What did that achieve though? I could buy a hana clone right now if i wanted, with or without the logo, so i'm guessing nothing but legal fees
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Authentic makers sueing Cloners?
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What did that achieve though? I could buy a hana clone right now if i wanted, with or without the logo, so i'm guessing nothing but legal fees
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The one thing that has been forgotten in this conversation is the difference between Chinese and American business. In communist China business is owned by or subsidized by the government so there is no need to worry about profit margins. I think anyone who has owned a small business in America (I do) knows that retail prices have gone up due to many factors. One of the biggest factors being the taxes on business. In my opinion authentic mod makers are not far out of line on their retail pricing. That being said I do believe that there is a need for clones to keep product available to consumers but counterfeit products are unacceptable. My humble opinion.
I wonder if there will still be so many clones if the authentic makers dramatically lowered the price on their products? For example, if the Hana Mod sold for $80, I wonder if it would still be cloned.
Someone told me that the Chinese are more interested in cloning atty and "round" things because they are "easier", as opposed to mods, but I guess that's not completely true. Then again, I'm surprised they haven't cloned the REO.
Someone told me that the Chinese are more interested in cloning atty and "round" things because they are "easier", as opposed to mods, but I guess that's not completely true. Then again, I'm surprised they haven't cloned the REO.
Yes round things are generally much cheaper to produce if they can use just a lathe. Milling machines are often more expensive and usually require more training to make parts to spec.
I'm starting to wonder at what price point can an authentic maker price their product to discourage cloning in the first place....
I don't think most clone manufacturers sell their products directly to consumers, usually it's through a distributor or retailer like fasttech. If an authentic maker starts to mass produce and outsource their product, and then sell it directly to consumers via their website, would their still be clones?
Let's say there is this authentic product that sells for $50, through various cost cutting and economy of scale. Can a $40 clone succeed?
I don't think most clone manufacturers sell their products directly to consumers, usually it's through a distributor or retailer like fasttech. If an authentic maker starts to mass produce and outsource their product, and then sell it directly to consumers via their website, would their still be clones?
Let's say there is this authentic product that sells for $50, through various cost cutting and economy of scale. Can a $40 clone succeed?
If it is a popular mod/atty, the same factory where the mod maker has his 'affordable' mod produced will make an extra 5000, which will go on sale at Fastech for less than the original mod maker can sell his China manufactured original mod for...
i my self will not knowingly by a knock off.
if you can't afford the authentic , guess what.
you don't get the authentic.you also should have enough common sense
not to buy the facsimile
i want a Cadillac Escalade.
can i afford it? no.
will i buy a knock off? of course not
the bottom line is if you can't afford the price you do not get it.
so sad for you? so what.grow some kahungga's.
you are not entitled to any thing.
regards
mike
if you can't afford the authentic , guess what.
you don't get the authentic.you also should have enough common sense
not to buy the facsimile
i want a Cadillac Escalade.
can i afford it? no.
will i buy a knock off? of course not
the bottom line is if you can't afford the price you do not get it.
so sad for you? so what.grow some kahungga's.
you are not entitled to any thing.
regards
mike
I rather like the approach Erlkonigin has taken with this-- they have the original Erlkonigin RTA (127,50 EUR), and just recently came out with a low-cost version called the Erlprinz (39,90 EUR). They essentially built, and are now selling, their own 'clones' before anyone else had a chance to do it. Seems pretty smart to me, and I'd love to see other manufacturers take this tack to discourage cloning.
If it were a wildly popular device, it would have been cloned and sold on Fastech for 19 Eur....
There are already clone listings up for it, actually, but they haven't managed to make any available for sale (preorder-only was the last I saw). The original manufacturer beat the cloners to the punch on this one, seems like.
It has been cloned, and very poorly, not even an air flow control. What I think is hilarious is that the Erlprinz is actually cheaper than the clone.
I'm not too familiar with the said product. What is the difference between the low cost version and the high cost version? There's got to be some significant difference to justify the price difference. For example, if I make a machined high priced version and sell it at $100, and then I make a low price version out of plastic and sell it for $40. A cloner can just clone the high end one and sell for $60, and still beats me.
I know many will argue this but the cloner who clones the high end one is not going to be using the the same materials or a high level of maching no matter what device they clone.
Product description from their website:
"Erlprinz
The Erlprinz has been designed in Austria, but some components are produced in foreign countries.
Because of lower production costs for the Erlprinz we have the possibility to offer a cost.efficient alternative to the Erlkoenigin to give interested vapors a lower priced alternative. With the Erlprinz we give everyone the chance for the introduction in royal vaping.
Although the design of the Erlprinz has been simplified it offers you almost the same vaping experience as the Erlkoenigin."
At any rate, it's definitely not plastic... well, except the co-poly tank, but that comes on the original version too.
Product description from their website:
"Erlprinz
The Erlprinz has been designed in Austria, but some components are produced in foreign countries.
Because of lower production costs for the Erlprinz we have the possibility to offer a cost.efficient alternative to the Erlkoenigin to give interested vapors a lower priced alternative. With the Erlprinz we give everyone the chance for the introduction in royal vaping.
Although the design of the Erlprinz has been simplified it offers you almost the same vaping experience as the Erlkoenigin."
At any rate, it's definitely not plastic... well, except the co-poly tank, but that comes on the original version too.
I see...but trust me, this still hurts the authentic makers. The cost to produce the vaping gears are not that much (especially if tooling/molds are involved) and the profit margin is very high for the authentic makers, even if production are not outsourced. The cloners essentially forced the authentic maker to offer something that is more aligned with the manufacturing cost. This might not be that big of a deal for something that didn't require R&D. But if someone put a lot of R &D into it, he will have a hard time recouping the development cost with this model.
For example, a drug company invest billions to develop a new drug and each pill only cost a penny to manufacture but can be sold for $10. A Chinese knockoff this and sell each pill for a nickel. No one would want to develop any new drugs.
An US authentic maker might think "hmm, this new mod I've designed cost $25 to machine and assemble, I will sell it for $100 in order to compensate me for my time." A Chinese cloner might think "hmm, this stuff cost me $15 to machine and assemble, I'll just sell it for $30 because that $15 USD profit can go a long way in China and I'm happy with it." Now the US authentic maker will have to offer a "simplifed" version that cost $20 to make and sell for $40. Guess who loses?
Again, the manufacturing cost of vaping gears are low relative to the selling price whether you outsource or not. By "simplifying" something you are not saving that much because the original version isn't that costly to make in the first place.
This is why clones are so deadly to the innovation in this industry.
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They are still in process. When the judgments come down and businesses get closed, that's when things change.
We will find out. Well, if they every stop extending the findings. I think the earliest is now Jan, and mediation has been ordered.
In a way, China isn't so far off than ourselves. Communist USA coming soon to a country near you. As slow as the one man boat from China to the US but it is creeping its way in.
Here in Ohio Kaisich decided to put more tax on Business and less on Individuals. The individuals said Wooohooo... They don't even see the increased product cost. Well his Small Business Deduction did help the small business. Although those saving were not offset to the consumer. What is a small business? An individual that collects a 1099 instead of W-2. At the end of the day it is not much of a difference. The same as a large corp vs small.
just as an aside under the heading some people have to much free time on their hands.
the best grade replica Rolexs are so good now a certified watch maker would have to
disassemble part of the movement to verify its authenticity.
not a jeweler a watchmaker.
regards
mike
the best grade replica Rolexs are so good now a certified watch maker would have to
disassemble part of the movement to verify its authenticity.
not a jeweler a watchmaker.
regards
mike
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