Liquid is insanely expensive.

[NicoHolic]

I try to keep everything in the perspective of traditional tobacco.

IMO, 3 ml of e-liquid ≈ one pack of twenty tobacco cigarettes
and 30 ml ≈ one carton of ten packs of twenty tobacco cigarettes

Below are some commercial juices I have some interest in.
30 ml bottles (some vendors below have larger/cheaper per ml)

Halo (Tribeca $19.99, 67¢/ml)
Johnson Creek (Red Oak Tennessee Cured $19.45, 65¢/ml)
Alien Visions (Boba's Bounty $16.30, 54¢/ml)
Alushion (Smooth Criminal NET $16.00, 53¢/ml)
Mountain Oak Vapors (Apache NET $15.99, 53¢/ml)
Heathers Heavenly Vapes (Huntsman NET $13.00, 43¢/ml)

Yes, these prices are as much as 7-11X what I DIY for... HOWEVER,
they're a bargain compared to the cost of a carton of tobacco cigarettes.

 

[Lombaowski]

You don't understand it because you're focusing on the rape instead of the "no effect on them personally".
I don't need to be personally effected by something to say it's wrong.
And even when I'm not directly effected I may be indirectly effected. As in the case of rape, if we allow people to get away with that eventually they will get around to effecting me with something I'm not a willing participant in.

You speak of free market working itself out but part of that free market is free speech and here you are (not you but others you are defending) complaining about others using their free speech to condemn certain practices within the free market to let others know they have other choices. Which is it?





Good thing I didn't use abortion as the analogy, which the majority of those against will never PERSONALLY be effected by. I'm sure you're really lose the PERSONALLY EFFECTED aspect with that topic.
Guess what, paying $1/ml fits the colloquialism of "being raped", the people paying it just don't know that's what's happening. I'm here to tell them that if I can buy DIY liquid at retail prices for 4.8¢/ml and they're paying $1/ml they're getting raped.

If you want to pay $300 for $10 worth of metal be my guest. But don't cry about it when I point out that it's $10 worth of material at retail prices and you just paid someone $290 labor to farm the work out to a machine shop.

I don't know of anyone here complaining about "costlier than DIY". Costlier is to be expected. The complaints are about how much costlier.
You're not saying it's OK to complain about kiosks are you?

You may find this link effective in your use of the word effect.

 

[Lombaowski]

I try to keep everything in the perspective of traditional tobacco.

IMO, 3 ml of e-liquid ≈ one pack of twenty tobacco cigarettes
and 30 ml ≈ one carton of ten packs of twenty tobacco cigarettes

Below are some commercial juices I have some interest in.
30 ml bottles (some vendors below have larger/cheaper per ml)

Halo (Tribeca $19.99, 67¢/ml)
Johnson Creek (Red Oak Tennessee Cured $19.45, 65¢/ml)
Alien Visions (Boba's Bounty $16.30, 54¢/ml)
Alushion (Smooth Criminal NET $16.00, 53¢/ml)
Mountain Oak Vapors (Apache NET $15.99, 53¢/ml)
Heathers Heavenly Vapes (Huntsman NET $13.00, 43¢/ml)

Yes, these prices are as much as 7-11X what I DIY for... HOWEVER,
they're a bargain compared to the cost of a carton of tobacco cigarettes.

I think this is the bottom line for most of us. I have four to five mls of 12mg of juice being equivalent to one pack of Marlboro Lights, so even at Five Pawns prices I'm still going to come out ahead in cost. With mod equipment, replacement parts and variety at worst you'll probably come out around even depending on what you like to use to power and cook your brew.

I personally would be way ahead already, but alas...I am a juice ..... who needs to try flavors from every vendor out there. At some point I will likely move away from this approach, but I might have to try 100 more juices from 10 different vendors to get there. Just like many things in life, it's the chase that is the most satisfying.

 

[Myk]

You may find this link effective in your use of the word effect.

Not really. I imagine I had much better usage before I ever read one of those and confused the issue. That one is no better.
I guess it wouldn't be worth writing up a webpage for a simple explanation though.

I generally go by what other people started (at least I wasn't the first one to be wrong if it's wrong) with or what an English major told me, "Usually 'effect' is what you want unless it's obvious that it should be 'affect'."

Here's a good one, Affect vs Effect - Difference and Comparison | Diffen
At least I wasn't the first one to have it wrong

 

[Myk]

I try to keep everything in the perspective of traditional tobacco.

IMO, 3 ml of e-liquid ≈ one pack of twenty tobacco cigarettes
and 30 ml ≈ one carton of ten packs of twenty tobacco cigarettes

Below are some commercial juices I have some interest in.
30 ml bottles (some vendors below have larger/cheaper per ml)

Halo (Tribeca $19.99, 67¢/ml)
Johnson Creek (Red Oak Tennessee Cured $19.45, 65¢/ml)
Alien Visions (Boba's Bounty $16.30, 54¢/ml)
Alushion (Smooth Criminal NET $16.00, 53¢/ml)
Mountain Oak Vapors (Apache NET $15.99, 53¢/ml)
Heathers Heavenly Vapes (Huntsman NET $13.00, 43¢/ml)

Yes, these prices are as much as 7-11X what I DIY for... HOWEVER,
they're a bargain compared to the cost of a carton of tobacco cigarettes.

No problem with those prices. In fact that is basically my list of ones I wanted to try and includes my main mixer when I wasn't DIY.

 

[Train2]

Just throwing a wrench for fun:
Saying the price of even the very highest priced juices are OK because they are less expensive than smoking is a justification, but not a good argument that it's a reasonable price.
It's like saying that the Arumania has a perfectly reasonable price for a bicycle, because, well... you COULD buy a helicopter to go to the park.

 

[Lombaowski]

Some of you people really need to work on your analogies.

 

[ijmunoz]

Here's the way I see it:
A 12ml bottle costs me about 8 dollars and generally lasts about a week. I was smoking a pack a day at 8 dollars. 8 dollars a week vs 56 a week....I am not complaining. Even though I am buying better e cigs from time to time, I am still saving money in the long run.

 

[TheSystemHasFailed]

Yeah, but whos to say there aren't trade secret sources that some premium vendors use...i.e. nothing you can get from a place that makes perfume...perfume?!
Therefore, never really re-creating the flavor. Contrary answers I'll need proof for...

Didn't think so...

Renowned premium juice is worth buying, subjectivity aside.

 

[vjc0628]

I try to keep everything in the perspective of traditional tobacco.

IMO, 3 ml of e-liquid ≈ one pack of twenty tobacco cigarettes
and 30 ml ≈ one carton of ten packs of twenty tobacco cigarettes

Below are some commercial juices I have some interest in.
30 ml bottles (some vendors below have larger/cheaper per ml)

Halo (Tribeca $19.99, 67¢/ml)
Johnson Creek (Red Oak Tennessee Cured $19.45, 65¢/ml)
Alien Visions (Boba's Bounty $16.30, 54¢/ml)
Alushion (Smooth Criminal NET $16.00, 53¢/ml)
Mountain Oak Vapors (Apache NET $15.99, 53¢/ml)
Heathers Heavenly Vapes (Huntsman NET $13.00, 43¢/ml)

Yes, these prices are as much as 7-11X what I DIY for... HOWEVER,
they're a bargain compared to the cost of a carton of tobacco cigarettes.

Agreed

It seems strange to me that with everything else people understand they pay much more for someone else to do for us then when we do it ourselves

I mean I could rebuild my bathroom much cheaper then calling a contractor
I can drive myself or take public transportation cheaper then a cab or car service
I can make a pizza cheaper then a paying a pizza place
All of these and many more I can do 7x or more cheaper then having someone else do it

However with some things I don't have the knowhow
others I don't have the time
some I don't have the equipment
some I can do but it would be subpar

when it makes sense for me then I do for myself
and Still other I just don't have the patients or the desire

But in all of them I have the choice
I prefer to pay others for various reasons

but somehow when it comes to eliquid people don't understand this anymore why?

 

[Heavyrocker]

DIY is the easiest thing ive done,try wrapping a mesh wick on the a AGA tank.

 

[Myk]

Agreed

It seems strange to me that with everything else people understand they pay much more for someone else to do for us then when we do it ourselves

I mean I could rebuild my bathroom much cheaper then calling a contractor
I can drive myself or take public transportation cheaper then a cab or car service
I can make a pizza cheaper then a paying a pizza place
All of these and many more I can do 7x or more cheaper then having someone else do it

However with some things I don't have the knowhow
others I don't have the time
some I don't have the equipment
some I can do but it would be subpar

when it makes sense for me then I do for myself
and Still other I just don't have the patients or the desire

But in all of them I have the choice
I prefer to pay others for various reasons

but somehow when it comes to eliquid people don't understand this anymore why?

You can't make a homemade pizza 7x cheaper than Dominoes or Pizza Hut, especially not if you consider time.
You can make a better pizza for slightly cheaper as long as you ignore the time involved. It costs me $15-$20 to make 2 large pizzas and I have to start making the dough early in the day.

Doing your own construction is similar where you only save if you don't count your labor, but not counting labor saves a bunch. I was shocked to learn they don't get to make much if any markup on materials (i.e., they don't get big price breaks from retail store prices).

The reason I have a problem with $1/ml is because I completely understand that and I understand it about many different businesses.

 

[vjc0628]

You can't make a homemade pizza 7x cheaper than Dominoes or Pizza Hut, especially not if you consider time.
You can make a better pizza for slightly cheaper as long as you ignore the time involved. It costs me $15-$20 to make 2 large pizzas and I have to start making the dough early in the day.

Doing your own construction is similar where you only save if you don't count your labor, but not counting labor saves a bunch. I was shocked to learn they don't get to make much if any markup on materials (i.e., they don't get big price breaks from retail store prices).

The reason I have a problem with $1/ml is because I completely understand that and I understand it about many different businesses.

Maybe that's true in Il not true in NY

the saving are not small with construction

with pizza I admit I don't know I haven't tried

but with most things the mark up is considerable
and that is mostly true
there are exceptions im sure but for most thing it is true

And there are reasons for it from overhead, rent, labor time consuming regulation whatever

the point is If I want to do it cheaper I can

If I don't I can pay the choice is mine

 

[TampaToker69]

I pay $0.50/ml from The Vapor Chef. I always order at least 60ml at a time. I've found my ADV and love it. I've tried many different juices. Sure you can find bargain prices on different liquids. I won't sacrifice quality for price.

 

[retired1]

People, let's keep it on topic. If you have a problem with a post, report it. If you can't restrain yourself, don't post.

 

[doots]

The Chinese probably buy thousands of gallons of nic at one time and their labor cost is next to nothing. I have had some good dekang juices. I dont know exactly what's in them but they are cheaper than US juices...... Doesn't mean they are inferior imo. Whatever you like..
I think juice is priced too high by some makers to some extent and play on made in the US. I haven't really seen pics of where they make it on their websites. Just saying. A pic or two would be nice since that is the major selling point in getting us to pay more..

Before someone chimes in on overhead. I understand that and didn't imply that they should be the same price as China juices.. Things cost more over here to make.. Just saying they could be much cheaper than they are with the exception of extracted juices which take lots of time to produce..

I tried so many in the US and most pretty much sucked. Imo. Some Dekang sucks too.. I diy mostly these days, but not everyone can or will take the necessary steps to do that or have the extra time to play scientist. I think the consumer will set the prices in the end.. If you pay they will charge what they want.. If you dont pay the prices will fall...
that's my 2 cents for this week

 

[Heavyrocker]

The only reason why i started DIY is because i could not find a store mix that i liked.

 

[panewtovaping]

I only read the first 3 pages of this thread so this may have been brought up by someone. Why are you comparing juice cost to wine? Are you vaping to quit drinking wine? No, you're vaping to quit smoking cigarettes! When I started vaping I lived in NJ. I smoked about a carton a week and a carton costs about $70 then. I don't mind paying for the juice because I am still saving a ton of money and I no longer cough myself awake in the morning.

 

[jwinkles]

I agree. Some prices out there are outrageous. For this reason, I started diy. I sell juice to a few people... I won't go higher than .50 a ml. even though I've been tongue lashed by a couple individuals... Some of the people I sell to buy 4oz bottles(118ml).... and if it's not a complex blend, I've sold them as cheap as $30....
I understand the cost of doing business...it's not cheap.......but come on.... the markup on juice though has slightly lowered, is still insane. But like I read in previous posts....if people buy it that way, they'll sell it that way.
Now...have I lost money....no...but I have no overhead...par from supplies....have I made allot of money...no....but, can I claim that at least a dozen people have been analog free for at least 6 months....YES...3 of which started at 24mg and now vape a zero, 1 just contacted me yesterday and requested that his future juice be 6mg...and to me, that's worth more than paper in my pocket.
I look forward to the day they donate their setup to help future analog quitters....isn't that one of the main reasons we all started vaping?

 

[Blueser]

I got into DIY when I realized it was much easier finding a crappy tasting juice as opposed to finding one I actually liked. Ordering juice is a crapshoot and it's much less expensive making my own crap...so far I can say I've been very pleased with my results.