Obama's position on e-cigs ?

[ecofriendy-smoking]

Both as President of the United States and an actual smoker, what is Obama's official position on E-cigs? Has he ever addressed this issue?

 

[Cool_Breeze]

It's been recently reported that the President's doctor has indicated that Mr. Obama is 'tobacco free' after his annual physical. As well, a statement attributed to Michelle Obama indicated the President quit smoking in March of 2010. There is a chance that the White House may issue something regarding e-cigs per the recent petition that was submitted.
https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitio...gov&utm_medium=shorturl&utm_campaign=shorturl

Otherwise, here is a news article in the New York Times on e-cigs.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/08/s...nlikely-critics.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

 

[gheebee]

I'm sure that if you asked him what his position was he'd give you a long winded monologue that wouldn't answer your question, just like pretty much any other politician would do.

 

[ecofriendy-smoking]

That was an interesting Times article. I agree that it's surprising to see the more liberal forces being against this healthier alternative.

If you keep the comparisons apples to apples, ecigs will come out smelling like a rose. That does not seem to be the case with many of these groups. And speaking of apples, those same people should be fighting to take apple juice off the shelves since trace amounts of arsenic have been found in it . (but obviously not enough to hurt anyone)

 

[Thulium]

That was an interesting Times article. I agree that it's surprising to see the more liberal forces being against this healthier alternative.

If you keep the comparisons apples to apples, ecigs will come out smelling like a rose. That does not seem to be the case with many of these groups. And speaking of apples, those same people should be fighting to take apple juice off the shelves since trace amounts of arsenic have been found in it . (but obviously not enough to hurt anyone)

Actually, comparing apples to e-cigs: According to Dr. Oz's research, apple juice frequently contains significantly more than the FDA allowable levels of arsenic for drinking water, but there is no such limit on apple juice. Meanwhile, the trace amounts of tobacco-related impurities the FDA detected in some e-cig cartridges was LESS than the allowable amounts in FDA approved MEDICINES.

 

[Cool_Breeze]

That was an interesting Times article. I agree that it's surprising to see the more liberal forces being against this healthier alternative.

A little speculation, if I may...

During the Clinton Administration the hammer really came down on tobacco. I think now we have had two rounds of Federal and two of State suites and/or major tax programs inplimented. No doubt a lot of the funds from those efforts have gone to support anti-tobacco programs. With the programs come administrators. The administrators' funding may be tied to the existance of anti-tobacco programs. Seemingly, as long as tobacco remains a threat, administrators might feel secure in their positions. Something seen as making the threat of tobacco less significant might be seen as a threat to the longevity and significance of various programs and the power and longevity of administrators. It is in their interests to see anything tied to tobacco as an evil.

 

[Thulium]

A little speculation, if I may...

During the Clinton Administration the hammer really came down on tobacco. I think now we have had two rounds of Federal and two of State suites and/or major tax programs inplimented. No doubt a lot of the funds from those efforts have gone to support anti-tobacco programs. With the programs come administrators. The administrators' funding may be tied to the existance of anti-tobacco programs. Seemingly, as long as tobacco remains a threat, administrators might feel secure in their positions. Something seen as making the threat of tobacco less significant might be seen as a threat to the longevity and significance of various programs and the power and longevity of administrators. It is in their interests to see anything tied to tobacco as an evil.

The same sort of ties that the right has to Military & Industrial interests, the left has with Healthcare & Pharmaceutical interests. Didn't you catch the "liberal" bent in MASH and Catch-22? Not a coincidence.

 

[windwalker]

Recently, the Royal College of Physicians issued an opinion that: "Opposition to this family of technology is both Immoral and Unethical"

What will Obama do?

It's like this: He needs a villain, because he needs re-election. He can't make the FDA the villain because it presides over nearly 50% of the GDP. Simultaneously, 75% of Americans are buying into the whole "Tobacco is a Terrorist out to Kill our Children" spiel, so he can't take any position to support anything which can be used to support tobacco or he looses popular support.

Meanwhile, the Pharmaceutical Industry wants this to become a Tobacco Product in the eyes of the populace so that they can lump it together in the 'Tobacco Hate Campaign'.

So, Obama's position must serve his backers, but at the same time it must get him votes and popular support. So he has to balance his position with a villain. In modern times, Tobacco has proved to be a politically safe villain.

For us, we all must be vocal and active - allowing and encouraging E-Cigs & Tobacco Vapor to join the war on tobacco.

We've got Harvard, Boston University of Medicine, The Journal of Public Health, The American Council on Science and Health, The American Association of Public Health Physicians, The Royal College of Physicians, Forbes, The Washington Post, and now the New York Times all working together to popularize this position: "The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco"

This is our catch phrase: "The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco" with that sentiment, the FDA stands to our side and begins to offer support. In this way, the politicians get to keep their 'anti-tobacco terror campaign' alive and well, while using our interests to support theirs.

It's homeopathy - using tobacco to attack tobacco, and with the press and population already getting behind the concept, Obama will begin saying it too...

"'The E-cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco' anyone who opposes the e-cig is
supporting the terror and havoc tobacco is wreaking on our society."
​

This correctly will become the official position of most politicians over the next 24 months.

 

[rothenbj]

A little speculation, if I may...

During the Clinton Administration the hammer really came down on tobacco......

Maybe that's why slick Willie found other uses for cigars.

 

[rothenbj]

"The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco"

First you need to recognize that the issue should not be tobacco, it should be smoking. Second it should not be a war, it should be education and honesty from those that have chosen to make this a war.

The war that the ANTZ have initiated has eliminated all the weak opponents. Now you have only the strong inveterate smoker to contend with. You are not going to convince them to quit by bullying, you may with viable, appealing alternatives. They exist today and will probably get better in the future but those that say they are concerned with public health need to actually show it.

The real question is, are they?

 

[windwalker]

@Rothenbj -

It's great points you make, and I feel Like I want to clarify myself.

My career is in Politics and Legislature, and I've got a 96% win rate across 23 pieces of legislation successfully passed. This is because I understand that in order to actually get things done, you need to create situations where your opposition is highly likely to support your position.

Meaning, Lawrence Deyton, Director of the FDA Center for Tobacco Products is the one who publicly declared 'War on Tobacco'. It's not my term, I didn't create it, and I don't like it - but what is done is done.

When you understand that the FDA oversees some 30% to 50% of the GDP, you also understand they must be honored and respected as an opponent - given the chance to gracefully save face and become supporters, even proponents of the e-cig industry without any humiliation or public disregard.

The phrase: "The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco" is deliberately designed to give legislators and politicians (who don't actually care about the issue) the chance to support our cause while furthering their own.

The use of this phrase places the 'Anti E-Cig' advocates in direct opposition to public health, stated policy, and the FDA's war on tobacco. ie: The FDA has declared War on Tobacco, and the E-cig is their #1 weapon in that war. This creates a situation where they can gain face and public support by supporting our cause.

 

[Vocalek]

Windwalker: We understand what you are saying, and your slogan might indeed be a little easier for the ANTZ to swallow than making them own up to the truth of the situation.

They have lost sight of the true goal -- saving lives.

They started out with that goal in mind, but then they slipped into referring to the problem as "smoking". It's not smoking that's the problem. It's the health consequences of smoking that's the problem.

Did you know that regular cigar and pipe smokers who use the products in the recommended way (not inhaling) have only 50% of the negative health consequeces of cigarette smoking?

J. A. Bell and D. H. Laing. Statistical analysis of mortality rates of cigarette, pipe and cigar smokers. Can Med Assoc J. 1969 May 3; 100(17): 806–810. Complete text: Statistical analysis of mortality rates of cigarette, pipe and cigar smokers.​

Next, they sidled into changing the name of the problem to "tobacco". "No smoking" morphed into "No tobacco". "Smoke free zones" morphed into "tobacco free zones." Now, it seems that the ultimate problem, in their minds, is nicotine.

There are a growing number of employers that refuse to hire people who test positive for a biomarker of nicotine. They don't care if the cotinine in your urine came from direct inhalation of smoke, from exposure to second-hand smoke, from use of a 99% less hazardous smokeless tobacco product, or from pharmaceutical nicotine products such as the patch, gum, lozenges, or prescription inhalers.

One of their strategies, the "denormalization of smoking," has turned into the "denormalization of tobacco users" and/or the "denormalization of any person with nicotine in their system."

E-cigs are, indeed, a wonderful weapon against smoking-related disease and death.

But low-nitrosamine smokeless tobacco products such as snus and disssolvables are equally effective weapons. Most everything we know about the safety of using nicoitne when separated from the health consequences of inhaling smoke comes from decades of research on smokers in Sweden who switched to snus.

For some background on all this, take a look at these web-sites:

Casaa.org - Harm Reduction
Tobaccoharmreduction.org
For Smokers Only

We could get behind a slogan that does not take some of the potential solutions and name them as the problem. How about:

"The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War Against Smoking-Related Disease and Death."

If that's too much of a mouthful, we could shorten it to:

"The E-cig is our #1 Weapon Against SRD&D"

Even shorter:

Quit or Die is a Lie
E-Cigs Save Lives

 

[MattZuke]

Quit or Die is a Lie
E-Cigs Save Lives

Yeah, I feel cheated I was never informed about the objective risks of smokeless tobacco, and it's really easy equation to work out.

25% of the population smokes. If a product is 75% less harmful, and this results in a maximum 4x increase, it's a net neutral.
If it's a 90% reduction in harm, again adopted by 100% of the population, it's a 30% net win.

And the objective evidence puts e-cigs well above 98-99%

 

[windwalker]

@Vocalek -

As always I love your comments and thought process and I truly appreciate you and the active role you are playing in this movement / campaign. It's people like you and the work you do that is genuinely saving lives.

Now, your rewording:

"The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War Against Smoking-Related Disease and Death."

...it is superior to mine in so many ways I won't even begin to list them. It also reduces to "...against smoking" cleanly.

It has the potential of working for both side of the issue as the common ground is established. We are looking for a long term stable vistory here, so if we can establish an integral alliance with our opposition, it furthers our cause immeasurably (if we can become indispensable to their cause, their interests will serve to protect our industry - it is tricky, but it is possible).

Your wording of the catch-phrase truly holds the potential to be viable for both the ANTZ and the Advocates to come together and establish common ground. (the ANTZ are free to promote the 0mg nic aspect of our industry "The Zero and Out" Campaign as a gateway to abstinence)

Interestingly enough - it would be statistically valid to say: "The E-cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Cancer" but that's a whole other topic, and we need to take baby steps right now while things are so volatile.

Conceptual Piece:

Politician -

Make no mistake my friends, we are at war with smoking, and it is a war that has claimed more lives and created more suffering than World War I and World War II combined. Since 1945, over 115 million people worldwide have died in this war with Smoking.

It is a war that attacks our children while they are young and impressionable, slowly consuming them from the inside out. As we watch, helpless to make it stop.

We must make use of every tool available to win this war, and reclaim the health and safety of our children.
and let us be clear, every person we can help stop Smoking Traditional Cigarettes is a person whose life we have forever changed. Of course, regulations have increased to prevent new smokers from starting, but it is not enough to leave stranded the 45 million Americans currently waging this war with their lives and lungs.

But let us not attack the farmer or merchant of tobacco for trying to make a living selling products the consumers demand. And let us not attack a plant on which much of our interstate commerce has been based.
We must wage war on Smoking, without destroying jobs in the process.

Instead, let us seek to create alternatives that are More Satisfying, More Desirable, and Radically Safer
than traditional smoking.

I feel proud, and honored to announce that our state is the first state in the union to
establish Regulatory Guidelines that will forever change this war against Smoking Related Disease and Death.

For the first time, we now have a tool that is 3 times more effective in helping people quit, and 5 times safer than any other quit smoking device ever conceived.
It is less expensive, and we have 9 years of data from around the world showing that this form of tobacco is 99.9% safer than traditional smoking, with over 6 million users worldwide reporting it to be MORE DESIRABLE AND SATISFYING than smoking.

Ladies and Gentlemen I am proud to introduce to you today, the first FDA approved for retail sale Electronic Cigarette.
We believe, wholehearted that this E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the war on Smoking Related Disease and Death."

Wishful thinking? Or a financial inevitability?

I will change the literature I'm working with to carry the new catch phrase:

"The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War Against Smoking-Related Disease and Death."

or, variably:

"The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War Against Smoking."

Thanks for the great feedback and support!
I also want to add, that I think: "E-Cigs Save Lives" ...is totally viable for large scale campaign collateral and advocacy (bumper stickers, buttons, mugs, t-shirts, etc.)

 

[Thulium]

Thanks for the great feedback and support!
I also want to add, that I think: "E-Cigs Save Lives" ...is totally viable for large scale campaign collateral and advocacy (bumper stickers, buttons, mugs, t-shirts, etc.)

I also like "E-cigs Prevent Forest Fires"

...and here's a T-shirt design I've been working on:

 

[LukeTheDuke]

I'm sure that if you asked him what his position was he'd give you a long winded monologue that wouldn't answer your question, just like pretty much any other politician would do.

iam with you, amen brother! well said


politicians +president=puppetshow x corporations=puppetmasters

 

[Vocalek]

I did the math, based on the a total adult population of 312,394,000. The CDC tellsus that the current death-toll is 442,083. If all smokers switched to a product that was 90% safer, and (horrors) all non-smokers took up use of the product, we would still be ahead. There would be only 270,799 deaths. And if the product that everybody started using was 99% safer, the death rate would drop to a mere 27,080.

Total Annual Deaths 442,083 270,799 27,080

Remember, the above assumes that all non-smokers take up use of the product. If none did,
the hypothetical deaths would be 39K at 90% safer, and under 4K at 99% safer.

All Smokers Switch 39,268 3,927

 

[Nicko]

I did the math, based on the a total adult population of 312,394,000. The CDC tellsus that the current death-toll is 442,083. If all smokers switched to a product that was 90% safer, and (horrors) all non-smokers took up use of the product, we would still be ahead. There would be only 270,799 deaths. And if the product that everybody started using was 99% safer, the death rate would drop to a mere 27,080.

Total Annual Deaths 442,083 270,799 27,080

Remember, the above assumes that all non-smokers take up use of the product. If none did,
the hypothetical deaths would be 39K at 90% safer, and under 4K at 99% safer.

All Smokers Switch 39,268 3,927

Thanks for that. And I bet it didn't take long to do the math. This kind of common sense logic is noticeably absent within the anti-smoking movement. Although, we all know they are not anti-smoking at all. They are pro-profit.

 

[ecofriendy-smoking]

This was a pretty impressive reference from Windwalker::

"We've got Harvard, Boston University of Medicine, The Journal of Public Health, The American Council on Science and Health, The American Association of Public Health Physicians, The Royal College of Physicians, Forbes, The Washington Post, and now the New York Times all working together to popularize this position: "The E-Cig is our #1 Weapon in the War on Tobacco"

Is there any place , pssobly even on thnis board, where we can access the collection of those studies/articles to tweet and facebook around to the general population?

 

[Vocalek]

Here is the most recent update to CASAA's "Electronic Cigarette Research" list. Hope this helps.

View attachment Electronic-Cigarette-Research.pdf

This is a link to the Royal College of Physicians 2007 report. This is a very scientific report with explanations of why smokers have such difficulty quitting and promoting the concept of providing less hazardous sources of nicotine for those who can't quit.

http://www.tobaccoprogram.org/pdf/4fc74817-64c5-4105-951e-38239b09c5db.pdf