Cotinine testing - Day three of zero nicotine

Status
Not open for further replies.

roxynoodle

Unregistered Supplier
ECF Veteran
Jun 19, 2014
15,344
37,213
Ohio
That, is part of the grand master plan!

Back in the early 80's I was in the service, an the whole random urine testing thing started. I was against it then, and am even more so now. I don't see the major portion of our current population ever standing up to fight to regain our freedoms, like the right to privacy of what is in my body. Wait till they start requiring folks to wear "fit bit" type devices with tracking on board. After all, it's for "your safety" ;) Trust us, were here to "protect" you...

They already are. Its called a cell phone. Most people are glued to theirs.
 

nyiddle

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Apr 9, 2014
2,826
2,692
USA. State: Inebriated.
Haven't seen it :)

Its been floating around in my mind since I developed pancreatitis. One of the first things they did was a dna test to see if I had any mutation of the Cystic Fibrosis gene. They looked for about 1600 mutations.

And doctors have told me they think there could be other hereditary factors and are researching that.

Here's the description from Wikipedia, just to illustrate how close you were:

In "the not-too-distant future", eugenics is common. A genetic registry database uses biometrics to classify those so created as "valids" while those conceived by traditional means and more susceptible to genetic disorders are known as "in-valids". Genetic discrimination is illegal, but in practice genotype profiling is used to identify valids to qualify for professional employment while in-valids are relegated to menial jobs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yiana

ENAUD

Resting In Peace
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jul 23, 2013
9,810
64,089
Bordertown of ProVariland and REOville
They already are. Its called a cell phone. Most people are glued to theirs.
True, we can already be easily tracked with those devices. I was thinking more along the lines of companies monitoring individuals biometrics for whatever agenda, like setting insurance rates, hiring eligibility for elevated risk positions etc.
 

YoursTruli

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 27, 2012
4,406
14,895
Ohio
Nicotine Testing/Denial of Employment is Much like e-Cigarette Sale & Use Policies.

Its just going to get Worse until Enough people quit talking about it and Stand Up and Do Something about it.

Existing anti-discrimination laws do not prohibit employers from discriminating based on whether or not the person is a smoker/nicotine user. In 2007 Cleveland Clinic became one of the first health care institutions to stop hiring smokers and trust me challenges have worked their way up through the court system over the years. As a result of these challenges, currently 21 states have laws explicitly allow hiring policies that prohibit smokers and tobacco users and since they use cotinine testing, now, this includes all nicotine use in any form. And... most no-nic employers also include in that policy... if you apply for a job and test positive for nicotine you can not reapply for 6 months.
 

rico942

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Jul 12, 2013
1,444
3,057
Carlsbad, CA
Unfortunately I know of a few cases where people tested positive for upwards of 3 weeks. Here, where I live, and most of the surrounding states, you can not get a job in the medical field if you are a nicotine user due to strict no-nic hiring practices (and that is just one industry who now has this hiring policy). Those nicotine users who were already employed when this policy went into effect were frozen into their current position, no transfers or advancement and pay much higher health insurance premiums.

An unintended consequence of such invasive policies, in the defense contractor industry, has been a massive "brain drain", the best and brightest young engineers are willing to take a pay cut to leave the big players and work for a startup that hasn't yet formed an HR department. Its a "quality of life" decision for many ...

Sadly, those startups don't often get the big funding, and frequently fail ...

The result is that our men and women in the armed forces do not always get the well-designed equipment that they need and deserve, but have to survive with flawed devices produced by sub-standard engineering ... :(

Its ironic that most of the great engineering achievements of the last century were fueled my copious amounts of alcohol, caffeine, and nicotine ... :rolleyes:
 

DC2

Tootie Puffer
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jun 21, 2009
24,161
40,974
San Diego
Afternoon of Day 7 results are in...

The test results are what might be called inconclusive.
In other words, I can not say that I am definitely testing negative.

The second line that needs to be there for a negative test is actually showing.
But it is not very dark, like my wife's was, so yeah...

But tomorrow, I should be negative for sure.
 
Last edited:

jwbnyc

Vaping Master
Supporting Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Mar 4, 2014
6,012
24,264
I dated an RN in a past life who worked at a hospital that did pre-employment and random cotinine tests but did NOT do drug testing, even pre-hire. Never made sense to me.

Drug use and abuse is endemic in the health care sector.

They would lose a substantial number of capable people if they came down hard on drug testing.

They can't afford to lose those current and potential employees.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hans Wermhat

YoursTruli

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 27, 2012
4,406
14,895
Ohio
I just saw an ad on tv for "hands only" cpr. I've taken cpr classes before. Breathing air into the lungs helps. I guess more people will die now, because of this. :facepalm:

Sorry, you are incorrect.
In 2010 the International Liaison Committee on Resuscitation reviewed hundreds of studies and found that breathing just wasn’t necessary for people when doing CPR. It has only been recently that people in the U.S. have been paying attention to these studies, many European countries changed their recommended method well before the United States.

The role of CPR is to allow a person’s brain the opportunity to function again, getting blood to that brain is the only way to do it. It takes about 10 chest compressions in a row to create enough pressure to get blood to the brain. The minute you stop chest compressions, like when you are giving someone breaths, the blood pressure goes immediately back to 0. The least amount of interruption in compressions, even for breathing, the better chance the person has of surviving.
 

Yiana

Ultra Member
Nov 20, 2015
2,210
4,723
Planet Earth
Sorry, you are incorrect.
In 2010 the International Liaison Committee on Resuscitation reviewed hundreds of studies and found that breathing just wasn’t necessary for people when doing CPR. It has only been recently that people in the U.S. have been paying attention to these studies, many European countries changed their recommended method well before the United States.

The role of CPR is to allow a person’s brain the opportunity to function again, getting blood to that brain is the only way to do it. It takes about 10 chest compressions in a row to create enough pressure to get blood to the brain. The minute you stop chest compressions, like when you are giving someone breaths, the blood pressure goes immediately back to 0. The least amount of interruption in compressions, even for breathing, the better chance the person has of surviving.
Hmm...never knew that. I know chest compressions worked. I was just taught that you need to get air as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: YoursTruli

YoursTruli

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 27, 2012
4,406
14,895
Ohio
Hmm...never knew that. I know chest compressions worked. I was just taught that you need to get air as well.

Sad, really, that the US is so behind the medical times in many areas. Who knows how many lives could have been saved if the US would have paid proper attention to these studies and implement the no breath CPR method years sooner.

ETA: To better understand.... There is usually an adequate amount of oxygen in the blood for a while, but brain cells begin to die approximately 4-6 minutes after blood stops flowing. Every minute after that, a person’s chance of regaining function within those cells goes down by about 10%, so, around 10-16 minutes after someones heart stops they will be brain dead.
 
Last edited:

zoiDman

My -0^10 = Nothing at All*
Supporting Member
ECF Veteran
Apr 16, 2010
41,619
1
84,742
So-Cal
Existing anti-discrimination laws do not prohibit employers from discriminating based on whether or not the person is a smoker/nicotine user. In 2007 Cleveland Clinic became one of the first health care institutions to stop hiring smokers and trust me challenges have worked their way up through the court system over the years. As a result of these challenges, currently 21 states have laws explicitly allow hiring policies that prohibit smokers and tobacco users and since they use cotinine testing, now, this includes all nicotine use in any form. And... most no-nic employers also include in that policy... if you apply for a job and test positive for nicotine you can not reapply for 6 months.

Correct. It is Currently a State by State issue.

And I believe there Needs to be Federal Legislation making this type of Employment Discrimination Illegal.
 

YoursTruli

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 27, 2012
4,406
14,895
Ohio
Correct. It is Currently a State by State issue.

And I believe there Needs to be Federal Legislation making this type of Employment Discrimination Illegal.

The existing anti-discrimination law that does not prohibit employers from discriminating based on whether or not the person is a smoker/nicotine user is a federal law.

ETA: Through the courts it was determined it is not discrimination if the person has a choice, unlike, skin color, disability... nicotine use is a choice just like alcohol and drug use which both of those can also ban you from employment without legal ramifications. I have been waiting for some time now for weight to come into full play, some are already testing those waters (since 2013) by charging their overweight employees higher insurance premiums.
 
Last edited:

rico942

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Jul 12, 2013
1,444
3,057
Carlsbad, CA
But tomorrow, I should be negative for sure.

images
 

AndriaD

Reviewer / Blogger
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jan 24, 2014
21,253
50,807
64
LawrencevilleGA
angryvaper.crypticsites.com
Hmm...never knew that. I know chest compressions worked. I was just taught that you need to get air as well.

Mouth-to-mouth is mainly effective if the person has stopped breathing for whatever reason -- an obstruction perhaps, which the preliminary steps -- clearing out the throat and mouth with the fingers -- can clear -- but their heart is still beating. But yeah, without blood pressure, it doesn't matter how much air you give them, if it's not getting to the brain.

Andria
 

YoursTruli

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 27, 2012
4,406
14,895
Ohio
Mouth-to-mouth is mainly effective if the person has stopped breathing for whatever reason -- an obstruction perhaps, which the preliminary steps -- clearing out the throat and mouth with the fingers -- can clear -- but their heart is still beating. But yeah, without blood pressure, it doesn't matter how much air you give them, if it's not getting to the brain.

Andria

not to get all medical-ie on ya LOL but never do a finger sweep in anyone mouth, first it has been proven blind finger sweeps can force a foreign object into an obstruction, and if it is obstructing already, a deeper immovable obstruction and second it is not uncommon for a person not breathing to have a seizure and bite down your finger if you stick it in there and trust me it's pretty impossible to get their mouth open enough to let anything go.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AndriaD

DC2

Tootie Puffer
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jun 21, 2009
24,161
40,974
San Diego
I see it like this. An employer can perhaps buy me for 8 hours a day. The rest is mine!!!!!! No negotiation on that point.
Quoted because living in a world that is NOT like that is NOT a valid reality to live in.
And yet, here we find ourselves, more and more.
 

curiousJan

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Dec 20, 2009
887
696
Central IL
Existing anti-discrimination laws do not prohibit employers from discriminating based on whether or not the person is a smoker/nicotine user. In 2007 Cleveland Clinic became one of the first health care institutions to stop hiring smokers and trust me challenges have worked their way up through the court system over the years. As a result of these challenges, currently 21 states have laws explicitly allow hiring policies that prohibit smokers and tobacco users and since they use cotinine testing, now, this includes all nicotine use in any form. And... most no-nic employers also include in that policy... if you apply for a job and test positive for nicotine you can not reapply for 6 months.

Some states have disallowed discrimination based upon legal activities like nicotine use. I happen to live in one of them. Personally I'd like to see that protection go federal, but I don't have high hopes that it will.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread