Rayon wick, better flow, flavor, saturation and Nic Hit!
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Rayon has become huge, over the top. This is another validation of how low the risk is for it.
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Here it is from flavor art themselves!
Thanks heavy rocker, good find.! A thousand likes!
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Rayon wick, possible side effects and causes.
Monday, 11 August 2014 | John
A number of vapers have said they have felt adverse effects after switching to Rayon and the focus has been on Rayon as the cause.
However, the general symptons have been mostly those associated with vaping too much, sore throat, wheezing, heavy chest,
which led me to look at it from a wider perspective. These are my observations, not definitive scientific tests.
I spent some years in th'owden days (1970s!) working in the textile industry for a company that used a wide range
of natural and synthetic material. It was when I revisited methods of Rayon manufacture that I had the 'light bulb moment'.
I remember studying material and colour technology and the description of Rayon is that it is a Filament yarn.
Cotton yarns are made by combing and spinning loose cotton fibres to make it into as uniform a strand as possible, which
means that although it looks like a thread, it is in fact many tiny pieces of cotton clinging together. It's natural properties
make it a good wicking material, but Rayon has a big advantage. Filament yarns are produced from a viscous liquid by forcing
it through a set of tiny holes called a Spinneret and binding it together as a continuous yarn. There are at least four extrusion/spinning
methods used on synthetic yarns, Rayon uses the oldest method, wet spinning. The Spinneret sits in a chemical bath and
as the filaments emerge from the bath they solidify. The result is a continuous yarn with a very uniform structure, as opposed
to cotton which is far from being continuous. The number/thickness of filaments in each yarn determines the Denier, or weight per length.
Rayon has a number of properties that make it a good candidate for coil wicks: the structure is uniform and tubular which allows easy
passage of liquid along it as the adhesion to the filament walls is stronger than the cohesive forces between the liquid molecules.
Rayon has a high absorbency level coupled with an efficient release level; it suspends liquid very well but does not cling to it excessively.
The Blue Foam has similar properties in terms of suspension/release but pore density is crucial, 45 pores per inch being ideal.
The bottom line is that Rayon will most likely wick liquids better than cotton, but that is possibly what is causing problems for some users.
I must default to the scientific position of 'we don't know yet', but it is possible that the Rayon is wicking so well that for some people and/or
in certain set-ups/devices it is delivering too much liquid for that individual which results in greater than normal quantities of vapour
(PG/VG/Nicotine/flavour) being delivered to the lungs and causing the symptoms that have been reported. There are several options that
might alleviate the symptoms; stop using Rayon (obvious!), reduce the efficiency of the device (power/airflow), reduce the Nicotine strength.
A scientific study on volume for volume comparison of how much is taken into the lungs with vaping v smoking might give some indication;
this is not a toxicity test as we know tobacco smoke is far worse, but I'm sure there are a lot of vapers who inhale far greater quantities per drag and/or inhale a greater daily quantity. There are contra indications, and although relatively mild on the whole, they still warrant investigation, along with more research on any potential adverse effects of using Rayon as wicking material. I would probably feel as safe using Rayon as any other common wick material, but whether it would lead to other problems I don't know.
What we do know is why Rayon makes a very efficient wick!
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Update: Dr Konstantinos Farsalinos has begun testing wick temperatures as part of his study on e-cigarettes/eliquid and their safety.
Hopefully he will be able to include Rayon in those tests as it is becoming popular with vapers.
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Jeremy,
You can be sure the Flavor Art did their homework before they posted their opinions without any caveats.
You can be sure the Flavor Art did their homework before they posted their opinions without any caveats.
Pretty crazy flavor art has to come out and set the record straight.
I like how they lead with the 'misleading title. Rayon deniers think they hit pay dirt, only to find it was another positive. lol
I like how they lead with the 'misleading title. Rayon deniers think they hit pay dirt, only to find it was another positive.
lol
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I'm pretty sure I got yelled at for telling the crybabys, a few thousand posts ago, that their problem wasn't that they were getting sore throats or whatever from rayon it was that they are getting more vapor...
Anything new, especially with the misconceptions that plague rayon, is going to meet with what I can only call "chicken littles".
In my quest to improve things that I already have rather than keep buying the "latest and greatest", I drilled out the air holes on a Protank air controller base to 1/16" today. That doesn't sound like it's very big, but it is significantly bigger than the stock holes. It has made a difference. A lung hit is no longer a contest between getting a decent hit and passing out from lack of air. I think the next trick will be increasing the size of the center pin hole a little. Time will tell. As it is now, I'm getting tons more vapor, and flavor, so I think it's a win. The only reason it worked is the cellulose wick. There's no way silica could keep up with the demand.
In my quest to improve things that I already have rather than keep buying the "latest and greatest", I drilled out the air holes on a Protank air controller base to 1/16" today. That doesn't sound like it's very big, but it is significantly bigger than the stock holes. It has made a difference. A lung hit is no longer a contest between getting a decent hit and passing out from lack of air. I think the next trick will be increasing the size of the center pin hole a little. Time will tell. As it is now, I'm getting tons more vapor, and flavor, so I think it's a win. The only reason it worked is the cellulose wick. There's no way silica could keep up with the demand.
awsum140, I have found that authentic kanger AeroTank coil pins have the largest center pins as compared to my EVOD and T3S coil units. The difference is so slight that it is hard to tell with the naked eye, but the truth lies with caliper measurements and the vape quality. I did the same as you and drilled out my AeroTank to 1.35mm and also added 3 more holes at the same size and noticed that I was being restricted by the center pin. I dug in my box and found and old dual coil unit and low and behold the center pin is bored out quite a bit from an EVOD unit. I ditched the dual coil units and went single for ease of rebuildability and won't ever fool with a dual setup again in my Aero.
Best bet would be to drill out the base some how.... Got wheels turning. Will give this a shot later on.
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Believe it or not, that is a feature only available in the clones and possibly versions later than the first. My authentic V1 is not capable of a rotating T-posi post. I tried this afternoon when I did my weekly rebuild.
I'm going to go this route as well so that I can center the coils and have equal wick tails on either side of the coil. Right now, I have one wick crammed under the coil and I know performance would be better if that wasn't the case. I have my neg post air holes blocked off anyway with the off center build so what the hell?
Well, at least there is that plus for the authentic. I have yet to cut a coil tightening down the coil fastening screws.
Pretty crazy flavor art has to come out and set the record straight.
I like how they lead with the 'misleading title. Rayon deniers think they hit pay dirt, only to find it was another positive.
Well, we all know the truth. A one JeremyR set that record straight many moons ago.
And yeah, love the title.
I just wanted to say that your coil work is prettyI put the T post at an angle on purpose to direct the negative air flow to the coil. See how air comes in it hits the t and will be directed to the coil. Instead of just going straight into the t and splitting both ways. Don't know if it makes a difference just thought if try it.. With air flow dynamics in mind I thought it would flow more toward the coil... Jury's still out, lower air hole will probably be filled soon so I can get some capacity in the well.
it would be a great cover photo for something 
That makes me want to play on a pc with particle dynamics and forces again lol.I put the T post at an angle on purpose to direct the negative air flow to the coil. See how air comes in it hits the t and will be directed to the coil. Instead of just going straight into the t and splitting both ways. Don't know if it makes a difference just thought if try it.. With air flow dynamics in mind I thought it would flow more toward the coil... Jury's still out, lower air hole will probably be filled soon so I can get some capacity in the well.
Short answer 50/50 - Long answer, yes, it diverts air around the coil to an extent...
I always wanted a PC that could rapidly solve dynamic simulations, it's so slow on typical hardware. Maya and Houdini have really nice simulation capabilities, not quite scientifically accurate but good nonetheless.
Isn't that what the hard core racers use for cylinder heads, intake, and exhaust manifolds? I have seen screenies of something like that that shows the flow in a "heat map" which is useful to see where your airflow is lacking.
It's a 3d particle simulation program that is scientifically accurate
Fight the indocrination...dimmer skies are safer skies!!!
https://www.facebook.com/InternationalChemtrail
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So i rewicked my kayfun again yesterday so far no leaks or dry hits, this is my 3rd build on this thing first one leaked like...., second one dry hit like crazy.
With this build i wrapped a different coil parallel 30g 4wrap spaced 2mm id (instead of 1/16).
This time i didn't trim the tails as thin as before and left the wick just long enough to bend at the juice deck, flufffled it all out while still dry.. Primed and went through 2 tanks with no dry hits or leaking YAY!
my battery was too low to takes pics when i built it i only got this one snapped before it shut off lol
With this build i wrapped a different coil parallel 30g 4wrap spaced 2mm id (instead of 1/16).
This time i didn't trim the tails as thin as before and left the wick just long enough to bend at the juice deck, flufffled it all out while still dry.. Primed and went through 2 tanks with no dry hits or leaking YAY!
my battery was too low to takes pics when i built it i only got this one snapped before it shut off lol
Kanger coil head improved:
First attempt. Tried 4 holes 90 degrees apart. Was close but not exact. 0.91mm at about 45 degree angle.
Needed more air.
Next larger reamer at 1.35mm. Much better.
With gasket installed:
Tools used. These are small dental burrs used to drill teeth. I have a ton of these for PCB repair. I think their official name is carbide burr (tree or radius shape). They rip right through the chrome plated brass like it is butter. I didn't even need a pilot hole or punch to get the smaller burr started.
Pin air hole measurements:
There is a rather significant difference between the EVOD and Aero coil units. I am not sure why I have two different measurements for my EVOD / T3S heads unless I mixed my 5 originals with my 3 cheapos that came in the T3S heads that I initially purchased when I started vaping.
Soooo much airflow! This Aero is now hitting like a smaller airflow dripper like my bored out Patriot. WOW!
First attempt. Tried 4 holes 90 degrees apart. Was close but not exact. 0.91mm at about 45 degree angle.
Needed more air.
Next larger reamer at 1.35mm. Much better.
With gasket installed:
Tools used. These are small dental burrs used to drill teeth. I have a ton of these for PCB repair. I think their official name is carbide burr (tree or radius shape). They rip right through the chrome plated brass like it is butter. I didn't even need a pilot hole or punch to get the smaller burr started.
Pin air hole measurements:
There is a rather significant difference between the EVOD and Aero coil units. I am not sure why I have two different measurements for my EVOD / T3S heads unless I mixed my 5 originals with my 3 cheapos that came in the T3S heads that I initially purchased when I started vaping.
Soooo much airflow! This Aero is now hitting like a smaller airflow dripper like my bored out Patriot. WOW!
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I just got done grading some quizzes, after which I needed some massive hits.
In my haste to rewick a dripper, I grabbed something fluffy and white on my desk. Before I had fully inhaled, it became clear that I had mistakenly grabbed organic cotton.
Rayon is far superior in the taste department. After less than a week using rayon and my mistake just now, I can definitively say this.
ETA: Fear not; I yanked the cotton out and am doing better now. Whew!
In my haste to rewick a dripper, I grabbed something fluffy and white on my desk. Before I had fully inhaled, it became clear that I had mistakenly grabbed organic cotton.
Rayon is far superior in the taste department. After less than a week using rayon and my mistake just now, I can definitively say this.
ETA: Fear not; I yanked the cotton out and am doing better now. Whew!
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With the recent dual coils I built; it seems due to using 32g with only 18-20w the coils may have too much wick coverage with them so far spaced out over two whole rayon wicks. A tighter coil may be in order on these - well I take it back, fully charged 18350s in the zmax @6v & 25w it's pretty darn good. 20w or less not so much....
I can see the infinite clt taking 80w.
I'm running the clt with air at about a 1/4- 1/3 and off to the right of the coil shooting at the positive connection on the opposite side gives best flavor. 9mg is kicking. Super wet vape feel like I just drank a bottle of juice. May readjust air flow.
I can see the infinite clt taking 80w.
I'm running the clt with air at about a 1/4- 1/3 and off to the right of the coil shooting at the positive connection on the opposite side gives best flavor. 9mg is kicking. Super wet vape feel like I just drank a bottle of juice. May readjust air flow.
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