SXmini M Class (TEMP CONTROL)

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Mhansel411

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I think these two points sum up a lot of the frustration with tp Varina since both are true! Without dry burning it is a pita to assess the presence of hotspots/legs etc. If you don't and problems ensue then there is always the possibility juice is being overheated etc as temp is increased to get a decent vape! Rocks and hard places.

So I think there is a real chance that these issues will turn a lot of people off tp before it really gets off the ground. That is a shame but the fact is that to get it to work often does require some thought and some fiddling around. It's not a plud-and-play activity yet!

Yes tinkering is a must. I'm still constantly getting hot spots and sending my temp readings all kinds of whacky. So I finally had enough of putting everything together and then testing, now I just build, then drip drops of juice to identify if there is going to be an issue before I go through the hassle of wicking and what not to then find an issue.
 

BNEAT

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that is if you can get the battery out first. I found the perfect thing. a 1879 gold dollar! I hope you get the irony. need some Chinese coinage. don't worry, the flask is double the trouble and does not run much longer.

temp works fine if you guys break down and get the kanger coils. I know that is like against the law here but at least it works no problem. they are as good as but the most esoteric builds. probably last longer too. I am not praising them I am just saying why the hassle.

Why would you say the Flask doesn't run much longer?
 

TheotherSteveS

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that is if you can get the battery out first. I found the perfect thing. a 1879 gold dollar! I hope you get the irony. need some Chinese coinage. don't worry, the flask is double the trouble and does not run much longer.

temp works fine if you guys break down and get the kanger coils. I know that is like against the law here but at least it works no problem. they are as good as but the most esoteric builds. probably last longer too. I am not praising them I am just saying why the hassle.
They don't work very well for me I'm afraid! Nothing but hassle...
 

nic_fix

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it is a given that different folks have different luck. too many variables here. the flask does not last "me" much longer,ymmv. the kanger coils are splendid for "me",ymmv. I just went to a coin shop. this is going to be another ymmv. tried all the modern Chinese coins. worked but not better than usa coins. the Mexicans saved the day with diez pesos. again, that is ymmv but it fits like a glove for "me". you honestly cannot compare experiences across the board with any of this stuff. one mans rubbish is another man's gold. incidentally the gold mex coin was too expensive to use as a screwdriver imo. I hope we can agree our results are not universal. this stuff is just too complex. it is nice to rely experiences for a basis though. I hope I am right and the way I view this does not upset anyone. it's just my opinion. take it with a grain of salt if you must.
 

Yozhik

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Yea I did a closer look and the numbers don't come in where they should IMO when in joule mode on mine similar to Pbusardo's. For Soft mode I'm getting about 58% power on the initial 2 sec signal, Powerful is about 74% and Powerful+ is about 76%. The numbers were from roughly the first 3 sec prior to TL being engaged with the same frequency. I've sent an email to Varitube and Yihi for an explanation.

Are you referring to voltage peak or did you measure the area under the curve? Or did you determine that all configurations had identical modulation? For example, for PWM, a 5V signal at a 30% duty cycle delivers less power than a 4V signal at a 50% duty cycle. Thus, for the variable frequency modulation of the SX Mini, one needs to confirm that standard/powerful/soft isn't adjusting the modulation as well as the voltage. Ideally, what one would have is a measurement of voltage and current over a few seconds for different configurations. Then you can compute the energy delivered over a period of time (e.g., 2 seconds) and see if there is a difference.
 
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Braddahbill

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Well my second M should be here tomorrow. I really love the vape on this. .08-.09 seems like the sweet spot to me at 410 18J. One thing I was wondering what was the site that had the skins for the IPV. I want to keep checking it because I think they would be crazy not to come out with one for these they are pretty popular. I do think I am going to get a roll of Tempered 28awg 50M and some 26awg 25m just to play around with. I like the way it is easier to wrap with. By the way Busardo came out with a review on the Lemo 2.

IPV Mini Silicone Case

That was me. You have to do a little cutting and the fit is not perfect, but it works and won't peel the paint when you take it off.
 

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Braddahbill

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I can partially close both sides at a time or one side by itself. Airflow hitting the side where there is no coil would make my vape way cooler than I like.

I guess my point is, why should I be pursuing temp control with a vape I don't enjoy? I've tried single coil numerous types and it never gives me the satisfying slightly warm vape that I like. And to add even more airflow to make the vape cold doesn't make any sense. Not to mention airflow from the other side would reduce flavor. I did just try that though and the results were as I expected. Cold, lacking flavor, etc.

Maybe you just need to find the right atty that works for you. My first 2 weeks I built on all 3 versions of the Lemo and have just added the Sub Tank to the rotation. The temp control builds have been just as warm and thick as the kanthal builds if not better. Yes, there were a few bumps along the way, but they were sorted out quickly.

My suggestion to anyone is to get an atty designed to run a single coil. Once you get used to the learning curve of the SX Mini and have no problems then move on to a dual coil device if you desire.
 

2legsshrt

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Still having problems... I feel for you. I'd be extremely frustrated if I were you. I was expecting problems building ni200 but I guess I've been very lucky so far because I have had none on the Subtank mini. Were you ever able to upload pics of your builds?
Thats me too Vlad. I just wrap up 7 wraps on my coil master and stretch it out squeeze it back till I'm happy with the spacing. Then put it on which I've found so much easier since my wife got me a big magnifying glass with a light on a stand so I can see that the wire is trapped good. The Kanger STM has worked great so far going to do another build and put it on the M that I have and break it in a little if it works like it should it will be already for my M that gets here tomorrow. I ordered 6 more HE2's I found I got 22,500 Joules with them and less sag when I use it since I got the M then the AW 2200mAh which I get 18,000 Joules with. Those HE2's are really good and 1/2 the price of the AW's but can't use them in my Vari 2.5's. If I would have known that a few months ago I could've saved myself some money cause I got 10 of the AW's to replace my 1 1/2 year old AW's which work just fine on my rDNA40 which I sold to pay for my 2nd M. Gave a friend a really good deal and I know he will get it to work right because he is really good with builds, he is a modder so even if he wants to upgrade it to the atty lock he can do it himself. VS wants 100 bucks to do it. Plus it is still on warranty. got kind of wordy here sorry bout that.
 

2legsshrt

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IPV Mini Silicone Case

That was me. You have to do a little cutting and the fit is not perfect, but it works and won't peel the paint when you take it off.
Who did you get them from and I wonder if they will start making one for the SX. They would be crazy not too. Looks good the way you did it. They could sell a ton of them, I know I loved my shark skin. That great the way you ended up doing the bottom because they don't really recommend charging with the USB. I wondered how you were going to do it. Didn't see it after you came up with a final. I just charged my rDNA with the port. Great job. You should sell them your idea.
 
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nic_fix

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got an 8 cent washer. Mexican coin is a little better but I picked too large of a washer.

about me saying this is very complex stuff. a while back someone stated the tank leaks, not the mod. then how do I explain st leaks like a sieve on any of my other mods but not sx mini s or m. there is luck involved too. there are just too many variables in this sport for everyone to get the same results. I am not trying to say anything just pointing this out as I see it. of course with luck involved some people will in fact get the same results. perhaps not if they try to. I feel temp control is worth the effort. even though I am using st coils. it is a big milestone imo. well, as of now. just wait.

the m's paint seems more robust than the s. the rdna pretty much requires the shark skin. unfortunately I did not know that. if you are going to drop it, indeed a case is in order.
 

ramrod

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My new wrap for the M :thumb:
Yihi is saying they are releasing a silicone case for the M class in mid May. But informed me they probably won't do one for the S class. This makes, no sense to me. If anything the S class could use it more! (Form factor) But no matter, wraps are cosmetic, like personalized custom paint. They don't really protect like a well designed silicone case...
 
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ramrod

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Thats not really your "sweet spot", you are just "fooling" the device and found your sweet spot there. As Yihi recommends the 0.065 build, that is where the unit will be the MOST accurate. Will 0.09 (or 0.15 for that matter work)...YES, but the unit will not be as accurate as if it was @ 0.065. ie., your temp and joules will be further off using a 0.015 Kanger OCC then a 0.9 RBA build and even further then the true 0.065 build.

I found in both the STM and Lemo2, 4.5 wraps -- 28G -- 3.0mm spaced and I am between 0.065-0.068 on both. Joules setting is irrelevant as it hits my 440 temp setting and throttles there (quicker pulses at higher joules). And I find the best flavor, no metal taste and least fluctuation from my set temp with this. Whatever your wire choice is, shoot for that 0.065 #. There's a reason Yihi recommends it. You'll see the difference.
I think most people should read and listen to this post from dannyben if they have the SXmini M class . If Practiced, this thread would have more pictures of very cool SXmini rigs !
 

nic_fix

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that's obviously why it is not working properly with the st. I wish they had made a more prominent point about .065 and maybe I would be without one. on the other hand it is hard to imagine it has such a narrow margin of accuracy. .065 or else! that is a real shame(for me). it is working, sort of. dna did not like me either. I might have to forego temp control until the next round. I am unhappy right now.

I was wondering something. is the m a different form factor than the s? have both right here look about the same to me.
 

JimScotty0

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One other question - when I use powerful and powerful+ in kanthal mode it hits hard immediately then backs off after a few seconds like it should. In joules mode with nickel it starts weak, bumps up after a second, then bumps back down after a few seconds. Why would it do that?
Could it be temperature limiting kicking in?
 

JimScotty0

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One of the ways to see if you are having a hot leg issue is to try the water test.

Throw some new dry wicks on the build. re-establish the baseline resistance with the new wicks. Set temp to around 400F. Go around mid power on the Joules, 25 should be fine.

Then saturate your wicks with water. A LOT of water... LoL

Usually when I am doing this I have the wicks really long so I can kinda run the wicks under the faucet while I am testing for total saturation the whole time I am firing. You may not be able to do this with a vertical build like that.

What you should observe when you fire is that the temp should rise up to somewhere around 200-220 (boiling point of water) and stall out, never getting much higher... Maybe a little higher or a little lower, but it should most certainly NEVER reach 400.

If you're still popping off the temp control, observe your coils for any glowing anywhere. If they are glowing anywhere, that is the source of your rapid increase in resistance, and thus the SXmini believes the temp of the coil has also increased. The most common point I have found glowing is the legs. And that has only been with 30AWG wire, and only when I was using more than ~17-19J of power. 10-15J was fine. Twisted 30AWG didn't give me any issues at all, and I would suspect that 28AWG would fare better than 30 as well. All my builds were clean, non contact coils and shouldn't have experienced hot legs at all, but they did. Maybe that's the 30AWG nickel being a bit more sensitive to the conductivity of the juice than Kanthal or NiChrome is?

Also, high VG juices are going to need to be vaped at higher temps. So if you're using a 100% VG juice, I would say a temp from 500-550F sounds about normal. That's where the juice starts to vaporize. Use the Joules setting to control the heat and density of the vapor.
Great explanation Dam718! My next build I have to give that a try. I guess what it comes down to is you want the heat in the coil itself where the wicking is at and not in the legs where the resistance will go up and the TC will shut down additional heat that the coil actually needs and not the legs. Good deal! :thumbs:
 
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JimScotty0

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I've observed this as well. In temp control mode, I leave mine on standard. In the PBusardo review video it shows there being less voltage applied in powerful, and even less still in powerful+ during the first 2 seconds in temp control mode. Doesn't make much sense. In standard it ramps up to the proper voltage within the first second and stays steady. Looks like the powerful/powerful+ modes don't work as intended in TC, at least with the current firmware revision.
But don't forget Phil did those tests when running at 50J. It could be at that setting the mod was already maxed out and can't go beyond the 50J to produce the higher initial settings. I don't know for sure, but that is just a guess. That would be a good question for Yihi to explain about the mode settings in TC mode.
 
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JimScotty0

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I own a Marquis. Love it with Kanthal. Absolutely awful results with Ni200. Air comes in from the back and then up, leaving the front hot. Coil legs are very long. That huge mass of metal that the positive post is on acts a a big heat reservoir.

Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk
What that is telling me is that with TC you really want the resistance to and heat to come from the coil itself and not from the legs or the posts. Something to consider when choosing an atty and the type of build when using TC.
 
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