Why Vapers are getting a BAD NAME.

[Jman8]

Science strongly suggests alot of things to later find it was wrong. Heard of any drugs or treatments being taken off the market after years of use? I choose to believe that vaping is less harmful than smoking but to say harmless... Dont think so!

Thank goodness I, and most, do not say harmless.

Though I would stick by relatively harmless to both match my earlier post and the science of SHV.

 

[Jman8]

This is what I think a lot of people tend to overlook when it is mentioned that vaping in crowds, doctor's offices, around people within inhale space. There are so many people with severe allergies, and asthma and while we know what is in our vapor, all they know is one whiff of the wrong thing can at the least require benadryl, and at the worst require a hospital. The flavorings, even when artificial can contain natural oils and such, like peanut, citrus, etc.

I just googled "peanut allergy based on smell" and from this got exactly what I was hoping for: information on actual studies about people who have allergy to peanuts and how the aroma affects them. I think every link I clicked on said something to the effect of, "Smelling the aroma of peanuts is not the same as inhaling peanut particles that could potentially contain the allergenic protein. The aroma of peanuts comes from different compounds that cannot cause an allergic reaction."

If we are at place where sensitivities to aromas ought to be respected, even if they don't actually cause undue harm, then I do truly believe we are at place where anyone not wearing a filter over their mouth while anywhere in public (including outdoors) is a plausible sign of disrespect toward everyone around that person. And if we continue to show up in a world where no one is wearing filters on their mouth, nor arguing that we should be, then SHV strikes me as equal to that in terms of science and relative harmlessness of that substance.

 

[Anjaffm]

If we are at place where sensitivities to aromas ought to be respected, even if they don't actually cause undue harm, then I do truly believe we are at place where anyone not wearing a filter over their mouth while anywhere in public (including outdoors) is a plausible sign of disrespect toward everyone around that person. And if we continue to show up in a world where no one is wearing filters on their mouth, nor arguing that we should be, then SHV strikes me as equal to that in terms of science and relative harmlessness of that substance.

After watching the carnival parade today in the small town where I live, my friends and I ate rolls with raw ground beef and raw onions. This dish is a very popular food in Germany, and it was delicious. (picture of "Mettbrötchen")
Should I be wearing a filter over my mouth now, just in case somebody will be offended by SHOB (Second Hand Onion Breath)?

By the way, I happily vaped all over the place, and nobody even gave me a weird look

 

[Anjaffm]

Oh and this guy here says it best - about the often-uttered "concerns" that vaping may be oh-so-harmful

Gutfeld: Senate Democrats ignore science, block progress | Latest News Videos | Fox News

He says it very well indeed. And in a way that is very clear and precise.
Now, I would not put it quite like this, in this forum, but this guy has no such restrictions.

"She claims that there is no way of knowing whether e-cigs are harmful. - There IS, it's called science, you .... !"

 

[CalamityJess]

I just googled "peanut allergy based on smell" and from this got exactly what I was hoping for: information on actual studies about people who have allergy to peanuts and how the aroma affects them. I think every link I clicked on said something to the effect of, "Smelling the aroma of peanuts is not the same as inhaling peanut particles that could potentially contain the allergenic protein. The aroma of peanuts comes from different compounds that cannot cause an allergic reaction."

If we are at place where sensitivities to aromas ought to be respected, even if they don't actually cause undue harm, then I do truly believe we are at place where anyone not wearing a filter over their mouth while anywhere in public (including outdoors) is a plausible sign of disrespect toward everyone around that person. And if we continue to show up in a world where no one is wearing filters on their mouth, nor arguing that we should be, then SHV strikes me as equal to that in terms of science and relative harmlessness of that substance.

That's really great to know. I was simply thinking if perfumes can do it, maybe scents from flavors could too in closed spaces (not outdoors that's just silly). But having been up since 3am to drop my husband off, I was just too damned lazy to google. I still probably won't do it in places like waiting rooms though...lol Or anywhere in the area I live in that's labeled no smoking...simply because I live on an Army base. Yes they are working on implementing the if you can't smoke you can't vape here thing. If they haven't already, currently it's some commands doing it, some not. My husband's is currently in the allowing it section. But if I got nabbed for it, he'd hear about it and that is bad.

And I just sneezed after a big draw, my nose is on fire...scuse me while I go stick my face underwater...ow ow ow.

 

[CalamityJess]

Oh and this guy here says it best - about the often-uttered "concerns" that vaping may be oh-so-harmful

Gutfeld: Senate Democrats ignore science, block progress | Latest News Videos | Fox News

He says it very well indeed. And in a way that is very clear and precise.
Now, I would not put it quite like this, in this forum, but this guy has no such restrictions.

"She claims that there is no way of knowing whether e-cigs are harmful. - There IS, it's called science, you .... !"

That was awesome.

 

[Berylanna]

That's really great to know. I was simply thinking if perfumes can do it, maybe scents from flavors could too in closed spaces (not outdoors that's just silly). But having been up since 3am to drop my husband off, I was just too damned lazy to google. I still probably won't do it in places like waiting rooms though...lol Or anywhere in the area I live in that's labeled no smoking...simply because I live on an Army base. Yes they are working on implementing the if you can't smoke you can't vape here thing. If they haven't already, currently it's some commands doing it, some not. My husband's is currently in the allowing it section. But if I got nabbed for it, he'd hear about it and that is bad.

And I just sneezed after a big draw, my nose is on fire...scuse me while I go stick my face underwater...ow ow ow.

There is a scientist ON OUR SIDE, he testified in Utah. He surprised the HELL out of the Utah state senate by saying the main thing that he's still worried about and studying is the food flavorings, starting with the known tank-killers. For peanuts, maybe the oil is irrelevant because it's protein. But he is more worried specifically about citrus and cinnamon.

Funny, I heard the NAVY is in favor of ecigs because of all their small spaces and the inability to take a walk outside submarines. I think the Navy might be the only service that is absolutely forced to be very scientific and realistic about small spaces.

This is my point: when you tell legislators that you're much more scared of lemons and cinnamon than pg and nic, suddenly they have context, their brains 'splode and they say "Is THAT all? Really? What's the big deal?" -- because those two things are FAMILIAR. So are a lot of other things allowed all kinds of places (which does not mean 100% of places, but it's probably 98%)

We need to make pictures in their brains that let the science take root instead of flying around inside their heads causing panic.

 

[Myk]

I figured out why I tend to not vape in public yesterday at the new vape shop. I don't like to vape standing up or walking. Sitting down I'll vape a lot.

This is what I think a lot of people tend to overlook when it is mentioned that vaping in crowds, doctor's offices, around people within inhale space. There are so many people with severe allergies, and asthma and while we know what is in our vapor, all they know is one whiff of the wrong thing can at the least require benadryl, and at the worst require a hospital. The flavorings, even when artificial can contain natural oils and such, like peanut, citrus, etc.

Heck my daughter's teacher was rushed to the hospital during class because she is so deathly allergic to ANY kind of perfume being sprayed she went into a severe asthma incident when some disrespectful kid sprayed Axe body spray knowing full well about her classroom being under strict no perfume spray rules.

The scent from vaping stays in enclosed places, part of what I love about it. But also a risk to anyone that may be allergic to the flavoring ingredients themselves. S I simply do just what I did when I smoked (except for the house, I vape in my house I didn't smoke in it). I keep it to my home, my car, places that allow smoking obviously, and that's about it. After 24 years of waiting until we leave a restaurant or movie to smoke it's second nature anyhow. Visiting family depends on who it is. My Mom, no problem, she let me smoke she'll have no issue with vaping.

His family? Not even going to bother, simply because his family is HUGE and stepping outside is a welcome break from the crowd! lol

I don't think it's overlooked. The attempt is to make it like anything else.
Assuming the student knew of the allergy spraying the perfume was wrong, but not knowing about an allergy doesn't mean everyone should avoid perfume in case someone has an allergy.
When you have an allergy or disease it is up to you to make sure the places you go are safe.
Of course if you think perfume and peanuts should be illegal to use in public because people have allergies I could see you saying vaping in public should be illegal.

 

[FRANKSTER]

That was awesome.

I watched the video and personally I do not care about whether I can vape where I could not smoke. I am only interested in how do I get that Brunet's phone number so I can take her out for a few drinks. I have my priorities straight.

 

[LDS714]

I watched the video and personally I do not care about whether I can vape where I could not smoke. I am only interested in how do I get that Brunet's phone number so I can take her out for a few drinks. I have my priorities straight.

LOL! I just want to vape where I COULD smoke before all the holes started banning everything. You know, like airplanes, doctor's offices, grocery stores, etc.

Yeah. I'm that guy.

 

[Anjaffm]

@CalamityJess:
I am sorry to hear about your child. I hope he will get better soon!

By the way:

The flavorings, even when artificial can contain natural oils and such

Please note that any kind of oil must not be vaporized in our vaping equipment.
Vaping any kind of oil may lead to chemical pneumonitis.
That is why not every kind of food flavoring may be used for vaping. Only those food flavorings that are sold specifically for vaping may be used for vaping.

Although propylene glycol and glycerine feel oily to the touch, they are not oils. They are alcohols.

Please, never vape any kind of oil.

-----

I am only interested in how do I get that Brunet's phone number so I can take her out for a few drinks. I have my priorities straight.

tee hee
Now make sure you vape at a distance from her, so the vapor does not mess up her hair.
After all, the vapor that we exhale is over 50% water vapor, which is expelled from our lungs through the process of exhaling. And with her lovely hairdo, yes, that might be worrying

Oh.. here is another worry for the easily offended: being around people who vape and exhale water vapor can mess up your hairdo!
Oh, the horror!
On the other hand, normal exhaled breath (without vaping) also contains this water vapor.
Oh the horror, whatever shall we do?
Yes, maybe we should all wear face masks at all times.
After all, a messed-up hairdo can be a worse annoyance than even SHOB (Second Hand Onion Breath)

 

[CalamityJess]

I figured out why I tend to not vape in public yesterday at the new vape shop. I don't like to vape standing up or walking. Sitting down I'll vape a lot.



I don't think it's overlooked. The attempt is to make it like anything else.
Assuming the student knew of the allergy spraying the perfume was wrong, but not knowing about an allergy doesn't mean everyone should avoid perfume in case someone has an allergy.
When you have an allergy or disease it is up to you to make sure the places you go are safe.
Of course if you think perfume and peanuts should be illegal to use in public because people have allergies I could see you saying vaping in public should be illegal.

Whoa there, hold your horses. I never said "should be illegal to use in public" I vape in public. I was referring to cramped quarters, tightly packed crowds, small indoor areas like doctors office waiting rooms where i do not. Geez, don't go putting words in my mouth. I certainly didn't spend hundreds of dollars on equipment, and juice, and accessories that I secretly want outlawed.

I HOPE studies are published by medical journals and every single legitimate platform for those things that prove EVERYTHING people assume about vaping is wrong, and that they show the world that it isn't hurting anyone. And I want that to lead to PSA's plastered all over TV touting the best way to get of cigarettes replacing these God awful anti-smoking scare tactics they call a "service". I HOPE they come out and say "Hey! Vape wherever you want, create clouds of happiness everywhere you go!" Because really when you see someone vaping you should thing "Good job buddy! Kudos on not smoking anymore!"

Did I have some minor concerns about the effect of my vaping on another person, a person with allergies or asthma? Of course, I'm a human being and I don't wish to inadvertantly harm anyone. That concern was addressed by someone with far more ambition than I had when I posted, I thanked them even. My family and friends get daily doses of Vaping education as I get more informed and keep posting things on facebook to the point they probably wish I'd get bored with it.

So yeah, maybe my concern was incorrect, and I appreciate the poster that corrected me with the correct information. That is how it should be done. Not jumping from "this person thinks that vaping might trigger an allergic or asthmatic reaction" straight to "this person wants peanuts, perfume, and vaping outlawed".

Showing concern and agreeing with wanting it outlawed are two very different things. And yes, people should be prepared for dealing with their potential reactions to triggers. Heck, I have to prepare for my own. And I'm relieved to know that I was incorrect. That student ( a senior no less) by the way did know. They were sent home with a notice at the beginning of the school year, verbally told the first day of class, AND there's signs on the door going in as well as in plain sight in the room.

 

[Anjaffm]

@CalamityJess:
I fully understand.
And thank you very much for your support for vaping!
We can all get a little short-tempered at times, after we have faced repeated anti-vaping postings, in a vapers forum, no less. This is not to mean that anybody would really consider your postings anti-vaping.

And please note that I amended my posting - above yours - to include a warning about vaping oils. Please, never vape any kind of oil.

 

[CalamityJess]

@CalamityJess:
I fully understand.
And thank you very much for your support for vaping!

And please note that I amended my posting - above yours - to include a warning about vaping oils. Please, never vape any kind of oil.

Thanks And it wasn't my child, it was her teacher but I feel bad for the students that witnessed it. That kid that sprayed his body spray should be suspended. He thought it was funny when she got wheeled out. I don't understand that.

On the upside,My child has now quit smoking with the help of an e-cig (she's almost 19) Now she's enthusiastically telling people about vaping...lol. So for her birthday I got her an ego.

 

[Myk]

Whoa there, hold your horses. I never said "should be illegal to use in public" I vape in public. I was referring to cramped quarters, tightly packed crowds, small indoor areas like doctors office waiting rooms where i do not. Geez, don't go putting words in my mouth. I certainly didn't spend hundreds of dollars on equipment, and juice, and accessories that I secretly want outlawed.

I HOPE studies are published by medical journals and every single legitimate platform for those things that prove EVERYTHING people assume about vaping is wrong, and that they show the world that it isn't hurting anyone. And I want that to lead to PSA's plastered all over TV touting the best way to get of cigarettes replacing these God awful anti-smoking scare tactics they call a "service". I HOPE they come out and say "Hey! Vape wherever you want, create clouds of happiness everywhere you go!" Because really when you see someone vaping you should thing "Good job buddy! Kudos on not smoking anymore!"

Did I have some minor concerns about the effect of my vaping on another person, a person with allergies or asthma? Of course, I'm a human being and I don't wish to inadvertantly harm anyone. That concern was addressed by someone with far more ambition than I had when I posted, I thanked them even. My family and friends get daily doses of Vaping education as I get more informed and keep posting things on facebook to the point they probably wish I'd get bored with it.

So yeah, maybe my concern was incorrect, and I appreciate the poster that corrected me with the correct information. That is how it should be done. Not jumping from "this person thinks that vaping might trigger an allergic or asthmatic reaction" straight to "this person wants peanuts, perfume, and vaping outlawed".

Showing concern and agreeing with wanting it outlawed are two very different things. And yes, people should be prepared for dealing with their potential reactions to triggers. Heck, I have to prepare for my own. And I'm relieved to know that I was incorrect. That student ( a senior no less) by the way did know. They were sent home with a notice at the beginning of the school year, verbally told the first day of class, AND there's signs on the door going in as well as in plain sight in the room.

I didn't mean to put words in your mouth. I was using the proverbial "you". If "someone" says "that" then "someone" can say "this" and they would be applying their thinking equally.
But if "someone" says something like perfume is OK to use in public but ecigs are not because someone may be allergic to vapor they are being irrational.

The only concerns I have about vaping around others with unknown issues is the off chance they have a VG allergy (I can't do much PG and if I can handle what I vape I'd think anyone could handle it second hand) and allergies to certain flavors.
Someone with asthma would have a terrible time if they were also allergic to PG since that is what is in the inhalers.

 

[Coelli]

A good point yes, however i make the argument that in public, including public schools it isnt really your problem if someone has an allergy, for example in high school i was almost expelled for refusing to not bring peanut butter and jelly sandwiches to school because someone had a peanut allergy. It is not my responsibility to cater to he allergies of someone else, it is theirs and in the case of schools and nut allergies/ scent allergies, it should be the school that makes accommodate for the affected child in a way that does not effect the rest of the student body

Edit: i just now saw that it was the teacher not a student that had the scent allergy

Just want to pipe in that peanut allergies are serious business and can be fatal. If you know someone in the school has a peanut allergy, in my opinion you DO have a responsibility to try to help them not die. Asking the student body to not bring something to school that can kill another student doesn't seem unreasonable.

 

[CalamityJess]

I didn't mean to put words in your mouth. I was using the proverbial "you". If "someone" says "that" then "someone" can say "this" and they would be applying their thinking equally.
But if "someone" says something like perfume is OK to use in public but ecigs are not because someone may be allergic to vapor they are being irrational.

The only concerns I have about vaping around others with unknown issues is the off chance they have a VG allergy (I can't do much PG and if I can handle what I vape I'd think anyone could handle it second hand) and allergies to certain flavors.
Someone with asthma would have a terrible time if they were also allergic to PG since that is what is in the inhalers.

Thanks for clarifying. Sorry I word barfed there. I actually had a friend in high school that had a nasty allergic reaction to her allergy medicine. I can't even imagine what would happen in a pg allergy with an inhaler.

 

[stevegmu]

E-liquid vapor is simply water vapor? Wow, that's news to me...

 

[Anjaffm]

On the upside,My child has now quit smoking with the help of an e-cig (she's almost 19) Now she's enthusiastically telling people about vaping...lol. So for her birthday I got her an ego.

That is wonderful news!

 

[Anjaffm]

@stevegmu:

As to exhaled e-cigarette vapor containing large quantities of water vapor, it may be beneficial to read the documents in the ECF Library.
The ECF Library is a great source of knowledge.

Like this document here:
Inhalation and Vapour Ingredient Myths

The average amount of water found in vapour tests of mini ecigs is 66%, and the PG/VG total content is around 5 or 6%. This is explained by the fact that normal exhalation contains a significant quantity of water vapour (therefore - rather obviously - there must be some in exhaled ecig vapour; so a test that shows none at all is clearly faulty). We don't know anything about vapour produced by more efficient hardware, since at Q1 2014 no one has published an analysis of it.

Oh, and it may also be beneficial to read - and understand - what somebody has written.

After all, the vapor that we exhale is over 50% water vapor, which is expelled from our lungs through the process of exhaling

I am glad I was able to help.
It is always beneficial to pass on knowledge