recommending a subohm rebuildable, or a mech, to a newer user is showboating 16-year old bull....; comes from the bragging irresponsible hipster thread running through a lot of the younger cloudchaser crowd. "I'm from the OC, be like me"....... get it off the new members forum. This will be dismissed as old timer chiche, but "you're gonna ruin it for everyone". What is a fad to you is life and death to some of us. There needs to be some moderator intervention
PLEASE stop recommending RBAs and RDAs to beginners in the Newbie Forum
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Lots of responses in new members have been not particularly helpful lately.
No asking the person what they want (or bothering to listen to what they've asked for), no links posted, lots of over their head initials that frankly I don't understand much less someone who has never vaped before.
i think telling everyone they're too stupid to figure it out and creating nanny state rules on a public forum to coincide with that idea is the issue. it's the thread title in a nutshell.
EDIT: maybe i'm missing something though. i don't frequent the newbie forum.
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It's not that they're too stupid. Most people don't even know if vaping is for them. They're used to buying a pack of cigarettes and a pack of matches. Granted, no pv is going to be that easy but lets not scare them away before they start. There isn't any need to.
As for the thread, don't like it- don't post in it.
Amen. As a former smoker my ideal vaping device is the size of cig, has the battery longevity of a MVP (if not more), the ability to hold hands free in the mouth. Basically an all day vaporizer in cigarette form. I would be happy not to buy coils, rebuild coils, charge batteries, mix liquids or anything else.
I want the ease of flipping open a zippo, lighting and relaxing with a fake smoke.
The only thing different for a RDA to a protank to me? It is easy to build a single coil on a RDA. Dripping is tedious. Not much more flavor/vapor at standard rez.
i can agree to that. in fact, my first posts, i thought suggested just the same. however... if there's someone in the newbie forum looking for advice that may gravitate towards rebuilding, i see no problem with giving them the advice they need/deserve/seek just the same. that's all i'm saying.
- err on the side of caution. suggest what works without issues.
- but if for some reason, the poster displays a want, need and/or the knowledge to be capable of rebuildables it would be ashamed not to be allowed to give them that advice.
If I knew I would be where I am now with gear, compared to what I started with a year ago.........I would have kept smoking, TOO MUCH INFORMATION.
I am not ......ed. I can pull an engine and rebuild it, I can build a house from plot plan to turn key move in. Blah, blah, blah.
But I wanted something that was simple, set it up and forget it, fires 99% of the time, no fuss, no muss, and not interfere with my daily routine. Ciga-likes where my first stop, and probably most vapers started there too. They got me through the first 3 weeks of no analogs......then I wanted something more.
So now I've gotten into rewicking and building micro coils....because it's cool, it's fun, I have the time, and I get a better vape. Don't think I'll ever DIY juice unless there's legislation on nic. But I'm into it because I wasn't satisfied with the general progression of my vaping.
It's a learning curve, some don't want to learn more than they have to, others dive right in and go for the gusto. But generally speaking, I don't think you're going to get the bulk of smokers to get into vaping by suggesting something that involves more than pushing a button on a battery and adding juice to a clearo. If BT is any reflection of what the majority of "smokers" want, with millions, if not billions, to be spent on market research, ciga-likes seem to be what most smokers/or want to be "ex-smokers" are looking for.
Personally, I wouldn't suggest any thing involving a meter, differing wire gauge, ohms, resistance, rebuilding, etc., unless someone specifically asked. Electricity, just like nicotine, can be dangerous if someone doesn't have the desire to learn.
Maybe the first question asked, if someone wants to "upgrade", should be "What happens if you pee on a hot wire?" If they get it right, suggest a RBA, RDA.
I am not ......ed. I can pull an engine and rebuild it, I can build a house from plot plan to turn key move in. Blah, blah, blah.
But I wanted something that was simple, set it up and forget it, fires 99% of the time, no fuss, no muss, and not interfere with my daily routine. Ciga-likes where my first stop, and probably most vapers started there too. They got me through the first 3 weeks of no analogs......then I wanted something more.
So now I've gotten into rewicking and building micro coils....because it's cool, it's fun, I have the time, and I get a better vape. Don't think I'll ever DIY juice unless there's legislation on nic. But I'm into it because I wasn't satisfied with the general progression of my vaping.
It's a learning curve, some don't want to learn more than they have to, others dive right in and go for the gusto. But generally speaking, I don't think you're going to get the bulk of smokers to get into vaping by suggesting something that involves more than pushing a button on a battery and adding juice to a clearo. If BT is any reflection of what the majority of "smokers" want, with millions, if not billions, to be spent on market research, ciga-likes seem to be what most smokers/or want to be "ex-smokers" are looking for.
Personally, I wouldn't suggest any thing involving a meter, differing wire gauge, ohms, resistance, rebuilding, etc., unless someone specifically asked. Electricity, just like nicotine, can be dangerous if someone doesn't have the desire to learn.
Maybe the first question asked, if someone wants to "upgrade", should be "What happens if you pee on a hot wire?" If they get it right, suggest a RBA, RDA.
I would like to think that helping people switch to vaping from smoking and giving them the information they need to give them the best chance of doing that is what the new members forum is about, not one-upsmanship. Rebuilding things is for the mechanically inclined, not the average smoker trying to get healthy. It is not a step up, just a niche for a very few people compared to the millions of smokers ECF is here to help.
People have mentioned "upgrading" that is mentioned frequently by new people. I have seen many many times vets suggesting MAJOR upgrades from an ego kit to a mech with sub ohms. lol I get a chuckle.
Then the thread gets hijacked by all the people who love that stuff. The new person is never heard from again here.
Just my 2 cents.
I still want to see the guy'who posted in this thread, his Grandma rebuild a kayfun!
Then the thread gets hijacked by all the people who love that stuff. The new person is never heard from again here.
Just my 2 cents.
I still want to see the guy'who posted in this thread, his Grandma rebuild a kayfun!
There are plenty of people in the newbie forum who are not new to vaping. I came in with a few months under my belt and I've got a clone genesis on order, not for my regular vape, but to try it out. So outlawing all discussion of such devices would just mean a pointless five posts.
To set up another straw man, if someone comes in who's only ever heard of cig-a-likes and wants an easy way to give up smoking, then I'd say cartos and maybe clearos, and no more. From my personal experience, I recommend pre-filled cartos for the very beginning, just to keep the learning curve as flat as possible. Giving up the smokes is hard enough. I'm sure that would not be the right advice for many people.
Even if someone was asking -- as someone was recently -- for the best kit they could get, money no object, I'd still say start with a good clearomiser and a Twist, and learn the ropes. Put the wallet away until you know what you want.
It also doesn't work to mark rebuildables as only for advanced vapers. That would just create a them-and-us hierarchy.
So I would be against a blanket ban, and I don't think any words handed down from on high can work either.
What would work is if people can remember that every addiction is different, every vaper is different, with different skills and capacities, and that what worked fantastically for you, might not work at all for them.
To set up another straw man, if someone comes in who's only ever heard of cig-a-likes and wants an easy way to give up smoking, then I'd say cartos and maybe clearos, and no more. From my personal experience, I recommend pre-filled cartos for the very beginning, just to keep the learning curve as flat as possible. Giving up the smokes is hard enough. I'm sure that would not be the right advice for many people.
Even if someone was asking -- as someone was recently -- for the best kit they could get, money no object, I'd still say start with a good clearomiser and a Twist, and learn the ropes. Put the wallet away until you know what you want.
It also doesn't work to mark rebuildables as only for advanced vapers. That would just create a them-and-us hierarchy.
So I would be against a blanket ban, and I don't think any words handed down from on high can work either.
What would work is if people can remember that every addiction is different, every vaper is different, with different skills and capacities, and that what worked fantastically for you, might not work at all for them.
And this is really a fair point which actually validates the OPs concern. There are people who aren't knowledgeable enough with simple ego batteries to know not to leave them in their car battery charger or not to use the 510 charger with an ego. Consider the damage a 18650 battery could do if not properly charged/used.
Also, I did just see in the new members forum the other day a person joking around about how he built a sub ohm something & fired it up on his device & fried the device. Didn't bother to check the ohms on it or anything before firing it up.
Yea, people can learn. I'd just rather they not learn by burning their house down.
HST there is nothing wrong with a new vaper starting off on rebuildables if that's an interest to them. But it is not necessary to jump into the mech world right away to do this. One can build on rebuildables & use safe devices with them. The only thing one can not do with protected devices are things that are dangerous, hence the reason they are SAFE.
You can cause danger with a regulated/boost device. You put a high resistance coil with a low c-rated battery...let's say the battery is rated for 4.5Amps...because, "hey, my APV is rated at 4.5 Amps." You use the boost circuit at it's full potential. That will create a drain on the battery past it's capability..thermal run away.. It won't be nearly as violent as using a 0.2ohm coil with that same battery, but it is enough to cause thermal run away...thus creating a pressure build up. I'm surprised I haven't seen that on the forums yet..
I really am not sure why this is being made into such an argument. Would you let someone who has never driven a car drive a ferrari? No.you wouldn't. That isn't saying that they aren't CAPABLE of driving it. But, for obvious safety reasons and other technical reasons that they might not know of YET..you wouldn't let them drive it. Everyone is capable of driving it.
Coils are the same way, they are really simple, but they take some research so you don't have an accident and give vapers a bad rep and yourself a major burn/injury.
That may be a bit much comparing to a car but it is still the same general principle.
Coils are the same way, they are really simple, but they take some research so you don't have an accident and give vapers a bad rep and yourself a major burn/injury.
That may be a bit much comparing to a car but it is still the same general principle.
I think the best course of action is to listen to what the op is asking for or telling us in their intro about what they want. Don't introduce something they haven't expressed an interest in.
Let's just raise our own antenna's and listen. It may be necessary to start them off by asking them questions because they simply do not know. Or, if they start off by asking more advance questions then go with it. It is hard enough in the beginning and most are overwhelmed.
I think the best path is to not make it worse because of our own preferences.
With more and more new members each day, we frankly can use all the help we can get. If you have some time, spend it helping in the new members thread. Who better to guide them but peeps who have been where they are?
jmho
Let's just raise our own antenna's and listen. It may be necessary to start them off by asking them questions because they simply do not know. Or, if they start off by asking more advance questions then go with it. It is hard enough in the beginning and most are overwhelmed.
I think the best path is to not make it worse because of our own preferences.
With more and more new members each day, we frankly can use all the help we can get. If you have some time, spend it helping in the new members thread. Who better to guide them but peeps who have been where they are?
jmho
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I agree that dangerous suggestions should be avoided. But as far as moderators go there is more than enough of that here. What one will deem fine another takes issue with. How about we moderate ourselves and if we see something that should not be, speak up. If this forum were moderated any heavier I would probably not be a member.
This is exactly why I started this thread, as a head's up. I ASKED with the word "please" to not do it, specifically with beginners, not to ban mentioning them, or to say that they'll burn your house down.
I sense at times a lot of attitudes here that are like someone handing a 13 year old the keys to a car, and saying "They'll figure it out between here and that brick wall."
I didn't call anyone stupid, please show me a link to where I did. Thanks in advance.
BTW - nanny state? Really?
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