Boycott state farm

[smonomo]

Did you really just link wikipedia in a discussion expecting someone to open it in the first place?

Wut!!!.....uh, yes I did

Secondly, to take anything in it as fact? Sorry, but I dont open Wiki for any information.

I didn't say it was fact, or information - It's a poem!....but how would you know, you don't open Wiki

Use Real resources please. All we need are people thinking they can show up to a State Farm fight quoting wikipedia articles.

Sure,


Here's some news you can use - The corporations run this country, they are the government.

Congratulations!.. you've taken political correctness to a new level...You must be the poster child.

 

[Reign]

Wut!!!.....uh, yes I did

Sadly, Yes, you did, and it shows how much you care for the "cause" you sit here and act out about.

I didn't say it was fact, or information - It's a poem!....but how would you know, you don't open Wiki

If its not fact, or information, then what was the reason to post it from wiki? Why not just copy and paste the poem? Too much work to right click and copy, then left click and paste? You have given the laziest post ever.

Will you read the poem to State Farm, which will immediately cause them to rewrite their company policy, changing the views of the FDA and other government offials and making E-cigs an approved device? Cant wait to see it.

Sure,

Here's some news you can use - The corporations run this country, they are the government.

Congratulations!.. you've taken political correctness to a new level...You must be the poster child.

Show some proof that the corporations run this country. That sounds like something an ignorant conspiracy theorist would say. Sadly, without proof, you lose. As far as I can see, We have government officials, elected by the US citizens who are running the country. Not the CEO of some corporation.

So how have I taken political correctness to a new level? I like to look at the facts, you have not and can't produce any. Your logic on attacking the corporations' policies causing the government to change the laws is majorly flawed, and it seems you lack the understanding of the meaning of basic words and phrases in the english language. I sure hope the fight for E-cigs never rests in your hands.

Buh Bye now.

 

[Mac]

Sadly, Yes, you did, and it shows how much you care for the "cause" you sit here and act out about.





If its not fact, or information, then what was the reason to post it from wiki? Why not just copy and paste the poem? Too much work to right click and copy, then left click and paste? You have given the laziest post ever.



Will you read the poem to State Farm, which will immediately cause them to rewrite their company policy, changing the views of the FDA and other government offials and making E-cigs an approved device? Cant wait to see it.







Show some proof that the corporations run this country. That sounds like something an ignorant conspiracy theorist would say. Sadly, without proof, you lose. As far as I can see, We have government officials, elected by the US citizens who are running the country. Not the CEO of some corporation.



So how have I taken political correctness to a new level? I like to look at the facts, you have not and can't produce any. Your logic on attacking the corporations' policies causing the government to change the laws is majorly flawed, and it seems you lack the understanding of the meaning of basic words and phrases in the english language. I sure hope the fight for E-cigs never rests in your hands.



Buh Bye now.

I am going to jump in here. Corporations have a huge political influence on our government. They don't call it bribery they call it lobbying. I suspect there are more shady and insidious instances taking place. But cannot prove it. I think a prime example of this is how the FDA has treated e-cigs. Their own studies pretty much prove they are way safer then cigarettes and yet they seek to prohibit them. why? I will tell you why. The FDA makes a great deal of money off of the pharmacutical industry and e-cigs are a serious threat to all the FDA approved NRT's. Thus the FDA's unethical stance. Can I prove it? No. Am i convinced that this is what's happening? Yes, 100%.



If you don't think a boycott will work then fine, don't boycott state farm. But when you come in here bashing people for joining in you are effectively working against our cause. If you use e-cigs that means you are working against your self which is the definition of counter productive.



In short, yes corporate america does influence our government and if you don't think my boycott will have an effect then don't join in. You don't have to attack the people who are.

 

[nikosm]

Show some proof that the corporations run this country. That sounds like something an ignorant conspiracy theorist would say. Sadly, without proof, you lose. As far as I can see, We have government officials, elected by the US citizens who are running the country. Not the CEO of some corporation.

Our government may give the impression that it is a democracy, but its just that - an illusion. Yes, we are called upon every 2 years to elect members of congress, 90% of whom are re-elected in the toughest years, but do you think they take the views of the average citizen into account when they draft legislation? Considering the cost of running for national office, a candidate needs to raise tons of money, which means getting donations from wealthy elites who have a stake in the status quo. This is why Obama met with the CEOs of insurance and drug companies prior to drafting his healthcare bill and why did Altria write the FDA tobacco regulation bill. The multinational corporations have owned Congress for years and thats why we're having this trouble with the e-cig. If Pfizer or Altria had invented it, they would have made sure that they could be used anywhere and hailed it as the long-awaited "safe cigarette". The corporations also donate heavily to organizations like the ACS ,ALA, and universities, who are not going to take a position that will piss off their benefactors. This is not conspiracy theory nonsense, this is reality.

 

[Reign]

I am going to jump in here. Corporations have a huge political influence on our government. They don't call it bribery they call it lobbying. I suspect there are more shady and insidious instances taking place. But cannot prove it. I think a prime example of this is how the FDA has treated e-cigs. Their own studies pretty much prove they are way safer then cigarettes and yet they seek to prohibit them. why? I will tell you why. The FDA makes a great deal of money off of the pharmacutical industry and e-cigs are a serious threat to all the FDA approved NRT's. Thus the FDA's unethical stance. Can I prove it? No. Am i convinced that this is what's happening? Yes, 100%.

The FDA has policies and procedures it follows. Policies and procedures that can always be interpreted to meet the needs of its interpreter.

Heres the question. Will pissing off State Farm cause the FDA to see the error of their ways and change things? Or will it give State Farm a reason to throw money at finding a way to kick our butts when it gets down and dirty later on? We cant hurt State Farm, but they can hurt us. Gatta pick your fights, This is not a worthwhile fight to pick.

If you don't think a boycott will work then fine, don't boycott state farm. But when you come in here bashing people for joining in you are effectively working against our cause. If you use e-cigs that means you are working against your self which is the definition of counter productive.

First and foremost, Quote where I bashed anyone for wanting to help our cause. I really want to see that. That is the most absurd thing Ive Heard so far. Go read the thread, then come back.

In short, yes corporate america does influence our government and if you don't think my boycott will have an effect then don't join in. You don't have to attack the people who are.

Again, Show me where I bashed anyone. Your just pointing fingers at a ghost at this point. Your laughable boycott is rediculous, and instead of going on some pointless venture, why dont you join up and fight one of the current battles going on.

Do you not think that State Farm has the right to determine what happens on their property? If I tell you not to bring alcohol to my house in any form because I dont want it around my children, is that Wrong of me to ask that? Should you be allowed to smoke at your childrens school or vape inside the school? Is it Wrong that they disallow it? You are, in principles, no different than the anti-smoking groups.

Why are you calling it YOUR boycott? Wouldnt it be OUR boycott since you are attempting to represent a larger group than just yourself? If you are not representing people other than yourself, thenwhy are you on this forum?

Our government may give the impression that it is a democracy, but its just that - an illusion. Yes, we are called upon every 2 years to elect members of congress, 90% of whom are re-elected in the toughest years, but do you think they take the views of the average citizen into account when they draft legislation? Considering the cost of running for national office, a candidate needs to raise tons of money, which means getting donations from wealthy elites who have a stake in the status quo. This is why Obama met with the CEOs of insurance and drug companies prior to drafting his healthcare bill and why did Altria write the FDA tobacco regulation bill. The multinational corporations have owned Congress for years and thats why we're having this trouble with the e-cig. If Pfizer or Altria had invented it, they would have made sure that they could be used anywhere and hailed it as the long-awaited "safe cigarette". The corporations also donate heavily to organizations like the ACS ,ALA, and universities, who are not going to take a position that will piss off their benefactors. This is not conspiracy theory nonsense, this is reality.

Fact: Bank of America is not our government
Fact: Walmart is not our government
Fact: State Farm is not our government
Fact: RJR is not our government

False: Corporations are our government


Having influence and being our government are two different things.

Two WAY different things. Im a member of the IAFF(union) which has alot of pull and influence. Does that make me government?

What it comes down to is the use of propaganda here that suggest that corporations own our government which isn't true. Stop being such drama queens.

Pissing off corporations is not what we want to do. We want to make the government see our side and give us a fair oppotunity to make our case.

 

[ApOsTle51]

Some companies won't employ anyone who uses nicotine regardless of the delivery method.

If they banned nicotine consumption instead of specifically naming e-cigs , would you still be up in arms about it ?

 

[Mac]

The FDA has policies and procedures it follows. Policies and procedures that can always be interpreted to meet the needs of its interpreter.

Heres the question. Will pissing off State Farm cause the FDA to see the error of their ways and change things? Or will it give State Farm a reason to throw money at finding a way to kick our butts when it gets down and dirty later on? We cant hurt State Farm, but they can hurt us. Gatta pick your fights, This is not a worthwhile fight to pick.





First and foremost, Quote where I bashed anyone for wanting to help our cause. I really want to see that. That is the most absurd thing Ive Heard so far. Go read the thread, then come back.





Again, Show me where I bashed anyone. Your just pointing fingers at a ghost at this point. Your laughable boycott is rediculous, and instead of going on some pointless venture, why dont you join up and fight one of the current battles going on.

Do you not think that State Farm has the right to determine what happens on their property? If I tell you not to bring alcohol to my house in any form because I dont want it around my children, is that Wrong of me to ask that? Should you be allowed to smoke at your childrens school or vape inside the school? Is it Wrong that they disallow it? You are, in principles, no different than the anti-smoking groups.

Why are you calling it YOUR boycott? Wouldnt it be OUR boycott since you are attempting to represent a larger group than just yourself? If you are not representing people other than yourself, thenwhy are you on this forum?



Fact: Bank of America is not our government
Fact: Walmart is not our government
Fact: State Farm is not our government
Fact: RJR is not our government

False: Corporations are our government


Having influence and being our government are two different things.

Two WAY different things. Im a member of the IAFF(union) which has alot of pull and influence. Does that make me government?

What it comes down to is the use of propaganda here that suggest that corporations own our government which isn't true. Stop being such drama queens.

Pissing off corporations is not what we want to do. We want to make the government see our side and give us a fair oppotunity to make our case.

If you think the FDA's behavior has been acceptable it is very clear that we disagree.

I don't care if state farm gets ...... off or not. I think any ecig user who uses them has the right not to if they don 't agree with their policies. Down and dirty later on? HA! It's down and dirty now.

You derailed the thread arguing about wikki. You also implied the effort was not worth it. Besides, how can you really believe that the corporations don't influence our government? That sounds like a conspiracy theory? Lobbying is no secret How many crooks have been caught in washington? How many do you suppose haven't been? That's hardly a conspiracy theory and pointless to bicker about since it distracts fropm the real issue which is how LAME it is for a business owner to tell someone struggling to quit smoking that they cant puff vapors from an electronic simulator in their own car. You can equate that to me encouraging kids to smoke in school if you want. But your logic is flawed. "Oh it's for the children" Hmm that sounds familiar. (really? I mean really dude?)

I do stand corrected for calling it my boycott though. You are 100% correct there. I retract that statement fully. It's for all of us! Every e-smoker! Boycott State Farm! Send a message to the Anti's! If you don't like us we won't buy!

 

[Mac]

Some companies won't employ anyone who uses nicotine regardless of the delivery method.

If they banned nicotine consumption instead of specifically naming e-cigs , would you still be up in arms about it ?

Yes I find that even more offensive. There should be limits to invasive corporate practices. You should not be able to dictate what an employee does when not working, especially if it does not break the law. They don't own you. Thats been over with for a long time.

I see the logic in restricting smoking in public areas. Especially enclosed ones. But in some places like bars it seems very silly. Nevertheless ecigs seem like they can provide a solution everyone can live with. Yet look at the reaction. It's because people who empower themselves by assuming control do not like that control rendered obsolete.Which makes me wonder if these so called crusaders ever had any interest in helping anyone anyway.

 

[Reign]

If you think the FDA's behavior has been acceptable it is very clear that we disagree.!

Dont think I've said that either. Read what has been written and nothing more. You seem to read either way into things, or maybe you put words in other peoples mouths on purpose to incite arguments. Im not sure, but it only hurts your cause by pushing people away.

I don't care if state farm gets ...... off or not. I think any ecig user who uses them has the right not to if they don 't agree with their policies. Down and dirty later on? HA! It's down and dirty now.!

You should care. The biggest reason boycotts dont work nowadays is because they are overly used with less than necessary resources. Companies laugh at them now. Every buisness out there at this moment is under some kind of boycott whether you understand that or not.

Your also absolutely correct. Anyone can choose not to do buisness with any company in the world for whatever reason they choose. People do it everyday which is why calling your little effort here a boycott is so funny.

You derailed the thread arguing about wikki. You also implied the effort was not worth it. Besides, how can you really believe that the corporations don't influence our government? That sounds like a conspiracy theory? Lobbying is no secret How many crooks have been caught in washington? How many do you suppose haven't been? That's hardly a conspiracy theory and pointless to bicker about since it distracts fropm the real issue which is how LAME it is for a business owner to tell someone struggling to quit smoking that they cant puff vapors from an electronic simulator in their own car. You can equate that to me encouraging kids to smoke in school if you want. But your logic is flawed. "Oh it's for the children" Hmm that sounds familiar. (really? I mean really dude?)

I didnt derail the thread with Wiki. One of your supporters did by linking wiki as a source. If you think using wiki as a source will win you any sort of fight...your in for a rude awakening.

I do think this little effort isn't worth it and I have every right to say so, just as you had the right to post it here, and State Farm has every right to stop nicotine use on their premises.

Once again, read the posts I wrote. I didnt say corporations didnt influence. I said they dont run or own the government as your "boycotters" claimed.

As for State Farm's Policy...again....They are an insurance company. They want the image of health and professionalism. Addiction to anything does not equate to health and having something shooting vapor out of your mouth during a meeting, or walking a client out of the building or to his car..is not exactly professsional either. Explain to me the fallacies in my logic.

Have you done any research to figure out what the cause of the policy was? Is it possible that a sales rep lost the company a large account because he lit a cigarette up while talking to the customer on the way to his car and blew smoke in his face? All this is the reason you fail. In order for you to do any sort of good, you need to give real information with actual sources(wiki doesnt count), NO propaganda, and drop the holier-than-thou attitude that pushed more people away from the cause than it brings in.

You seem to get very defensive when anyone comes in and has the slightest opinion varience to the point that you act like they are attacking your agenda. This isnt true. How can you possibly fight if you havent debated and seen both sides of the argument?

I do stand corrected for calling it my boycott though. You are 100% correct there. I retract that statement fully. It's for all of us! Every e-smoker! Boycott State Farm! Send a message to the Anti's! If you don't like us we won't buy!

Please, Do not represent me. You say you want to send a message to the anti's...your attitude and disregard towards people has made you one.

 

[Reign]

Yes I find that even more offensive. There should be limits to invasive corporate practices. You should not be able to dictate what an employee does when not working, especially if it does not break the law. They don't own you. Thats been over with for a long time.

I see the logic in restricting smoking in public areas. Especially enclosed ones. But in some places like bars it seems very silly. Nevertheless ecigs seem like they can provide a solution everyone can live with. Yet look at the reaction. It's because people who empower themselves by assuming control do not like that control rendered obsolete.Which makes me wonder if these so called crusaders ever had any interest in helping anyone anyway.

If you are on their property, they should be able to have you follow any rules they set. Otherwise, you can leave the property. That is your choice as theirs is to set the rules.

 

[ApOsTle51]

my job deems i am expected to give regular and un announced drug testing. nicotine isnt one of them ( yet) but many apparently innocent over the counter medicines are a no no, ibuprofen for example, cold and flu remedies ..booze of course even NRT needs to be monitored for side effects.

I knew that fact when i took on the job and i abide by my employers wishes. If you don't like it , then you don't do the job. Nicotine is harmfull to your health you can't refute that fact. If a company wishes to maintain a healthy workforce then it is their perogative to do so.

 

[smonomo]

Sadly, Yes, you did, and it shows how much you care for the "cause" you sit here and act out about.


If its not fact, or information, then what was the reason to post it from wiki? Why not just copy and paste the poem? Too much work to right click and copy, then left click and paste? You have given the laziest post ever.

Will you read the poem to State Farm, which will immediately cause them to rewrite their company policy, changing the views of the FDA and other government offials and making E-cigs an approved device? Cant wait to see it.



Show some proof that the corporations run this country. That sounds like something an ignorant conspiracy theorist would say. Sadly, without proof, you lose. As far as I can see, We have government officials, elected by the US citizens who are running the country. Not the CEO of some corporation.

So how have I taken political correctness to a new level? I like to look at the facts, you have not and can't produce any. Your logic on attacking the corporations' policies causing the government to change the laws is majorly flawed, and it seems you lack the understanding of the meaning of basic words and phrases in the english language. I sure hope the fight for E-cigs never rests in your hands.

Buh Bye now.

That's amusing..

You've tied yourself up into a huge knot that would be impossible to unravel....I was right, it is too late for you.
Your posts, paragraph after paragraph of nonsense drivel reflect an astounding level of naivety and ignorance, the likes of which I've rarely seen.

 

[Reign]

That's amusing..

You've tied yourself up into a huge knot that would be impossible to unravel....I was right, it is too late for you.
Your posts, paragraph after paragraph of nonsense drivel reflect an astounding level of naivety and ignorance, the likes of which I've rarely seen.

?? Thanks for the general nonsense from left field...Im sure with a little work, you'll be able to put coherant thoughts together in writing that will make some sense.

Looks like your feelings are hurt...I would suggest never going to a forum where people might have different opinions ever again. You seem to have very thin skin.

Also, Way to add to the discussion without resorting to 3rd grade namecalling tactics.

 

[LadyPamela]

"A" major "A"merican "A"uto insurance company just opened an office next to my place of work and they have banned smoking on their premises. So, what do their employees do? They come behind their building, along a walkway, and sit in my building's quad area with benches and ashtrays, trees and flowers.

What is the REAL point of it? I think it's a gimmick... "Our offices are totally smoke free." Yeah, doesn't mean your employees are but they can pat themselves on the back about the good work they're doing to stop smoking.

 

[smonomo]

?? Thanks for the general nonsense from left field...Im sure with a little work, you'll be able to put coherant thoughts together in writing that will make some sense.

Looks like your feelings are hurt...I would suggest never going to a forum where people might have different opinions ever again. You seem to have very thin skin.

Also, Way to add to the discussion without resorting to 3rd grade namecalling tactics.

Reign,

I'm sorry for anything hurtful I've said, how about we shake on it, and move on?

 

[gooney0]

I'm with Mac and Grimgreen on this. The company does have the right to make silly policies, and we have the right to buy elsewhere.

Buy elsewhere I shall.

-Gooney0

 

[Reign]

I'm with Mac and Grimgreen on this. The company does have the right to make silly policies, and we have the right to buy elsewhere.

Buy elsewhere I shall.

-Gooney0

The bold seems to be where Mac disagree's with others. He doesn't seem to believe that that company should have the right to make their own silly policies.

Again...assuming they didnt have that right, why would we have the right to choose to use our PV's and/or tobacco products at all? Its all relative. Fighting them to change their rules on their own property is basically what the anti-smoking nuts did to us in the form of mandatory smoking bans for businesses in certain states when it should have been the business owners choice to allow or disallow smoking.

Silly company policies are for employee's to fight with their company over.

We need to go after what will affect us...which is government. Wasting efforts and spreading ourselves thin between thousands of projects just makes the thousands of projects futile. We go after the Main target all at once...we have a stronger fight.

Reign,

I'm sorry for anything hurtful I've said, how about we shake on it, and move on?

You got it brother, Hard feelings and grudges are for chumps, right?

 

[nikosm]

My guess is that some companies get discounts on group health insurance if they have a tobacco-free policy. Most hospitals where I live now forbid smoking on their grounds . Trying to police how employees behave on their own time is another matter. Sure you can test for nicotine, but it doesn't discriminate between a 2 pack a day Marlboro smoker, a vaper and an NRT user. Yet, no place dares to fire obese employees if they don't slim down and bring in a bucket of KFC for lunch.
A friend of my wife who despises smoking went through a phase where she would get wasted at bars 4 nights a week and end up in some dude's bed. She would then go to the doctor and take a morning after pill because she couldn't remember if he wore a rubber. Well, she's now married to Mr. Right and they are trying to make a baby, the only problem is that she can't conceive very easily, they think because she used the morning after pill too often. Lucky for them, her employer's insurance covers fertility treatments which I'm sure cost a lot more than it would to insure several nicotine-loving employees - but it is acceptable, and now encouraged to discriminate against us.
The reason for this is John F. Banzhaf III, head of ASH and GWU law professor , who has encouraged this kind of discrimination against smokers for the past 40 years. He was also one of the first to go ape***** over the e-cig and has probably threatened to sue places if they don't ban it.

 

[Mac]

If you are on their property, they should be able to have you follow any rules they set. Otherwise, you can leave the property. That is your choice as theirs is to set the rules.

At that point, when they control what you do 24/7 you are their property.

 

[Mac]

Dont think I've said that either. Read what has been written and nothing more. You seem to read either way into things, or maybe you put words in other peoples mouths on purpose to incite arguments. Im not sure, but it only hurts your cause by pushing people away.



You should care. The biggest reason boycotts dont work nowadays is because they are overly used with less than necessary resources. Companies laugh at them now. Every buisness out there at this moment is under some kind of boycott whether you understand that or not.

Your also absolutely correct. Anyone can choose not to do buisness with any company in the world for whatever reason they choose. People do it everyday which is why calling your little effort here a boycott is so funny.



I didnt derail the thread with Wiki. One of your supporters did by linking wiki as a source. If you think using wiki as a source will win you any sort of fight...your in for a rude awakening.

I do think this little effort isn't worth it and I have every right to say so, just as you had the right to post it here, and State Farm has every right to stop nicotine use on their premises.

Once again, read the posts I wrote. I didnt say corporations didnt influence. I said they dont run or own the government as your "boycotters" claimed.

As for State Farm's Policy...again....They are an insurance company. They want the image of health and professionalism. Addiction to anything does not equate to health and having something shooting vapor out of your mouth during a meeting, or walking a client out of the building or to his car..is not exactly professsional either. Explain to me the fallacies in my logic.

Have you done any research to figure out what the cause of the policy was? Is it possible that a sales rep lost the company a large account because he lit a cigarette up while talking to the customer on the way to his car and blew smoke in his face? All this is the reason you fail. In order for you to do any sort of good, you need to give real information with actual sources(wiki doesnt count), NO propaganda, and drop the holier-than-thou attitude that pushed more people away from the cause than it brings in.

You seem to get very defensive when anyone comes in and has the slightest opinion varience to the point that you act like they are attacking your agenda. This isnt true. How can you possibly fight if you havent debated and seen both sides of the argument?



Please, Do not represent me. You say you want to send a message to the anti's...your attitude and disregard towards people has made you one.

Nothing that you are saying here makes what this company is doing cool. It's not right. Banning tobacco? Ok maybe I can see that. But an ecig is different. Especially in your own vehicle. You gonna try to tell me that someone lost an account because they smoked an ecig in their car on their lunch break? Yeah right.

I will tell you this though. Great response, it's very eloquent and well written. Probably makes me look bad if someone ignorant was reading it. Maybe the FDA's PR department is hiring. You would be a great asset =)