Nic Base Storage: Freezer vs. Room Temp Experiment

[sofarsogood]

In principle, it shouldn't.


Probably.

I don't mess with my 100 mg nic in the freezer. Since I mix a whole 120ml bottle of 100 mg base down to vaping strength at one time, I don't worry whether it has stratified because the whole bottle gets dumped into my mixing container, and then the bottle gets rinsed with PG that also ends up in the mixing container (waste not, want not).

Now when I've made a mixed-down batch of unflavored, all of it except one bottle goes back in the freezer, where some of those bottles will remain for many months. Whenever I pull a fresh one out of the freezer to start using, I let it come to room temperature and then give it a good shake. I doubt it's really necessary, but it doesn't seem to hurt anything either.

I don't know if the materials separate but one may tend to float above the other if the specific gravity of each is sufficiently different from the other. For instance the SG of VG is significantly higher than PG. I don't know the difference between PG and nic.

 

[Rossum]

I don't know if the materials separate but one may tend to float above the other if the specific gravity of each is sufficiently different from the other.

Right, that does happen if you just dump them into a mixing container. But once they've been mixed into a uniform solution, they really should not separate.

 

[ChelsB]

Right, that does happen if you just dump them into a mixing container. But once they've been mixed into a uniform solution, they really should not separate.

That is, of course, until flavor is added, correct? It's drilled in to vapers' heads to ALWAYS shake the ejuice before using, although I've certainly forgotten and had no issues...

 

[Rossum]

That is, of course, until flavor is added, correct? It's drilled in to vapers' heads to ALWAYS shake the ejuice before using, although I've certainly forgotten and had no issues...

I suppose with flavorings it depends on exactly what they're composed of. If everything in a flavoring goes into solution with the unflavored base during the initial mix, then it really shouldn't stratify or otherwise separate. OTOH, if some of the flavoring's components only go into suspension rather than a proper solution, then indeed the mixture probably won't remain uniform if it just sits around.

 

[ChelsB]

I suppose with flavorings it depends on exactly what they're composed of. If everything in a flavoring goes into solution with the unflavored base during the initial mix, then it really shouldn't stratify or otherwise separate. OTOH, if some of the flavoring's components only go into suspension rather than a proper solution, then indeed the mixture probably won't remain uniform if it just sits around.

Thanks, I appreciate you taking the time to explain things scientifically, yet understandable to the layman. I took a screenshot of your reply regarding condensation and have already quoted you in real life conversation. I actually sounded like I knew what I was talking about

 

[DaveP]

FWIW, I kept out one 240ml working bottle of 100mg/ml MFS nic when I froze the rest of my last nic purchase a couple of years ago. It's now about 1/3 full and still clear after being kept at 37F in our Samsung fridge (according to the LCD temp display on the fridge door). It's in a clear glass Boston rounds bottle wrapped in several layers of paper towel to reduce light, rubber banded, and stored in a zip lock freezer bag. I've had it out several times to mix up batches of juice and then back into the fridge. 37F nic base is easier to work with for DIY than 0F juice from the zero degree freezer.

Before, when I'd take a bottle out of the freezer I had to let it sit to warm up or run warm water over it. The fridge bottle warms quicker. It's still thick at 37F, but becomes workable much quicker under a tap water warm up.

 

[sofarsogood]

FWIW, I kept out one 240ml working bottle of 100mg/ml MFS nic when I froze the rest of my last nic purchase a couple of years ago. It's now about 1/3 full and still clear after being kept at 37F in our Samsung fridge (according to the LCD temp display on the fridge door). It's in a clear glass Boston rounds bottle wrapped in several layers of paper towel to reduce light, rubber banded, and stored in a zip lock freezer bag. I've had it out several times to mix up batches of juice and then back into the fridge. 37F nic base is easier to work with for DIY than 0F juice from the zero degree freezer.

Before, when I'd take a bottle out of the freezer I had to let it sit to warm up or run warm water over it. The fridge bottle warms quicker. It's still thick at 37F, but becomes workable much quicker under a tap water warm up.

My routine is a little different. The 1 liter long term storage bottles are not opened until it's time to divide in to 250 ml mixing bottles. (Similar to the one liter bottles they are wrapped in bubble wrap and put in a zip lock bag an stored in the freezer. When it's time to mix I shake the bottle, pour immediately, replace the cap and put back in the freezer. What I find is there has been no color change from the time the small bottle is opened for the first time until it's finally empty. I don't wait for the mixing bottles to warm up.

Also, I pour directly from the mixing bottle to a 25 ml graduage cylinder for my 200 ml batches. I keep my hand steady by putting a knee on the floor and an elbow on the counter. I find room temperature VG easier to pour because it's thicker than PG and cold PG is easier because it's thicker. I learned to pour by practicing with a bottle of straight PG, no nic. Never look away from the pouring, even for an instant.

 

[ChelsB]

FWIW, I kept out one 240ml working bottle of 100mg/ml MFS nic when I froze the rest of my last nic purchase a couple of years ago. It's now about 1/3 full and still clear after being kept at 37F in our Samsung fridge (according to the LCD temp display on the fridge door). It's in a clear glass Boston rounds bottle wrapped in several layers of paper towel to reduce light, rubber banded, and stored in a zip lock freezer bag. I've had it out several times to mix up batches of juice and then back into the fridge. 37F nic base is easier to work with for DIY than 0F juice from the zero degree freezer.

Before, when I'd take a bottle out of the freezer I had to let it sit to warm up or run warm water over it. The fridge bottle warms quicker. It's still thick at 37F, but becomes workable much quicker under a tap water warm up.

Ooh, I need a refrigerator with LCD temp display!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[DaveP]

Ooh, I need a refrigerator with LCD temp display!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As soon as your present one gives up the ghost, most of the mid range ones and up come with it! Tech advances are cool, but all you need is a thermometer inside the freezer and it's all good.

 

[Tabac man]

I've read this thread with interest as I used to hoard and freeze nic. Although steps can be taken to reduce the wastage, in my experience some will always go off as if by magic. There's no way to calculate just how much frozen nic will still be good in the future.

It's also worth talking about what 'going off'' means and it would seem to be very very subjective. If my nic was not clear as water, it gave me unpleasant side effects so I had to bin it. I got head aches and they were not pretty. Sometimes I would just feel like I had a foggy head. If it didn't look right, smell right or look clear I couldn't vape it. I gave up buying large quantities to freeze and instead bought usable sized bottles to mix quickly. If it turned up not clear I sent it back. Plenty seem to be able to vape nic that's turning yellow or pink but I never could without side effects.

 

[Rossum]

I've read this thread with interest as I used to hoard and freeze nic. Although steps can be taken to reduce the wastage, in my experience some will always go off as if by magic. There's no way to calculate just how much frozen nic will still be good in the future.

It's also worth talking about what 'going off'' means and it would seem to be very very subjective. If my nic was not clear as water, it gave me unpleasant side effects so I had to bin it. I got head aches and they were not pretty. Sometimes I would just feel like I had a foggy head. If it didn't look right, smell right or look clear I couldn't vape it. I gave up buying large quantities to freeze and instead bought usable sized bottles to mix quickly. If it turned up not clear I sent it back. Plenty seem to be able to vape nic that's turning yellow or pink but I never could without side effects.

Hmm. I've never had nic that's been stored properly "go off" on me.

Back in in the second half of 2015 I did leave about 160ml of left-overs from the blind test sitting around at room temperature for several months and noticed all of it got noticeably darker and smellier. The NN that came in a glass bottle changed the least; the others were all in plastic. I did end up mixing it all down, but even at 15mg, the color was still apparent and the taste was definitely off. I vaped it anyway, but I didn't care for it much, and I was real happy when it was finally gone and it was time to make a new batch from base that had been kept in the freezer.

That experience, along with the fact that I'd already accumulated enough nic to last the rest of my life provided a good bit of the motivation for starting this thread.

How were you handling your nic? Was it in and out of the freezer and being opened and closed as you were using it? What are the steps that can be taken to reduce spoilage?

My entire supply is in 120ml glass bottles that are never opened until I need a new batch of vaping-strength base.

 

[zoiDman]

I've read this thread with interest as I used to hoard and freeze nic. Although steps can be taken to reduce the wastage, in my experience some will always go off as if by magic. There's no way to calculate just how much frozen nic will still be good in the future.

...

I've been on the ECF for a Long Time. And I haven't seen many (any?) posts where people's Nicotine Base Magically went off when stored (using reasonable techniques) in a Freezer.

In the absence of Science, or any Information about how you Store your Nicotine Base or what it Tasted like before you stored it, maybe your House was built on an Ancient Indian Burial grounds?

 

[stols001]

I don't think I have either.

I store my nic base and flavors in a refrigerator so old (half size) that it has wood paneling. It's been fine. I think you are over thinking this.

If the stuff in your freezer NOW is actually frozen (like lamb chops or whatever) I'm fairly sure you could just shove your nic in it. You can let your food be your LED display.

Anna

 

[Tabac man]

Hmm. I've never had nic that's been stored properly "go off" on me.

Back in in the second half of 2015 I did leave about 160ml of left-overs from the blind test sitting around at room temperature for several months and noticed all of it got noticeably darker and smellier. The NN that came in a glass bottle changed the least; the others were all in plastic. I did end up mixing it all down, but even at 15mg, the color was still apparent and the taste was definitely off. I vaped it anyway, but I didn't care for it much, and I was real happy when it was finally gone and it was time to make a new batch from base that had been kept in the freezer.

That experience, along with the fact that I'd already accumulated enough nic to last the rest of my life provided a good bit of the motivation for starting this thread.

How were you handling your nic? Was it in and out of the freezer and being opened and closed as you were using it? What are the steps that can be taken to reduce spoilage?

My entire supply is in 120ml glass bottles that are never opened until I need a new batch of vaping-strength base.

The steps that can be taken have all been discussed at lengh on this thread. I found glass to be better than plastic. If they weren't in brown bottles I covered them in black plastic before freezing. I did most of what has been discussed here.

 

[Tabac man]

I've been on the ECF for a Long Time. And I haven't seen many (any?) posts where people's Nicotine Base Magically went off when stored (using reasonable techniques) in a Freezer.

In the absence of Science, or any Information about how you Store your Nicotine Base or what it Tasted like before you stored it, maybe your House was built on an Ancient Indian Burial grounds?

By magic I meant it went off regardless of steps taken to prevent that. I didn't taste nic before freezing because I didn't want to open it. By going off I mean it was changing colour. I've already stated I couldn't vape it like that without side effects. I wouldn't throw nic in the bin without reason as it cost me money. If others can vape it when it's changing colour that's great. Sorry for the lack of science. Unlike you I have read about peoples nic changing when despite taking reasonable steps when freezing.

I've also bought nic that isn't clear and I have read suppliers comments about it. They claim some discolouration is normal, which is just fine. But I couldn't vape it.

 

[zoiDman]

By magic I meant it went off regardless of steps taken to prevent that. I didn't taste nic before freezing because I didn't want to open it. By going off I mean it was changing colour. I've already stated I couldn't vape it like that without side effects. I wouldn't throw nic in the bin without reason as it cost me money. If others can vape it when it's changing colour that's great. Sorry for the lack of science. Unlike you I have read about peoples nic changing when despite taking reasonable steps when freezing.

I've also bought nic that isn't clear and I have read suppliers comments about it. They claim some discolouration is normal, which is just fine. But I couldn't vape it.

If you Didn't taste the Nicotine Base before you stored it, how do you know that it Tasted OK when you got it?

The Colour of a Nicotine Base isn't a Definitive benchmark of Taste to me.

Because I have received Nicotine Base that was as Clear as Mountain Spring Water. But tasted like an Old Gym Sox that was dipped in Battery Acid.

And I have some 5 Year old Nicotine Base in a Filling Cabinet that has turned Amber. But there has been No really change in the Taste.

 

[Tabac man]

If you Didn't taste the Nicotine Base before you stored it, how do you know that it Tasted OK when you got it?

The Colour of a Nicotine Base isn't a Definitive benchmark of Taste to me.

Because I have received Nicotine Base that was as Clear as Mountain Spring Water. But tasted like an Old Gym Sox that was dipped in Battery Acid.

And I have some 5 Year old Nicotine Base in a Filling Cabinet that has turned Amber. But there has been No really change in the Taste.

I'm not claiming the colour of a nicotine base is a definitive benchmark of taste. I'm claiming most nic base I mixed with that wasn't crystal clear gave me headaches. Most not all. I have not had crystal clear nic that tasted of old gym socks but I have had crystal clear nic that had a peppery taste. I quite liked it and had no adverse affects from using it.

If I didn't taste it before freezing it I couldn't possibly know how it tasted before freezing it. The colour and taste is not my issue here. My problem was I had bad side effects vaping nic that was turning, oxidising or whatever the hell else one calls it. I wish I didn't but I did.

 

[zoiDman]

I'm not claiming the colour of a nicotine base is a definitive benchmark of taste. I'm claiming most nic base I mixed with that wasn't crystal clear gave me headaches. Most not all. I have not had crystal clear nic that tasted of old gym socks but I have had crystal clear nic that had a peppery taste. I quite liked it and had no adverse affects from using it.

If I didn't taste it before freezing it I couldn't possibly know how it tasted before freezing it. The colour and taste is not my issue here. My problem was I had bad side effects vaping nic that was turning, oxidising or whatever the hell else one calls it. I wish I didn't but I did.

It is Definitely a Downer that you Can't use what you had put away in Storage.

But All I was say'n is I'm Not sure you can Say that Nicotine Base that has be Reasonably Stored in a Freezer can just go Off based on what you have.

 

[Tabac man]

It is Definitely a Downer that you Can't use what you had put away in Storage.

But All I was say'n is I'm Not sure you can Say that Nicotine Base that has be Reasonably Stored in a Freezer can just go Off based on what you have.

I used the stuff that was ok and didn't use the stuff that wasn't ok. Some of it was ok some wasn't. I'm not sure what you mean by your last point. I can say some of my nic went off despite taking the reasonable steps discussed on this thread, because it did. Again I'll stress by 'going off' I mean it was giving me headaches. Most people seem to be fine with slightly discoloured nic, frozen or not.

I didn't have any problems with nic until I started to freeze it. I would buy some and use it then buy more. If I bought non clear nic I would return it.

 

[440BB]

It may be useful in the future to transfer your nic concentrate to clear glass bottles, storing them in a solid container. A little light exposure when opening the box will be worth the ability to see the color of the liquid over time. It also allows you to verify the lack of color when initially rebottling into glass.