SnusX Bucket - bulk snus, add your own flavours (formerly 'Make your own snus')

[exogenesis]

Certainly will be very interested in their reply Vaporer, I'd really like it be that
these are made from air-cured, pasteurised, dried & ground 'unadulterated' tobacco.

Only 100 flavours eh , how many are oils that would effectively flavour smelly snus ?

TB seems to have been missing for a while, maybe too involved in video production ?

 

[Vaporer]

Here is the reply from V2. Not what I expected.

"Hi
The already contain salt and sodium carbonate.. So ready for use.

Med venlig hilsen / Regards

V2 tobacco A/S

Patrick Vogel
V2 Tobacco - snus manufacturer "

Time for a follow up email.
They have to have a suggested solution for this problem if they plan on continued sales.

exo, not sure. Some are in drams and some are 4oz! Can't for get the 4oz of menthol crystals either!

 

[Vaporer]

Well, I havent received a 2nd reply yet from V2. I did a reply to their email. Sometimes that doesnt work and it has to be sent from their website. It hasnt been returned yet so it should have went through.

I read all 4 pages of the Snus Experiment, very worthy read and some good links from there too. Strange the experimenter never mentions a foul odor at anytime. He does confirm they taste like Ettan if untouched, still with no comment.

Anyone here that has tried these, I can see the plastic bucket itself retaining the odor. Has anyone followed the exact instructions(not in english! lol) of removing a few portions to a neutral aroma empty snus tin, flavored and let sit 3 days? Agitating each day, which does air them a bit.
The experimenters description was very detailed and he commented they got better by each day till day 3. His final portions look very much like Thunder Frosted.

Another question Ihave I havent seen posted is does the bucket require refridgeration?
Before opening, after opening? The experimenter stated a good date till 2012 and the portions very dry. This leads me to believe even after opening, storage in my basement at 58-60* dark most of the time should be fine.
We lost the large deep freezer during the winter and never replaced it yet. I can use my daughters but I hate to push my wife for upright freezer space beyond my now normal stock. I have a bunch on the way!

I still plan to buy a bucket. The stupid health care bill passed last night so the signing of the Pact Axe will probably soon fall.

Appreciate any input on my unknowns.

 

[exogenesis]

Oh well, salt & carbonate already added, expected as much really.

Still might make 'your average' snus I guess, I'll give it a miss for now.

Would have thought that refrigeration & multiple exposure to air would
cause significant water adsorption over the life of the bucket, maybe a
dry cool place is better ?

I think TB did follow the 3 day instructions after the initial rush at it.
Seems to have gone of the boil on feedback.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Would have thought that refrigeration & multiple exposure to air would
cause significant water adsorption over the life of the bucket, maybe a
dry cool place is better ?

I think it surely would. If kept in a fridge, any moisture from infrequent opening to pull out a cans worth (recommended way I'd think) would be taken care of, keeping the unused snus in its dry state. That way, humidity wouldn't be a factor. Refrigerators are really de-humidifiers. Just need to avoid that warm-cold-warm thing .

 

[Vaporer]

2nd reply from V2.

"Hi

When people say foul odor, it can mean many different things.
Do you want a more fresh smell (then try with some menthol)...
More sweet taste - try with minimum vanilla

Med venlig hilsen / Regards

V2 Tobacco A/S

Patrick Vogel
V2 Tobacco - snus manufacturer "

They seem oblivious to there being a problem.

 

[Vaporer]

My thoughts were to air the portions out a few days then transfer 20-40ea to ziploc or vacuum seal freezer bags. Opening the bucket and removing a few off the top on occasion , I wouldnt think would introduce that much moisture since they had been left to sit out for days airing if you went that route. A dessicant pack can always be put back in the bucket.
If the odor is that strong and foul I'd prefer to lose the bucket anyway.

Thoughts?

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

My thoughts were to air the portions out a few days then transfer 20-40ea to ziploc or vacuum seal freezer bags. Opening the bucket and removing a few off the top on occasion , I wouldnt think would introduce that much moisture since they had been left to sit out for days airing if you went that route. A dessicant pack can always be put back in the bucket.
If the odor is that strong and foul I'd prefer to lose the bucket anyway.

Thoughts?

Oblivious to the problem...hmmmm.....donno, could be. I know most folks don't normally savor bergamot, salt and pepper 'til they've "developed a taste" for Swedish snus. Yeah, they probably oblivious, now that I think about it .

You're above plan of attack sounds ok, V. It's hard to tell til somebody says "oops". In my case, there's no place better than my snus fridge. I'm not worried about the kids toying with it other than to occasionally sample the odor (boys), but if it gets popped open during those high humidiy summers days (and worse, the lid isn't resealed) I'm afraid those little portions will become desiccant packets. I'm actually considering breaking it all down into clean, empty snus cans and stacking in the snus fridge. I know an opened can dries faster than popcorn in a air-popper, so I can grab a can as needed and start the mixing process. I'm still up in the air, though.

 

[Vaporer]

TV, all plans usually sound good till you try them. lol
I have many plastic tins I could do that too. Good idea. I don't have small children to worry abt either.
I wonder if they were baked dry in a toaster oven at 170* for an hour or so till really dry?
Shouldnt hurt the nic at that temp.
I know that water crystals form great in my Thunders in the freezers when I go to get my days assortment out.

Oblivious.......how else you you read those responses? Am I missing something?

I would like to see TB post again here with a more detailed description of his techniques tried.

 

[Skrymr]

TV, all plans usually sound good till you try them. lol
I have many plastic tins I could do that too. Good idea. I don't have small children to worry abt either.
I wonder if they were baked dry in a toaster oven at 170* for an hour or so till really dry?
Shouldnt hurt the nic at that temp.
I know that water crystals form great in my Thunders in the freezers when I go to get my days assortment out.

Oblivious.......how else you you read those responses? Am I missing something?

I would like to see TB post again here with a more detailed description of his techniques tried.

I wonder if they are just used to the smell? Or it just doesn't smell bad to them? Could be the case since they work with it all the time.

 

[Vaporer]

Skrymr,
Thats what I'm thinking. Any organic material that has fermented usually smells bad.
We all are purchasing snus that has went through this process, been flavored to taste and few complain of an odor that a quick airing out doesnt fix.

So......I'm looking at it as finding the correct method of flavoring and prep for use.
My bucket order is still on. I like a good challenge and I hate to lose. lol

Another issue arises in that all the tobacco being grown will have to be made into snuff only if this isnt resolved. If we pasturize it as instructed to make our own snus we may have the same problem to address.

 

[exogenesis]

It's possible that TB just got a particularly smelly batch,
maybe they're normally nicer ?

Wouldn't heating the portions to 170'C drive off most of the nicotine,
as well as the volatile smelly compounds & water ?

I've found the liquid droplets that form in thunder cartons kept in the freezer seem
to be very strong in nicotine & flavour,
it seems to be a concentrated 'condensate' of the snus juice.

The last portion to get used is wiped around the carton & gives one huge blast relative to the first.

 

[Vaporer]

exo,
There's 2 diff sides to the story for sure. I'm wondering if TB's may have still been to moist and continuing a very small amount of fermentation.
Oh, my americanism showing, I was in F not C ..lol 170*F.
Just a warming temp to dry. Most toaster ovens bottom working temp is 170-180* F.

I've noticed that on Thunder too among others. The flavor and hit isnt as strong from a portion if taken straight from the freezer. Let them thaw or back in the fridge for a few days and all is well again.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

I've noticed that on Thunder too among others. The flavor and hit isnt as strong from a portion if taken straight from the freezer. Let them thaw or back in the fridge for a few days and all is well again.

Maybe snus is like cheese......room temp and all that.

Probably just a coincidence, but here a few days ago, I got a can of Thunder Frosted from the freezer (first one from the long storage vault) and slid it in my work bag for when my current can would run out. Since I've cracked it open it's been hittin' like a sledge hammer. Don't know why. Maybe from a stronger batch....maybe freezing, then a quick thaw....beats me, but it's strong and is feeding a good amount of nic for a good hour and a half. Not the regular trickle effect over a couple hours, but a steady, decent flow. The taste doesn't seem any different, but for all these Thunders I've consumed, this can is like a nic IV. I only made through 3 portions today and I always do at least 4, usually 5 or 6. Strange.

 

[Vaporer]

TV,
While doing more research on the buckets I read an interesting thing on freezer storage of portion snus. I think it was on Northeners site somewhere.

It stated that long term storage, freezer, was perfectly fine, but did result in a little lower nicotine and flavor level. But, it was perfectly safe. I can see the flavor if directly removed could be held in the "frost" crystals in the tin, but the nic lower? hmmmm
I would think they are smarter than I am on the subject. lol
I've just never seen the specs on frozen nicotine degradation. Looking up nicotine specs, one wouldnt think it would happen. Flavors being non oil based is an easy to understand thing, but rethawing would resolve this in most cases. Freezing may breakdown some flavors.

Stronger, hmmm............... maybe the liquid that freezes out went back into just some portions and nic was in it and boosted those. Tough call there.

Oh, the long term thing was in jojos link she found on Viking snus , the buy out, and it was talking abt pasteurization vs freezing and TSNA increase with storage.

 

[exogenesis]

What was the conclusion about TSNAs increasing with snus age ?

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Pretty strange, indeed. I'm leaning toward something different in a snus run on the assembly line, but since this is the 1st frozen can of my hoard I can't help to wonder. Definitely stronger, though. And consistent with each portion. I only have about 5 or 6 portions left in the can, so we'll see what the next one does. Although, I have some Oden's ES Kanel I wanna tackle first, so it might be a few before I crack the next Thunder open.

I read that stuff on the link jojo provided. Quite interesting and scandalous, weren't it? For the sake of caution, I think I'll pass on the Viking. Explains the good sale. My guess is it's a flop and Northerner's trying to unload it.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

What was the conclusion about TSNAs increasing with snus age ?

With pasteurized snus the TSNA's stay the same when it ages, but the fermented keeps rising. I guess manufacturers of fermented snus have a policy to replace anything on the shelves that's 30, 60, or 90 days old, depending on the individual maker. So unless you can use by the "use by" date, don't get any .

 

[exogenesis]

That definately make sense, thanks.

Was wondering :
since it seems the TSNAs are mostly created by microbial metabolic breakdown (of nicotine),
if when you finger your (pasteurised) snus you significantly reduce the shelf life,
cos you've contaminated them with your own skin bacteria.

Might be more significant for the SnusX bucket, with the much larger amount.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Just as a precaution, that's why I always wear a SCBA (self-contained breathing apparatus) and a Level A suit when I handle snus. Also spend a few minutes in a Decontamination shower before and after.......... Slow day around here....been waiting for an open door to the smartaxx department.