Quick question and forgive me if it's been asked before, but. Is there any health risks to using NETs as opposed to the regular artificial flavors found in most juices?
Natural Tobaccos
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Giving W2V Louisville, London, and Paris my full attention this week. The last few hours have been Louisville...and this baby puts a smile on my face (though probably not on my atomizer's face...if atomizers had faces). I'm getting a little more sweetness than Jerms is experiencing, but I'm thinking that's probably a result of my juices being a bit older. I didn't realize that I've had these around since March 1. Ha!
Jerms, how new are your bottles?
Jerms, how new are your bottles?
I can't make any hardcore claims about this or not. However, Ahlusion, (*)Mountain Oak Vapor, House of Liquid are the vendors that I know of that have had their liquids checked via GC-MS for TSNAs (Tobacco-specific nitrosamines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) and/or minor alkaloids. (I am sure there's more, but I don't know of them. Maybe someone else can speak to other NET vendors liquids being tested?) Once again, that is not to say that they are safe, safer than artificial flavors, or that all artificial flavors are safe (we know that is not the case), but all in all, I think it is as safe as any eliquid out there, meaning relatively safe.
Who knows, there may be some study that shows something negative regarding NETs or NETs from a specific vendor (they are not all created equally), but there will always be some study that shows some results that help to substantiate a pre-existing position. As far as safe goes, I can say that I am safe from cigarettes.
*See edit below, post #9547
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And better than cigarettes. Or at least I'm willing to take my chances.
HA! I was re-wording my final thoughts in that post to reflect a similar sentiment.
As an FYI for those that have been reading lately--VapeRite has a flavor, Butterscotch (and possibly a few more), which they openly admit to having Diacetyl. The site states, "Note: This product contains less than 1% percent of diacetyl. A naturally occuring flavor molecule found in vanilla-custardy, Buttery type flavors."
I like that they have this posted, but as far as I am concerned, I am much more leery of this than NETs.
Fairly new I think, got a few ml of each of those from CW, who I believe got them fairly recently. I did get a little sweetness, I'm guessing London and Paris will have even less when I try them, doing London tomorrow and Paris Friday. I must say R, you are a true veteran to agressive tobaccos to find notable sweetness in Loisville lol.
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Final Note and edit for clarity: MOV had their regular liquid tested for TSNAs, but not their NETs (as far as I know). It is a wildly costly endeavor, so I don't expect that most vendors would do this all the time, if they will ever do it. Oh, and not just NET vendors, but most vendors have yet to have their liquids tested and or posted results--the ones that have are far and few between. MOV had their artificial tobacco, Tennessee Original, tested on 6/2012 and that was before they began with NETs.
HoL has their results posted on two of their NETs, Guevara and Virgina Prime, at Concept Liquids - Specially designed e liquid production laboratory (though, I don't think the posted results could be considered third party since they actually make the juices there.)
Ahlusion doesn't have any of their GC-MS results posted. Wlad does the third party GC-MS testing for other vendors, so he has the capabilities and know-how to test his own liquids and to satisfy inspections, but not to post. Posting of first hand testing can not be considered viable for one's own site.
In the end, whether you are vaping NETs, artificial flavors with food coloring like Red-40 (there is plenty of info on health concerns with food coloring, and I would venture a guess that some issues people associate with PG may, may be due to "other" issues with the juice), buttery flavors with diacetyl, whole tobacco alkaloids, oily juices or acidic juices that crack tanks, silica wicks, LDPE bottles etc., it all has to be a calculated risk. I have done my calculations and my risk keeps coming up < burning tobacco.
HoL has their results posted on two of their NETs, Guevara and Virgina Prime, at Concept Liquids - Specially designed e liquid production laboratory (though, I don't think the posted results could be considered third party since they actually make the juices there.)
Ahlusion doesn't have any of their GC-MS results posted. Wlad does the third party GC-MS testing for other vendors, so he has the capabilities and know-how to test his own liquids and to satisfy inspections, but not to post. Posting of first hand testing can not be considered viable for one's own site.
In the end, whether you are vaping NETs, artificial flavors with food coloring like Red-40 (there is plenty of info on health concerns with food coloring, and I would venture a guess that some issues people associate with PG may, may be due to "other" issues with the juice), buttery flavors with diacetyl, whole tobacco alkaloids, oily juices or acidic juices that crack tanks, silica wicks, LDPE bottles etc., it all has to be a calculated risk. I have done my calculations and my risk keeps coming up < burning tobacco.
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I think Ahlusion Devil Dog! might have permanently altered my taste buds. It's kind of like my tolerance for spiciness before college. I used to be a total spice wuss, but then I had Indian roommates in college. Eating their mothers' home cooking changed me forever. Ha!
More seriously though, I'm betting it's a time thing. When I first had Devil Dog! it was enjoyable, but the tobacco hit me like an axe kick to the head. Months later, the tobacco calmed down -- as Wlad said it would -- and it was more like a right cross to the face.
that'd be 4-22 arrival date at my place. the smaller bottle should decrease steeping time... along with the second trip across the country, it might be equivalent to being in a cabinet for a month
I have done my calculations and my risk keeps coming up < burning tobacco.
Or whatever that was we were burning.
Yep, also the Ramon Allones Celestial. How ironic is it, that I have never actually shopped for tobacco at a tobacconist until I quit smoking.
Bronze, now that you're a bananabacco fan, remind me to send you some of the Nougat Burley Cavendish I mixed up with my NEB (naturally extracted banana). It is hell on atomizers but Oh. So. Good.
I have my Patriot v1 in my AGI today and DAYUM but this stuff is the top of the heap. The RBA is picking up green notes I never noticed, but they don't scare me like "greenness" usually does. Instead it just adds depth to the whole blend. I will miss this when I upgrade to Version 2.
I just want to say what everyone else already knows. Mr.Mann ROCKS!!!! He's even awesome to talk to on the phone. Thanks to his incredible generosity, he grabbed a 30ml bottle of XPress Sahara Blend while visiting Ahlusion.
Now I understand why it's taking so damn long for the XPress line to drop. This juice was made in November '12!!!! Yep, a 6 month steep.
The taste is out of this world. I usually vape 12mg, this juice happens to be 24mg. Mann didn't know what MG I vaped and that's fine. The point is that he was kind enough to think of someone else. He really is a great guy and I can't wait to meet him.
Thanks so much Mr.Mann!!!
Oh!!! If you haven't seen his artwork you're missing out on some awesome abstract paintings. Be on the lookout for some Mr.Mann/Shatner collaborative art in the near future.
Maybe that's why my 10mls of Sahara isn't working for me yet... it's too darn young! It is pink like yours, but it was only purchased in March.
LOL
I like the spice in it...
In the mornings, I have a huge cup of chai mate tea... for those not familiar with it, it is a caffeinated mate tea with deep flavors, slight fruit,nutty, and spice... not sweet in the slightest but, loaded with spice and hints of green, black, and white tea. Here is the description of the 2 that I blend from their website: "caffeine-rich green mate & green rooibos blend. Cinnamon, anise, cardamom, and almond are fortified with papaya and pineapple, orange, and lemongrass" plus "mate, black tea and red rooibos. This morning blend is filled to the brim with sweet cocoa, chocolate and almond bits, pistachio nuts, macadamia nuts, and coriander rounded off with warm hazelnut and cinnamon"
Clove Cove is reminiscent of that flavor for me.
I find that my juice preferences mirror pretty heavily my tea and alcohol preferences which isn't really a surprise
It sounds crazy but, it blends quite well.
Check out some of the tea varietals at teavana. they are pricy but, worth looking at.
My local tea shop is this outfit.. Their Toasty Warm (honey nut oolong) and Sencha Quince are excellent to drink as well as to vape
My company used to send me on business trips to Sydney and I would stay at a particular hotel that had a smoking floor. Even though I haven't needed it for a year, the hotel still would put me in a room on that floor. The flight crews from Garuda Indonesia airlines stay there too, and as soon as you get off the elevator you'd get a waft of clove/kretek smoke. It smelled absolutely heavenly.
FYI, Ahlusion's BGB goes awesome with BBQ'd Spicy Italian Sausages and a Spiced Rum.
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FYI, Ahlusion's BGB goes awesome with BBQ'd Spicy Italian Sausages and a Spiced Rum.
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With all those heavy flavors, you need a juice that can cut through. Most juices would just taste like plain PG/VG after that kind of meal.
Yep, also the Ramon Allones Celestial. How ironic is it, that I have never actually shopped for tobacco at a tobacconist until I quit smoking.
Bronze, now that you're a bananabacco fan, remind me to send you some of the Nougat Burley Cavendish I mixed up with my NEB (naturally extracted banana). It is hell on atomizers but Oh. So. Good.
I have my Patriot v1 in my AGI today and DAYUM but this stuff is the top of the heap. The RBA is picking up green notes I never noticed, but they don't scare me like "greenness" usually does. Instead it just adds depth to the whole blend. I will miss this when I upgrade to Version 2.
Well, I can't profess to being a bananabacco fan since I liked only one of the four I tried (2 of 5 if we're counting CC as a bananabacco) but that banana extract sounds like it would go good with the NBC.
Heads up. VaporBank is having a really great 2 day sale they do once a season, from mods to RBAs to batteries, etc. Vamo V2 $34 for chrome and $39 for stainless. The SmokTech SID for $40. Couple mechanicals for $35. IGO-S and IGO-L for $11 and $12. A7 for $12. The new AGI for $25.
I'd jump on that stainless SID VV/VW device and a few RBA drippers, but I still haven't received my new debit card with the new number. Great deals.
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I'd jump on that stainless SID VV/VW device and a few RBA drippers, but I still haven't received my new debit card with the new number. Great deals.
Sent from my LGL55C using Tapatalk 2
I just want to say what everyone else already knows. Mr.Mann ROCKS!!!! He's even awesome to talk to on the phone. Thanks to his incredible generosity, he grabbed a 30ml bottle of XPress Sahara Blend while visiting Ahlusion.
Now I understand why it's taking so damn long for the XPress line to drop. This juice was made in November '12!!!! Yep, a 6 month steep.
The taste is out of this world. I usually vape 12mg, this juice happens to be 24mg. Mann didn't know what MG I vaped and that's fine. The point is that he was kind enough to think of someone else. He really is a great guy and I can't wait to meet him.
Thanks so much Mr.Mann!!!
Oh!!! If you haven't seen his artwork you're missing out on some awesome abstract paintings. Be on the lookout for some Mr.Mann/Shatner collaborative art in the near future.
It's a setup -- don't do it! That 24mg Sahara will turn you into one of THEM!
I've been trying to get my hands on an Igo-L and every vendor that has them in stock doesn't deliver beyond the US including Vaporbank which I just discovered.
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