Vaping and Reduced Lung Capacity (Long Post)

[sub4me]

Please see your physican and don't rely on anything on the internet. I'm sure you probably know that but I hope the best for you.

 

[WillyZee]

I am with the high VG and too many lung hits ... hope you sort it out soon.


Sent via iPhone

 

[Frankieboy]

In the past 2 months, I have been dripping subohm, so larger amounts of vapor have been drawn directly to my lung. I recently have cut back on the deep hits and just been exhaling through my nose.

Look I'm only new to this game of a few weeks, but y'know. I'm sitting enjoying some pineapple juice and getting great satisfaction from an iClear16 and a twist battery, so I've got the hang of it.

I'll just come right out and say what I think - you're caning it mate. Sub ohm dripping, I've seen that. You're pushing things to the max. You need to calm down and just start smoking it lightly like a real cigarette again.

I think because this is so much less harmful than smoking, and is so enjoyable that we can easily lose sight of the fact that it is still drawing certain demands from your throat and lungs. You get a scratchy throat if you do it too much, right? Same with the lungs. If I cane vaping a bit, even off my equipment, my lungs feel a bit scratchy for about half an hour.

If this was coffee, you're effectively drinking barrel fulls of it a day. Too much. Coffee is harmless but in that amount is pretty toxic.

Edit - I notice you say 'directly to my lung'. I don't like lung hits. They don't feel right. I think you should go back to nice relaxed mouth to lung hits. It seems to me it's harder to monitor how much you're getting if you do direct to lung, and by the time you realise it's too much, it's too late and you've already inhaled it.

By the way, I do a bit of boxing training from time to time. I'm going to report back in a bit of how I found it lung-wise after my almost full switch to vaping.

 

[chapeltown]

Hump-
I myself alternate a bit between tanks and dripping. I love dripping, but have, like you, sometimes experienced just what you are talking about. Through some trial and error, here is what I have noticed. The lower my build, the higher the chance I have a heavy chest. .69 ohms was definitely a player. I don't think that as one of the posters said that you need to jump to 24mg to get what you need out of a tank, but I would definitely grab a protank or dct and either lay off dripping for a while or make your builds quite a bit higher.... like in the 1.5 or 1.8 ohm range. As for pg/vg ratios, I think pg plays more of a role for me lung wise than vg. If I vape anything more than 50/50 pg , my lung issues seem more pronounced.
Hope this helps.

 

[Piak]

Seems to me like the only thing you haven't tried is to stop vaping, that is, in your quest to find out if what you are experiencing is something brought on by vaping.

There are just too many variables when it comes to a specific symptom we might be experiencing, we do use our lungs, vaping or not, every second of our lives. Like many that have suggested before, see a physician. But if I were an MD that sees hundreds of patients on a weekly basis and can only afford to take 2 minutes to try to figure out what the next course of action should be, I would tell you to stop vaping and come back in a week if it doesn't get better...

I think see your physician and make sure to have him/her do everything possible to rule out other things like Pneumonia or Asthma and the likes.

I would be interested to know how this turns out, and all the best!

 

[D91ICE]

I too have only been vaping for 2 months. I got that heavy chest feeling a lot when I smoked analogs. I felt like I could never get a full breath. One month into vaping, I yawned one night, and felt air go to the bottom of my lungs. It felt great! I ended up with quite a few different juices and was vaping the majority of the day. I ended up getting the heavy chest again. When I can't get a full breath I panic. It felt like I could breathe in but no oxygen was getting in. This happened after I had a "high VG" juice blended for me. I was vaping this blend for about 2 days before I noticed the symptoms. For the record it was 6mg tobacco (tasty). I narrowed my problem down to high VG juices. I still use them, but keep them in rotation with my other flavors. I'm new to this and have been thinking about upgrading. As of now I have a VV 1000mah battery and keep a few T3S tanks in rotation. But this setup works for me. My recommendation would be to get yourself a simpler setup such as a tank and pen battery. Stop the direct lung hits. I like to take big hits every now and then to blow a nice cloud or fog up the car with some great smelling vapor but mostly I just take a few puffs and put it up. I used to chain vape like a mad man but I do realize that although it is probably a better alternative to cigarettes, it still isn't good for you. But try a pen battery and cheap T3S tank. It won't be what you're used to but you'll still get a decent hit without overdoing it. Just my opinion.

Sent from my Z930L using Tapatalk

 

[Frankieboy]

VG causes problems but PG doesn't?

 

[ddkl7780]

Most likely VG and big lung hits. Happens to me when I drip too much high VG . Didnt happen when I was vaping 50/50-70/30 but I like VG heavy so its usually 80/20-90/10. I went from Kayfun to dripper all the time now I'll switch off give dripping a break. I prefer lung hits but I started this today do half/half. Little hard for me but Ive too exp some heavier breathing Im pretty sure its VG and the amount of it taken in.

 

[humpstyles]

Think I'm just going to shelf my drippers completely and wait for the Orchid to come in. Turn my DNA30 down to 8-9 watts and go back to mouth to lung hits.

In the meanwhile, I have been trying to do mouth to lung instead of direct lung inhales, which has proven difficult on RDAs that I have been acclimated to. Nose exhales seem to help a lot.

Also gonna order some Ahlusion tonight I think.

Once again, thanks everyone in this thread that is giving me advice.

It is refreshing to hear that others have experiencing heavy lungs from too much VG. Hopefully turning the intensity down will cure my ailments.

 

[nic_fix]

you need to see an md. it may or may not be related to vaping. breathing problems are nothing to play with. please do not try to be your own md and figure this out. if symptoms go away you will think it is vaping when it could be something else. vaping can irritate some people and it does in fact cause recoverable reduced lung function. however to most of us it would not be noticeable. either way, if it were me I would be seeing a doctor about it.

 

[Knifemaker]

Your Dr. may want you to have a pulmonary test done. I am a COPD patient, and that disease is pretty much the same symptoms you are having. Only Much, Much worse. I have learned that If I vape a heavy VG, i do feel the symptoms you describe. Especially on a high humidity day, or when doing strenuous work.

Hope you are not in the early stages of COPD and simply backing off the VG and Full lung hits can help you out a bit!

Good Luck, and get checked out!

KnifeMaker

 

[Katya]

VG causes problems but PG doesn't?

It may. I can't tolerate high VG juices. Others have sensitivities to PG.

 

[Katya]

At this point in time, our community (in conjunction with Dr. Farsalinos) was now hearing more and more about Diacetyl testing and how juice companies were ignorant to the fact that their juices contained Diacetyl, and it's substitutes, AP and Acetoin. Although there has been a ton of scaremongering on this subject lately, I believe that ecigarettes and vaping can absolutely be categorized as harm reduction, and it is 100% okay to want to reduce as much potential harm to your body as possible. Some disagree and say "it can't be half as bad as the 3000 chemicals in an analog", and, while I agree, I still would like to try my best at concocting a safer and healthier vaping plan. Now I don't believe I am actually developing "popcorn workers lung" (Bronchiolitis Obliterans) from vaping the flavoring Diacetyl, but after reading what the symptoms are, I feel as if my problem shares some similarities with it, such as reduced lung capacity. Also, desserts flavors have always been my go to, which is where Diacetyl plays a main role. I have recently been trying to buy from vendors who have had their juices lab-tested (a bit extreme, strokes/folks) so I can eliminate yet another variable out of my dilemma. It seems as in FlavorArt and some other flavor manufacturers are beginning to create 100% diketone-free flavors to fight this problem (this is great for our community's future, btw).

First of all--you have to see a physician. Nobody here can diagnose anything--and practicing medicine without a license is a felony. You may need to find a pulmonologist.

I just have a few comments wrt to diacetyl and popcorn lung. Diacetyl has always been present in cigarette smoke, in high concentrations, and no smoker has ever developed a popcorn lung--to my knowlegde.

That said, I agree with Dr, Farsallinos that it is an unnecessary and completely avoidable risk--don't vape anything that may contain diacetyl (and other diketones like acetyl propionyl). I don't--even though I used to like custardy, buttery, caramelly vapes once in a while.

Other than that, you may try to experiment a bit--try vaping PG only or VG only juices, maybe unflavored for a while, and see if that helps. You may also vape without inhaling into your lungs--most of nic absorption from vaping takes place in your mouth and nose, anyway. You'll get your nic and bypass the lungs altogether.

But you have to see a doctor first.

 

[Tuyak]

Look I'm only new to this game of a few weeks, but y'know. I'm sitting enjoying some pineapple juice and getting great satisfaction from an iClear16 and a twist battery, so I've got the hang of it.

I'll just come right out and say what I think - you're caning it mate. Sub ohm dripping, I've seen that. You're pushing things to the max. You need to calm down and just start smoking it lightly like a real cigarette again.

I think because this is so much less harmful than smoking, and is so enjoyable that we can easily lose sight of the fact that it is still drawing certain demands from your throat and lungs. You get a scratchy throat if you do it too much, right? Same with the lungs. If I cane vaping a bit, even off my equipment, my lungs feel a bit scratchy for about half an hour.

If this was coffee, you're effectively drinking barrel fulls of it a day. Too much. Coffee is harmless but in that amount is pretty toxic.

Edit - I notice you say 'directly to my lung'. I don't like lung hits. They don't feel right. I think you should go back to nice relaxed mouth to lung hits. It seems to me it's harder to monitor how much you're getting if you do direct to lung, and by the time you realise it's too much, it's too late and you've already inhaled it.

By the way, I do a bit of boxing training from time to time. I'm going to report back in a bit of how I found it lung-wise after my almost full switch to vaping.

This. To much of a good thing is bad.. chill it out.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

 

[xiKUTTHROATix]

First off I want to say. I hope you feel better and all goes well, second definitely go see a doctor. But what I really want to say is this, You say you can run around for an hour straight while playing indoor soccer, and not have any breathing problems... If you had a decrease in lung capacity you would definitely notice it while you playing. Second you said you like dripping, and you cut down your nicotine to 3 mg because you thought 6 mg was too high to drip with, which IMHO is kinda high. But you said you don't want to cut down to 0 nic because you like to catch a nic buzz...

I think the culprit really lies in the nicotine... It is a stimulant nonetheless and can cause a bunch of symptoms. I feel it might be causing anxiety.I suffer from anxiety and too have similar symptoms. The past couple days I've had the feeling that something has been sitting on my chest but threw it to the back of my mind that it is just anxiety and today I am fine.

Back to you saying you could play soccer for an hour without any symptoms then when done vape and the symptoms come back proves that it isn't permanent and the onset happens soon after you vape.

I do not know if anyone has pointed it out or if you have actually tried vaping without nic, I didn't read it anywhere. I would suggest slowing down on nic intake just to rule it out.

But then again it could be the PG/VG. I am not a doctor and all I am trying to do is make a suggestion and give you another possible idea of what it could be.

I do strongly suggest going to the doctor though.

 

[realsis]

Hi, I am a pulmonary patient myself and I feel I have to say it's absolutely necessary you get some tests ran. Believe it or not adults can even develop asmatha later on in life and your still very young and you could have had it and it gone undetected until now. You might also be expirencing panic, which can manafiest into very real physical symptoms. . There are just too many factors to come to a definite conclusion without tests from your doctor.. I urge you to get some tests then I would be very interested in the results.as it stands now so many things can be causing your symptoms and without tests I would be very hesitant to pinpoint vaping as a cause. So please see your doctor. Being as young as you are, it wouldn't suprised me at all if the symptoms your feeling are realated to stress or panic. At your age I had anexity and it manafiest itself into physical symptoms. So please see your doctor and let us know what the tests show. Best of luck.

 

[Deeo]

I appreciate the input from everyone very much.




Something interesting to point out is that I really only notice it during sedentation; in other words, when I am sitting or not doing anything. When I am basically sprinting for 50 minutes straight at soccer, my breathing isn't labored at all. I feel absolutely fine. If I were to leave that soccer game and have 4-5 draws on my vape, I would then experience some difficulty breathing.

I'm going to schedule a doctor's appointment tomorrow, and I plan on still responding to comments, but will eventually update this thread with what the doc says. (Times like these, I wish there was an actual Vaping Doctor).

This sounds more like anxiety. Anxiety might be set off from a heavy feeling in your chest due to the VG, the in turn setting off anxiety making it hard to breathe. Keep us updated.

 

[xibxang]

This sounds more like anxiety. Anxiety might be set off from a heavy feeling in your chest due to the VG, the in turn setting off anxiety making it hard to breathe. Keep us updated.

I was going to suggest this also. I have an ongoing love-thing with anxiety and depression and I get the very same symptoms during my off-periods.

 

[IMFire3605]

Hey all.

First and foremost, as per my stats, I am familiar with ECF and the generally positive vibe that flows through these forums. I used to enjoy scanning through the New Posts and helping as many new users as I could, but lately, it seems like I am the one that needs some guidance. This post is meant to search for optimism and hope in my vaping journey, just as everyone has had their own obstacles to overcome. (Mods, this might deserve to be in the Health subforum, FYI.)

A little background info on me and vaping:

I smoked cigarettes (on average anywhere from 5 to 15 a day) for 5 and a half years. I quit on September 24th, 2013, so I have been vaping for a little over a year with no cigarettes - there is no appeal to ever have one again either. I started with cigalikes (My7s) around 18mg for a few months, moved on to an eVic and clearos (2-3 mL of 6-12mg a day), then to a DNA30 and some mechs (down to 3mg, normally use drippers on anywhere from .5 to .8 subohm builds and vape 3-6mL per day). I have been regularly dripping for about 2-3 months now. My Tobeco Kayfun has been giving me troubles recently so I have not set up a reliable tank in a while. I gave all my clearos and atty heads to coworkers who I have passed my vaping knowledge onto.

The predicament:

Recently, in the past 3 months or so, I have been experiencing reduced lung capacity. It has been growing persistently worse. Reduced lung capacity is really just a vague identifier, as I feel this could fall under "trouble breathing", "tight chest", and a few other obscure derogatory monikers. I am 24 years old, weigh 170 lb., am in good health (presumably), go to the gym twice a week, and play an hour of indoor soccer once a week. My occupational life is sedentary, but otherwise, I am very active - eating well and getting plenty of rest. Hydration-wise, I drink around 120oz of water a day. In light of my healthier aspects in life, I feel as if I am the only vaper experiencing this problem since these forums are normally focused on the positives aspects of vaping. And before anyone gets the wrong idea, I am all about the so-far scientifically-proven positive aspects. I still defend vaping against any naysayers even though it tears me apart that I am experiencing this problem.

Isolating the problem:

When it first started, I thought that since I was experiencing some uncomfortability, I should look into isolating the problem so I could eliminate it from the equation. The very first thing I looked into was VG and PG. Normally, we hear that certain vapers have a PG sensitivity/allergy and switch to a higher VG to ease their problems. I've never vaped any juice over 60/40 PG heavy, as I am not really into the throat hit attribute. I decided to switch from 50/50 to 70/30 VG heavy which definitely seemed to reduce the throat hit, but also tended to be a little heavier on my lungs. I wasn't experiencing allergic or flu-like symptoms, but my breathing felt a little heavier (especially if dripping). I decided that my body and vaping experience was more in favor of VG than PG, so I stuck with the higher VG blends.

I then looked into the amount of nicotine in the juice (at the time, 6mg on a 1.0ohm Kayfun). I decided to drop from 6mg to 3mg, which was a good decision, but I still felt as if my breathing was still labored. In contrast, this problem coincided with my interest in mech mods and RDAs, where I was going through 5-8mL a day just because they chug juice so much faster due to the higher wattage. The low(er) nicotine levels lead me to believe that I was not experiencing a nicotine OD, since scientifically it didn't compute. I decided to stay on 3mg since it is the most available nic level that is closest to 0mg (and I still want a little buzz, don't we all?). I am 99.9% sure that nicotine is not the culprit.

Although a very small factor, I have been avoiding any driptips or atomizers that are made of copper or brass, just as a precautionary measure.

At this point in time, our community (in conjunction with Dr. Farsalinos) was now hearing more and more about Diacetyl testing and how juice companies were ignorant to the fact that their juices contained Diacetyl, and it's substitutes, AP and Acetoin. Although there has been a ton of scaremongering on this subject lately, I believe that ecigarettes and vaping can absolutely be categorized as harm reduction, and it is 100% okay to want to reduce as much potential harm to your body as possible. Some disagree and say "it can't be half as bad as the 3000 chemicals in an analog", and, while I agree, I still would like to try my best at concocting a safer and healthier vaping plan. Now I don't believe I am actually developing "popcorn workers lung" (Bronchiolitis Obliterans) from vaping the flavoring Diacetyl, but after reading what the symptoms are, I feel as if my problem shares some similarities with it, such as reduced lung capacity. Also, desserts flavors have always been my go to, which is where Diacetyl plays a main role. I have recently been trying to buy from vendors who have had their juices lab-tested (a bit extreme, strokes/folks) so I can eliminate yet another variable out of my dilemma. It seems as in FlavorArt and some other flavor manufacturers are beginning to create 100% diketone-free flavors to fight this problem (this is great for our community's future, btw).

Where I sit now:

This very moment, I'm quite torn since something I used to love is now starting to become a burden. I want to figure out what is wrong and get back to where I was a few months ago. I'm sick of trying to go to sleep when I feel as if I can't breathe normally because my lungs feel heavy. I plan on visiting the doctor by the end of the month, but already know what they're going to say - that vaping is the same as smoking and the results are still unknown.

I really don't even know what I planned to accomplish in posting this; I guess I just wanted to get my feelings out there since ECF is a great source of feedback, guidance, and assistance.

I'll be glad to answer any questions anyone has.

hump.

Everything you are describing is sounding to me like a VG reaction as that is the one thing in the whole equation that has changed with your vaping habit moving towards dripping. Just like people having reactions to the PG in their liquids, they can also have a negative reaction to the food flavorings which are mostly suspended in PG, but also the VG which the symptoms you described all point to a VG reaction, especially the heavy feeling in your lungs. I'd move back up to at least a 50/50 blend again, try to get that Kayfun back up and running, and if you can't get it back up and running, look into a Nautilus or Nautilus Mini with the BVC coil head, even a Kanger Aero Tank possibly. Want to stay on the rebuildable side if the Kayfun is beyond fixing or getting a refurbishing kit for it, maybe look into an Expromizer (Kayfun build deck but a little wider and deeper channels, Nautilus style airflow regulator, Taifun style tank section at about $65USD plus shipping), Russian, Taifun, even an Erlkonigen as alternatives.

 

[ddkl7780]

I had asthma when I was young but I started smoking at a young age as well. I smoked 20 years and when I quit bam have symptoms of asthma again mostly if I get a cold etc. Its not real bad but the dr told me when you smoke it can mask it. But you say you are active and dont have issues at all during that time so idk if it would be that. Best to see a dr cant hurt. This was an interesting article on asthma and vaping. Small study http://......................./benefits-of-switching-to-vaping-for-asthmatic-smokers