Cheap Chinese Knock-Offs
- Thread starter jamesd1628
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
My personal opinion after many dollars and 4 years of vaping:
DID, expensive and the negative post too far from the wick, best just stick the neg leg of the coil in the wick hole.
Line, expensive and has leak and shorting problems in the post isolation.
Bulli A2 and T, expensive and serious wicking problems as they come.
GTUS, A Sherman Tank with a Volkswagen beetle engine.
Penny and Ody, super expensive but pretty gadgets for those who like to fiddle a lot.
Right now a Dud, a vivi nova on cotton, and a slightly modified vivi genesis tank will equal or out preform any of these and leave a lot of change in your pockets. If you want to impress the girls get a 55 Tbird.
DID, expensive and the negative post too far from the wick, best just stick the neg leg of the coil in the wick hole.
Line, expensive and has leak and shorting problems in the post isolation.
Bulli A2 and T, expensive and serious wicking problems as they come.
GTUS, A Sherman Tank with a Volkswagen beetle engine.
Penny and Ody, super expensive but pretty gadgets for those who like to fiddle a lot.
Right now a Dud, a vivi nova on cotton, and a slightly modified vivi genesis tank will equal or out preform any of these and leave a lot of change in your pockets. If you want to impress the girls get a 55 Tbird.
Last edited:
Readily is the operative word. It's an import and they don't waste it on PVs
Wuxi City Ge Ming Sheng Steel Trading Co., Ltd. - stainless steel sheet They should waste it on PVs.
Well, I've had a DiD knockoff for a couple of weeks now, and I have to say it's performing pretty well. After slightly enlarging the air hole, it's on par with the other top-coil gennys I have. I guess it's chrome plated and not SS, so I don't expect it to last as long, but for $8, it's a solid rebuildable. On the other hand, I've had terrible luck with the Chinese versions of the supposedly all-mechanical battery tubes. I have broken almost all of the ones I have with just a simple drop. They almost all have soldered wires in them and/or non-metal parts. I broke the firing button off one of the Smokteck telescoping mods. The part that broke appears to be made of chrome-plated plastic. Jeez. I don't really need these cheap PVs, but I buy them primarly as loaners and I would say they perform that job fairly well.
I completely agree with BJ43 about the Chinese. Whether we like it or not, they are not only responsible for the existence of e-cigs, but most of what the called "companies with good reviews" sell are exactly the same Chinese products with another name.
They are not even a copy, they are imported from China and gain another package. The only difference is the much bigger price.
Just got 2 Chinese bargain A2-T covers and I'm enjoying so much (with cotton wick) that I'm already finding a way to buy the Bulli just to have it in Stainless Steel. No other reason.
They are not even a copy, they are imported from China and gain another package. The only difference is the much bigger price.
Just got 2 Chinese bargain A2-T covers and I'm enjoying so much (with cotton wick) that I'm already finding a way to buy the Bulli just to have it in Stainless Steel. No other reason.
I couldn't tell you how many times I have explained this to people and they still do not get it. They only look at the first time payment. What most do not realize is that the something like a Provari is essentially the same as buying those carton of cigarettes for one month and it will last years.
I have been using ecigs since 08, got out of the game then came back in 09 and have not spent thousands of dollars. I have spent over 1,000 but not over 2. I have 2 Provari's, a Zap, have owned a GGTS along with a couple other mods through the years and I have still saved money over smoking cigs.
A knock-off is a great way to start vaping, I agree with this. Once you realize you love it, do yourself a favor and upgrade the Mod. The atty in various forms can still be cheap if you need, since that is one part that is easily replaceable.
I will say this though, something like an HH357 that costs way above the normal atty is worth it in the long run. I have had 3 of them that have lasted over a year. You really do get what you pay for in the long road.
A word about build quality of Chinese knock-offs:
I see every atomizer from this angle: If it doesn't leak, if its made from non-toxic material, and its design alow the juice to get in the coil, it's good for me because I can make it work as I wish.
Find the right coil and wick design and you can make it work perfectly, so as anyone that can rebuild coil and wick.
It's just a matter of finding the right point between flooding the wick and not wicking - That's why I don't believe in reviews that say a specific device doesn't vape as it should. It's not the device, it's the wick, the coil or something else, and all can be solved. I repeat: If it doesn't have any serious design flaw.
I see every atomizer from this angle: If it doesn't leak, if its made from non-toxic material, and its design alow the juice to get in the coil, it's good for me because I can make it work as I wish.
Find the right coil and wick design and you can make it work perfectly, so as anyone that can rebuild coil and wick.
It's just a matter of finding the right point between flooding the wick and not wicking - That's why I don't believe in reviews that say a specific device doesn't vape as it should. It's not the device, it's the wick, the coil or something else, and all can be solved. I repeat: If it doesn't have any serious design flaw.
Buying something isn't just a question of price. Cheaper is worst and expensive is better is not a static rule.
Each person must develop his own criterias to find what's best for him. For example: I have some restrictions.
I won't use anything too large. I don't vape too much, so I don't need and don't like giant tanks, I quited smoking cold turkey and enjoy e-cigarettes but really don't need them to stay away from analogs. I live in a country where smoking e-cigarettes is rare, I never saw anyone vaping except me and my brother.
For me it's important to take my e-cigarette with me, so those Provari or GGTS are out of question. I don't want people looking at me like I am an ET with a strange flute that produces smoke in my mouth.
Battery is not an issue for me, I use Ego batteries and I find no problem in making well finished batteries over 18650s, 14650s, or 14500s in a much smaller size than those giant high-tech battery containers.
People's needs and taste change over time:
It's been less than a week that I decided I won't use fiberglass anymore, so no matter what brand or atomizer design, if I can't change the wick to something else than fiberglass, no chance I will use it. This changed (again) my targets.
Price is not the only issue: if I think it worths I will buy. Obviosly prefer to buy something similar that's cheaper before buying the most expensive original.
That's what I did buying 2 knock-offs Bulli A2-T copies. I didn't expect much, but I am very impressed: THEY WORK FLAWLESSLY.
I can't imagine the original working better, only lasting longer and THAT'S ALSO RELATIVE: I don't need something that lasts a lifetime because probably in 5 years we will have many better toys to play with.
I will buy the original Bulli because of the stainless steel material (I wouldn't do so if I didn't test the knock-off). Between the knock-off chrome finish and the Aluminum Bulli, I prefer the healthier chrome finish.
And to be honest, this cheap piece is so much over my expectations that I will buy some more to take anywhere and don't care much if I lose one from time to time.
Sometimes paying 10x more for something that lasts a lifetime is not desireable simply because in a few years it will be obsolete anyway, and I've seen so many tricks in the market. Example: Few years ago, people working in law enforcement bought Surefire krypton bulb flashlights because they were the best and would last forever, for at least US$100. They are all obsolete now.
Now they are all LED and I can choose between the "lifetime lasting" Surefires for $100-$200 or Chinese R$12-15 (wich uses exactly the SAME CHINESE LEDs as the Surefire) working perfectly, that will be equally obsolete in a few years. I don't need a lifetime lasting obsolete flashlight as I don't need a lifetime lasting obsolete e-cigarette.
Each person must develop his own criterias to find what's best for him. For example: I have some restrictions.
I won't use anything too large. I don't vape too much, so I don't need and don't like giant tanks, I quited smoking cold turkey and enjoy e-cigarettes but really don't need them to stay away from analogs. I live in a country where smoking e-cigarettes is rare, I never saw anyone vaping except me and my brother.
For me it's important to take my e-cigarette with me, so those Provari or GGTS are out of question. I don't want people looking at me like I am an ET with a strange flute that produces smoke in my mouth.
Battery is not an issue for me, I use Ego batteries and I find no problem in making well finished batteries over 18650s, 14650s, or 14500s in a much smaller size than those giant high-tech battery containers.
People's needs and taste change over time:
It's been less than a week that I decided I won't use fiberglass anymore, so no matter what brand or atomizer design, if I can't change the wick to something else than fiberglass, no chance I will use it. This changed (again) my targets.
Price is not the only issue: if I think it worths I will buy. Obviosly prefer to buy something similar that's cheaper before buying the most expensive original.
That's what I did buying 2 knock-offs Bulli A2-T copies. I didn't expect much, but I am very impressed: THEY WORK FLAWLESSLY.
I can't imagine the original working better, only lasting longer and THAT'S ALSO RELATIVE: I don't need something that lasts a lifetime because probably in 5 years we will have many better toys to play with.
I will buy the original Bulli because of the stainless steel material (I wouldn't do so if I didn't test the knock-off). Between the knock-off chrome finish and the Aluminum Bulli, I prefer the healthier chrome finish.
And to be honest, this cheap piece is so much over my expectations that I will buy some more to take anywhere and don't care much if I lose one from time to time.
Sometimes paying 10x more for something that lasts a lifetime is not desireable simply because in a few years it will be obsolete anyway, and I've seen so many tricks in the market. Example: Few years ago, people working in law enforcement bought Surefire krypton bulb flashlights because they were the best and would last forever, for at least US$100. They are all obsolete now.
Now they are all LED and I can choose between the "lifetime lasting" Surefires for $100-$200 or Chinese R$12-15 (wich uses exactly the SAME CHINESE LEDs as the Surefire) working perfectly, that will be equally obsolete in a few years. I don't need a lifetime lasting obsolete flashlight as I don't need a lifetime lasting obsolete e-cigarette.
It really gripes me when a modder comes up with a radical new design (you know what I mean, it has happened to us all), only to see the design mass-produced in the orient a couple of months later --------- No honor among thieves, I guess.
Purist modders design doo-dads just for the pleasure of it anyway, but still ..........
Considering that Ruyan (Ruyan Group Holdings Limited, based in Hong Kong) was the company that invented ecigs, I do find the "orient" bashing a bit odd.
One of the inventors credited is Hon Lik, a chemist and engineer who had seen his father die of cancer, invented the modern version.
Years later, both the UK and the US caught on. Essentially, then, isn't everything NOT made in China a "knock off" of the original ecig?
A high-tech approach to getting a nicotine fix - Los Angeles Times
I didn't see your post before I posted.
I find the "chinese bashing" that goes on in this forum rather humorous. esp. when being called thieves.
Last edited:
Actually the first patented Electronic Cigarette was by a guy named Herbert Gilbert way back in 1963. He was from Beaver Falls, Pennsylvania , USA. Although it never took off back then it does seem he was the first by about 40 years. Since it is passed the 20 years a patent protection lasts you cant say anyone stole the idea. anyone is free to make a E cig royalty free.
First Electric Cigarette Patent | Electronic Cigarette Review
If that one dont work for you here is one from 1988 that looks alot like the first versions outa china
http://www.google.com/patents/US4771796?printsec=abstract#v=onepage&q&f=false
First Electric Cigarette Patent | Electronic Cigarette Review
If that one dont work for you here is one from 1988 that looks alot like the first versions outa china
http://www.google.com/patents/US4771796?printsec=abstract#v=onepage&q&f=false
Last edited:
I really wonder how much something like the DID or ZAP actually costs, materials + machining time.
And then how much of a profit is made per unit on these items.
Sir Scuba is probably in the best position to shed light on this
EDIT: I guess to muddy things we'd have to consider that say Person X designs one of these puppies, but then he has to shell out to a machinist to mass produce (I think). So of course there is at least an extra step on the way to our price tag.
Anyway I think cheap is great, so long as it works. I too can get a Vivi or E1 humming like any of my more expensive units, but I do consider those more expensive units pretty and far more durable. I don't have any DUDs or Vivi tanks so I can't comment, but believe me when the Fatty and ERA knock offs start pouring in I'm going to be ALL over them lol.
The one thing I personally worry about from time to time, and BJ et al can attest to my neurosing here, is the contact of juice with mystery metals.
Its probably all speculation and tomfoolery for now, I'd like to see some devoted chemical testing, etc to see what's happening, if anything. Too much of what we conclude is safe or unsafe is based on what we can see, which to me, is ...well all we have for now, but a mere start at best.
And the more important question, what if any of the metal(s) actually manage to make it into our vapor stream and into the GI/Pulmonary system
If someone can riddle me that, I can actually use/access my field of expertise for once and answer the safety questions
And then how much of a profit is made per unit on these items.
Sir Scuba is probably in the best position to shed light on this
EDIT: I guess to muddy things we'd have to consider that say Person X designs one of these puppies, but then he has to shell out to a machinist to mass produce (I think). So of course there is at least an extra step on the way to our price tag.
Anyway I think cheap is great, so long as it works. I too can get a Vivi or E1 humming like any of my more expensive units, but I do consider those more expensive units pretty and far more durable. I don't have any DUDs or Vivi tanks so I can't comment, but believe me when the Fatty and ERA knock offs start pouring in I'm going to be ALL over them lol.
The one thing I personally worry about from time to time, and BJ et al can attest to my neurosing here, is the contact of juice with mystery metals.
Its probably all speculation and tomfoolery for now, I'd like to see some devoted chemical testing, etc to see what's happening, if anything. Too much of what we conclude is safe or unsafe is based on what we can see, which to me, is ...well all we have for now, but a mere start at best.
And the more important question, what if any of the metal(s) actually manage to make it into our vapor stream and into the GI/Pulmonary system
If someone can riddle me that, I can actually use/access my field of expertise for once and answer the safety questions
Last edited:
- Status
Similar threads
