New Atomizer Prototype

[jacko]

Here's some information that I found on Nichrome concerning resistance, heat, current...etc. I looks like at 1 A or so, this thing gets really hot!
I believe that the recommendation for connection is braze, or using silver solder to hold up better to the heat. There was also mention (don't know which place I read it) of using crimp joints. If anyone has ever taken a coffee maker apart to replace the thermal switch, you may have noticed that the switch is crimped to the wiring.

 

[Bubo]

I guess I read too much... This sounds easier and more permanent than anything else...

For those concerned with soldering the nichrome read this by Vaporer post 128 and 132.

 

[Bubo]

RoadKill - nice pictures - it's great to see someone knows how to focus!
Scottbee - what are we trying to accomplish? Burned fingers of course!

Aspiring Glass Workers - Small pieces of normal glass, like the ones that we are talking about here, can be 'worked' with stuff that you already have. It's not really that complicated.

As RoadKill's pictures show - you can soften thin glass with a normal lighter (Assuming that you still have some lying around somewhere!) or a candle - you don't need torches unless you are working with bigger pieces.

Cutting glass can be done by scoring (okay - so you might need a $1.50 glass cutter) with a glass cuter or file, then snapping the sheet, or rapping the tube.... Heating and cooling can be used too.

Remember Google and YouTube are your friends! ;-) And yes, take all the safety precautions and have a couple of band aids lying around....

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Go to the store and grab a fiberglass wick for a oil lamp. Separate out one of the bundles from the wick. Wrap the nichrome wire around it in a vertical position just as you have done here with the bulb. The fiberglass wick should hold up to the heat and work nicely to pull the fluid to the coil. Cartomizers are constructed this way and is about the simplest design I have seen so far to reproduce.

True, but I was hoping to improve on the juice-on-coil design.

Here's some information that I found on Nichrome concerning resistance, heat, current...etc. I looks like at 1 A or so, this thing gets really hot!
I believe that the recommendation for connection is braze, or using silver solder to hold up better to the heat. There was also mention (don't know which place I read it) of using crimp joints. If anyone has ever taken a coffee maker apart to replace the thermal switch, you may have noticed that the switch is crimped to the wiring.

I think we only need 200 degrees Celcius, which apparently only requires 0.38/2=0.19A for a 36ga wire? Seems a bit low, don't most attys do around 1A? It would be nice to keep the temperature somewhat limited, as according to StratOvation VG will decompose at around 280C, possibly releasing some bad chemicals.

Crimp joints will have to do, I guess, for now. I'm worried about my solder melting within the bulb. I might be able to get access to a welder later though...

 

[Bubo]

We really have to quit posting at the same time Roadkill!

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

We really do, I have to keep checking before I submit my reply if any new posts have been added

I've been cutting the bulbs by making a small scratch or score, then putting it inside a loop of super hot nichrome, which propagates the crack and (hopefully) results in a really nice break. I bought a triangular file but I think the edges are too dull But I'm glad to hear we can use cheap stuff to work with our tiny glass pieces!

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Bought a 50 mini lights set for $2... back to experimenting!

I wonder if we might be able to implement a really crude temperature control by using the same method that flasher bulbs work--once the temperature reaches a certain point, power is cut off, until it cools down again. They use a bimetallic strip, more details here. It would be hard to calibrate but it would be like an extremely cheap PWM system.

 

[jacko]

I wonder if we might be able to implement a really crude temperature control by using the same method that flasher bulbs work--once the temperature reaches a certain point, power is cut off, until it cools down again. They use a bimetallic strip, more details here. It would be hard to calibrate but it would be like an extremely cheap PWM system.

I'm not sure that a temp control is needed, since these heating periods should only be for 3 or 4 seconds. Do you think it would get too hot in that time frame?

EDIT- just thinking... that may be why the batteries have a shut-off.

 

[Bubo]

I'd save that for v2!
Once this beast gets operational, then we gotta figure out how to mount it...

And RoadKilll - you BOUGHT lights? Don't you have 20,000 dead ones lying around? I know I will come December.... (And they where all new last year!)

 

[jacko]

I have dead ones too. Hell, I gotta get some Nichrome to get busy..... I also have some ceramic tubes that came out of mercury vapor lamps I want to cut up to experiment with.
This may take a while, but think about what Edison went through to get a working filament.

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

I'm not sure that a temp control is needed, since these heating periods should only be for 3 or 4 seconds. Do you think it would get too hot in that time frame?

Haha, on second thought, I was just overthinking it. But! It is an option if we need something similar in the future... I think it would make it really rugged and fix a lot of the "worst case" and "abuse" scenarios.

And RoadKilll - you BOUGHT lights? Don't you have 20,000 dead ones lying around? I know I will come December.... (And they where all new last year!)

I found 5 bulbs that I had saved for like 10 years. I'm surprised I didn't find more... I am a horrible junk collector. But I went out and bought the cheapest set so that I wasn't tempted to take apart our other ones

 

[Scubabatdan]

Ok, I have been following this thread and pretty much any othe atomiser construction thread, this is what I have ben playing with:

It is 5/32" in dia. and abount .5" in length. It is a solder tip for a battery powered soldering iron. I just ordered 5 more as the first one I disected. It is nichomium wire cased in ceramic covered in a metal jacket. After cutting the jacket off and crushing the ceramics I could see the wire inside. When I connected it to a 3.7vdc 18350 battery it took 1 second for it to go cherry red. I will now take a fully assembled one and see if I can create a ceramic resivor jacket that looks like this:

It would still use a bridge but it could be removeable, still in conceptual mode right now.

Dan

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Very interesting, what are those meant to be used for? How much do they cost?

 

[dubnluvn]

Does a nice diagram (like the OP) exist for the design of current atomizers?

 

[Scubabatdan]

Very interesting, what are those meant to be used for? How much do they cost?

They are made for battery powered soldering irons, cost about 5.00 The say it takes 10 seconds to reach 900 degree F. So a couple seconds of 3.7vdc and it should be ready for vaping. Once warm it should act like a normal coil... we hope LOL
We will see how they work, I have a craft center here with a kiln so I can manufacture my own ceramic inserts that will fit a 901/801 etc atomizer. We will see...
Dan

 

[roadkilldeluxe]

Does a nice diagram (like the OP) exist for the design of current atomizers?

Not really, but they're pretty simple. I had to search the forums for a few weeks to really get a decent grasp... Unfortunately a lot of older posts no longer have working images

A really good one is breakdown of a DSE901 by Exogenesis. They're not all built alike but this diagram helped me make sense of it all.

 

[Scottes]

OK, I don't know much about this stuff, but Dan's doohickey looks like it has some serious possibilites.

Keep up the good work guys!!

 

[callousparade]

we just need to escape nichrome. some materials engineer needs to sit down and just figure out how to mass produce ceramic resistors that ramp up to speed really quick and are made out of a non-oxidizing compound. It wouldn't wear out! just potentially fracture if its heated up WAY too high (accidentally holding button down in the pocket) but that happens with the ones we have now anyway.

 

[jacko]

They are made for battery powered soldering irons, cost about 5.00 The say it takes 10 seconds to reach 900 degree F. So a couple seconds of 3.7vdc and it should be ready for vaping. Once warm it should act like a normal coil... we hope LOL
We will see how they work, I have a craft center here with a kiln so I can manufacture my own ceramic inserts that will fit a 901/801 etc atomizer. We will see...
Dan

This looks great! where can I get some of those tips? This looks exactly like what I was thinking.
1) they should last a long time.
2) they should be relatively maintenance free
3) they should be less costly than the current ones (or not much more expensive-especially if they last longer)
4) they should vape really good

I need to play with some of those. Does RatShack have some of those, I wonder?
Good job Dan

 

[jacko]

we just need to escape nichrome. some materials engineer needs to sit down and just figure out how to mass produce ceramic resistors that ramp up to speed really quick and are made out of a non-oxidizing compound. It wouldn't wear out! just potentially fracture if its heated up WAY too high (accidentally holding button down in the pocket) but that happens with the ones we have now anyway.

They already make wire wound resistors... and high wattage resistors that dissipate lots of heat, but I wonder if those would heat as quickly as NiChrome. Probably not. I haven't seen a resistor get really-really hot without destroying itself.