SXmini M Class (TEMP CONTROL)

[Ariel_MX]

Chatting with a friend about the SX Mini M Class (and the SX Mini 350J Chip), we came to the conclusion that it will be great if Yihi implement, in this new firmware upgrade that is coming, a feature to set the internal resistance of the atomizer.

The internal resistance of each atomizer is dependant of a lot of factors, as its design, contact points, materials used, etc.

When we "set or calibrate" the resistance in ours SX Minis M, the measured resistance includes the "internal resistance" of the atomizer, as the temperature calculations are done based in the variation of resistance due the change in temperature of the coil, those temperature calculations would be different with two atomizers with the same displayed resistance (during the calibration process), but different internal resistance, for example:

Atomizer 1:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.018 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.047 ohms

Atomizer 2:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.026 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.039 ohms

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, the temperature calculations would be more accurate.

So the temperature calculations for Atomizer 1 should be made based on a resistance of 0.047 ohms.

Of course, we could be totally wrong about this, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

An experiment to measure the internal resistance of my Tilemahos v1 (previously washed, cleaned, tightened all the connection points, etc.).

4 strands of pure silver wire:

Internal resistance:

6 total turns + legs of 28 AWG Nickel NI200 wire, 2.5 mm diameter:

Actual coil resistance would be more or less: 0.081 ohms - 0.014 ohms = 0.067 ohms

What do you guys think about it?

 

[Yozhik]

Chatting with a friend about the SX Mini M Class (and the SX Mini 350J Chip), we came to the conclusion that it will be great if Yihi implement, in this new firmware upgrade that is coming, a feature to set the internal resistance of the atomizer.

The internal resistance of each atomizer is dependant of a lot of factors, as its design, contact points, materials used, etc.

When we "set or calibrate" the resistance in ours SX Minis M, the measured resistance includes the "internal resistance" of the atomizer, as the temperature calculations are done based in the variation of resistance due the change in temperature of the coil, those temperature calculations would be different with two atomizers with the same displayed resistance (during the calibration process), but different internal resistance, for example:

Atomizer 1:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.018 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.047 ohms

Atomizer 2:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.026 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.039 ohms

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, the temperature calculations would be more accurate.

So the temperature calculations for Atomizer 1 should be made based on a resistance of 0.047 ohms.

Of course, we could be totally wrong about this, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

An experiment to measure the internal resistance of my Tilemahos v1 (previously washed, cleaned, tightened all the connection points, etc.).

4 strands of pure silver wire:

Internal resistance:

6 total turns + legs of 28 AWG Nickel NI200 wire, 2.5 mm diameter:

Actual coil resistance would be more or less: 0.081 ohms - 0.014 ohms = 0.067 ohms

What do you guys think about it?

It makes sense, but the way to implement that would require a change in the algorithm. I see something like that working better when the bluetooth chip comes out. Then you could set all the parameters for your atomizer on your phone.

 

[gilegue]

Chatting with a friend about the SX Mini M Class (and the SX Mini 350J Chip), we came to the conclusion that it will be great if Yihi implement, in this new firmware upgrade that is coming, a feature to set the internal resistance of the atomizer.

The internal resistance of each atomizer is dependant of a lot of factors, as its design, contact points, materials used, etc.

When we "set or calibrate" the resistance in ours SX Minis M, the measured resistance includes the "internal resistance" of the atomizer, as the temperature calculations are done based in the variation of resistance due the change in temperature of the coil, those temperature calculations would be different with two atomizers with the same displayed resistance (during the calibration process), but different internal resistance, for example:

Atomizer 1:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.018 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.047 ohms

Atomizer 2:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.026 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.039 ohms

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, the temperature calculations would be more accurate.

So the temperature calculations for Atomizer 1 should be made based on a resistance of 0.047 ohms.

Of course, we could be totally wrong about this, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

An experiment to measure the internal resistance of my Tilemahos v1 (previously washed, cleaned, tightened all the connection points, etc.).

4 strands of pure silver wire:

Internal resistance:

6 total turns + legs of 28 AWG Nickel NI200 wire, 2.5 mm diameter:

Actual coil resistance would be more or less: 0.081 ohms - 0.014 ohms = 0.067 ohms

What do you guys think about it?

Interesting, I'm not sure if yihi already put the internal resistance in their j chip or not. As for the m class, they should because it is a whole Mod while the j chip is just a chip CMIIW. Anyone have a fact on this?

 

[Yozhik]

So who wants to pimp their SX Mini?

SX Mini Custom-Knöpfe | Box-Mods | Mods | Steampipes

 

[SavePaperVapor]

Chatting with a friend about the SX Mini M Class (and the SX Mini 350J Chip), we came to the conclusion that it will be great if Yihi implement, in this new firmware upgrade that is coming, a feature to set the internal resistance of the atomizer.

The internal resistance of each atomizer is dependant of a lot of factors, as its design, contact points, materials used, etc.

When we "set or calibrate" the resistance in ours SX Minis M, the measured resistance includes the "internal resistance" of the atomizer, as the temperature calculations are done based in the variation of resistance due the change in temperature of the coil, those temperature calculations would be different with two atomizers with the same displayed resistance (during the calibration process), but different internal resistance, for example:

Atomizer 1:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.018 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.047 ohms

Atomizer 2:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.026 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.039 ohms

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, the temperature calculations would be more accurate.

So the temperature calculations for Atomizer 1 should be made based on a resistance of 0.047 ohms.

Of course, we could be totally wrong about this, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

An experiment to measure the internal resistance of my Tilemahos v1 (previously washed, cleaned, tightened all the connection points, etc.).

4 strands of pure silver wire:

Internal resistance:

6 total turns + legs of 28 AWG Nickel NI200 wire, 2.5 mm diameter:

Actual coil resistance would be more or less: 0.081 ohms - 0.014 ohms = 0.067 ohms

What do you guys think about it?

The dna 200 has this. Can't wait to test it.

 

[Monk72]

Hey guys I mostly lurk ecf, but I need some advice, if possible.

From day one, I've built clean, spaced, firmly connected ni200 coils. I'm using 28 AWG Lightening Vapes ni200. Just about every coil I've put on either my STM rba or Lemo has a similar problem. After properly lock in the resistance (.065-.09), I fire it, and I get problems.

I'm running 22-25J at anywhere from 350-480F. Once it hits the desired temp, it starts jumping up and down about 10 degrees and making a quiet sputtering type sound. The battery icon also jumps up and down with it. It still vapes, but a bit weaker than it should.

I tried the prebuilt .15ohm OCC heads for a bit (They'd always end up locking in at .10-.11). I could get some stability out of these, but it didn't last long and they started doing the same thing my rba deck would do.

Everything is tight and clean, but only been washed with water. Is this likely a sign that my STM or Lemo is a bit dirty and needs an alcohol bath?

Any ideas would be much appreciated. This gets pretty frustrating.


EDIT: Video link

sxmini.mp4 - Google Drive

 

[2legsshrt]

Well I got my sleeves from Ginger Vapes and I like them a lot. They are a little slippery but that will hopefully go away but awesome fit. Now all 3 are double bagged. Jwraps inside sleeve outside should protect them very well. I have the carbon fiber inside they seem to fit really well does the slipperiness go away?

 

[Yozhik]

Hey guys I mostly lurk ecf, but I need some advice, if possible.

From day one, I've built clean, spaced, firmly connected ni200 coils. I'm using 28 AWG Lightening Vapes ni200. Just about every coil I've put on either my STM rba or Lemo has a similar problem. After properly lock in the resistance (.065-.09), I fire it, and I get problems.

I'm running 22-25J at anywhere from 350-480F. Once it hits the desired temp, it starts jumping up and down about 10 degrees and making a quiet sputtering type sound. The battery icon also jumps up and down with it. It still vapes, but a bit weaker than it should.

I tried the prebuilt .15ohm OCC heads for a bit (They'd always end up locking in at .10-.11). I could get some stability out of these, but it didn't last long and they started doing the same thing my rba deck would do.

Everything is tight and clean, but only been washed with water. Is this likely a sign that my STM or Lemo is a bit dirty and needs an alcohol bath?

Any ideas would be much appreciated. This gets pretty frustrating.


EDIT: Video link

sxmini.mp4 - Google Drive

That's how it is supposed to work. The temperature is being updated in real time. The rattle snaking sound is from the pulse frequency modulation as it seeks to limit the temperature. You can reduce it by lowering the Joules. You can also adjust the pre-heat if desired to compensate for the lower Joule setting.

 

[Bikenstein]

Chatting with a friend about the SX Mini M Class (and the SX Mini 350J Chip), we came to the conclusion that it will be great if Yihi implement, in this new firmware upgrade that is coming, a feature to set the internal resistance of the atomizer.

The internal resistance of each atomizer is dependant of a lot of factors, as its design, contact points, materials used, etc.

When we "set or calibrate" the resistance in ours SX Minis M, the measured resistance includes the "internal resistance" of the atomizer, as the temperature calculations are done based in the variation of resistance due the change in temperature of the coil, those temperature calculations would be different with two atomizers with the same displayed resistance (during the calibration process), but different internal resistance, for example:

Atomizer 1:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.018 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.047 ohms

Atomizer 2:

Displayed resistance (calibration process): 0.065 ohms
Internal resistance: 0.026 ohms

Actual coil resistance: 0.039 ohms

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, the temperature calculations would be more accurate.

So the temperature calculations for Atomizer 1 should be made based on a resistance of 0.047 ohms.

Of course, we could be totally wrong about this, but it makes sense, doesn't it?

An experiment to measure the internal resistance of my Tilemahos v1 (previously washed, cleaned, tightened all the connection points, etc.).

4 strands of pure silver wire:

Internal resistance:

6 total turns + legs of 28 AWG Nickel NI200 wire, 2.5 mm diameter:

Actual coil resistance would be more or less: 0.081 ohms - 0.014 ohms = 0.067 ohms

What do you guys think about it?

I did a 6 wrap 28g x 2.5mm Ni-coil in a GS Air M earlier and got .064 ohms on the SX so I guess the connection is good and there is 0 internal resistance with the BCCs.

 

[Bikenstein]

So who wants to pimp their SX Mini?

SX Mini Custom-Knöpfe | Box-Mods | Mods | Steampipes

I like the look of the Kunststoff Shwarz better

 

[Monk72]

That's how it is supposed to work. The temperature is being updated in real time. The rattle snaking sound is from the pulse frequency modulation as it seeks to limit the temperature. You can reduce it by lowering the Joules. You can also adjust the pre-heat if desired to compensate for the lower Joule setting.

Oof really?

What about situations where I have it set at say 450F and it won't get past ~400F.

Just up the joules?

 

[Bikenstein]

Yes or drop the temp

 

[Yozhik]

Oof really?

What about situations where I have it set at say 450F and it won't get past ~400F.

Just up the joules?

When a coil is nicely wicked, vaporization will stop the coil from further increasing after a certain temperature (which is dependent on a number of factors). Once the e-liquid runs out, that is when the coil will rapidly increase in temperature. The reason that you're build was stopping at 400 F was more likely a result of the e-liquid, coil build and energy input selected than the SXM deciding that 400 F was a place to stop.

 

[Monk72]

Thanks dude!

 

[JimScotty0]

Oof really?

What about situations where I have it set at say 450F and it won't get past ~400F.

Just up the joules?

Don't try to make it go higher than the build allows otherwise it will jump around. Every build, ejuice, wicking, will have its sweet spot. Find the temp that gives you your preference and then just set the joules just enough to keep that temp stable. I have some combinations that will not go above 390F but still producing good vapor and flavor.

 

[Braddahbill]

I have a Sub Tank mini single air hole (early model) and I also bought a replacement air control (single air hole) and bell cap from Sweet-Vapes which is like buying another tank but with out the pre made coils and RBA section. I have NO problems running the 2 tanks, my builds are rock solid.

I just purchased a black STM and an additional RBA (old style), I'll report back if I see any problems with the new black STM or the RBA plus.

I don't have any issues with subtanks either

In fact the opposite as they give the most consistent readings out of all my tanks

They are not keen on Ti Clapton coils Yet ... work in progress

 

[Braddahbill]

I got my AFC (single hole) from Sweet-Vapes, I also bought the Bell Cap too. The AFC and Bell Cap came out to $16.XX together.

Subtank Mini Bell Cap

@2legsshrt

Where have you been buying your Subtank Mini AFC base's from? I went and screwed up one of my Subtank mini AFC tonight. Don't ask just note it's not a good idea to try to take something this small apart with a pair of 10" channellock pliers..

 

[Vlad1]

I got my AFC (single hole) from Sweet-Vapes, I also bought the Bell Cap too. The AFC and Bell Cap came out to $16.XX together.

Subtank Mini Bell Cap

Thanks, I ended up buying one from sweetvapes and another from myvaporstore just in case I decide to screw another one up.

 

[Ariel_MX]

This part of the e-mail I sent to Yihi:

I know a new firmware for the SX350J chip is about to be released in these days, that includes the capability of using Titanium Grade 1 wire as coil on the Joules Mode (Temperature Limiting).

Thinking about how the temperature limiting feature is implemented, I think it would be a great improvement if you inlcude a new feature, in which the user could set the internal resistance of his atomizer, so the SX350J chip, can take that data in consideration to calculate the true resistance of the coil.

Taking in consideration the internal resistance of the atomizer, would make the temperature calculations more accurate.

How I think it could be implemented?

In a similar way in how the "Resitance Lock" feature is implemented, for example:

Previously the user will have to prepare his atomizer for the "Internal Resistance" setting, by using a very conductive wire, as silver wire as if it was a normal coil.

Then, the user will screw the atomizer in the SX Mini and enter to the "Internal Resistance" checking option, the SX Mini will store that value as the internal resistance of the atomizer.

Then, the user will prepare his atomizer with a normal coil for Joules mode (nickel or titanium), and will have to lock the resistance (same way it currently works, by pressing the "up" and "down" buttons at the same time).

The difference is that the chip knows now what is the internal resistance of the atomizer, so the chip can subtract that value to have the real resistance of the coil, which should be used for the temperature calculations.

It shouln't be difficult to implement in the new firmware, and it will make the SX350J chip even more precise.

For example, I did some experiments:

[Experiments with images]

The reply from Yihi:

Dear Ariel,

Thanks for your email and time.

Re your idea, we already passed to our engineer department. It is workable but need waiting for their news.


Waiting for your soon reply.

B.rgds,
Cari

 

[2legsshrt]

How do you know the internal resistance of your atty.