related products. Ejuice nicotine doesn't fall in this category and although it can be used as a pesticide, that's not it's primary purpose. The PACT act will not allow food grade or USP grade nicotine to be shipped. Maybe industrial grade, but you wouldn't want to vape that.