FDA Business way down because of 8-8??
- Thread starter sofarsogood
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
That was/is the Weak Link in the Chain.
And the Reason that the Overwhelming Majority of Vapers have No Clue as to What is Going On.
On point. I have been updating my husband about the FDA's proposal and subsequent ruling and the other day he told me he 3 of his favorite vape shops closed. No kidding honey.
Retailing is difficult in the best of times. You starve for a while and try to develop a large enough following to pay the rent. Some times it just doesn't work out. Mail order competition doesn't help either. Add to that the uncertainties created by the severe regulations and any shop that's not thriving may close up because there may be no reward for toughing it out.
My view, in the long long run, even without a hostile government, vape shops would fade because kids vape instead of smoke then lose interest in vaping and the life long vapers learn to mix and rebuild. If everybody who vapes was as stingy as me the vape market would be a tiny blip on the economic radar screen.
[QUOTe If everybody who vapes was as stingy as me the vape market would be a tiny blip on the economic radar screen.[/QUOTE]
I have been mixing for 4 1/2 years now. I am frugal and saw the savings. That was way back when I was doing cig-a-likes, that lasted about an hour! It was $14.95 for five cartos that THEY said were equal to a carton of cigs. (LOL More like 25 cigs). I now make about 240ml at a time and let it steep as I use up the last 1/4 of the batch beore this. I can see how, if many have started to DIY, because of the regs, the stores are loosing money. And if kids can't buy, that is also a good point. I have a good stockpile and need nothing right now. So, I am not contributing to the B&M's.
As a side note, I will never go back to smoking cigs, and when I run out of e-liquid and can't buy anymore (say, 10 years from now) I will go back to the nic gum, so, Big Pharma will then get my money.
I have been mixing for 4 1/2 years now. I am frugal and saw the savings. That was way back when I was doing cig-a-likes, that lasted about an hour! It was $14.95 for five cartos that THEY said were equal to a carton of cigs. (LOL More like 25 cigs). I now make about 240ml at a time and let it steep as I use up the last 1/4 of the batch beore this. I can see how, if many have started to DIY, because of the regs, the stores are loosing money. And if kids can't buy, that is also a good point. I have a good stockpile and need nothing right now. So, I am not contributing to the B&M's.
As a side note, I will never go back to smoking cigs, and when I run out of e-liquid and can't buy anymore (say, 10 years from now) I will go back to the nic gum, so, Big Pharma will then get my money.
There's WAY more products than when I started vaping in 2012.
We didn't have many options in hardware..........and certainly not eliquid either. If you wanted high VG your choices were very limited to like under 15 companies.
Now you have about 5,000 choices of eliquid.
Anyway, for us it really wasn't a problem. The forum was busier then as well, and classifieds were very busy.
We all quit smoking on these things that now people *say* can't be used to successfully quit smoking.
There were quite a lot of reports in the financial sector side about the ecig industry back in 2015, things were slowing down because of over-saturation of the market. There were reports that in some more metropolitan areas there were vape shops popping up on every other street corner.
We had one in 2012 and he was busy. And then 6 by 2015 with each not being packed anymore...
Vape shops are a crazy business. You can make the core product for a couple of cents per ml and sell it for 50 cents or a dollar? [removed] Nobody gets markups like that. Too many vape shops is predictable and governments are insanely jealous and it's funny to watch.
A disruptive technology is usually something that has such a supreme price advantage that it buries it's competition. PC's and smart phones and the internet have done that to a bunch of businesses. It hard to find something low tech and mechanical, like ecigs, that can do the same, but it's happening.
If autonomous vehicles actually work they will change the world too but that's mostly about computers and networking, not the mechanical part of automotive technology.
Last edited by a moderator:
I've spent several hundred dollars lately moving from premade liquids to DIY. It seems that lots of vapers here on ECF have done that. I buy here and there from the one decent vape shop in town, but they cater to new vapers and the products it takes to keep them supplied. I've spent 4 or 5 months worth of online juice ordering on DIY parts and supplies, but that will drop drastically once I'm just replacing PG and VG and flavorings.
I've bought 1/2 to 2/3 of the mods and tanks I own from the local vape shop and paid about 20% to 30% more mainly because I could take it back if there was a problem in the warranty period. I got to look at it and play with it before buying. There's value in that, too.
The local store had lots of juices in multiple brands, but most of them had some strange base flavor that wasn't what I consider to be "clean" flavoring. I could never find anything that I considered a daily vape. I averaged ordering about 400ml a month from a North Carolina supplier that sold Hangsen premixed juice to get what I liked.
In the last couple of months I've spent a good bit setting up for DIY, ordering mods at competitive/sale prices for backup, and supplies for coils and wicking. I probably won't visit the local store much at all unless a new mod comes out and I just have to check it out. If the price is fair, I'll buy it, but maybe not if I can save 40% online.
I've bought 1/2 to 2/3 of the mods and tanks I own from the local vape shop and paid about 20% to 30% more mainly because I could take it back if there was a problem in the warranty period. I got to look at it and play with it before buying. There's value in that, too.
The local store had lots of juices in multiple brands, but most of them had some strange base flavor that wasn't what I consider to be "clean" flavoring. I could never find anything that I considered a daily vape. I averaged ordering about 400ml a month from a North Carolina supplier that sold Hangsen premixed juice to get what I liked.
In the last couple of months I've spent a good bit setting up for DIY, ordering mods at competitive/sale prices for backup, and supplies for coils and wicking. I probably won't visit the local store much at all unless a new mod comes out and I just have to check it out. If the price is fair, I'll buy it, but maybe not if I can save 40% online.
Last edited:
My best estimate is it should be possible to get started with DIY for about $150 including a liter of nic, $50, a gallon each of PG and VG, $40, a couple of all in one flavors, $20, and some mixing paraphenalia, $40. I put 5 liters total of nic in the stockpile from two different suppliers in case one batch goes bad. 10 years seems reasonable but there is enough for 20 years if both batches are good and frozen nic turns out to be immortal. After that it's 10 of the rda's I favor, 5 Picos and 5 VTC minis. The bare stockpile cost $650 and is in addition to the few things I use every day. I'm looking for 10 years minimum, may be 20.
I've got the nic and the rda's but not all the mods. I hate buying mods I don't need.
Last edited:
I spent money on scales, bottles, syringes, some beakers and pipettes, a liter each of PG and VG, and two liters of nic. I spent about $100 on assorted flavorings and additives, and that was just to do tobacco style juices. I haven't added up the tickets, but I wouldn't be surprised if I spent $250 initially.
I spent about $40 to $50 a month on premade juices, so I'll break even on my expenditures in a matter of months. After that most of my outlay will be on PG and VG. As my flavorings run out I'll have to replace those. In the long run I'll save money.
Last edited:
Of which I hardly use any of it anymore - yea syringes and bottles, but that is about it...
Mail order pre mix was costing me about $360 a year. Cost of ingredients for DIY is $30 a year. But lately there is another benefit. Management is trying to restrict vaping at work. After 2 years of vaping without problems I'm going to resist it. First step is high PG liquid. I'm testing that now. It's not as satisfying as my 50-50 pg/vg mix but it's a lot better than not vaping. I already use very low flavoring percentage partly so there is less odor in the air and on my clothing. No commercial operation mixes to address these issues and even if they did would it be my 9 mg nic, which is trending down, or a flavor I happened to like? Mixing is about more than the money and I'm no vape chef.
Don't know what kind of flavors you like but I will mention this. My other half has a bloodhound nose and dislikes smelling any flavor. Every flavor I have ever made or bought except one she can detect. TFA Key Lime at 10% she cannot detect the smell. I also throw about 1/3 drop per ml of Alice in Vapeland Zesty Key Lime concentrate in for some extra zip.
I think females have superior olfactory glands that help them detect things we don't notice. 
My wife will comment on certain juices when I change flavors. She'll say a juice has a sweet odor or a "certain odor" that I don't notice. I can taste the difference in the juices she notices, but I have to go outside and come back in to even detect a little of it. I just enjoy the differences in flavors. Most of what I vape is a variant of tobacco flavoring.
There are days when I can walk outside and smell fresh cut grass and pinestraw or high ozone levels after a thunderstorm (fresh air smell). Most of the time my detection level is below average.
That said, I like my DIY juices on the average or lower percentage of flavoring. Too much and I have to cut it with a plain pg/vg base with added nic to keep it all balanced.
My wife will comment on certain juices when I change flavors. She'll say a juice has a sweet odor or a "certain odor" that I don't notice. I can taste the difference in the juices she notices, but I have to go outside and come back in to even detect a little of it. I just enjoy the differences in flavors. Most of what I vape is a variant of tobacco flavoring.
There are days when I can walk outside and smell fresh cut grass and pinestraw or high ozone levels after a thunderstorm (fresh air smell). Most of the time my detection level is below average.
That said, I like my DIY juices on the average or lower percentage of flavoring. Too much and I have to cut it with a plain pg/vg base with added nic to keep it all balanced.
I think females have superior olfactory glands that help them detect things we don't notice.
My wife will comment on certain juices when I change flavors. She'll say a juice has a sweet odor or a "certain odor" that I don't notice. I can taste the difference in the juices she notices, but I have to go outside and come back in to even detect a little of it. I just enjoy the differences in flavors. Most of what I vape is a variant of tobacco flavoring.
There are days when I can walk outside and smell fresh cut grass and pinestraw or high ozone levels after a thunderstorm (fresh air smell). Most of the time my detection level is below average.
Now my wife and daughter do not like the stronger odored vapor, but most of what I vape is light. My daughter does not like the smell of un-flavored - says it smells like my old socks...
Now my wife and daughter do not like the stronger odored vapor, but most of what I vape is light. My daughter does not like the smell of un-flavored - says it smells like my old socks...
Add a tiny touch of Vanilla! They like that ...
Hey, I will try anything. I really try to vape on 1% or less flavoring strengths. For some of my mixes I will get near 2%, but I try to avoid it...
For me personally my vape buying has pretty much come to an end.
I heard about the impending deeming of doom 1 week after I started vaping and went on a one woman crusade to figure out how to make vaping sustainable for me personally for my lifetime (and then some if truth be told). The end result was by the time my first month of vaping was over I was building coils and DIYing juice. I have been stockpiling hardware slowly over the years. I am good to go with several solid Mechs and RDAs. 4 good electronic mods and about 2 dozen subtank minis (+ spare parts). A lifetime supply of nic in the freezer.
About all I buy is PG/VG, wick and wire. I will continue to replace anything that breaks as long as it is available but I am not buying new stuff. Very rarely I will splurge and buy a bottle of premade liquid I happen to like but have not managed to reproduce but I won't come unscrewed when I can't do that anymore. A twice a year bottle of premade juice won't really be missed.
I doubt I am all that unusual for a vapor that knew what was coming down the pipe. It is the ones that have not started vaping to quit cigs I cry for and the ones that are continuing on in blissful ignorance of what is happening. I stop and talk to every vapor I see about the deeming. They either brush me off or the light bulb goes on and I send them to ECF to read up more on it and learn how to prepare.
I don't have the money to make big donations to the cause but I do what I can when I can. I fight through my extreme social anxiety to talk to the vapers is see. I write letters to congress critters and do the CTAs. I really don't know what else I can do at this point except sit back and pray.
I heard about the impending deeming of doom 1 week after I started vaping and went on a one woman crusade to figure out how to make vaping sustainable for me personally for my lifetime (and then some if truth be told). The end result was by the time my first month of vaping was over I was building coils and DIYing juice. I have been stockpiling hardware slowly over the years. I am good to go with several solid Mechs and RDAs. 4 good electronic mods and about 2 dozen subtank minis (+ spare parts). A lifetime supply of nic in the freezer.
About all I buy is PG/VG, wick and wire. I will continue to replace anything that breaks as long as it is available but I am not buying new stuff. Very rarely I will splurge and buy a bottle of premade liquid I happen to like but have not managed to reproduce but I won't come unscrewed when I can't do that anymore. A twice a year bottle of premade juice won't really be missed.
I doubt I am all that unusual for a vapor that knew what was coming down the pipe. It is the ones that have not started vaping to quit cigs I cry for and the ones that are continuing on in blissful ignorance of what is happening. I stop and talk to every vapor I see about the deeming. They either brush me off or the light bulb goes on and I send them to ECF to read up more on it and learn how to prepare.
I don't have the money to make big donations to the cause but I do what I can when I can. I fight through my extreme social anxiety to talk to the vapers is see. I write letters to congress critters and do the CTAs. I really don't know what else I can do at this point except sit back and pray.
You wonder how many are stockpiling. Lets say there are 10 million vapers in the US. If 10% are seriously stockpiling at this point I'd be amazed. Stockpiling has become one of the more interesting parts of the hobby for me. Hoarding and bing buying are not the same as stockpiling.
- Status
Similar threads
