Eleaf Istick

[JD4x4]

Wow, this thread moves fast!

Understood. I wish you had an MVP, VV3 (anything by Innokin) or a provari to test in the 3.0-3.3 volt range. These 3 devices all vape much cooler to me compared to the istick. And "I think" others here have said the same.

Mathematically, I can live with the numbers. Just curios about the differences in tech here. I find it interesting.

Thanks JD!

I was curious too & that's really why I did the measurements. All of the devices I measured that use PWM vaped cooler than my iStick as well when all were set to 5 watts. Except for the Vamo v2 in Vavg mode, which hit about exactly the same. But, when you look at the numbers and do the math only the iStick and Vamo v2 in Vavg mode consistently come closest to a 5 watt value. So, given the measurement tools we have available (assuming most won't have a scope and if so won't do the waveform math to see if it's Vavg or Vrms) I think it effectively means the other devices should be assumed to be putting out lower watts than indicated. Now, that may not be technically correct but at the end of the day I'm sure not going to break out the scope to do quick Ohms/Watts law math on a different resistance coil. I'm either going to use my Radio Shack or Harbor Freight DMM's, if I use any at all. More likely I'll just bump up my other device watt settings and/or bump down my iStick settings to get to happy vape land.

Cool. TY JD4x4.

But here is a Rookie O-Scope question.

What Value does 1 Horizontal line Represent? And where is 0 on the Horizontal Lines?

Horizontal lines are either 10 volts or 2 amps per line depending on the measurement (volts or amps), vertical lines are 20 ms on all. Zero horizontal line is the middle one. The volt scale isn't optimum but the only choices were 2 volts per division or 10 volts per division. Yes, most volt patterns look like about 5 volts. But that's what pulsing on and off times gets you.. a lower average voltage (or rms average). Another reason I like the amp readings for a resistive heater element. Not an engineer by any means, but amps (and watts) makes more sense to me as a ballpark benchmark for coil/heat output.

 

[DHCrocks]

First couple of days with this thing and I was in love...perfect small size and battery lasted a long time. But now I've got the dreaded "no atomizer" with a 5 different toppers. I tried pulling the center pin and that works for a little while till it settles back in and won't fire. I tried searching but haven't found a good tutorial on how to do the dental floss fix. anyone got any tips?

 

[spaceballsrules]

Kinda looks like the battery is working too good (Hot) when u first get the iStick for all you low voltage vapers. Then it calms down (doesn't hit as hard) after using it for a while. Is that what's happening - peeps that have had it a while?

I really hope this is true. My iStick hits like a freight train. Right now I am keeping the wattage set to 2.0 watts and just letting it choose the minimum possible power on all my clearos. Anything higher than that and everything tastes burnt.

Hers appears to do from 2 Watts to 20 Watts??? Shows it on 5 Watts in the video, but I thought it was 7-20 Watts. Still waiting for mine should have 1 possibly Tuesday or Wednesday.

My bad Colbert Vape Report says right off 7-20 but it does show it doing 2Watts, guess a lot of reviewers are stuck on the 7-20Watts with the Hana clones.

Without an atty/clearo on it, you can set the iStick as low as 2.0 watts, and it will adjust automatically depending on the resistance of the atty/clearo. The minimum wattage is calculated with 3.0 volts being the minimum possible power output. For instance, if I use a clearo with 2.6 ohms of resistance, the wattage goes to 3.4, but if I put a clearo with 2.0 ohms of resistance, the lowest it will go is 4.5 watts. The lowest I have been able to get it is 3.1 watts, and that was with a clearo that was reading 2.9 ohms.

 

[JD4x4]

I agree with JD4x4. The iStick outputs voltage below that of the native battery charge. It outputs as low as 3V. But it does it in average volts (Vavg). The iStick is incapable of firing below an effective 4.17 Vrms which is equal to a constant 4.17VDC.

<snip>

I immediately unwrapped the iStick and threw my KFL+ on it for the hour drive to the airport. A displayed 6W fired like 12W.

My subjective taste test feeling was 5W on the iStick equaled about 8W on my v3 Vamo, v2 Vamo in rms mode, and my VTR, but close counts & agreed.

For giggles, I set up both the VTR and VAMO for the same test and found what I expected. For example, @ 3.5V settings: the iStick metered 3.5V, VAMO 1.9V and the VTR 2.2V. This is as I expected. The VAMO & VTR are definitely outputting RMS Voltage (Vrms) and fire different peak Voltages.

Note my Vamo in Vavg ("No1") comments & readings.

I'll do a quick first impression of the iStick tomorrow or the next day. The real takeaway from today is: The iStick is really a 4.2 - 5.5(+?)V device. That doesn't necessarily make it bad, just not what the manufacturer claims it to be.

Or is Vrms the appropriate way to gauge a restive heater device or has it just become a defacto vaping standard (based upon PWM for resistive motor usage, to compensate for torque)? Are the others inflating their output? I bet electrical engineers might debate this. Defining "real" wattage (work) based on voltage average vs. rms voltage average is a variable benchmark depending on what one is trying to measure, from what I've read.

But at the end of the day two "standards" do make it hard to compare devices on paper and in discourse. One "standard" device spec. favors low watt vapers, and the other device spec. favors high watt vapers. I fall in the "low to average" wattage category so either work for me

 

[aldenf]

Wow, this thread moves fast!


I was curious too & that's really why I did the measurements. All of the devices I measured that use PWM vaped cooler than my iStick as well when all were set to 5 watts. Except for the Vamo v2 in Vavg mode, which hit about exactly the same. But, when you look at the numbers and do the math only the iStick and Vamo v2 in Vavg mode consistently come closest to a 5 watt value. So, given the measurement tools we have available (assuming most won't have a scope and if so won't do the waveform math to see if it's Vavg or Vrms) I think it effectively means the other devices should be assumed to be putting out lower watts than indicated. Now, that may not be technically correct but at the end of the day I'm sure not going to break out the scope to do quick Ohms/Watts law math on a different resistance coil. I'm either going to use my Radio Shack or Harbor Freight DMM's, if I use any at all. More likely I'll just bump up my other device watt settings and/or bump down my iStick settings to get to happy vape land.

Remember the Vrms value is equal to constant VDC. 4VDC = 4Vrms = 2.78Vavg.
Remember we calculate Watts with Vavg with: (Vpk²/R) * Duty Cycle = W

There is no doubt in my mind that the Watt display on my iStick is entirely inaccurate. I'll be calculating my Watts with the above equation.

G'night

 

[aldenf]

My subjective taste test feeling was 5W on the iStick equaled about 8W on my v3 Vamo, v2 Vamo in rms mode, and my VTR, but close counts & agreed.

Note my Vamo in Vavg ("No1") comments & readings.

Or is Vrms the appropriate way to gauge a restive heater device or has it just become a defacto vaping standard (based upon PWM for resistive motor usage, to compensate for torque)? Are the others inflating their output? I bet electrical engineers might debate this. Defining "real" wattage (work) based on voltage average vs. rms voltage average is a variable benchmark depending on what one is trying to measure, from what I've read.

But at the end of the day two "standards" do make it hard to compare devices on paper and in discourse. One "standard" device spec. favors low watt vapers, and the other device spec. favors high watt vapers. I fall in the "low to average" wattage category so either work for me

RMS voltage is used both in AC and in PWM (DC) to equal VDC in dissipated power (Watts) in a resistance load (coil). So 4Vrms = 4VDC. Vrms is an accurate plug-in for Ohm's Law. Vavg is not.

 

[JD4x4]

Remember the Vrms value is equal to constant VDC. 4VDC = 4Vrms = 2.78Vavg.
Remember we calculate Watts with Vavg with: (Vpk²/R) * Duty Cycle = W

There is no doubt in my mind that the Watt display on my iStick is entirely inaccurate. I'll be calculating my Watts with the above equation.

G'night

I'm going to bed as well, but for the sake of argument I'll take the position that Vrms might not be appropriate for heat output measurement from a resistive heat element (not a resistive motor) driven by a positive only PWM D.C. voltage. Granted I can't argue that because I'm not an electrial engineer, but rather saying it to see if anyone can show me that it's incorrect in this application.

I'll be calculating my vape by device/carto/settings.

Have a good vape before bed.

 

[salemgold]

First couple of days with this thing and I was in love...perfect small size and battery lasted a long time. But now I've got the dreaded "no atomizer" with a 5 different toppers. I tried pulling the center pin and that works for a little while till it settles back in and won't fire. I tried searching but haven't found a good tutorial on how to do the dental floss fix. anyone got any tips?

Here you go-

A couple suggestions for the users with connector problems on the iStick (or any 510 mod)

Carefully lift the center pin with a jewlers screwdriver or dental pick. Then take a piece of dental floss and wrap is around the underside of the pin once or twice, tie it off with a surgeon's knot for no slippage. It will keep the pin elevated if your topper isn't screwed in too tight again.

Otherwise you can simply use a 510-510 or 510-eGo adapter. Prior to use take a pair of tweezers and push on the adapter's center pin from both sides. Be sure it moves fairly easily, it's supposed to be a floating pin. Then push the pin from the top so the pin extends past the bottom of the adapter, thread it on to your mod until snug. This will ensure the pin is hitting the mod's pin and attach your topper just until contact is made, presto vapor.

With the iStick you can press the fire button to wake up the display, it will show 0.0Ω. The gently screw in your topper, as soon as contact is made the display will change showing the coil resistance.

 

[DHCrocks]

thanks salemgold, I saw that be cant figure out how to get the dental floss down around the pin. I can only get it to move up a mm or so and just not enough room ti wiggle floss around it. How high does the pin come up?

 

[scaredmice]

Kinda looks like the battery is working too good (Hot) when u first get the iStick for all you low voltage vapers. Then it calms down (doesn't hit as hard) after using it for a while. Is that what's happening - peeps that have had it a while?

OK, folks, it seems all of you are getting this wrong....

Let's say, for the sake of the crew )) that you get accustomed to it....

... or perhaps you'd rather like to think that....

I cannot imagine how an electronic device would get 'tired' if it is working inside its parameters. And if not, usually they simply get burnt.

Wait! I got it!

eLeaf had to set up a secret WiFi networked feature by which the iStick secretly connects to iSmoka cloud server and it gets a secret software upgrade to adress the PWM-gate!

Our iSticks have WiFi enabled connectivity!

(Sorrily, we do not get ahold what's more with the secret activity of our iSticks..... beware where and how you leave them.....)

End of LOL mode....

 

[scaredmice]

About power, RMS and averages....

...we Spaniards call V_rms "voltaje efectivo", as 'effective' or 'actual' voltage, and there is a very good reason for it, apart from our Latin (as Roman Empire language) roots....

The very definition of that voltage stands as the numeric value that outputs the same energy (or power) that a pure flat DC current with the same numeric value. In fact, some high-end voltmeters use that precise definition, making real-time comparisons between resistors powered by the instrument and the current under test...

For any not flat supply, like the PWM-ed of the iStick, but also for AC and other pulsating DC supplies, V_rms, as statistical mathematical construct, satisfies the definition, and that's because power (energy) is proportional to the squared power of voltage.

So, forget any 'pseudo-standarts' and alike. IF the voltage shown by the iStick is average instead of RMS AND IF that voltage is also used to calculate the power shown on screen, the engineering team of the iStick (whoever and wherever they are) has done it wrong....

I can cope with V_ave instead of V_rms, but I cannot accept, in any circumstance, that the power shown, IF it is calculated from V_ave, is accurate (enough, in this Universe and in all its alternatives....)

If all the highlighted IF's prove to be correct and they apply, I supppose someone is getting a buck full of thumbsdown......

What's left, as open question to eLeaf/iSmoka/Joyetech, is (if the IF's are true), what are you going to do with all the batch which shows bad power readings? Are you going to call a new VW category, the 'V_aveW's mods'?

 

[cocacola31173]

Might be worth a shot...

​

Do you remember where you got that black and white drip tip from? I like the ming style drip tips but have been looking for some shorter ones cause they just don't want to quite fit into my case and that black and white one would be perfect!

 

[Thespis]

If all the highlighted IF's prove to be correct and they apply, I supppose someone is getting a buck full of thumbsdown......

What's left, as open question to eLeaf/iSmoka/Joyetech, is (if the IF's are true), what are you going to do with all the batch which shows bad power readings? Are you going to call a new VW category, the 'V_aveW's mods'?

I don't think it matters what they call them. They're selling a buttload of them!

 

[pokemom]

thanks salemgold, I saw that be cant figure out how to get the dental floss down around the pin. I can only get it to move up a mm or so and just not enough room ti wiggle floss around it. How high does the pin come up?

There are several YouTube videos on how to fix the center pin of an itastes vv3 or an MVP, one guy uses a tiny oring from a hardware store instead of dental floss. The procedure is the same for pin problems in any of the devices. Maybe you can find the oring instead of trying to tie knots?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MrsP0721]

Is it just me or is the usps being extremely slow lately?? Updates and deliveries! Ugh

 

[DancingHeretik]

Do you remember where you got that black and white drip tip from? I like the ming style drip tips but have been looking for some shorter ones cause they just don't want to quite fit into my case and that black and white one would be perfect!

I don't know where Katdarling got her drip tip, but I've always had a strong preference for short drip tips. Here's a few ideas.

From FastTech:
Acrylic Shorty Drip Tips
Aluminum Shorty Drip Tips
White Teflon Drip Tip
Black/Stainless Drip Tip
Stainless Drip Tip

From RTD Vapor:
Black Delrin Type A

From Empire Mods:
Black Delrin Straight
Ceramic Shorty

From Mad Vapes:
Anodized Super Shorty Drip Tip, Black
Anodized Super Shorty Drip Tip, Silver
Slotted Transformer Drip Tips
Concave Transformer Drip Tips
Short Stainless Drip Tips

 

[RIMP]

Thanks for the links DH

 

[chuci]

How are you guys stealth vaping with this? There's a big tank on top of the battery that sticks out when you vape. I've come from an eroll and that's real stealth vaping.

Out of interest. I'm currently rocking the istick and nautilus mini. Can anyone recommend a smaller but equally good clearo for the istick. I don't care about juice capacity as I carry my refil bottle with me..but it needs to be easy to refil. I looked at the silo but i think that's slimmer than the nautilus mini but longer.

 

[Big Me]

I received notification that my iStick was sent yesterday afternoon and it arrived this morning! Woo-hoo!

I'm in LOVE! lol.

I tried to screw my Naughty Mini directly onto the iStick but there was too much of a gap when it made contact so I've added the 510-ego connector to it with the beauty ring that came with my Naughty and topped it all with the Mini. Much better.

I'm coming from an ego battery so, for me, this is a definite step up. So much so that I can't take it much past 6.5W before it starts to taste "wrong". (This is for mouth to lung hits. For a straight lung hit, I'm down to 4.5W). I'll see if this changes with different juices/ new coils.

Oh, if anyone reading this bought theirs from Van .... Vapes - mine came with an EU wall charger, not a UK one. Not a deal breaker for me.

 

[DancingHeretik]

If you're looking for stealth vaping, why not try a 306 or 901 atty, a 510 carto, or a CE3? Does it have to be big?