Nicotine Comparisons

[SLM]

I have never tried their regular. I only vape unflavored at between 20 mg and 30 mg 50vg/50pg. I just find it so clean with a good but not harsh throat hit with a really nice subtle flavor. Kind of like a sauvignon blanc wine with a hint of nutiness. Very subtle but delicious.

20 to 30 mg? Is that right? What do you vape on?

 

[Dubminer]

20 to 30 mg? Is that right? What do you vape on?

Yes. I use SJMY or SXK Doggystyle 2K16 clones. I do sometimes use a Zeus as well but in that 6 mg is plenty.

 

[DaveP]

I mixed up a 100ml bottle of unflavored last night from my recently received 100mg nic from EcigExpress. It's nice and smooth with a very mild throat hit and no strange artifacts or off tastes. I'm a happy camper.

 

[chanelvaps]

I talked with the folks at Nicotine River today. The Pur Nic brand of nicotine they are carrying has nothing to do with Purilum. Purilum is Nicotine Rivers parent company but the PurNic is a different company altogether. Sourced from India, same as NicSelect.

 

[52anddone]

Good to know. Thanks chanelvaps, and good to see ya again.

 

[chanelvaps]

Good to know. Thanks chanelvaps, and good to see ya again.

right back at ya!

 

[Myk]

Has anyone tried Nicotine Giant since RTS went out and then Giant took over?
I just noticed the price is much better than when I last bought so I'm questioning if it's from the same source or RTS was making that much more in profit (I do recall some talk about RTS being expensive compared to some so competition could've drove the price down).

If nobody has I think I'm going to buy a small bottle to try before getting another liter.

 

[52anddone]

I bought menthol concentrate from TFA, I believe, but I have a pound of menthol crystals on order, should last nearly forever. I do use a TON of menthol. Right now the menthol is really the flavor. Just 70/30, with nic, and menthol to taste. Going back to doctor again, maybe get scrip change, or referral to ENT, gotta lose the sinus infection before I can taste anything!

Something I think I forgot to tell ya, Put those Crystals in a plastic zip lock baggie, close the baggie and push all the air out first, then take a rolling pin to roll over those Crystals and crush them into almost a powder, they will dissolve a whole lot quicker in PG that way.

 

[IDJoel]

Thanks Guys. I think I came up with a solution. I took about 45ml and poured it into a Clear glass pint mason jar, took a paper towel to use as a lid, and took off the top layer (it was a 2-ply sheet) so as to keep it covered but protected from any debris falling into the liquid, but also let in as much air as possible. I took my hand mixer and frothed it up real good (till it turned white from all the bubbles), then used the outside screw portion of the mason jar cap with that paper towel for the center and screwed it onto the jar and set it below my window on top of my desk where the heat of my big 20" IBM CRT monitor sitting next to it might also influence the mix, at least some. I'll give it a good mix each day and see what transpires.

Howdy, 52. Any updates, initial perceptions, on your oxidation experiment?

 

[52anddone]

Yup, my oxidation experiment went just as you and others predicted, added pepperiness. I went 7 days with my test bottle uncapped and a coffee filter covering the jar, 2 days (only about 9-10 hours all together though) in sunlight. I did a side by side test with my normal Nic and realized a noticeable difference, not a lot, but I could tell a difference none the less, more days in the sun would cure that though, I am sure. Further experimentation is needed here to zero in on what it will be that I like the best though. Now that I know that it works, I might be able to adjust for if/when ECX decides to do a slight change to their Nic recipe so I can keep it just the way I like it, looks like I'm making myself more work. Oh well, I'm not afraid of work, never have been.

Sorry about not getting back here and reporting on my findings, I've been stocking up on the last of the New Hohmtech devices I can find that are still for sale (Slice & G2's), and trying out a new Tobacco, FlavorsExpress Tobacco Additive from ECX @ 1% in a 10mg/ml Nic base, which goes really nicely with their ECX Nic BTW.

 

[Dubminer]

For those who like Nude Nicotine i just heard they have slashed all their prices. Apparently due to expanding their production site.

 

[chanelvaps]

Naturally they did this after I just purchased 2 LTRS of NicSelect (I already have at least 1 LTR in freezer)

 

[Mowgli]

Naturally they did this after I just purchased 2 LTRS of NicSelect (I already have at least 1 LTR in freezer)

I put another 2L of VT TH in my deep freeze last week.
I might get another gallon of NN @ $200 though.
Stocking to CYA is great.
Covering family and friends' could be necessary.
Hero-ing is hard but somebody's gotta do it.

 

[Dubminer]

Yes now it is a competitive price. I love Nude nicotine but think Heartlands ultra premium and vaperstek chemnovatic is at least on par. Now they are all priced around the same if you factor in shipping. This surprises me, i thought prices would go up not down. Vaperstek also recently slashed their prices. My guess is sales are not what was anticipated.

 

[Vapntime]

Naturally they did this after I just purchased 2 LTRS of NicSelect (I already have at least 1 LTR in freezer)

Don't worry NicSelect is better on paper and in my mouth

 

[chanelvaps]

Don't worry NicSelect is better on paper and in my mouth

I kinda think so too!

 

[Mowgli]

Just saw this.

I think your freezer should be just fine at -18C. This is about 0 F, and cooler than my freezer (10F). I have only limited data from freezing a VG-nic juice with 20% water, from years ago, but it did not separate or have solid ice in it...it just got thicker. It was only one attempt at this, but it makes sense to me from a chemistry view: through cross H-bonds, the water solvates completely with the VG, and cannot recombine back into pure water with cold.

As for those that are obsessed with purging headspace air from the stored bottle with a gas like Ar, let's do a little calculation. Let's assume 4 mL of headspace in a bottle of nic. If O2 is 25% of the air (rough estimate) that is 1 mL of O2. We will ignore vapor pressure of VG or water. If we assume 1 atm pressure and 25 C (298K), we can use standard PV=nRT high school chemistry math, where n is moles, and R is 0.0821L-atm/mol-K. So 0.001L O2 is

0.001L x 1 atm/(0.0821L-atom/mol-K * 298K) = 4.08x10^-5 moles of O2.

If one mole of O2 reacts with one mole of nicotine (it is in fact a 1:1 molar ratio in the reaction), then 4.08x10^-5 moles of nicotine will react if all that O2 reacts. Molar mass of nicotine is 166.22 g/mole, so

4.08x10^-5 moles nic x 166.22g/mole x 1000 mg/g = 6.8 mg of nic oxidizing if ALL the O2 in 4 mL headspace reacts.

I think I may have overstated the importance of O2 from added water some years ago here. O2 solubility in water at room temp and 1 atm is about 8 mg/L (0.008g/L). Suppose we add 20% water to 100 mg VG-nic, and we are storing 50 mL of the mixed base in a glass bottle. mg of nic that will oxidize if all the O2 reacts from the added water (10 mL) will be

0.008 g O2/L * 0.010L * 1mole/32g * 1mole nic/1 mole O2 * 166.22 g/mol * 1000 mg/g = 0.4 mg nic oxidized if all the O2 in the water reacts with nic. Less than 1 mg.

O2 solubility in VG is about 2 mg/L. In our 50 mL bottle of VG-nic with 20% water, we have 40 mL of VG (about, there is nic too, but to make it simple). This will lead to oxidation of nic of:

0.002 g O2/L * 0.040L * 1mole/32g * 1mole nic/1 mole O2 * 166.22 g/mol * 1000 mg/g = 0.4 mg nic oxidized if all the O2 in the VG reacts. Same amount as from the 10 mL added water. O2 solubility in PG is about the same as in VG.

Thus, if no O2 gets into the VG-nic from outside, the intrinsic O2 present in the headspace, 20% water and VG will oxidize less than 8 mg of nic total in a 50 mL bottle with 4 mL headspace. Might be enough to give a very slight yellow, but most probably not enough to detect in a DIY e-liquid made from it. And even at room temp, this will take some time.

You cannot remove this intrinsic O2. But it is certainly not enough to be worried about even if it all reacts. Most plastics we use are fairly porous to O2 transport through it from the atmosphere, but while glass is virtually impervious to O2, the plastic caps are not, although they are better than typical dropper bottle plastic (LDPE). This is why even at room temperature, VG-nic in sealed glass bottles lasts a long time without significant coloration. But probably not years. So we cool the nic to slow any reaction from O2 invading through the cap to almost zero. Shrink wrap or electrical tape around the cap might help some, but maybe not much. I don't know, but I don't do this myself.

I store undiluted VG-nic mostly at 100 mg/mL for space reasons, and only in glass. For my VG-nics stored cold after 6.5 years there has been no change. I don't know why one batch of PG-nic I had years ago oxidized to deep yellow-orange after about a year, but to be honest it was not as pure as the nic we generally use today, and might have been oxidized somewhat upon getting it (2009 Totally Wicked Red Label). It was in a deep amber glass 30 mL dropper bottle (rubber surrounding) with child-proof cap that might not have been good at keeping O2 out. Rubber is not good at blocking O2 transport. Other purer PG-nic I have had in better sealed glass did fine for the couple of years I stored it. I haven't had PG-nic in my possession as long as my VG-nic, since I don't vape PG-nic. But others here that have stored pure PG-nic have had good results for multiple years in glass in the freezer.

Conclusion: no matter the DIY-nic you get, get it into well-sealed glass, give a bit of headspace for possible expansion (VG/PG expands with heat), put it in the freezer, and worry about it no more.

From May 18, 2016

Bump for anyone wondering how much their properly stored nicotine will oxidize.

Easy answer = an insignificant amount as far as vaping is concerned.

 

[Mactavish]

I put another 2L of VT TH in my deep freeze last week.
I might get another gallon of NN @ $200 though.
Stocking to CYA is great.
Covering family and friends' could be necessary.
Hero-ing is hard but somebody's gotta do it.

All my concentrated Nic, is from Nude Nicotine, lots of bottles properly stored in glass bottles with polycone caps, very little air space. Even bought some of their long term storage Nic when not long ago we didn’t know if a real ban might occur. However, I enjoy their “smooth salts” even more. NN does not disappoint!

 

[Rossum]

From May 18, 2016
Bump for anyone wondering how much their properly stored nicotine will oxidize.
Easy answer = an insignificant amount as far as vaping is concerned.

I agree, if "properly stored" means "in the freezer".
But left at room temperature, it will change to more than just a "slight yellow".
Nic Base Storage: Freezer vs. Room Temp Experiment

 

[Mactavish]

In the FREEZER! No room for FOOD!