New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers

[Myk]

COPD may well be the REAL killer, but it is entirely, 100% (IMHO as always) one of the WORST ways to die. People with COPD are MISERABLE. When I went to see my retirement community, she said, "Oh, gosh, we don't tend to see the folks with COPD much, they stay in their homes due to lack of mobility.

The guy I got my small lathe from had emphysema. Used to always be at the shop where I shoot to work on his big lathe (always smoking). Ended up he couldn't even work on the little lathe in his own garage. Moved to FL (I can't breathe in FL without lung problems) and died in a few years.

I got pneumonia a year or two after vaping, not on immune suppression yet (although my Ducktor at the time said it was, it's not), I was barely exposed to any humans to get any germs. Turns out people with IBD are at higher risk for pneumonia. I didn't even know it, I was staying in bed with a high fever waiting for my Dr appointment to roll around, I was breathing fine. He sent me to the ER.
It was after they gave me antibiotics that I couldn't breathe for weeks and standing up in the heat was a blackout for a year. The slight wiff of cigarette smoke shut off my breathing instantly for a couple of weeks. I was able to vape lightly.

I have not had a cold or anything like that since going on immune suppression. Hand sanitizer in my pocket, a mask if anyone seems sick or a crowd is too big to judge, refusal to shake hands or hug and gloves if I can't avoid touching someone. The added paranoia must help.
Although I found out I probably got the pneumonia from myself, we have the germs inside and sometimes they make it into our lungs.

 

[gerrymi]

they do nothing to prevent the FDA from claiming vaping leads to smoking

I think I first ran into "The Mashed Potato Theory" WAY back in high school...

Two things/events can occur together...but...that doesn't mean one causes the other...

98.7% of drivers in automobile accidents have eaten mashed potatoes in the week before the accident...

Therefore...eating mashed potatoes leads to automobile accidents!!??!!

..

 

[CMD-Ky]

Logical fallacy: Post hoc ergo propter hoc. The gateway theory is a current excellent example. It drives me batty every time someone mentions "gateway". Weak minds produce weak arguments. Weaker minds agree cite those arguments.

 

[ScottP]

I think I first ran into "The Mashed Potato Theory" WAY back in high school...

Two things/events can occur together...but...that doesn't mean one causes the other...

98.7% of drivers in automobile accidents have eaten mashed potatoes in the week before the accident...

Therefore...eating mashed potatoes leads to automobile accidents!!??!!

..

Correlation does not equal causation.

 

[Alphazero]

Screw logic and science, go for the emotional heartstrings.....

I totally agree with you.
What do you think juul temperature control mode is set fo?

 

[mikepetro]

I totally agree with you.
What do you think juul temperature control mode is set fo?

I dont know, but I do know they take temperature into consideration. If I were a betting man, I would bet the temp is limited below the steep climb in the curve, assuming you are using their juice\pods as designed.

 

[Alphazero]

I dont know, but I do know they take temperature into consideration. If I were a betting man, I would bet the temp is limited below the steep climb in the curve, assuming you are using their juice\pods as designed.

Very interesting. But you assume that they care more about your health than from the experience.2) if i search for juul alikes cig their temp are above the steep.

I think that the catch is this:
Need tc mode for safer vaping >>
Need subohm atomizer for TC mode >>
Need low nicotine for sub ohm vaping>>
Need to take alot of puff just to feel satisfied.

So how we overcome this obstacle?
We need TC mode which allow high nicotine
And preferred MTL to minimize lung exposure.

Any tips?

 

[mikepetro]

Very interesting. But you assume that they care more about your health than from the experience.2) if i search for juul alikes cig their temp are above the steep.

I think that the catch is this:
Need tc mode for safer vaping >>
Need subohm atomizer for TC mode >>
Need low nicotine for sub ohm vaping>>
Need to take alot of puff just to feel satisfied.

So how we overcome this obstacle?
We need TC mode which allow high nicotine
And preferred MTL to minimize lung exposure.

Any tips?

Well, I think your assumptions may need a little tweaking.

Assuming the use of TC, "subohm" takes on a whole different meaning than it does with a Mech. Yes, people using subohm coils on mech usually do need to use low nic, but a subohm coil on a TC mod does NOT require low nic. TC uses subohm coil as a function of the type of wire you have to use. It does not necessarily imply an intense hit.

I use TC, and I use builds in the 0.12 to 0.30 range (technically subohm), and I vape 36mg juice. One MTL hit off of one of my 0.15 ohm TI clapton coils on a DNA75C at around 440f is quite satisfying.

 

[mikepetro]

Very interesting. But you assume that they care more about your health than from the experience.

I make no such assumption. I assume they did their research and went down the road they actually thought might fly via a PMTA, and figured out how to get a decent hit within those parameters.

 

[mikepetro]

E-Cigarettes Lose Popularity Among Adult Smokers
But increase in vaping seen among former smokers in 2014-2016

"A review of National Health Interview Survey (NHIS) data over the 3-year period showed an increase in the number of U.S. adults who were ever-users of e-cigarettes, meaning that they had tried the products at some point in their lives. But prevalence of self-reported current use of e-cigarettes declined among adults during the period -- with the important exception of former smokers."

Yay...... thats the way it should be!

 

[Rossum]

E-Cigarettes Lose Popularity Among Adult Smokers
But increase in vaping seen among former smokers in 2014-2016

"A review of National Health Interview Survey (NHIS) data over the 3-year period showed an increase in the number of U.S. adults who were ever-users of e-cigarettes, meaning that they had tried the products at some point in their lives. But prevalence of self-reported current use of e-cigarettes declined among adults during the period -- with the important exception of former smokers."

Yay...... thats the way it should be!

So losing popularity among people who still smoke, but not among former smokers. Not real surprising, I guess. I know we'd like to think otherwise here, but vaping does not work for everyone as an acceptable substitute for smoking.

Then there's also the fact that the way they worded that strikes me as an intentional attempt to spin up some more "Save the Children from the Scourge of Vaping" agitprop.

 

[440BB]

Of the increasing number who've tried them, ecigs get used regularly mostly by former smokers. It suggests to me that vaping among younger groups isn't becoming something they carry into adulthood. Maybe the fad has run it's course.

That continued vaping is most popular with former smokers has always seemed obvious (to us), hasn't it?

No other group has such a need to keep our hands busy fiddling as we do to stay off the smokes.

 

[mikepetro]

No other group has such a need to keep our hands busy fiddling as we do to stay off the smokes.

Careful, didnt your Mamma warn you that would make you go blind......

 

[Rossum]

Careful, didnt your Mamma warn you that would make you go blind......

Hey, I can still see just fine, despite the fact that I'm constantly playing with my wood.

 

[mikepetro]

Nice collection, too bad @gdeal got "moved on".

A testament to the death of modding on ECF.

 

[Rossum]

Nice collection, too bad @gdeal got "moved on".

Those are all pdib mods. gdeal was (probably still is?) the owner of the 3rd one ever made and likely had some influence on their design, but his own designs (which were 3D printed) came about 6 months later. There were also a few hybrids; pdib made wood a few wood shells designed to accept gdeals's 3D printed DNA board internals.

Yes, what ECF's management did to gdeal (and worse, his content here!) was a travesty.

 

[badwaterbill]

Busy hands just til you need glasses!

 

[U2Desire]

This is new to me but apparently some people are vaping MCT oils like coconut oil. I found this post r/electronic_cigarette - Why I Choose MCTs and You Will Too. Please Read! . I don't know if there was a final consensus on whether it is safe or not. I would be interested in whether formaldehyde etc. are produced at similar or higher temps compared to vg and pg.

 

[mikepetro]

This is new to me but apparently some people are vaping MCT oils like coconut oil. I found this post r/electronic_cigarette - Why I Choose MCTs and You Will Too. Please Read! . I don't know if there was a final consensus on whether it is safe or not. I would be interested in whether formaldehyde etc. are produced at similar or higher temps compared to vg and pg.

I cant offer anything whatsoever on any base other than VG or PG. Maybe someone else can.

 

[Alphazero]

Well, I think your assumptions may need a little tweaking.

Assuming the use of TC, "subohm" takes on a whole different meaning than it does with a Mech. Yes, people using subohm coils on mech usually do need to use low nic, but a subohm coil on a TC mod does NOT require low nic. TC uses subohm coil as a function of the type of wire you have to use. It does not necessarily imply an intense hit.

I use TC, and I use builds in the 0.12 to 0.30 range (technically subohm), and I vape 36mg juice. One MTL hit off of one of my 0.15 ohm TI clapton coils on a DNA75C at around 440f is quite satisfying.

Hi, what tank do you use? Why do you prefer ti over ss?