BEHOLD: The absolute perfect tobacco flavoring and nicotine extraction method.

[Faethe]

Do tinctures have to be made with VG, or can the same method be used with PG? I only ask because my one experience with VG was somewhat unpleasant. (sour/rumbly stomach, some heartburn)

Either one works the same way. Propelyne Glycol gets a bad rap from cosmetics manufacturers for some reason. I think because it's processed and not organic. I don't know. It's thinner, though. People do like VG because it's sweet. Some tinctures are used for medicines and stuff. Grain alcohol is NASTY to taste. But yes - you can use PG or VG no worries. In fact I'm pretty sure PG handles heat better than VG so you may be able to boil it directly independent of a water bath.

 

[duncantiv]

@Faethe:
Thanks for the info. I'm not sure when I'll try it, but I'll feel a bit more confident about the whole thing when I do.

By the way, I tried the first method listed by the88thcrazy (with some tweaks), and as far as I'm concerned, it was a blazing success! The only tweaks consisted of how many Snus I used and the duration of soak. The Camel Snus they sell around here have a hint of honey, I was told, and after letting 3 soak for about 27 hours in a shotglass (I was shooting for 24 hours, but life got in the way), I can tell you that honey is definitely in there! I took one drag and was instantly in love. There was a small hint of tobacco flavour, which was nice, but it was seriously like smoking a honey-flavoured cigarette.

Recap: 1 2 oz. shotglass with 3 Camel Snus Mellows, filled almost to brim with PG, covered in cling wrap and left on top of the fridge for 27 hours. Approximately 1.5 oz. of juice was produced. I then poured into a bottle using a funnel with a coffee filter (just in case). No residue was left on the filter, which didn't surprise me, so I'll probably ditch the filters from now on. Nicotine level seemed a bit low, but I puff almost constantly on my 801, so I doubt that'll be a big issue. Flavour was predominately of the honey, with a hint of tobacco.

Next: Unflavoured Snus on the way from BuySnus, both Camel as well as the Oden high-nicotine stuff. Until they arrive, however, I'm going to experiment with "sun brewing" my juice to see if it gets a bit more kick. Oh, and a neighbour gave me one of those single-cup coffee pouches. I may play with soaking that too.

Thanks to all for these great ideas!

 

[Deadmau5]

will this dirty up your atomizer D:

 

[Deadmau5]

i've read somewhere that chewing tobacco has molasses to enhance the flavor, and I wud think that snus would, too.

molasses on atomizer = nono

 

[duncantiv]

i've read somewhere that chewing tobacco has molasses to enhance the flavor, and I wud think that snus would, too.

molasses on atomizer = nono

The Swedish snus state that nothing is added to the tobacco, but currently I'm using the American, so I'm not sure about molasses but definitely honey. I'll have to do a residue test to see. It may take a day or two for me to get time to try it, but I'll post once I know for sure.

 

[duncantiv]

Hey, I have an odd question for the group. Looking at bottles on ebottles.com, they talk a lot about the resins the bottles are made from, and the different applications those resins are good for. Does anybody here have any idea what kind of plastic would be good for storing PG?

I'll be calling ebottles on monday to ask their opinion, but thought I'd try here first.

 

[duncantiv]

Damn it, I need an edit button.

Ok, checked around, and discovered a handy guide to plastic bottle symbols. It turns out that my PG came in an HDPE bottle, indicated on the bottom by a 2 inside of the triangle-arrow symbol and the letters HDPE underneath the symbol. The 10mL bottles I have gotten from BestECig seem to be of the same type of material, but have no definite indicator.

HDPE does have a small amount of flex to it, so in combination with a dropper dispensing lid, I think it'll be good. I've requested some samples from containerandpackaging.com so once they arrive, I'll know for sure. I'm still going to call them and ebottles to check on the compatibility of LDPE, which is softer and therefore better for squeeze bottle application, but it probably won't be needed.

If anybody is interested, the part numbers at containerandpackaging.com are L500 for the dropper lid (25 cents ea) and B439 for the 0.5oz/14.8mL HDPE bottle (10 cents ea). Bulk discounts are available.

Hmmm, an edit button has now appeared. Odd, but very welcome given how my brain works.

 

[duncantiv]

will this dirty up your atomizer D:

Curse you and your "reality", Deadmau5! I did the residue test with three drops of my homemade stuff and three drops of RY4 from BestECig. The residue spot from the homemade was about 2-3 times bigger than the spot from the RY4!

Oddly enough, there was a tiny spot of syrupy liquid left from the RY4 that I couldn't get to evaporate in a reasonable amount of time, but that's a little beside the point.

So, what's the best way to clean an atomizer?

Edit: I am still going to try this with the Snus I have coming. They're up to the Swedish standard and should have less additives.

 

[Faethe]

The Swedish snus state that nothing is added to the tobacco, but currently I'm using the American, so I'm not sure about molasses but definitely honey. I'll have to do a residue test to see. It may take a day or two for me to get time to try it, but I'll post once I know for sure.

I am really glad this is working out for you Yeah - the Oden Snus smell and appear to break down into what tastes like Tobacco Absolute. There is just nothing in there except Tobacco from what I can tell. I ordered the plain ones. You can get some with a hint of anise in it. What I am doing now is goofing around with essential oils as flavorings. This is *not* recommended because oil *appears* to make your atomizer run hotter. This is even after diluting it in vodka. I put one drop of Anise Essential oil in 10ml of snu juice and there is a difference.

However, I can not sufficiently rule out that this is because I am vaping my head off or because the oil is making that much of a difference. I am using a Janty Dura C for all this. My home brew has not had significant decrease in vapor production for about 3 days, so i am going to say it's not fouling the atomizer anymore than usual.

Note that I do clean my atomizers once a week. I cycle through 3 atomizers in total during the week and clean/boil them in coffee pot/espresso machine cleaner at the end of the week. I expected that snu juice would produce more 'dregs', but it hasn't. There are particles floating around in there but they are very tiny. All things being equal the finished product looks very much like very dark nic juice.

 

[Faethe]

Oh - I just noticed you wanted cleaning info

There are many threads with many methods. I settled on getting a small thing of this stuff:

Joe Glo

The shipping for that stuff is crazy. You can use any espresso/coffee machine cleaner. Different people like different ones.

With the Joe Glo I use a tablespoon of stuff in about 200ml of water in a 400ml pyrex beaker. I pop my atomizers in and boil them very gently for maybe two or three minutes, then let them cool. I blow them out, then rinse them out with clean water. Then I let them dry.

And that's it. Stuff does come out, but nothing weird. Not yet, anyway

 

[duncantiv]

Faethe, you are rapidly becoming my heroine! Thanks for the cleaning tips.

Ok, redid my residue test. Last time I used a spoon over a lighter, but decided that a shaky hand or misestimated distance between lighter and spoon could have skewed the results, even if only marginally. On top of that, when I rinsed the spoon, the Snu residue washed right off almost immediately.

For the second test, I took a small pot, maybe 1 quart size, and put five drops of each liquid on either side of the pan, about the same distance from the center. The homemade juice evaporated much more quickly, leaving a light residue over the entire area the 'puddle' had sat. The RY4 surprised me, though. It took a LOT longer to cook off all the liquid, and when it was all done, I was left with a deep brown "scab" that took up maybe 25% of the area the liquid initially occupied. After letting the pot cool for a bit, I ran hot water into the pot, and like the spoon, the homemade juice residue rinsed away almost completely with just water, but I had to go in with a scrubber brush to get rid of the RY4 scab. It was relatively easy to get rid of the scab, but my fingers are currently crossed that I haven't ruined my favourite Ramen pot! 8-o (Damn, just realized I should have taken some pictures of the results. Sometimes I'm SUCH a .....!)

I really wish I had plain tobacco flavour juice to try this with, but money has been tight of late. If anybody else can try the same experiment with plain tobacco juice, I for one would love to hear the results. As for the RY4, it seems cleaning would be a lot harder, and would most likely shorten the lifespan of an atomizer more, than if one were vaping the Snu juice.

Opinions?

 

[let_there_be_vaping]

Regarding the mentions of what the ingredients in Odin's Snus might be. The following are their ingredients:

Contents: Tobacco
Water (about) 52%
Taste Enhancer (table Salt)
Humectants (E 1520)
Acidity Regulator (E 500)
Nicotine (about) 17 Mg/g
Salt (about) 5%

This information was found at: Odens Original Extra Stark Portion, Odens Extra Stark Cinnamon, Portion, Swedish snus, tobacco, snus, smokeless tobacco, original, classic, portion

See any problem ingredients? Any to cause atomizer troubles? I'm thinking about making some, but with my atty luck I'm wondering if my luck will decrease even more! So that is a definite concern for me.

Thanks.

 

[casey8579]

Hi, everyone.

1st off thanks to everyone for their info on this thread about making your own liquid, very helpful.

Just got my 510 3 days ago and getting used to it but so far so good. After reading thru this thread I tried a quick and dirty experiment for making liquid which actually turned out pretty good. I had some old (and I do mean OLD) pipe tobacco which I put a handfull loose in a saucepan 3/4 full of tap water. Left it simmering uncovered on the stove til the water cooked off leaving maybe 3/4 cup of very dark liquid. I strained this thru a coffee filter into a jar for saving.

Then using some vg picked up at the drug store, I mixed up a small bottle of liquid that is suprisingly good. Definite tobacco taste and mildly sweet tasting, with more vapor because of the vg as I understand it.

Of course there is no way to know the nicotine strength, my subjective opinion is that it is fairly strong because after refilling a cart and trying it, it left me more satisfied with the smoke than with the camel light carts I had been using that came with the kit.

Wonder if you could get it a little stronger by adding more water back to the pan and let it simmer longer? Any ideas?

 

[deeptrout]

Ok i asked this question once already but didnt get a response so here it is again.

I am interested in vaping as an alternative to the various cancerous chemicals that are included in tobacco, these home extraction methods of commercial tobacco products just seem to provide a different way of getting those same nasty chemicals into the system. Am i missing something here?

 

[sherid]

Ok i asked this question once already but didnt get a response so here it is again.

I am interested in vaping as an alternative to the various cancerous chemicals that are included in tobacco, these home extraction methods of commercial tobacco products just seem to provide a different way of getting those same nasty chemicals into the system. Am i missing something here?

Some people are still interested in finding a safer way to smoke it. Burning tobacco appears to be the most dangerous. It would make sense that heating via an atomizer rather than lighting with fire and burning tobacco would be somewhat safer. I believe that some vapers would still love to use tobacco, especially if they could lower the risk of doing so.

 

[Faethe]

I really wish I had plain tobacco flavour juice to try this with, but money has been tight of late. If anybody else can try the same experiment with plain tobacco juice, I for one would love to hear the results. As for the RY4, it seems cleaning would be a lot harder, and would most likely shorten the lifespan of an atomizer more, than if one were vaping the Snu juice.

Aw thank you That's really interesting there. So you are saying that the quality of residue was harsher with the RY4? I can try to test this out tomorow with a candle burner thing I have. I am also going to uncork the coffee I put up three weeks ago and see what that is like as a flavoring agent.

I am interested in vaping as an alternative to the various cancerous chemicals that are included in tobacco, these home extraction methods of commercial tobacco products just seem to provide a different way of getting those same nasty chemicals into the system. Am i missing something here?

I'm not using American tobacco. People who make their own juice have a tendency to be picky because we don't want the carcinogens added back in. Also - we are not burning any of this stuff. There are threads where there has been speculation about VG decomposing into something else at temperatures exceeding 100 C (the boiling point of water). If you want to look there, you can see the various arguments pro and con as to whether this is something to be concerned about.

The best possible solution (and some people are doing this) is to grow your own tobacco from scratch. It's really not hard to do. You can grow it in a pot. Or get 'organic tobacco' and experiement with that.

The whole reason we are using snus in this thread is because the amount of nicotine in the snus is advertised (for most of them). When you use raw tobacco, or pipe tobacco, you run the risk of making a too strong 'tea'. This is also why the people in this thread started with just one snu in a shotglass of VG. At high levels, Nicotine can kill you or at the very least make you explode various liquids from orifices that usually do not. If you've crapped yourself, it's too strong You don't want to do that, do you?

Some people are still interested in finding a safer way to smoke it. Burning tobacco appears to be the most dangerous. It would make sense that heating via an atomizer rather than lighting with fire and burning tobacco would be somewhat safer. I believe that some vapers would still love to use tobacco, especially if they could lower the risk of doing so.

Yeah exactly. We don't know at this point. We do know that we are not burning it. My Doctor did a backflip when I explained all of what I know to her. She thinks the majority of what we are experiencing is behavioral - we think we smoke and therefore we are. But we don't know yet. The preliminary studies suggest that this is safer to much safer.

Just stay tuned. We'll know more when the studies come in. As for me personally, I feel much better since I have stopped smoking leaves.

 

[WerkIt]

I bow to all here for these wonderful experiments and wish you much luck in your endeavors.

As a snus user, I would like to let you all know, if you are looking for a pure tobacco flavor, without any additional flavors added in, such as bergamot, citrus, juniper, anise, licorice, mint, etc, Tre Ankare snus is one you might wish to try for extraction.

For those working with roll your own (ryo) tobacco for your extractions, be aware of how the tax game is now played. The tax increases that hit on 4/1/09 placed a tax of $24.50 per pound on roll your own tobaccos. What many ryo tobacco companies have done to counter this, is to market ryo tobaccos as pipe cut tobaccos. What this means is, instead of paying $40 for a pound of ryo tobacco, you can now pay $17.95 for 12 oz. of 'pipe cut' tobacco, many of which provide a VERY smooth tobacco at that price. I HIGHLY recommend the Smoker's Outlet "Natural' pipe cut tobacco(http://www.smokersoutletonline.com/smokers-outlet-pipe-tobacco-p-211.html), which is for sale at that price, although the 'robust' blend will most assuredly provide a higher nicotine level than the 'natural.' If you find the cut a bit 'rough' for extraction, run the tobacco through a food processor or coffee grinder prior to proceeding with your extraction experiments.

Additionally, the highly famed D & R has also made their exceedingly fine tobaccos available in pipe cut (Trisha's Cafe-Premium Pipe Cut Tobacco-Pipes-Pipe Cleaners-Tampers-Pouches). If you wish to extract pure Virginia you can order either the Windsail (British Virginia) or Penhooker (Canadian Virginia). If you really wish to extract an optimal tobacco flavor, cut either of the above Virginias with a quarter to a third of the Ramback Turkish, although I would personally recommend 1/4 of the Ramback Turkish to 3/4 of either Virginia. The addition of the Turkish will lower the nicotine content of the final extraction. However, you will find the sacrifice will be well worth what the Turkish does for the final flavor. (Turkish is to tobacco as salt is to food, it improves the flavor of EVERY tobacco to which it is added.) Again, if you find these pipe cuts to be too rough, process or grind them prior to extraction. The D & R can be purchased in quantities as small as 3.5 ounce tins or 14 oz pouches and cost a bit more than the Smoker's Outlet brand, but far, far less than any of the sub standard ryo tobaccos at the new tax tier.

I do not work for either of the above companies. I have merely been in the ryo arena for almost two years and am fairly well aquainted with the available tobaccos and hope to provide information that will prove fruitful in future experiments, while hopefully, saving money for those who will be purchasing tobaccos for extraction, by helping those to escape the new extortionary taxes on the ryo tobaccos.

 

[rinkusu]

...If you've crapped yourself, it's too strong

I about fell outta my chair when I read that.

"Experiment complete.
Begin test vaping.
Am I crapping myself?
No!
Keep vaping!"

 

[tescela]

I bow to all here for these wonderful experiments and wish you much luck in your endeavors.

As a snus user, I would like to let you all know, if you are looking for a pure tobacco flavor, without any additional flavors added in, such as bergamot, citrus, juniper, anise, licorice, mint, etc, Tre Ankare snus is one you might wish to try for extraction.

For those working with roll your own (ryo) tobacco for your extractions, be aware of how the tax game is now played. The tax increases that hit on 4/1/09 placed a tax of $24.50 per pound on roll your own tobaccos. What many ryo tobacco companies have done to counter this, is to market ryo tobaccos as pipe cut tobaccos. What this means is, instead of paying $40 for a pound of ryo tobacco, you can now pay $17.95 for 12 oz. of 'pipe cut' tobacco, many of which provide a VERY smooth tobacco at that price. I HIGHLY recommend the Smoker's Outlet "Natural' pipe cut tobacco(http://www.smokersoutletonline.com/smokers-outlet-pipe-tobacco-p-211.html), which is for sale at that price, although the 'robust' blend will most assuredly provide a higher nicotine level than the 'natural.' If you find the cut a bit 'rough' for extraction, run the tobacco through a food processor or coffee grinder prior to proceeding with your extraction experiments.

Additionally, the highly famed D & R has also made their exceedingly fine tobaccos available in pipe cut (Trisha's Cafe-Premium Pipe Cut Tobacco-Pipes-Pipe Cleaners-Tampers-Pouches). If you wish to extract pure Virginia you can order either the Windsail (British Virginia) or Penhooker (Canadian Virginia). If you really wish to extract an optimal tobacco flavor, cut either of the above Virginias with a quarter to a third of the Ramback Turkish, although I would personally recommend 1/4 of the Ramback Turkish to 3/4 of either Virginia. The addition of the Turkish will lower the nicotine content of the final extraction. However, you will find the sacrifice will be well worth what the Turkish does for the final flavor. (Turkish is to tobacco as salt is to food, it improves the flavor of EVERY tobacco to which it is added.) Again, if you find these pipe cuts to be too rough, process or grind them prior to extraction. The D & R can be purchased in quantities as small as 3.5 ounce tins or 14 oz pouches and cost a bit more than the Smoker's Outlet brand, but far, far less than any of the sub standard ryo tobaccos at the new tax tier.

I do not work for either of the above companies. I have merely been in the ryo arena for almost two years and am fairly well aquainted with the available tobaccos and hope to provide information that will prove fruitful in future experiments, while hopefully, saving money for those who will be purchasing tobaccos for extraction, by helping those to escape the new extortionary taxes on the ryo tobaccos.

test test test

 

[let_there_be_vaping]

Well I just ordered a couple cans of Odin's.

Gonna try this out. With the luck of I'm having with my atomizers, I am guessing that this won't kill them any faster (and hoping too!). Maybe making my own juice will free up some dollars that can be spent on more hardware... that'd be great (as Tony the Tiger says it).

Now to just wait for it's arrival.