Come to Yellow Springs. You will see him. He's a fixture there.
Just don't yell, "I'm Rick James, blank!" to him.
That's been over for a long, long time. But college kids still do it. Sad, he's a family man.
State troopers reaction to seeing my lavatube 2.0
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Come to Yellow Springs. You will see him. He's a fixture there.
Just don't yell, "I'm Rick James, blank!" to him.
That's been over for a long, long time. But college kids still do it. Sad, he's a family man.
I like you Rocket, and I do get your point. I do agree that much of the rudeness can come from the citizen in these situations. I think your percentages are a bit off, however. I do not give them the complete silent treatment, but when I talk to LEOs I use very short answers. I frequently attempt to use single word answers when I can. I always avoid unnecessary chatter. I think that is the point of the video, taken to a bit of an extreme. No disrespect to the police, generally they are just doing their job, and I make sure I do not hassle them for doing so.
Some percentage (maybe 10%?) of LEOs in my experience really seem to thrive on their authority and feel the need to dominate (not just control, but actually dominate the whole situation) the scene when they show up. They will talk down to you, talk over you, and play loose with the facts. This is where hostility for the police comes from. I simply will not tolerate someone talking down to me or telling me something that is flat out wrong. No person should ever have to. If you find yourself dealing with this sort, simply demand that the LEOs supervisor come to the scene.
I do feel that many people talk WAY too much when talking to a LEO. Sometimes being nice and friendly will help you, so choosing the no talk/minimal talk method does close doors, you may "not talk" your way into a citation.
Some percentage (maybe 10%?) of LEOs in my experience really seem to thrive on their authority and feel the need to dominate (not just control, but actually dominate the whole situation) the scene when they show up. They will talk down to you, talk over you, and play loose with the facts. This is where hostility for the police comes from. I simply will not tolerate someone talking down to me or telling me something that is flat out wrong. No person should ever have to. If you find yourself dealing with this sort, simply demand that the LEOs supervisor come to the scene.
I do feel that many people talk WAY too much when talking to a LEO. Sometimes being nice and friendly will help you, so choosing the no talk/minimal talk method does close doors, you may "not talk" your way into a citation.
yes, where my submissive innocent little girl act comes in handy! mwahahah
I'm sorry, Sir. Please forgive me, Sir.
I'll be more careful next time, Officer.
90% of the time it works.
Thank god I've never been stopped by a female, they would see through that crap immediately.
of course usually it's just because I've been speeding. whoops!
Oh, this post just BEGS to be "fisked", so, please indulge me while I attempt to correct the errors in your thinking...
Actually this is not true. In fact, there is a growing trend among LEAs to NOT hire candidates for "beat cops" who are too smart. One guy in New London, CT was not hired because he scored too high on the entrance exams, and when he sued the department, the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in New York upheld the departments decision, saying that cops who were "too smart" tended to end up costing the department money, because they didn't stay with one department long enough to make it worth their training investments...
Jordan v. New London
According to most studies, the average IQ for a cop is 104. "Average" for all humans is about 100. So that means that at least 25% of cops, statistically are, in fact, WAY down the spectrum, and are borderline ......ed...
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/iqbasics.aspx
So, actually, you are wrong. Most cops ARE in fact, "dumb". Because although statistically, about half are above-average in intelligence, some are average, and at least half are below average. Do the math...
LEOs get most of their training these days either DIRECTLY from various Federal agencies (DOJ, DHS, DOD, etc) or through programs that are developed by these Federal agencies. And the PREVAILING model coming from the Feds today is adversarial. They are TRAINING local LEOs that EVERYONE they encounter is not just a potential criminal, but that EVERYONE they encounter is a potential DEADLY THREAT and possibly even a domestic terrorist.
They are taught, not to be helpful and "peace officers", but that they are "authority figures" and that ANY questioning of their "authority" or resistance to their probing (no matter how unreasonable or illegal that probing may be) is "resisting arrest", "obstruction" and "disrespecting their authority", and should be perceived as--and dealt with as a PERSONAL ATTACK.
This pervasive adversarial mindset causes police to enter into most encounters with the idea that you are some sort of crazed criminal at the very least, and if god forbid, you should actually KNOW your rights and attempt to exercise them, you are attacking them personally, and potentially you are planning to attack the Institution that employs them.
Not my opinion--that is how they are trained today.
You are right. The fact that DHS has purchased 2 BILLION rounds of ammo in the last year (enough to fight a full-scale war like we have in Iraq and Afghanistan for 30 years straight), has recently puchased over 2000 Armored Personnel Carriers, and has an RFP currently active to purchase 7000 full-auto assault rifles doesn't mean they are planning for any sort of "martial law".
And the way that G20 protesters were treated in Pittsburgh in 2009 DEFINITELY wasn't "martial law"...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAkzfuRGLjc
Police have NO DUTY to "serve and protect" individual citizens. This has been established as commonly-held legal precedent through over a dozen court cases--state and Federal--over the last several decades. The ONLY entity the police have a duty to "protect" is their employers--the municipalities that contract them as their agents.
Read up on "Warren v. District of Columbia"--the landmark case in this precedent--and then re-read it if you don't "get it" the first time. Then come back and tell me if you still believe that the police have any sort of "duty" to "protect" you--or even a legal obligation to show up at all when you dial 911...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia
Police Have No Duty to Protect Individuals
I have almost NEVER had a bad experience with a cop when I was caught doing something wrong. Nearly traffic stop I've had (and there haven't been many--mostly for lights or tag issues) have been professional, polite, and lawful, with the exception of one in Baltimore City about 5 months ago (where I did nothing wrong, but some crazed female traffic cop waved me and another woman down because we couldn't understand her bizarre hand signals...)
But where I HAVE had bad experiences were when I was doing nothing wrong, minding my own business, and some power-crazed, sociopathic bully with a badge decided that I was someone who looked like they could be pushed around. Usually, dropping the name of a well-known law firm, or pulling out my cell phone and auto-dialing a lawyer friend was enough to set them on the "path to righteousness"...
Knowing your rights and exercising them is NOT being slimey. Anyone who says that standing your ground in the face of an illegal "color of law" attack on your rights is "wrong" is either a coward or a collaborator.
What it ultimately comes down to is that I don't "hate cops". I have tremendous respect for the good LEOs out there (and that is unfortunately a fast-shrinking minority).
What I hate is thugs, bullies and criminals. And if some of them just happen to wear a uniform with a badge as their chosen profession, then that is indeed unfortunate for us all--and they are deserving of our distrust, derision and scorn. Because a criminal is a criminal--no matter WHAT clothes he wears on the job...
Actually this is not true. In fact, there is a growing trend among LEAs to NOT hire candidates for "beat cops" who are too smart. One guy in New London, CT was not hired because he scored too high on the entrance exams, and when he sued the department, the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in New York upheld the departments decision, saying that cops who were "too smart" tended to end up costing the department money, because they didn't stay with one department long enough to make it worth their training investments...
Jordan v. New London
According to most studies, the average IQ for a cop is 104. "Average" for all humans is about 100. So that means that at least 25% of cops, statistically are, in fact, WAY down the spectrum, and are borderline ......ed...
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/iqbasics.aspx
So, actually, you are wrong. Most cops ARE in fact, "dumb". Because although statistically, about half are above-average in intelligence, some are average, and at least half are below average. Do the math...
LEOs get most of their training these days either DIRECTLY from various Federal agencies (DOJ, DHS, DOD, etc) or through programs that are developed by these Federal agencies. And the PREVAILING model coming from the Feds today is adversarial. They are TRAINING local LEOs that EVERYONE they encounter is not just a potential criminal, but that EVERYONE they encounter is a potential DEADLY THREAT and possibly even a domestic terrorist.
They are taught, not to be helpful and "peace officers", but that they are "authority figures" and that ANY questioning of their "authority" or resistance to their probing (no matter how unreasonable or illegal that probing may be) is "resisting arrest", "obstruction" and "disrespecting their authority", and should be perceived as--and dealt with as a PERSONAL ATTACK.
This pervasive adversarial mindset causes police to enter into most encounters with the idea that you are some sort of crazed criminal at the very least, and if god forbid, you should actually KNOW your rights and attempt to exercise them, you are attacking them personally, and potentially you are planning to attack the Institution that employs them.
Not my opinion--that is how they are trained today.
You are right. The fact that DHS has purchased 2 BILLION rounds of ammo in the last year (enough to fight a full-scale war like we have in Iraq and Afghanistan for 30 years straight), has recently puchased over 2000 Armored Personnel Carriers, and has an RFP currently active to purchase 7000 full-auto assault rifles doesn't mean they are planning for any sort of "martial law".
And the way that G20 protesters were treated in Pittsburgh in 2009 DEFINITELY wasn't "martial law"...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAkzfuRGLjc
Police have NO DUTY to "serve and protect" individual citizens. This has been established as commonly-held legal precedent through over a dozen court cases--state and Federal--over the last several decades. The ONLY entity the police have a duty to "protect" is their employers--the municipalities that contract them as their agents.
Read up on "Warren v. District of Columbia"--the landmark case in this precedent--and then re-read it if you don't "get it" the first time. Then come back and tell me if you still believe that the police have any sort of "duty" to "protect" you--or even a legal obligation to show up at all when you dial 911...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia
Police Have No Duty to Protect Individuals
I have almost NEVER had a bad experience with a cop when I was caught doing something wrong. Nearly traffic stop I've had (and there haven't been many--mostly for lights or tag issues) have been professional, polite, and lawful, with the exception of one in Baltimore City about 5 months ago (where I did nothing wrong, but some crazed female traffic cop waved me and another woman down because we couldn't understand her bizarre hand signals...)
But where I HAVE had bad experiences were when I was doing nothing wrong, minding my own business, and some power-crazed, sociopathic bully with a badge decided that I was someone who looked like they could be pushed around. Usually, dropping the name of a well-known law firm, or pulling out my cell phone and auto-dialing a lawyer friend was enough to set them on the "path to righteousness"...
Knowing your rights and exercising them is NOT being slimey. Anyone who says that standing your ground in the face of an illegal "color of law" attack on your rights is "wrong" is either a coward or a collaborator.
What it ultimately comes down to is that I don't "hate cops". I have tremendous respect for the good LEOs out there (and that is unfortunately a fast-shrinking minority).
What I hate is thugs, bullies and criminals. And if some of them just happen to wear a uniform with a badge as their chosen profession, then that is indeed unfortunate for us all--and they are deserving of our distrust, derision and scorn. Because a criminal is a criminal--no matter WHAT clothes he wears on the job...
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Always greet a LEO as you would greet your Momma (without the hugs and kisses). Treat your new acquaintance as your best friend. Keep answers short (Miranda rights). You have the right to deny complicity in accusations. Begin any encounter with, "I offer you no thread. I'm one of the good guys/girls." Don't try to be witty or snide. Be nice, but don't do their job for them. Definitely don't resist (Rodney King).
I've been thinking about that very scenario since I started vaping. Good to hear people are getting cuffed and taken away.
Well, StereoDreamer... now how can I possibly go up against that?
Obviously anything I say at this point will only make me look like a complete fool, as you speak legalese and I do not.
So, I'll just turn into the plebe and say one last thing, "Respect".
By chance, are you a lawyer?
And your description of Law Enforcement made me sad, really. Really, really sad.
Nothing I say at this point will hold a candle to your post, so I'm just going to say... I like cops, and I appreciate what they do, and I think you're wrong when it comes to the idea that cops are trained to perceive EVERYONE as a potential threat. That's just ridiculous. And that's all I say.
You shut me up, good for you.
Obviously anything I say at this point will only make me look like a complete fool, as you speak legalese and I do not.
So, I'll just turn into the plebe and say one last thing, "Respect".
By chance, are you a lawyer?
And your description of Law Enforcement made me sad, really. Really, really sad.
Nothing I say at this point will hold a candle to your post, so I'm just going to say... I like cops, and I appreciate what they do, and I think you're wrong when it comes to the idea that cops are trained to perceive EVERYONE as a potential threat. That's just ridiculous. And that's all I say.
You shut me up, good for you.
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Most cops are decent individuals doing a hard job. Some cops are thugs, and some police departments are basically well-organized street gangs (LAPD comes to mind). I have a slight concern that someday I'll see a news item where some poor schmuck got blown away because a dumb, violent cop thought his PV was a weapon.
I live in NY, the home of stop and frisk. I've been stopped for no reason walking down the street going to a cafe to do work. "what you doing over here?" the cop asked me. I was never frisked but a LEO stopped me on a sidewalk to question me for absolutely no reason. The problem with cops is they are given the right to assert authority and some of these officers will assert authority by any means. In NY, stop and frisk has become more than a safety measure, it's harassment. It's to the point were the police are forcing people to not respect them and not like them, so in turn LEO assert more aggressive authority. Both sides feel threatened by each other and it only escalates situations.
The only respectful officer I ever met was the one that sits behind a desk.
The only respectful officer I ever met was the one that sits behind a desk.
I'm not being snarky, and by no means am I picking a fight, I actually hate debating politics and such, but how did the stop and frisk law come about? It seems to me it had to be on a ballot somewhere.
Rocketpunk,
Stop and Frisk was instituted by Mayor David Norman Dinkins in 1991, and was massively accelerated by Mayor Giuliani through is term, and has continued to increase in scope and lawlessness under Bloomberg.
684,000 people were stopped in 2011, 88% of which resulted in no arrests or citations.
NYPD's Stop and Frisk Practice: Unfair and Unjust | Center for Constitutional Rights
Stop and Frisk is nothing more than state-sponsored thuggery, harassment and the "state" flexing it's muscles in the face of the People, to let them know "who's boss" in NYC...
It was put into effect as Opration Clean Halls under the guise of cleaning up drug and gang activity in inner-city housing projects, and was put in place based on a loose interpretation of a section of the NY Penal Code that allows police to stop people and search them based on "reasonable suspicion". State and Federal Courts have ruled numerous times that S&F as implemented by NYPD is not only illegal under NY law, but is unconstitutional, and a blatant breech of civil rights.
No law had to be passed--S&F is a "procedural" policy implemented by the Mayors Office and the NYPD, disguising government-sponsored racist thuggery as "increased security for the public good".
But they keep on doing it, because much like in Chicago and DC, the City Government and LEAs seem to believe that the Law of the Land and the Rulings of the Courts don't apply to them because they are soem sort of special, anointed neo-nobility with some sort of twisted, evil Divine Right to Rule...
Stop and Frisk was instituted by Mayor David Norman Dinkins in 1991, and was massively accelerated by Mayor Giuliani through is term, and has continued to increase in scope and lawlessness under Bloomberg.
684,000 people were stopped in 2011, 88% of which resulted in no arrests or citations.
NYPD's Stop and Frisk Practice: Unfair and Unjust | Center for Constitutional Rights
Stop and Frisk is nothing more than state-sponsored thuggery, harassment and the "state" flexing it's muscles in the face of the People, to let them know "who's boss" in NYC...
It was put into effect as Opration Clean Halls under the guise of cleaning up drug and gang activity in inner-city housing projects, and was put in place based on a loose interpretation of a section of the NY Penal Code that allows police to stop people and search them based on "reasonable suspicion". State and Federal Courts have ruled numerous times that S&F as implemented by NYPD is not only illegal under NY law, but is unconstitutional, and a blatant breech of civil rights.
No law had to be passed--S&F is a "procedural" policy implemented by the Mayors Office and the NYPD, disguising government-sponsored racist thuggery as "increased security for the public good".
But they keep on doing it, because much like in Chicago and DC, the City Government and LEAs seem to believe that the Law of the Land and the Rulings of the Courts don't apply to them because they are soem sort of special, anointed neo-nobility with some sort of twisted, evil Divine Right to Rule...
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Well, you can start with some well-researched facts about how LE is REALLY being operated in the US these days, rather than subscribing to some sort of unicorns and fairy dust illusion of Sheriff Andy of Mayberry. Because that's not how it is anymore in most places...
And I'll just say that "respect" is a two-way street, and something that must be EARNED. It is not given to someone just because of the clothes they wear or the car they drive.
And when SOME people have shown themselves to be untrustworthy, paranoid, lawless thugs, acting as nothing more than revenue-collecting mercenaries, I think they deserve every bit of respect due to someone who has chosen such a life-path...
No, but I worked as a DOJ contractor in the DC area for 10 years, doing research and equipment certification, training LEOs, and doing publications fpr the DOJ's NIJ. BJS and BJA.
And I've been a VERY vocal and visible 2A activist for the better part of 10 years, and especially in the last 5 where I was one of the key "movers and shakers" for Open Carry in Eastern North Carolina. So I HAVE to know the law, and I HAVE to know how to deal with cops because when you carry a gun in public as a law-abiding citizen, knowing the law can mean the differnce between not only staying out of jail, but possible being shot.
I know how it it as "the top", and I've seen how this mentality of adversarial "law enforcement" has changed cops over th last few decades. They used to be "Peace Officers". Now they are seen by the government officials as having two main objectives--collecting revenue, and keeping the People in fear, "in line" and under their thumb.
Police are seen--by their employers--as nothing more than modern-day Hessians, and unfortunately, many Departments are living down to that expectation with flying colors...
I agree. I find the entire situation to be very sad...
Believe whatever makes you comfortable. It's a dream and an illusion, but if delusions of Barney Fife help you sleep at night, then so be it...
i don't live in NEW York anymore. as soon as people started checking the garbage cans to see if people were recycling?, i knew it was way past time to go. if stop and frisk had been in use when i lived there, it would have no doubt deterred me from being the criminal i was. arrested many times, i only had bad experiences with 2 police officers during my wayward youth. all the other times i knew why they were in my life at that moment . no reason to give them disrespect. i took responsibility, and went on with my life of self destruction. you get what u give with them for the most part. don't blame the entire group for the actions of a few flawed feeling human beings who have to do a necessary function of civilized society. as smokers we understand flaws of character better than anyone else. so we have no right to judge the flaws of others.
Stop and frisk was never a ballot, never voted on, It is based on the decision of the United States Supreme Court in the case of Terry v. Ohio, in which the United States Supreme Court held that the Fourth Amendment prohibition on unreasonable searches and seizures is not violated when a police officer stops a suspect on the street and frisks him without probable cause to arrest, if the police officer has a reasonable suspicion that the person has committed, is committing, or is about to commit a crime and has a reasonable belief that the person "may be armed and presently dangerous."
I actually don't blame the beat cops, they are trained and encouraged to be the way they are. I blame the system that breeds them, the draconian laws that put people behind bars that drives modern day slavery. A person with a vice (such as drugs) shouldn't be thrown in jail unless they are major traffickers. They are trained to push you to the limit so if you are innocent the smallest thing you say or do to a cop can turn you into a felon and make you property of the state, thrown in a privately owned prison industry that trades on the stock exchange and the worth only grows based on the amount of people in prison. Put in a place where you are forced to work in fields, making license plates, government office furniture, brooms, brushes, some companies out source data entry and call centers to prisons, and the prisoners literally make cents for a days work. It is slavery. When you are released from prison you are branded as a felon for life, noone will hire you, the only thing to do is create your own business/work or become /continue to be a criminal where you will end up back in a prison working for nothing.
*I'm ranting again*
but heres a list of companies who use prison production and labor
MicroJet, Nike, Lockhart Technologies, Inc., United Vision Group, Chatleff Controls, TWA, Dell Computers, Microsoft, Eddie Bauer, Planet Hollywood, Redwood Outdoors, Wilson Sporting Goods, Union Bay, Elliot Bay, A&I Manufacturing, Washington Marketing Group, Omega Pacific, J.C. Penney, Victoria’s Secret, Best Western Hotels, Honda, K-Mart, Target, Kwalu, Inc., McDonald’s, Hawaiian Tropical Products, Burger King, “Prison Blues” jeans line, New York, New York Hotel/Casino, Impereal Palace Hotel/Casino, Crisp Country Solid Waste Management Authority, “No Fear” Clothing Line, C.M.T. Blues, Konica, Allstate, Merrill Lynch, Shearson Lehman, Louisiana Pacific, Parke-Davis, Upjohn, Heinz-Wattie, Living Earth Co., Gala Gardens, Layton’s Linen Hire, Morro Holdings, Encore Tech., Peek Displays, New Zealand Post, Ideal Print, Royal (NZ) Foundation for the Blind, Packaging Specialists, Taylor’s Group, Cortex Group, Premier Bin and Pallet Supplies, Price McClaren, Stages, Larson’s Concrete and Drainage, Calix Nursery, Garden City Composting, Southern Seeds Tech., Christchurch City Council. Fresh Direct, Fergusson Services
"the fuzz" made me lol, did you just date yourself? am I dating myself? lol
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