FDA says TVECA claims it has a copy of FDA's e-cig regulatory proposal
- Thread starter Bill Godshall
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Could it mean something bad? Is that the REAL reason they don't want to release it, afraid of riots and such! Cause if they try and shut down my vaping supply, I GUARANTEE I'm going to be "active"!!!
Argh, the thought both scares and infuriates me!
You would not have seen them released on Monday because the FDA never said they were releasing the regulations. The FDA said
"The proposal is still in draft form and under review." So, Ray's stunt has nothing to do with the regulations not being released.
Believe me, we will know when the FDA is ready to release them.
- Apr 2, 2009
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I have no idea if TVECA has a copy of the yet to be proposed FDA regs, but I'd be shocked if someone from FDA gave it to them (as that person would be fired immediately and may face charges)
But its clear that TVECA wanted lots of folks looking at TVECA's website over the weekend (or they wouldn't have posted the countdown clock) to remember that TVECA still exists.
But its clear that TVECA wanted lots of folks looking at TVECA's website over the weekend (or they wouldn't have posted the countdown clock) to remember that TVECA still exists.
TVECA, eh?
I do not know the reputation of TVECA among US vapers.
I do, however, know the reputation of TVECA among European vapers: They shot us, the consumers, in the back. Pure and simple.
By sending a letter to the EU - before the vote on the tobacco Products Directive (TPD) in February 2014 - saying that they (the industry) would be happy with the new tobacco Products Directive. Which will be a de-facto ban on all e-cigs except the cigalikes made by Big T. They also added to please disregard what everybody else (i.e. the consumers) were saying.
See here.
TVECA may speak for consumer interests in the US. May. Once they get their noses out of the (hindquarters) of the EU mercenary bureaucrats.
But, judging from our experience in Europe, don't count on it.
And you do know who the board members are of CORESTA, the "mother association" above TVECA?
BOARD MEMBERS (2012-2014)
Alliance One International (USA)
Borgwaldt KC GmbH (Germany)
British American Tobacco (UK)
China National Tobacco Corporation (China)
Imperial Tobacco Ltd. (UK)
Japan Tobacco Inc. (Japan)
KT&G Corporation (South Korea)
Papierfabrik Wattens GmbH &
Co KG (Austria)
R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Company (USA)
Sodim SAS (France)
Swedish Match North Europe Division (Sweden)
SWM International Inc. (USA)
Universal Leaf Tobacco Company (USA)
University of Kentucky (USA)
source
Just do not count on TVECA speaking in favor of the consumers.
I do not know the reputation of TVECA among US vapers.
I do, however, know the reputation of TVECA among European vapers: They shot us, the consumers, in the back. Pure and simple.
By sending a letter to the EU - before the vote on the tobacco Products Directive (TPD) in February 2014 - saying that they (the industry) would be happy with the new tobacco Products Directive. Which will be a de-facto ban on all e-cigs except the cigalikes made by Big T. They also added to please disregard what everybody else (i.e. the consumers) were saying.
See here.
TVECA may speak for consumer interests in the US. May. Once they get their noses out of the (hindquarters) of the EU mercenary bureaucrats.
But, judging from our experience in Europe, don't count on it.
And you do know who the board members are of CORESTA, the "mother association" above TVECA?
BOARD MEMBERS (2012-2014)
Alliance One International (USA)
Borgwaldt KC GmbH (Germany)
British American Tobacco (UK)
China National Tobacco Corporation (China)
Imperial Tobacco Ltd. (UK)
Japan Tobacco Inc. (Japan)
KT&G Corporation (South Korea)
Papierfabrik Wattens GmbH &
Co KG (Austria)
R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Company (USA)
Sodim SAS (France)
Swedish Match North Europe Division (Sweden)
SWM International Inc. (USA)
Universal Leaf Tobacco Company (USA)
University of Kentucky (USA)
source
Just do not count on TVECA speaking in favor of the consumers.
^ I just knew it had to be something like this. That OP in the New Members area and those following just reeked.
Found it. And yup, I agree. Very irregular, to say the least.
I do not mind at all if they see my posting above. Not at all. The European vapers have seen the actions of TVECA, shooting the consumers in the back. And adding just a little insult to injury, advising the EU not to listen to "other stakeholders", i.e. the consumers. Not to listen to those completely irrelevant people who - by purchasing vaping gear - put food on the table of TVECA's members.
It is no secret. It is on the internet, for anybody to see. *big smile*
Let them look in the mirror, if they wish. They are welcome to it.
Oh, and my memory fails me at the moment. Could somebody please fill me in on that Ray something or other of TVECA? Isn't he the guy who owns that cigalikes company?
(Do remember that the TPD that TVECA so vocally supported in Europe will be a de-facto ban on any vaping gear except cigalikes - with a 20 mg nic top limit. I.e. overpriced, proprietary junk that will not get - or keep - one single person off tobacco. But a nice cash cow for the makers and sellers, of course. Like the "printer cartridges" business model.)
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Anjaffm, I went to look after you posted. I should have given the link since I posted on the thread and it was in "My Posts"... just didn't think... sorry. Anyway, I see she took my advice and edited her OP though the Header which I also advised modification of. It originally said something like... my sarcastic words but close in meaning: The FDA will regulate all ejuice and hardware (as paraphernalia) and that's a good thing. We can all breath a sigh of relief this Monday. Go see the countdown meter at TVECA. She later posted she would keep us all updated as if she was part of the powers-that-be at TVECA. She toned it down in later posts though. I had to put a bandaide over my mouth to avoid being snarky. 
If you look at the replies, you'll see that she had some really upset. And she had a post count of 4 when she did it.
If you look at the replies, you'll see that she had some really upset. And she had a post count of 4 when she did it.
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Ray Story was one of the principles in Smoking Everywhere, the company that filed suit against the FDA in 2009 asking for an injunction against product seizures. The U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia granted the injunction. That was appealed by the FDA, but by that time, SE was going bankrupt and dropped out of the case. The Intervenor Plaintiff, Soterra, Inc. maker of NJOY products continued fighting the FDA and their lawyers made some very impressive arguments. For those who don't know, the three judge panel for the U.S. District Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia, upheld the lower court's injunction. At this point, the FDA asked for a rehearing by the full 9-judge panel, and the Appeals court turned them down. The only legal recourse they had left was to ask the U.S. Supreme Court to hear the case. Finally, the FDA figured out that the law wasn't on their side and announced that they would abide by the court ruling.
Ray Story started another company, Wannavape, and is listed of the CEO of TVECA on their web site.About The TVECA | TVECA
Bill is probably right about this whole thing being a grab for getting more members. Today's message on the TVECA home page is
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Anjaffm, I went to look after you posted. I should have given the link since I posted on the thread and it was in "My Posts"... just didn't think... sorry. Anyway, I see she took my advice and edited her OP though the Header which I also advised modification of. It originally said something like... my sarcastic words but close in meaning: The FDA will regulate all ejuice and hardware (as paraphernalia) and that's a good thing. We can all breath a sigh of relief this Monday. Go see the countdown meter at TVECA. She later posted she would keep us all updated as if she was part of the powers-that-be at TVECA. She toned it down in later posts though. I had to put a bandaide over my mouth to avoid being snarky.
Oh, I did look in your last posts, dear, and I found it easily.
Aaaarrrgggghhhhhhhh
Yeah, that's TVECA alright.
You see, they do not give a flying fig whether they make their money with useless, proprietary, overpriced cigalikes and / or pre-filled cartridges that contain all kinds of unspeakable ingredients.
Oh, anybody who thinks that FDA regulation will serve to secure ingredient purity should do some research on that issue. Here is just one example, yum yum - do not open while snacking, please .. 20 Scariest Food Facts
TVECA has just about as much concern for consumer interests as the Big T members who rule the board of its mother association, CORESTA.
Thank you very much for the explanation, Elaine
So, Ray Story is the person who filed suit against the medicinal regulation in the US. That is a good thing for us vapers. Medicinal regulation would have killed vaping.
Medicinal regulation would also have killed his business. Destroyed his livelyhood.
He killed two birds with one stone. Good thing.
Now, however, that the e-cig business is secure from the threat of medicinal regulation - and more money can be made with proprietary cigalikes and refillable cartridges than with refillable, reusable 2nd generation products and DYI vapers ... hm..... I cannot help the feeling that consumers will be readily thrown under the bus. (They did it in the EU, see my link above).
So, Ray Story is the person who filed suit against the medicinal regulation in the US. That is a good thing for us vapers. Medicinal regulation would have killed vaping.
Medicinal regulation would also have killed his business. Destroyed his livelyhood.
He killed two birds with one stone. Good thing.
Now, however, that the e-cig business is secure from the threat of medicinal regulation - and more money can be made with proprietary cigalikes and refillable cartridges than with refillable, reusable 2nd generation products and DYI vapers ... hm..... I cannot help the feeling that consumers will be readily thrown under the bus. (They did it in the EU, see my link above).
Maybe, maybe not.
But if the FDA does not announce the deeming regulation tomorrow it's going to make TVECA look pretty silly after today's message on their home page.
I'll see your wolf and raise you a crying boy.
I suspect this TVECA quagmire is going to get interesting. If anything were true the FDA now has the power to embarrass them by not publishing anything. And whether that is or isn't reality, TVECA can claim the FDA didn't publish it just to embarrass them. This can turn into an endless game of allegations which essentially will still focus some attention on TVECA.
I just realized that the TVECA is off the hook. They never said that the deeming regulation would be posted tomorrow. It's the deming regulation that they said will be posted. Click on the screen capture in response #33 to verify.
Hm... and what will TVECA do with the attention?
I had no idea what the heck TVECA even was - until they sent that damn-the-consumers-as-long-as-WE-make-money letter to the EU, and European vaping forums and Twitter carried the story of their deceit.
And let me tell you something:
I am very much aware of the goings-on in Germany and of the victories in the courts. Of the things that TVECA mentions here as their (!) successes: About The TVECA | TVECA
The word / name TVECA was not once mentioned in those connections. Not once. Not anywhere. Not by anybody. Ever.
We have a phrase for such things in German: "sich mit fremden Federn schmücken" = to make yourself look pretty with feathers that are not your own.
And seeing the comments here, it looks like TVECA does not have much of a reputation among consumers in the US either.
I was going to add "I wonder why". But that would not be truthful. I do not wonder at all.
......................
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ROFLOL
Now that, of course, might be nice thing
source
But then, I do not suppose that the FDA would touch such concepts with a ten-foot pole
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Nope. I don't believe that the FDA will have anything to do with such a deming regulation
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They must be (much like the FDA) monitoring us.
I must give them credit for being quick. The corrected spelling was posted within 5 minutes of my calling attention to "Deming" (Response #36). The screen capture in the Tweet I received from Jake Jacobsen was taken at 4:34 Central.
I must give them credit for being quick. The corrected spelling was posted within 5 minutes of my calling attention to "Deming" (Response #36). The screen capture in the Tweet I received from Jake Jacobsen was taken at 4:34 Central.
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I would not be surprised if someone leaked the document to them, and I would not be surprised if the FDA does announce tomorrow, informally they have hinted at April in the past, and at this point they are coming under much pressure from many congressman to put SOMETHING out there. Just remember if it does come tomorrow, DONT PANIC, it's a proposal! And also I think we should all question why one association would get the "scoop" before the public. Doesn't seem right to me, I too at first thought this was just a marketing ploy for TVECA to get attention, but after there latest announcement i am kind of doubting it. then again, I wouldn't put anything past them.
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