*GEM: A new RTA by MarkBugs
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Is the six flask using the 350j chip? If so I have no issues with the gem (stainless) and the boxer I use with that chip. The screw position affects the initial read for resistance. So if you build and it looks way off. Screw in or out.
As a rule keep it screwed in as much as possible
So it just touches and you shouldn't have an issue. Congrats man. The titanium gem is easily the best looking tank I've seen - for my tastes
Yes, the Flask uses the SX 350J chip. I have tried my first built using SS 304 wires and the ohms were jumping all over the place on my Flask SX, SX Mini ML and my Dicodes. I will try my next built later with perhaps only 4 or 5 wraps on 28G SS 304 and SS 430 wires. I will post my results here.
By the way, I have had no problems with my other RTA's using the same build and mods. I'm not putting this RTA down by any means, just reporting what I am experiencing.
By the way, I have had no problems with my other RTA's using the same build and mods. I'm not putting this RTA down by any means, just reporting what I am experiencing.
There ARE vapers out here looking for SS GEMs, who do not care about Temp Guessing...and would be willing to buy them from you.
There's no need to worry if they're "unsuspecting"...98% of people looking for the GEM know exactly what they're looking for.
Also, I'm sorry to hear you had such bad experiences with them...but just because they weren't ever designed or intended for Temp Guessing, doesn't make them failures or trash.
But the funny part is, it's the truth.
Unless there were a temperature sensor at or on the coil, which is impossible, there's no such thing as true "Temp Control" vaping.
So, as long as a mod is calculating the temperature, based on coil resistance and selected wattage/voltage/temperature desired...it could fairly be called guessing. Because there's no temp sensor on or at the coil.
Provape is not the kind of company to attempt to defame anyone, especially as a marketing ploy. They don't give a second thought to what the competition is doing, hence all the constant "Provape is behind the times" statements by anti-Provarians.
Trust and believe, if they cared all that much about marketing, they'd at least hire a better photographer. I mean, have you seen the product photos on their website? Definitely subpar, considering the quality of product they deliver, and the premium price you pay for said product/legendary customer service.
Obviously ProVape has you sold, me not so much. In fact, not at all.
Aware as I am of the Fourier Transform and the triviality of programming for it a 2°-4° variation, at a maximum, on a Set Temperature of 450°, is outside human perception with respect to touch or taste.
As is a similar variation to the human ear at 44.1K, 88.2K, or 176.4K, even for the most well trained audiophile or audio engineer (speaking from experience). I leave the mathematical interpolation to you. [emoji41]
The best that ProVape will be able to claim, as a NEW marketing ploy, is that their temperature mod is 0.001% accurate, which will be, and is utterly meaningless. Until that time they are limited to defamation.
Well, as long as they don't attach a product or company name to the phrase "temperature guessing" they are safe from a law suit...It is, to stick to the Preacher Man metaphor, a matter of religion not science, marketing not fact.
And, to be perfectly clear, I mean no offense to anyone who buys into the ploy.
My boxer is back tomorrow. Since I didn't get around to the SS build tonight I will tomorrow. I know the post position matters so my main goal after cleaning is to set it as far as possible inside. That seems to level it.
I can do the stainless on the stainless or the titanium gem. I have what was sold as 316L. It was a 2 lb spool from eBay. It's possible it's not 316 but I believe it is. I'll post my results too. Maybe they won't be as positive wth the boxer as they are wih istick and evic mini. We will see
Just some general thoughts meandering about the topic and customer service etc
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I don't have much to add to the Provape discussion other than their customer support is very very good. To some that is a big consideration. I've had great support recently from three companies and horrible support from 2 others. I had a bad run with gear going wrong or being wrong. If I'm going to oay a lot from now on I'll be sticking to the companies with the good support.
As for temp sensing I care about one thing. Does it combust if it goes dry. If not. It works. Providing it doesn't fluctuate so much a consistent fm some isn't possible.
I don't however think sampling a million times a second is good for anything other than causing problems - or rather my practical experience shows me it's not good for anything.
With the DNA 200 mod I had it didn't offer me anything more than others do and t gave me a lot more problems than any of my others.
As for power delivery. With the p3 I really like he boost feature. I also feel the vape is different than on the istick. I can't really tell you what is off between them but at the same user setting the Provape provides noticeably more punch even without boost. I guess rays probably to do with how the power is delivered
However if the poor battery life in my unit is not due to a problem with the chip inside the p3 the I don't think I'm willing to get the extra smooth delivery at that price. It gets right now about 1/3 the battery life as the DNA 30 powered wae ii. I believe that it is a problem
Wth my chip. They reflashed it rather than replacing as I was in pretty big need of it back. Unfortunately the one tank I was relying on for this six week period that was to pair with the p3 - the manufacturer still hasn't completed a warranty claim in now five weeks. So it turns out the Provape hurry was for naught. So now I'll talk to them and see if they'll do more testing and such.
I try to remember at least half what we're paying for with high end or expensive gear is customer experience. When companies don't reply to emails (especially when you're chasing after them wih five or six in a month or two) shows they aren't delivering that half.
If you can't provide support that meets a widely considered s mandated if above average or better you shouldn't be in the market selling products at 3-8x the average. Provape very clearly gets that as do some others. Mark bugs for example clearly doesn't.
I'm suppose to receive a 510 adaptor and still haven't. Not had my emails regarding chimney updates been answers. But hey when I bought something it was here in two days. If begs been on top of it and read my emails they would have very clearly seen the order they just shipped was meant to have a replacement part. Maybe they're going to surprise me with a free chimney update - seems unlikely.
Not good enough. Boutique companies producing limited runs need to have too level support and interact with their fans. When you don't do both those you don't keep your boutique appeal - you become known as arrogant and greedy typically. Even if you aren't. People will pay for the finest. But finest extends to the experience. Some companies really get that and some don't.
Just bear that customer service stuff in mind I say when choosing companies. The market competition is fierce. Very few of the people that choose not to race to the bottom are acting like high end companies in anything but pricing. To those who do. Kudos.
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Let me just say, NOBODY sells me on anything but ME. I am a fully formed, mentally agile human, with the capability to perform trial and error to decide what I wish to own.
They may not "have you sold" but that's the beauty of free will. You can buy whatever you want. Provape isn't holding a gun to your head.
Provape has already openly stated that, until the methods of temperature sensing in vaping can be as accurately done, as they see fit...while falling in line with their own top-notch line of safety standards...they will not be producing a Temp Control device. Which basically means, they won't put one out until they invent their own proper method of temp control.
And I, for one, will not own any such device until it is made by Provape.
I may fall into what you view as a minority of vapers, by being fully satisfied by everything Provape has to offer. And that's fine. You fall into what I view as a minority of vapers that needs anything more than what is provided by Provape.
Some folks need MOAR POWER! And some of them are willing to pay to be told they're getting all that power.
Some folks, like me, prefer durability. Dependability. And all of us are willing to pay for exactly the power that is promised to us.
One thing cannot be refuted here. Provape's AccuSet technology/algorithm/whatever is deadly accurate. When they say you get 40 watts, you get 40 watts. And I'd rather pay for 100% of 40 watts, that will keep working for years, and is backed up by best-in-industry customer service...rather than pay for 200 watts, only get MAYBE 100 watts reliably, and worry about what happens when my hot-glued-together board fails in a matter of months.
I know you weren't. You're a person of integrity, and I wouldn't expect any less of you.
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So (mods) why are we talking about all this, and how does it relate to the topic?
Well, to the best of my knowledge, the GEM was never designed or intended for Temp Control...which was part of the topic being discussed.
Then Jazz and I had a brief convo about Provape, which still involved Temp Control, which was being discussed for the GEM.
All is cool.
No shots fired.
All guns on the ground.
No Provari/Anti-Provari wars starting here.
[emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41][emoji41]
And I ain't no provocatin' type of guy!
No matter what they say about me!
umm, do you realize that most temperature sensors actually are nothing more than a variable resistor? and that in the case of temp control on a mod, the coil in essence BECOMES an actual temperature sensor? you're basically taking a reading directly from a temperature sensor with temp control, the only real problems wind up surfacing when there happens to be varying resistance in the circuit itself, meaning connections to the coil, mainly in the 510 connection.
it has been proven that with rock solid connections temp control is pretty damn reliable and consistent, especially with a wire type like ni200. some wires don't vary as much with temperature changes which gives a lower resolution scale, but in essence temp control is using the coil itself as it's own temperature sensor, and the current scheme of things has the potential for fairly high accuracy and repeat-ability, again with poor connections being the only real main potential problem area. it's really not just guessing at temperature, it's actually measuring it
I've never been a fan of temp control. Ive used it successfully, but I think nickel irritates my throat a bit and I don't have a big interest in the other options. Furthermore, I can't remember the last time dry hits were an issue.
I've used provape products up until they lacked the power I was looking for. I made the switch to mechanical bottom feeders and have been content with that for the last 2 years.
Out of curiosity, I ordered a Radius. I liked it so much I broke out some older gear. This led me to the Gem. Loved it. It's really a fine vape. Fine enough that a 2nd Radius and the Ti Gem is due to arrive this afternoon. I still like my squonkers, but leaving the house with a 10 ml bottle of juice, 1 mod and no extra batteries is pretty nice. Hats off to provape and Mark Bugs. It's definitely a winning combination.
I've used provape products up until they lacked the power I was looking for. I made the switch to mechanical bottom feeders and have been content with that for the last 2 years.
Out of curiosity, I ordered a Radius. I liked it so much I broke out some older gear. This led me to the Gem. Loved it. It's really a fine vape. Fine enough that a 2nd Radius and the Ti Gem is due to arrive this afternoon. I still like my squonkers, but leaving the house with a 10 ml bottle of juice, 1 mod and no extra batteries is pretty nice. Hats off to provape and Mark Bugs. It's definitely a winning combination.
Did Mark Bugs ever say publicly say that the GEM was not designed for use in temperature controlled conditions? If they did I certainly missed that because I would not have put down the money for two devices which are so poorly done for my preferred vaping mode. I am going to remake the positive pins with proper tolerances and see if I can achieve acceptable/reliable results because I do like the aesthetics of the GEM. I think that is very well done.
Duane
turbocad6
I've found temperature control to be a huge benefit to quality of the vape and certainly far more than just a method to avoid dry hits. I think your comments are "right on" with respect to the technology as long as good electrical connections are achieved. The core of the problem is that the 510 connection itself is marginal with respect to a solid electrical connection but some producers have made it possible to limp home to half way decent performance and others have failed miserably. A new connection method with sound engineering and execution would be a big boon to vaping.
Duane
As I said, it's to the best of my knowledge.
It would seem to me, that if one needs to remake or modify anything on a device, in order to get it to work with TC, then the original part wasn't intended for TC.
I've heard nothing but problems with the GEM and TC, which leads my mind to say 2+2=4...if it doesn't work with TC, it's probably because it wasn't intended for TC.
I wish someone could get a hold of Mark Bugs...there are a lot of questions that a lot of people have.
But apparently he's harder to get a hold of than a greased pig at a county fair!
Quote from Mark Bugs in the other Gem thread:
From the test and the feedback that we have done/received, depending on your builds/wire/juice/device looks like majority succeed to vape it in TC.
From the test and the feedback that we have done/received, depending on your builds/wire/juice/device looks like majority succeed to vape it in TC.
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