Eliquid Suppliers that can actually prove they have a chemist supervising, a video of Lab, and Independant testing

[PLANofMAN]

I don't sell eliquid, but I have embarked on a couple of sell-from-home ideas that taught me how easy it was to lose money. With all due respect, I have no personally-proven advice to give anyone on how to "recoup costs pretty quickly". I do have some knowledge of just how difficult it is to do, though. Think of the time to fill and label those little bottles. You can't just look at material costs without looking at time spent/labor cost.

I did think about it, and those samples would be a loss leader. Expect to make nothing to very little on something like that, but it's the repeat business that will draw the customers back, and that's where you make the money. Alice in Vapeland is a good example. Full slection of samples, little charms on the bottles, real glass, etc. They get so much business that they can only stay open for a couple of hours, once per week. Customers will probably buy the samples only once, or maybe several other times to give to friends.

One of my buddies owned a McDonald's franchise and he told me that McChicken's and McDouble's cost more to make than what they sell them for, but they make it back and then some by selling french fries, sodas and other things along with them. The same principle applies here.

 

[bigbells]

Still, I don't tell somebody that something is easy unless I've done it myself. Whenever I see infomercials where they're selling ideas rather than product, I can't help thinking that if it was so easy to make money then the person on the infomercial would be selling the product that he or she is telling others how to sell, instead of selling ideas on how to sell.

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

Still, I don't tell somebody that something is easy unless I've done it myself. Whenever I see infomercials where they're selling ideas rather than product, I can't help thinking that if it was so easy to make money then the person on the infomercial would be selling the product that he or she is telling others how to sell, instead of selling ideas on how to sell.

So very, very true. I'm self employed and earn a very good living but it took a long time to get to where I am and it's extremely stressful. People that find out my vocation laugh and think "it's easy $$ and a lazy way to riches". Previously I paid my dies via the workforce/ the normal way.

 

[metropolitan]

i don't understand the logic that just because cigarettes were really bad for us we should be ok with something that might also be bad for us just because it's not as bad as tobacco cigarettes.
i'm vaping because i didn't want lung cancer or emphysema. if it turns out that 10 years from now my kidneys will fail because of vaping, then i totally f---- up.

 

[bigbells]

i don't understand the logic that just because cigarettes were really bad for us we should be ok with something that might also be bad for us just because it's not as bad as tobacco cigarettes.
i'm vaping because i didn't want lung cancer or emphysema. if it turns out that 10 years from now my kidneys will fail because of vaping, then i totally f---- up.

I don't think a single person has said they don't care if vaping has unknown health risks.
The question is, though, would you rather not have the opportunity to be one of us guinea pigs that will be the group that determines what long-term effects, if any, are associated with vaping?

 

[PLANofMAN]

i don't understand the logic that just because cigarettes were really bad for us we should be ok with something that might also be bad for us just because it's not as bad as tobacco cigarettes.
i'm vaping because i didn't want lung cancer or emphysema. if it turns out that 10 years from now my kidneys will fail because of vaping, then i totally f---- up.

You live in NYC. Your chances of dying in some horrible, gruesome, random manner are pretty high to begin with.

I don't think a single person has said they don't care if vaping has unknown health risks.
The question is, though, would you rather not have the opportunity to be one of us guinea pigs that will be the group that determines what long-term effects, if any, are associated with vaping?

I do like this answer better than mine, though.

 

[metropolitan]

I don't think a single person has said they don't care if vaping has unknown health risks.
The question is, though, would you rather not have the opportunity to be one of us guinea pigs that will be the group that determines what long-term effects, if any, are associated with vaping?

that's a false dichotomy. i've never said i was for banning vaping.
i'd rather have e-liquid vendors list all their ingredients and show more responsibility for testing the products they carry.

 

[metropolitan]

You live in NYC. Your chances of dying in some horrible, gruesome, random manner are pretty high to begin with.

I do like this answer better than mine, though.

this is off topic but you night be surprised to learn that NYC is one of the safest big cities in the USA. it has one of the lowest violent crime rates of all major american cities. it's not really like they make it out in the movies.

 

[PLANofMAN]

this is off topic but you night be surprised to learn that NYC is one of the safest big cities in the USA. it has one of the lowest violent crime rates of all major american cities. it's not really like they make it out in the movies.

Hmm...
I lived an hour away from Detroit for 10 years, that kind of soured me on "big" cities. Detroit is actually worse than it's portrayed in movies. Unless that movie happens to be Robocop.

 

[charmschool]

i don't understand the logic that just because cigarettes were really bad for us we should be ok with something that might also be bad for us just because it's not as bad as tobacco cigarettes.
i'm vaping because i didn't want lung cancer or emphysema. if it turns out that 10 years from now my kidneys will fail because of vaping, then i totally f---- up.

I've said it before & I'll say it again - NOBODY gets out alive. We're all going to die of something. You can quit smoking, quit vaping, but you'll still die. I could die of food poisoning or a drug side effect from a substance that is FDA approved. Or get killed in a car wreck, or an aneurysm or blood clot that I don't even know I have. I switched to vaping to improve my quality of life RIGHT NOW. I breath better. I cough less. My sense of taste & smell are fanastic now. I use common sense - I buy only from US suppliers that at least pay some attention to quality control, and I try not to overdo it. If I pay a consquence for this behavior, I'll say the same thing I said when people told me "those cigarettes will kill you". My reply was always "yep, if nothing else does first".

 

[bigbells]

that's a false dichotomy. i've never said i was for banning vaping.
i'd rather have e-liquid vendors list all their ingredients and show more responsibility for testing the products they carry.

It depends whether your kidney failure is due to unnamed ingredients, or unknown effects of vaping. I thought you were referring to the latter.

 

[dragonbone]

Fact - Imported Chinese drywall causes severe sickness - class action suits are now in motion and almost all american suppliers refuse to sell or stock it now.
Fact - Chinese baby food kills babies.
Fact - Imported Chinese pet food kills pets.
Fact - Imported Childrens toys contain toxic levels of lead.

Check YOUR facts and get your tenses right.
Fact - after the hurricanes in the SE, corrosion was found on pipes inside dry walls. Some tests were done and Chinese dry wall was blamed. However after blind testing dry wall from US and China...... From Wikipedia:
"As expected, the contaminated Chinese samples gave off high levels of sulfur gases. But all but one of the U.S. samples emitted sulfur gases, as well - not at levels as high as the defective Chinese product, but unexpected. Perhaps more surprising, "There were some American products that we tested that had higher emission than some of the new Chinese products that we tested."[20]

Fact -in 2008, 6 Chinese babies died from baby formula and sickening many thousands. After it was discovered that melamine was added to milk products, one person got murdered, several were sentenced to death and executed, and many went to jail to serve a life sentences, and many government officials were fired.
Fact - In 2007 several hundred pets in the US, and a few other countries died from renal failure due to melamine added to pet food. Offending companies were seized and closed down by the Chinese authorities.
Fact - in 2007, Unnaceptable amount of trace lead found in the paint on some children's toys. Result: China EXECUTED it's state Food And Drug head. A suspended death sentence to another, and then later in 2007, the factory owner who supplied Mattel, committed suicide by hanging himself in his factory after paying wages to all 5000 of his employees first.

HOWEVER..... After his death.... (From Wikipedia)

On September 21, Mattel issued an apology to China over the recall of Chinese-made toys, taking the blame for design flaws and acknowledging that "vast majority of those products that were recalled were the result of a design flaw in Mattel's design, not through a manufacturing flaw in China's manufacturers"

 

[blackHelix]

i don't understand the logic that just because cigarettes were really bad for us we should be ok with something that might also be bad for us just because it's not as bad as tobacco cigarettes.
i'm vaping because i didn't want lung cancer or emphysema. if it turns out that 10 years from now my kidneys will fail because of vaping, then i totally f---- up.

But that's your logic too. You're not vaping because you don't want cancer or emphysema. You're NOT smoking because you don't want cancer and emphysema. You don't have to vape. The false dichotomy you refer to (in this sense) is true - because you have a third option which is not do either. For some people the question of why shouldn't I smoke and why should I vape are inseparable. They look at the risk's of both and choose one over the other, and of course over doing nothing at all.

However....I still completely agree with vendors providing all of their ingredients so we can make better, informed choices. Transparency is never a bad thing

 

[DJ RyckRak]

There are no 'ingredent' labels on packages of cigarettes...
except 'American Spirit'...but we smoked em anyways.

There have been many-many studies on cigarettes-none to promissing-
but we smoked em anyways.

40 years of 'burning bacco'- probably didn't do me much good.
Am I worried about Vaping ?
No.

 

[charmschool]

Check YOUR facts and get your tenses right.
Fact - after the hurricanes in the SE, corrosion was found on pipes inside dry walls. Some tests were done and Chinese dry wall was blamed. However after blind testing dry wall from US and China...... From Wikipedia:
"As expected, the contaminated Chinese samples gave off high levels of sulfur gases. But all but one of the U.S. samples emitted sulfur gases, as well - not at levels as high as the defective Chinese product, but unexpected. Perhaps more surprising, "There were some American products that we tested that had higher emission than some of the new Chinese products that we tested."[20]

Fact -in 2008, 6 Chinese babies died from baby formula and sickening many thousands. After it was discovered that melamine was added to milk products, one person got murdered, several were sentenced to death and executed, and many went to jail to serve a life sentences, and many government officials were fired.
Fact - In 2007 several hundred pets in the US, and a few other countries died from renal failure due to melamine added to pet food. Offending companies were seized and closed down by the Chinese authorities.
Fact - in 2007, Unnaceptable amount of trace lead found in the paint on some children's toys. Result: China EXECUTED it's state Food And Drug head. A suspended death sentence to another, and then later in 2007, the factory owner who supplied Mattel, committed suicide by hanging himself in his factory after paying wages to all 5000 of his employees first.

HOWEVER..... After his death.... (From Wikipedia)

On September 21, Mattel issued an apology to China over the recall of Chinese-made toys, taking the blame for design flaws and acknowledging that "vast majority of those products that were recalled were the result of a design flaw in Mattel's design, not through a manufacturing flaw in China's manufacturers"

I had to quote this one. I don't think most in the USA realize the consequences of producing harmful products have such high penalties in China. Did we execute anyone for oh, say, peanut butter, spinach, hamburgers, cantalopes, just to name a few recent food problems that caused massive illness & deaths here in the states? Have any big US pharma execs committed suicide because their drugs caused harm? I buy USA only from vendors that are vapers for the simple reason that they're using the same product they're selling. I figure they will take the most care since they're using what they are selling....but my logic may be flawed. Now that I think about it, aren't most drug dealers addicts themselves? Gee, thanks for the dilema, lol!

 

[metropolitan]

my basic beliefs come down to the following.

e-liquid manufacturers should:
1. be willing to register company owner and address with the FDA, the way food producers have to
2. note batch/lot numbers on the packaging and keep records, the way food producers have to
3. list all ingredients, the way all food products do
4. be ready for possible inspection of premises the way food factories and restaurants get health inspections
5. test random batches for correct nicotine content and contaminants and make results public
6. package all retail products with child protective caps
7. have some liability insurance the way all food manufacturers that engage in interstate commerce have to
8. avoid marketing that can attract children or minors (i.e. no joe camel / spuds mckenzie mascots, etc.)

is that totally unreasonable?

 

[dragonbone]

I could go on but I won't.

What do you mean? What could you go on with that you won't? Isn't this is your first post in this thread?

 

[PLANofMAN]

my basic beliefs come down to the following.

e-liquid manufacturers should:
1. be willing to register company owner and address with the FDA, the way food producers have to
2. note batch/lot numbers on the packaging and keep records, the way food producers have to
3. list all ingredients, the way all food products do
4. be ready for possible inspection of premises the way food factories and restaurants get health inspections
5. test random batches for correct nicotine content and contaminants and make results public
6. package all retail products with child protective caps
7. have some liability insurance the way all food manufacturers that engage in interstate commerce have to
8. avoid marketing that can attract children or minors (i.e. no joe camel / spuds mckenzie mascots, etc.)

is that totally unreasonable?

I'll admit I have an issue with #3. If manufacturers had to list ingredients just like food manufacturers do, we would call them ....... It would look like one of these 6 options:

propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, flavoring, nicotine
vegetable glycerin, propylene glycol, flavoring, nicotine
vegetable glycerin, flavoring, nicotine
propylene glycol, flavoring, nicotine
propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, flavoring, WTA/NET, nicotine
vegetable glycerin, propylene glycol, flavoring, WTA/NET, nicotine

since we already know that, I would feel better with the nicotine mg. and percentage of VG/PG that most manufacturers already list.

#6, I really don't know how I feel about that one. Child safety caps would be nice, if the ones that are available for the type of bottles we use weren't absolute garbage. A child is more likely to be harmed by skin exposure than ingestion, so keeping your stash out of reach is the best policy.

Everything else, I pretty much agree with.

 

[metropolitan]

i don' t meant to double post but in a different discussion thread i wrote the following personal anecdote:

i was involved in a friend's artisinal gourmet condiment company from the beginning and i watched him go from him fixing the stuff in his kitchen (with a cat, while smoking cigarettes) to him using a commercial kitchen with a health inspection certificate (rented by the day), getting insurance, passing local and state health inspections, getting lab test for the acidity of his products, getting lab test for the nutritional label once his products started to sell out of state and so on.
in the early days he was terrified of having to go through all these steps and thought it was going to be the end of his little home business. he bit the bullet and went through it all and his business has been growing steadily. the big stores like Whole Foods wouldn't look at his product until he had the liability insurance in place. the cost of it? $1200 for a year. he's made more than that in profits from Whole Foods alone and his products are only in three of their stores.

i know it's a hassle to deal with these things and it's scary and daunting if you have never done it before, but it's relatively painless in the end and it was a necessity for his business to succeed.

 

[Jeremy Evans]

this is off topic but you night be surprised to learn that NYC is one of the safest big cities in the USA. it has one of the lowest violent crime rates of all major american cities. it's not really like they make it out in the movies.

then how come on every episode of law and order someone dies and there is like 4 different series? your telling me that it isn't true?? lol