Official ProVari Radius Thread

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ENAUD

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The fear is that it has the potential to really create some flame wars because as we all know how WE are attached to our devices... the same goes for the lovers of the import stuff... I mean, They REALLY want to believe that a watt on the screen = a watt on the coil. And some of them think they have the tools to argue. It does get pretty tiresome when they REALLY believe those numbers are true. AND when they REALLY believe their math actually means what they think it does... It may be better saved for a less "tumultuous" time.
You make a valid point, a product release thread should be fun for all, and this one seems to be ...Epic :)
 

zapped

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..so many people Vape for 8 minutes continuously...at most 5-10 second pulls? So your magical 8 minutes you love to throw around would easily be a few hours of average vaping. Again, someone who doesn't Vape at high power blasting what they don't understand.

I think your definition of "average vaping" differs considerably from the norm, and Im basing that off of what Ive seen from numerous vaping conventions and with other vapers out in the wild.

Everybody likes to think that theyre the average, or the exception depending on circumstance, and they tend to judge things from their own perspectives but thats not really practical in real life. . ..or in this situation.

Using you own numbers, a 10 second pull nets you 46 pulls total, assuming an eight minute run time.

Thats a REALLY small number spread out over the course of a few hours. No way that would last me an 8 hour work day.....or even 2 hours if I was drinking.

Cloud chasers remind me of hot rodders.Your car might go fast, be flashy as hell and have lots of muscle but it drinks gas like crazy, costs a fortune in maintenance and is barely even street legal. Nor is it very practical for day to day or long term use.

I'll stick to my E30 BMW thanks.
 
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Zen~

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You make a valid point, a product release thread should be fun for all, and this one seems to be ...Epic :)
Back in school we had a little saying.... "It's not REALLY a party until something gets broken" so maybe, just maybe, tonights events will count as something getting broken, and the party is about to begin...

VAPE 360... WE NEED MORE INFO... see what happens when you DENY us?
 

JohnD0406

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And in the audio world... ESPECIALLY car audio... the whole idea of making lower impedance speakers means MORE POWER to people that don't understand that while you do HAVE double the power, the load you just created REQUIRES double the power, so you have not increased your output by a single DB, AND you messed up the damping of the whole kit and kaboodle... AND by the way, that amp doesn't REALLY double as you halve the resistance, because the power supply is going soft on you, AND for added measure, now it's clipping... Fun isn't it?

Unless it's a Carver, sucking power right from the wall, dimming the lights with the beat ;) Kidding...

Yep, even the most knowledgeable audiophiles I run into don't REALLY understand impedance curves/graphs, and how it varies based on frequency. Start talking about damping factors and watch their heads spin. Yet they hear my (admittedly very expensive) DIY system and ask how I got the midbass so clear. Ah well, "audiophiles" scare me anyway - too many horror stories, and wrong thread to go into it.

Vape360 - really gonna make us wait 'till Friday? We can go all kinds of off topic by then! :p
 

USMCotaku

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There are very few people that understand that, and it's completely true.

I have tested SO many imported boxes for output, and they are often only capable of as LITTLE as 50% of their rated output. Some do better than others, but very few that claim to be 50 watts actually are, and there are 75 watt Asian box mods that don't even put out 38 watts into a real load.

People believe what they read on the screen as being the actual power that is being delivered, and in SO many cases it's not true at all.

And the Steam Engine site can be used to verify the lie, because they just input the numbers on the screen, which of course will sum to the screen numbers.

I know that my P3 at 20 watts (where I only have vaped it "for fun") with a Kanger Subtank, actually hit HARDER than an Invader Mini at 35 watts.

I should pull some of the data we recorded in the shop and post it just for fun one of these days.
And that's why my invader mini sits unused.........
Thought it would be my indestructible barn mod......and it is rugged, but the vape?.......meh

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
 

JohnD0406

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Using you own numbers, a 10 second pull nets you 46 pulls total, assuming an eight minute run time.

I know you weren't replying to me, but at 60W, nobody is going to be taking 10-second pulls. You need too much airflow at that power, otherwise you'll be in for a nasty burnt surprise, so 2-3 seconds is all your lungs can handle. Depending on your vaping style, that could last all day (though most high-power mods will not let you maintain that wattage as the battery drains, so you'd want to charge it throughout the day, just like a mechanical).
 

jwbnyc

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I have to say, besides the whole set it and forget it safety thing, the main reason I went ProVari is the accuracy.

I'm not dissing any mods, but I did notice that none of them did what they said they were doing, except the M Class. And I don't really know what the M Class does beyond it's mid range.. I think it is a pretty accurate mod though.

Everything else has been all over the place.

The MVP is pretty good, but it does drop off towards the end of a charge.
 

JohnD0406

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I have to say, besides the whole set it and forget it safety thing, the main reason I went ProVari is the accuracy.

ProVari 2.5 was my first real mod. I went with it because I'd heard great things about ProVape, I liked the feel of it (didn't feel cheap like other plastic mods 'competing' with it), and the design was great. I don't think I was considering accuracy back then - probably didn't think it would be an issue (and maybe it wasn't back then, but it certainly is now).

I'm not dissing any mods, but I did notice that none of them did what they said they were doing, except the M Class. And I don't really know what the M Class does beyond it's mid range.. I think it is a pretty accurate mod though.

IIRC, PBusardo did a review on the M-class, and it scored very well (except with some higher resistance atty's at high wattage, which would be a little silly to do anyway).

The MVP is pretty good, but it does drop off towards the end of a charge.

I would expect that, both intentionally (for safety) and unintentionally (for poor design).
 
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zapped

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I know you weren't replying to me, but at 60W, nobody is going to be taking 10-second pulls. You need too much airflow at that power, otherwise you'll be in for a nasty burnt surprise, so 2-3 seconds is all your lungs can handle. Depending on your vaping style, that could last all day (though most high-power mods will not let you maintain that wattage as the battery drains, so you'd want to charge it throughout the day, just like a mechanical).

I take it you mean lung capacity? Most of the cloud chasers Ive seen dont do a real lung inhale to start with.

It looks to me like most of it is wasted and is mainly just for show.

One of the positives to a lot of us in regards to vaping is the savings versus the cost of cigarettes.

A lot of that is negated when youre going through juice faster than a glutton gorging themselves at an all you can eat buffet.
 

USMCotaku

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I take it you mean lung capacity? Most of the cloud chasers Ive seen dont do a real lung inhale to start with.

It looks to me like most of it is wasted and is mainly just for show.

One of the positives to a lot of us in regards to vaping is the savings versus the cost of cigarettes.

A lot of that is negated when youre going through juice faster than a glutton gorging themselves at an all you can eat buffet.
Unless you make your own for pennies on the dollar ;)

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
 

Zen~

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Cloud chasers remind me of hot rodders.Your car might go fast and have lots of muscle but it drinks gas like crazy and is barely even street legal. Nor is it very practical for day to day use.

I often compare High Power vaping to Hot Rodding. I did that the other night and I still feel it applies.

Back in the 50's, it was really the first time in history where cars were affordable enough to be anything but a luxury for most... And the Hot Rodder/ tinkerer had a great hobby of "souping them up".

But there really wasn't any place to race them... so they street raced. And people died at dead mans curve.

Then law makers set speed limits, there WAS a time in this country when there wasn't such a thing. Once limits were set, then fines could happen. Slowed things down... a bit.

Now we have drag strips where people settle the "whose car is fastest" question. And cars that are not street legal can race there... but EVEN there, there is tech inspection before you can race. Safety is job one.

The vaping industry is young, and the law makers are about to step in. Many of us in this industry fear the law makers will simply ban it entirely if they deem it unsafe. Unlike cars, which are essential and therefore cannot really be banned entirely, vaping is not considered essential. They will ban it in a heartbeat if things get too out of hand.

Then what? We look back and wish we ALL had taken a more proactive step to prevent it from happening.

Yep, even the most knowledgeable audiophiles I run into don't REALLY understand impedance curves/graphs, and how it varies based on frequency. Start talking about damping factors and watch their heads spin. Yet they hear my (admittedly very expensive) DIY system and ask how I got the midbass so clear. Ah well, "audiophiles" scare me anyway - too many horror stories, and wrong thread to go into it.

Yet the comparison to vaping IS right on point.... When the load impedance goes down, power MUST come up, or it clips... and by halving that power EVERY thing in the path to that speaker has DOUBLE the effective loss.

Vaping is exactly the same way... Halving the resistance of the coil will require double the power... same as audio... but here is where vaping really needs to look at the resistances being used... If, for example, the connections from the output of the board in your mod (including your connections all the way to the coil) have a series resistance of, say, .2Ω, then if you create a coil that is ALSO .2Ω then HALF your power is lost in the connections... your 60 watt mod is now only delivering 30 watts to the coil... a loss of 50%. Now look at the calculations if you have the same mod, same series resistance, but a 1Ω coil... That's a whole lot better, right? So raise the voltage, lose a lower percentage in the connections.... same mod, MUCH better results... and requires less power.

And that's why my invader mini sits unused.........
Thought it would be my indestructible barn mod......and it is rugged, but the vape?.......meh

I was pretty disappointed with that one...
 

zapped

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Unless you make your own for pennies on the dollar ;)

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

Not interested, thanks.

Smoking was one of the simplest things in the world. I try to approach vaping the same way.
 

Zen~

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And talking about the connections and the internal resistance of them, THIS is where the P3 connector REALLY shines... there is SO much less loss in there than in the traditional 510. The ground path alone probably has triple the contact area. (assuming you pair it with an atty that is native P3)
 

USMCotaku

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I started DIY, because even at tootle puff levels, I really can't afford "craft" juice, and the cheaper juices taste, well, cheap. So I can get quality juice for about $2 for 30ml.

It's why I'm so set on wanting a mod to be able to cover at least my adv range if I'm going to try and save up so much money to buy one......of all my "nicer" mods, I've won all but one, and I made payments on that one (the variant).....and that took forever [emoji14]

If I won, or someone gave me a P3 say.....I'd use it, and never complain about the 20 watts limit......I do have tanks that work well in that range, that I do use now and then. But for me to try and save up this much cash.......it will be for something I use more then occasionally (40 watts would do that). Till then, my adv is the Asolo.

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
 
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