http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-library/
This covers about every subject and gets updated from time to time as information changes.
There are also "stickies" that have done this type of thing on most subjects.
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http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-library/
This covers about every subject and gets updated from time to time as information changes.
There are also "stickies" that have done this type of thing on most subjects.
I've used a bag for years. I have a bunch of RC stuff so also a bunch of experience with all kinds of batteries. Scariest battery pack I ever had was for a RC boat that had over 60 volts and 60 amps.
Meh, play with a golf cart with six 12v batteries wired series/parallel trying to figure out which solenoid isn't working! That'll get your blood flowing!
Please tell me you've wired that into a DIY MOD...
Lost it years ago. The boat stuffed a wave and went submarine. Never did find it again because I didn't put floatation in it.
You got me there.
I have 3 mega Ego twist batteries, 2 of them have gone through at least 500 charge cycles.
Would you consider that they're starting to become a potential hazard? Would you discard after this
many cycles?
That's the impression I got from a few responses.
Would you consider that they're starting to become a potential hazard? Would you discard after this
many cycles?
That's the impression I got from a few responses.
"...and now here's how it would have looked if it had exploded a school of bunnies..."
I'll believe this story soon as we get confirmed reports of cell phones blowing the heads off people. I'm sorry but that's not possible. Not with the current laws of physics. Lithium ion batteries do not explode. They "vent". This can, now and again, in very rare cases, cause whatever casing they are in to burst and quite dramatically so. But they simply are not "bombs" and they don't "explode".
Maybe the fire set off her .... lab...
Got anything else that's rechargeable? Cell phone? Lap top? Kindle? iPad?
Same batteries. Same charging chips. Same risk level.
I have a back up Motorola Razr cell here. It'll take my current SIM card. The original battery (I have a more recent spare) is now six years old. Doesn't hold a charge terribly long but still works. I got about... oh... two hours talk time out of it before I have to switch. Well, when I was using it. I picked up a cheap Samsung I'm using right now (I'm a geek but don't care for phones... had a iPhone but sold it off and went back to the rickety old Moto before buying the $15, plastic Samsung, I may have 4 terrabytes of drive storage on my desk right now but I don't "do" phones... they annoy me
).The original Li-ion battery probably went through 1500 (ish) charge cycles. Have I discarded it yet? Nope. Am I afraid of it? Nope.
Know what worries me about Li-ion batteries? People throwing them in the trash. The chemicals leach into the soil and potentially the water table. The greatest danger of our batteries is we'll poison our water by tossing them into landfills instead of recycling them properly.
By the way, the single most dangerous battery in your life right now is in your car. Lead acid batteries are very, very, very dangerous batteries. Having to do a "jump start" is something I will do but it makes me very nervous. I'm extremely cautious at every step. People are far, far too casual about doing "jump starts". And most people do them in the most absolutely wrong and most dangerous way possible.
Did you know the amperage level of a car battery can stop your heart?
Got anything else that's rechargeable? Cell phone? Lap top? Kindle? iPad?
Same batteries. Same charging chips. Same risk level.
I have a back up Motorola Razr cell here. It'll take my current SIM card. The original battery (I have a more recent spare) is now six years old. Doesn't hold a charge terribly long but still works. I got about... oh... two hours talk time out of it before I have to switch. Well, when I was using it. I picked up a cheap Samsung I'm using right now (I'm a geek but don't care for phones... had a iPhone but sold it off and went back to the rickety old Moto before buying the $15, plastic Samsung, I may have 4 terrabytes of drive storage on my desk right now but I don't "do" phones... they annoy me
The original Li-ion battery probably went through 1500 (ish) charge cycles. Have I discarded it yet? Nope. Am I afraid of it? Nope.
Know what worries me about Li-ion batteries? People throwing them in the trash. The chemicals leach into the soil and potentially the water table. The greatest danger of our batteries is we'll poison our water by tossing them into landfills instead of recycling them properly.
By the way, the single most dangerous battery in your life right now is in your car. Lead acid batteries are very, very, very dangerous batteries. Having to do a "jump start" is something I will do but it makes me very nervous. I'm extremely cautious at every step. People are far, far too casual about doing "jump starts". And most people do them in the most absolutely wrong and most dangerous way possible.
Did you know the amperage level of a car battery can stop your heart?
Any of us that have seen a vehicle battery explode first hand have (or should have) a whole new respect for them!
One of four I have seen bent upwards the corner of a not so thin 60's Ford hood and rained electrolyte all over the place.
Luckily the lady was just starting the car in the parking lot and it was not a "jumping" accident.
Hydrogen is very potent when mixed with oxygen and an ignition source.
I still have them in my vehicles and lawn mower.
Years ago a truck with a propane conversion leveled a car wash here killing 1 and injured over a dozen.
Propane explosions and fires happen all the time, but I still have a propane grill on my back deck.
Up North of us a backhoe struck a main gas line regulator allowing high pressure natural gas to go through low pressure lines into homes across Centralia burning down at least 9 homes and catching many others on fire because pilot lights became flame throwers. I still have natural gas cooking equipment and furnace.
Bottom line is the inherent risks are considered low enough that we choose to use these devices anyway.
Yes we should be prudent.
Yes ecigs are in the spotlight now.
Yes the media will sensationalize.
Yes I am sure her recollection of the venting is overstated, however studies have shown that our memories of an event that we see as extraordinary can (and often are) more sensationalized than what actually happened.
What bothers me is if this woman was provided both the ecig & charger that were incompatible then she was set up for failure.
If she mixed and matched, does this necessarily put the blame on her?
After all she obviously was not a vaper, but rather purchased a consumer level product(s).
The industry should abandon the 510 or Ego connection for charging and provide a USB client level charging port on these consumer level products.
It would only seem prudent given the exponential growth of consumer level ecigs.
BTW, less than 1/10 of an amp across a heart can stop it but that is a whole different topic.
Good idea but hard to fit in the cig-alike format that is having the greatest growth. Also, the extra cost (well under a buck per unit) would not sit too well with manufacturers, retailers or consumers.
Best way to charge anything USB, not just ecigs, is to have a separate a/c powered usb hub.
I don't plug anything into my laptops or computers as most of those things are way cheaper than my computer equipment. Powered usb hubs are very cheap, no reason not to have one.
You are correct.
However the cigalikes should have proprietary carto connections if they don't already.
This precludes charger mixing and insures that the consumer will have to purchase their cartos.
Win - Win
Once moved on to eGo style where the form factor allows, not using the 510 / eGo connection for charging and providing a client USB port like some of the Joyetech eGo-C's already have currently incurs $3 more msrp over the non USB version. (23.99 USD to 26.99 USD for the 650mah and 25.99 USD to 28.99 USD for the 900mah) This cost would surley be less due to volume and not having to make / change tooling if all of them were manufactured this way.
Yah but, the batteries charge at 4.2v.
I switched from a 510 "cig-a-like" to Twists and still have my old 510 charger. Both it and my eGo charger output 4.2v, the difference been the eGo puts out 420mA, the 510 puts out 150mA. Li-ions, in the main, are charged to 4.2 (see: Lithium-ion Batteries Information - Battery University et al). The most common around are Li-cobalt and though I haven't checked, would bet that's what's in pretty much every e-cig/PV product on the market. They've been around for near two decades, are mass produced by the bajilions (such as the US has more activated cell phones than people which is a stat that always bugs me to no end
), are well understood, and the control chips are "off the shelf".(I'm a bit of a "widget" geek who hasn't... sigh... had time to play with my widgets lately but I can tell you that were I to need a Li-ion battery in a project, I'd pop over to Jameco and buy the cheap chips everybody uses. No fretting over "design". The heavy lifting has been done, miniaturized, and prepackaged. There are reasons all eGo's do the "five click" on/off thing. The control chips are standardized, commoditized parts.)
So I say this:
Is very much not right.
The battery may well discharge around 3.7 but the charge is at 4.2 and that charger specifically says don't do that.
I went digging and the "eHit" is apparently made by Seego:
eHit - The 2013 Latest Electronic Cigarette Model Launched by Seego Technology Co., Limited
Check out the actual eHit kit:
Note the pretty typical looking eGo set up. And how that ain't the charger the woman was using. What they show is the common wall wart (albeit looks like EU style plugs or maybe that's an adapter so it works on both sides of the pond) with the typical "dongle".
What's in the photo from the article looks like the wee charger I had with my Blu. Had a one piece that could sit in my USB hub and I could screw a battery into. The PCC could charge off the wall wart while one of the absurdly underpowered batteries could be charging on the USB hub.
If the charger in the photo is what the vendor sold her, he's some 'splaining to do. That ain't the eHit kit charger. That ain't an eGo charger at all. That's a "cig-a-like" tiny stick charger at best. Since the vendor didn't insist (at least the article doesn't say) she was using the wrong charger, makes me wonder what's going on in a certain shop over Atlanta way.
Anyway, the fact that the battery fires at around 3.7 doesn't negate the fact that they charge at and to 4.2 and the standard control chips are going to expect to pull 4.2v. The charger explicitly states it's not rated for 4.2.
Finally, the woman is lying. A wall rattling explosion? We're supposed to believe that when the computer is still in one piece? Not to mention, they show the battery. The bottom cap popped. The casing is intact. The frickin' charger is intact.
But she got on the tee-vee and got to call all her friends to watch her on the TEE-VEE!!!!!
And, really, isn't that what's important?
<shudder>
I've never seen one in person. Which I'm quite fine with actually!
Have seen the results. You know, when a car burns, it's... um... impressive.
(No Hollywood "explosion" then either. But impressive none the less.)
Those are questions a "journalist" might have asked but I notice the extent of the investigative powers of the "news" department in question is sending a couple of emails. Maybe even to the actual company in question. But without noticing the issue of "language barrier" (as I recall, China is not majority English speaking but maybe I've been mislead?).
I can say this much:
That ain't the right charger.
I thought about writing the "journalist" in question but I'm just too sarcastic to be let out in public.
(At least that's what the court order says)
No, not at all.
The older they get, the less charge they'll old; that's it.
If you bang them around like drumsticks, that's another story
Automotive batteries use a completely different chemistry and construction, but they can deliver lots of power or explode spectacularly.
Li-Ion cells are far more powerful, but have the disadvantage of being more "fragile". I'm not surprised that they aren't quite as common in electric cars.
Boeing tried them in the new 777 Dreamliner, but problems caused all 777s to be grounded, worldwide, for months. Turns out a couple of wires were crossed, and that the temperature sensors, which couldn't monitor a failure properly, weren't tied to a system to respond appropriately to a failure. The battery wasn't encased properly, and kinda threw off the airport's fire response teams, when they threw water on the problem...
Li-Ion cells are far more powerful, but have the disadvantage of being more "fragile". I'm not surprised that they aren't quite as common in electric cars.
Boeing tried them in the new 777 Dreamliner, but problems caused all 777s to be grounded, worldwide, for months. Turns out a couple of wires were crossed, and that the temperature sensors, which couldn't monitor a failure properly, weren't tied to a system to respond appropriately to a failure. The battery wasn't encased properly, and kinda threw off the airport's fire response teams, when they threw water on the problem...
From what I've seen, almost everytime a battery had exploded/vented, was with eGo knockoff's. Haven't heard any of Joyetech's products catastrophically malfunctioning. Although I'm sure in very rare instances, under the worst conditions, It has and it does happen
In all seriousness, yes. Absolutely. And the "press" is being irresponsibly sensationalist (I don't agree we have either a "liberal" press nor a "conservative" press, what we got is an idiot press who's actual purpose is to increase ratings and ad revenue).
The most used lithium ion battery out there has been around almost two decades now. Early in their use in laptops (the first big usage of Li-ion in consumer products), there were some problems. A failure rate in the range of one in 200,000 which certainly isn't "mass explosions" but when Li-ions do go, they're total drama queens about it.
One of my favorite videos is this one:
Laptop Battery Fire - YouTube
Notice, by the way, despite the dramatic flare, no "window rattling explosion" occurred. No "FIFTY FOOT FLAMES SHOT ACROSS MY LIVING ROOM AND KILLED MY CATS AND MY NEIGHBORS' CATS AND THEIR NEIGHBORS' CATS AND THEN SHOT LAZER BEEMS AND TOOK OUT ATLANTA!!!!!!!!!!!" nonsense. And laptops use multiple cells. Far, far more than the one little cell in the common consumer PV/e-cig (and, also, your cell phone... if you have a cell with a changeable battery, take a look, the label on the battery will be, I'll bet cash money, "3.7v Li-ion"... same thing in your PV/e-cig... and your Kindle reader... and your iPod or other mp3 player... and your iPad or other tablet... and your laptop... which, by the way, you put in your lap on toppa your, ahem, delicate parts).
I remember the flap in the tech press (being I've been around the computer industry since we used steam) and the recalls and all. We're actually talking about a "problem" that was fixed years ago. Not that the batteries cannot fail but the risk of a serious Li-ion battery failure is such a tiny sliver of a chance, worry about it is a good thousand times less rational than fretting over being struck by lightning while winning the lottery and being hit by a train that was derailed by a meteor strike.
The batteries used in PVs/e-cigs were "commoditized" ages ago. Once the fix to the early failure rate was found and applied, the things took off big time. They're just good batteries. Very, very good. Without them, we wouldn't be running around with tiny computers in our pockets connected to global networks (aka "smart phones").
But despite the irresponsible talking (empty and lazy) heads on the teevee machine, fact is, thermal runaway (what that laptop in the video is doing) is insanely rare.
Consider the fact that the US alone has more active cell phones than people. I am not kidding. Do not ask me to explain how that works but it's true. Right now, there are enough active cell phones for every man, woman, and child (down to infant just home from the hospital) and still enough left over to supply half of Canada. How that works, I can't even imagine. Considering the vast bulk of us have one cell phone each, I can only assume there are people out there wearing clothes made of activated cell phones Lady Gaga style or something.
That's just cell phones. Just the US. Each and every one containing an Li-ion battery just like what's used in the common, consumer e-cig/PV (mods, being mods, are different cases even though the basic Li-ion technology is more or less still the same thing).
I'd have to go digging for the citation and I ain't gonna right now (the mold spores from outer space are trying to take over my sinuses or something, I been sneezing in weird codes that mean either "take us to your leader" or "humans taste delicious"... I'm not certain).
Anyway, there's around 320 million active cell phones in the US. All using the commoditized, mass produced Li-ion used in our PVs and e-cigs. Using the same mass produced charge and control circuits and such since it makes no sense to re-invent that every time you make a new product. Once we got it nailed, we turned it into "off the shelf" components. I can give you a link to where you can order them. They're cheap.
Google "cell phone explosions" and you can find more stories about those than you can for e-cigs and PVs. And there's this:
Cell phone battery explosions should be investigated, Schumer says | WJLA.com
"...dozens of incidents since 2011..."
320 million activated cell phones and we've had "dozens of incidents" in two years.
In short, your life is at risk by an order of a good million times driving to the vape shop. Around 3,000 people die per month in traffic accidents. Li-ion's "dozens of incidents" out of hundreds and hundreds of millions of batteries in use have so far resulted in... um... poorly researched news stories? Startled cats? A really cool YouTube video? Some nasty burns to a number of people small enough you could fit them into my living room and have seating left over?
Yes. Lithium is a volatile material. Inert materials don't make good batteries. They don't make batteries at all. Storing and/or generating electricity generally requires some kind of chemical reaction (I mean, even solar requires a giant nuclear fusion reactor we commonly call "the sun" in order to generate power). So the general rule is: don't be stupid.
I mean, come on. Cheap, ordinary double A batteries we all use in TV remotes and all? Do you leave them on the dashboard of the car in the summer sun? Well, no, you don't. If you did and your car burned, nobody would run sensationalist stories, they'd all mutter, "idiot" while shaking their heads.
This story? Easy. Ponkaw caught it: [url]http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/general-e-smoking-discussion/463752-another-battery-explodes.html#post10575146[/URL].
I went digging myself and the "eHit" is made by a company named Seego in the same city all the big names (like Joyetech) are (don't ask me to spell it
). If you look at the actual kit:eHit - The 2013 Latest Electronic Cigarette Model Launched by Seego Technology Co., Limited
You may notice the charger the woman in the story used is not the one that comes with the kit.
How that came about, I can't say but she used a charger that explicitly states, in red, to not do what she did...
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