Official DNA 40 introduction

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DejayRezme

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    I want to make you aware of my Vapor Flask V2.5 DNA40 fiasco.

    Oh man so sorry to hear! But I am curious. Did you put in new batteries and after all this the display got glitched? Does it still work?

    I would expect the display to be fried but without some intense burning / flames / gas I'd think the chip should still be ok.
     

    rusirius

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    I'd say, the best reverse battery protection in the World is a century old idea to have the positive end nipple tipped. But Vapor Flask should at least, have installed a diode that would allow the current flow in only one direction between two batteries. IMHO
    Yes, with a dual parallel mod flipping one battery results in a direct short. The board should be fine though. A simple diode is no good for reverse battery protection because you have a .7V drop across it. You could do it with a mosfet and get it down to a few millivolts though.
     
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    rusirius

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    The diode trick works and so does using a diode bridge then you can plug the batteries in any direction and the unit will still work. The problem here is we are trying to get all the voltage and current that the battery can provide. adding a single diode drops the voltage supplied by one bat by 0.7 volts and the bridge circuit drops the total voltage by 1.4 volts.

    Anyway your board may still be OK just dead-ish batteries.
    That's why I use fets for reverse polarity. No bridge, but you can get voltage drop down to 3 or 4 millivolts.
     

    HolmanGT

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    That's why I use fets for reverse polarity. No bridge, but you can get voltage drop down to 3 or 4 millivolts.

    rusirius,

    Ah Grasshopper it is hard to keep good German engineering down. :)

    Actually I think that is how most reverse bat protection is implemented. A circuit to test polarity and when that circuit decides everything is OK it turns the FET on which puts power to the controller board.
     

    TheKiwi

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    Boy oh boy - Kiwi, You must have brass Gazongas to give the reverse bat protection a try after all the problems you had with your first VF. :ohmy:

    By the way if you put the batteries in one at a time and look at the display before putting in the second battery you should also be OK even with the V.F. Then you are only testing the reverse polarity protection of the DNA40 and not the max current flow between to 35 amp batteries. :facepalm:

    Ha. FOR SCIENCE. That said I didn't dare do it for the flask. I'm pretty sure if you put both batts the wrong way round it will be fine but THESE ARE BALLS OF BRASS. not titanium or steel. Hehe


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    KTMRider

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    AMDTrucking

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    Oh man so sorry to hear! But I am curious. Did you put in new batteries and after all this the display got glitched? Does it still work?

    I would expect the display to be fried but without some intense burning / flames / gas I'd think the chip should still be ok.

    It still works, only uses one battery, the other battery is not being used. I think the wire that connects two batteries together has burnet out like a fuse.
     

    AMDTrucking

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    Surrounded by EEs. HA! Loving it! :) What a friggin convergence of knowledge!

    @AMD - I'm a little embarrassed that I didn't ask you this in my first post /sigh Are you OK physically? I hope. I wish. That's the #1 issue IMHO.

    Thank you, I'm fine. I took the battery out as fast as I could.
     
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    rusirius

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    rusirius,

    Ah Grasshopper it is hard to keep good German engineering down. :)

    Actually I think that is how most reverse bat protection is implemented. A circuit to test polarity and when that circuit decides everything is OK it turns the FET on which puts power to the controller board.
    Actually no test circuit needed. With a p channel you can wire the drain and gate across the battery and use the source to feed the positive side of the load (gate and negative side of the load wired together to the negative of the battery). Or flip it and use an n channel. When the battery is right the gate will be pulled high relative to the source and turn on, if it's backward it'll turn off and protect the load. At our voltages an Si4838DY works perfect. At 2V it's only .003 ohm and handles 60 amps. :)
     

    HolmanGT

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    Actually no test circuit needed. With a p channel you can wire the drain and gate across the battery and use the source to feed the positive side of the load (gate and negative side of the load wired together to the negative of the battery). Or flip it and use an n channel. When the battery is right the gate will be pulled high relative to the source and turn on, if it's backward it'll turn off and protect the load. At our voltages an Si4838DY works perfect. At 2V it's only .003 ohm and handles 60 amps. :)

    Ah... it looks like the Grasshopper is on the other side this time. I have noted your instructions in my stash book of secret tricks. Thanks.
     

    TheKiwi

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    ..... Holy crap..... The TP is truly awesome.

    I know we all know how it's supposed to prevent dry hits conceptually, but I've never actually experienced the awesomeness of it until a few mins ago.

    There I was watching tv and puffing along and suddenly go vapor. Flask kept telling me tenperature protected and my first instinct was damn it! It's being weird again :mad:

    After messing with it for a bit it finally dawned on me to look at my tank. BAM. dry as a bone

    26c96aa3448b176cf2a8c239a2e270d3.jpg


    c4c4c6feb5b53b84449ac4e49d53dda1.jpg


    THIS CHIP SAVED ME FOR THE EXTREME BURNING OF MY THROAAAAAAT! :O


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    AMDTrucking

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    Dam# the burnt fingers!!! God Truck Drivers are tough.

    Are you going to send it in to get it fixed or do the usual AMD refurbishing job?

    I'm going to RMA it back to Vapor Flask if they will honor the warranty.

    Because I just received a Facebook PM from Charlie Causs of Vapor Flask saying:

    "In response to your post, I'm not sure where we've claimed reverse battery protection. We actually still have pictures showing how to correctly insert the batteries on our packaging card"

    Another word, he is saying that $350.00 Vapor Flask does NOT have Reverse Battery Protection.
     

    jazzvaper

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    I'm going to RMA it back to Vapor Flask if they will honor the warranty.

    Because I just received a Facebook PM from Charlie Causs of Vapor Flask saying:

    "In response to your post, I'm not sure where we've claimed reverse battery protection. We actually still have pictures showing how to correctly insert the batteries on our packaging card"

    Another word, he is saying that $350.00 Vapor Flask does NOT have Reverse Battery Protection.

    This is very unfortunate...and the price we pay for participating in a still nascent commercial space. :facepalm: VS was no better.

    After very specifically detailing their reverse polarity "problem" with the rDNA 30 (how their battery position invites reverse polarity relative to other mods...pointing out the warning VF provides, & etc.) they declined a free fix...then added a warning to their web site, but not their insert card--where both should have been there from the get go. In any other commercial space a law suit would have been instantaneous, the trivial amount of cash involved. notwithstanding.

    Okay!, I learned my lesson; I'll NEVER do THAT again.
     

    HolmanGT

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    I'm going to RMA it back to Vapor Flask if they will honor the warranty.

    Because I just received a Facebook PM from Charlie Causs of Vapor Flask saying:

    "In response to your post, I'm not sure where we've claimed reverse battery protection. We actually still have pictures showing how to correctly insert the batteries on our packaging card"

    Another word, he is saying that $350.00 Vapor Flask does NOT have Reverse Battery Protection.


    AMD, your saying they read the mail on this thread? Oh-God I must be on their poop list for sure.
     

    tchavei

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    Anybody can make a mistake but a $350 mod should have every bell and whistle installed to protect the user and give the ultimate vaping experience instead you give a hefty profit margin to the manufacturer.

    This should be a BMW or Mercedes not a Ferrari or Lamborgini :/

    Regards
    Tony

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    KGie

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    This is very unfortunate...and the price we pay for participating in a still nascent commercial space. :facepalm: VS was no better.

    After very specifically detailing their reverse polarity "problem" with the rDNA 30 (how their battery position invites reverse polarity relative to other mods...pointing out the warning VF provides, & etc.) they declined a free fix...then added a warning to their web site, but not their insert card--where both should have been there from the get go. In any other commercial space a law suit would have been instantaneous, the trivial amount of cash involved. notwithstanding.

    Okay!, I learned my lesson; I'll NEVER do THAT again.

    If this had happened to me, "THAT" to never do again would be ordering from Vapor Flask. Or in my case, in the first place. What century is this? And they can't be bothered with at least putting in a couple of fuses??? Hard to believe.
     

    TyCreek

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    I've one DNA40 board working absolutely great and I'm quite thankful!
    - 1st fully installed and would sometimes work for an hour without visual issue. Even with some glitches I liked it more than the 30 (used it for over a week with various atties and dozens of coils).
    + 2nd works perfect so far (didn't have silicone) and hasn't had so much as a hiccup for over a week of solid use with many different atties and coil combinations (nickel, titanium, hybrids, kanthal).
    - 3rd posted picture above screen issues
    - 4th screen issues on first or second hit 2 different coils and didn't even boot right sometimes
    eEKRJJX.jpg


    - 5th screen issues right away so why mess with it?
    xnLFt3g.jpg
     

    WeirdWillie

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    Rossum

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    The 0.7 volt drop doesn't work that way. It is more of a forward conduction threshold that subtracts from the applied voltage i.e. 4.2 - 0.7 = 3.5 volts supplied from the battery. The only thing that dissipates heat in the forward direction it the conducting resistance of the diode which is generally pretty low. I am being too lazy to look it up right now but it would not be anywhere near 14 watts with a good quality diode which after you exceed the 0.7 volt threshold would have a resistance in the milli-ohm range.
    If it doesn't work that way, where does the energy go? To make the math easy, let's say you had a 1.7V DC source. You put a diode with a 0.7V drop in series with a 1 ohm resistor as a load across this source. Your source is putting out 1A at 1.7V -- that's 1.7 watts. The resistor sees 1.0V and therefore dissipates 1.0 watts. So where did the other 0.7 watts go? If it's not being dissipated in the diode, it has vanished. Energy does not vanish.
     
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