The Final Count Down -- Are You Ready?
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No, not the same thing, but similar- except now it involves far more than the federal government. None of us know exactly what's going to happen, like no one did then. I don't think many expected a virtual 100% reprieve for several years.
My take: I'm 100% certain that vaping will exist, and would bet my life on it. Maybe all legal products will be BT owned. Maybe some unknown investors are preparing PMTA's that will work. Maybe almost nothing will be legal, and 90% of what's available will be black market. Too many unknowns about what will happen federally, and state by state, or for that matter, cities and counties, and even other countries.
But vape products available in 6 months, a year, 2 years.....that'll be very different than today. If you're good at adapting, and don't care about what you pay, don't worry about it. If you want to continue to vape the way you do today, you're probably already behind in stockpiling.
I didn't perceive the Deeming as a panic or frenzy, but rather an indication of things to come and as such have already stocked up. I made a comparative meme at the time of the Deeming with a frog in a heated pot since it was to be implemented incrementally. Sure enough they further put it off and put it off to where the frog feels safe. However the writing is on the wall with the court mandated FDA deadline approaching and what is written in their latest "guidance". Most vapers (I've talked to several "Joe public" vapors) have no clue that storm is coming.
The recent CDC & Media fiasco of blaming vaping and not the the tainted (and for at least the most part illegal) THC carts brought an unexpected element. Locals here went through that same kind of panic in the mid to late 80's with an unscrupulous supply of pot laced with embalming fluid from St Louis, but media reported it straight and law enforcement shut it down pronto.
This time vaping is around and is hated so much by the control freaks. It was a political jack pot, a perfect storm so to speak. Governors shutting down selling flavors and some all vaping related items to make political points.
The storm can be viewed from my location but it has hit others already due to the unexpected element. So the panic has already started, but IMO the real frenzy is still to come.
When you've got multiple states banning all flavored vapes, and one state outright banning all vape products regardless whether they are flavored or not? Massachusetts did the latter with no warning at all, effective immediately a few days ago. And we've still got the PMTA deadline now less than 7-1/2 months away...
Yes, we've had times when people felt uncomfortable before, but I wouldn't describe them as "panics". Heck, I'm not sure I'd describe what's happening right now as a "panic", because that would imply substantially higher prices in the marketplace.
I'm not sure there's ever been quite the sense of urgency that many people have now. The state-level bans are something of a wake-up call. The notion that "vaping is killing people" that the media is spreading like a wildfire makes it nearly certain that the PMTA deadline will stand where it is now (May 11th, 2020) and that once it passes, enforcement will be vigorous.
Me, I finished stocking up more than three years ago, and I have never once regretted it. My ongoing costs to vape have been essentially $0.00 per year since then. OK, some new batteries every once in a while and maybe $20 a year for the electricity to run my freezer?
I'm still not clear about nic solution as it relates to the feds. What I know is gear and juice are in the center of the deeming deadline in May. I'm not seeing or hearing that nic solution IS. Yes, I've heard aplenty that, "If they can wipe out the gear and juice then they can wipe out nic on a moments notice". Of course they can! The government can take away anything I have on a moment's notice and especially nic. But still, is nic solution a part of the May deadline? I don't know if it is.
I put my final two liters of nic in the freezer. This order put me to the point where I should never have to buy nic again. I feel like I’m set on hardware too between what I’ve saved from 10 years of vaping and recent purchases. Future purchases will be less and just for fun.
I downloaded that almost 4 years ago according to my computer so yep, whomever made it missed the fine details but the idea the BT would be the ones to survive and with tobacco flavors was spot on.A glass dropper bottle with a non child-proof cap? No way would that be "FDA Approved".
It is covered by the deeming in so far as you need a manufactures license and FDA number to purchase. There has not been any mention of enforcement.......yet. Some suppliers have voluntarily started limiting sale of higher strengths. So anyone's guess.
So then technically, next May it will be illegal for a supplier to sell nic solution to a slug like me, correct?It is covered by the deeming in so far as you need a manufactures license and FDA number to purchase. There has not been any mention of enforcement.......yet. Some suppliers have voluntarily started limiting sale of higher strengths. So anyone's guess.
I don't know for sure whether it is or isn't. It's not a "finished tobacco product", so it doesn't need to a PMTA in order to be sold to FDA registered tobacco product manufacturers. But I am sure the the regs could be interpreted to require a PMTA if it's sold to consumers.
I'm don't think anyone can answer that with absolute certainly.
I'll say this: I would consider an assumption that it will remain legally available after May 11th to be imprudent at best.
Nic is under FDA purview, considered a tobacco product. But I don't think anything written yet specifically details how it will be handled as a standalone. So I don't think we can, with any certainty, say it will be illegal.
I'm counting on restrictions at minimum (strength available to the public, authorized pathways to market). And banning for purchase by the general public, requiring it only be used for products passing PMTA's at maximum. Actually, this is potentially the most unknown and impactful thing to be determined.
If it isn't mentioned in the forthcoming 1,000 page regulation, cautious suppliers will restrict sales to individuals out of fear. It's kind of like parking a dozen police cars in front of a liquor store. May not be against the law/regulation, but who in their right mind is going to go in there and try it?
I think that what we call "base solution" would still be considered a consumer product, as is, if it is sold to the general public. It really is just another version of a non-flavoured nicotine juice, so it would have to meet all of the PMTA and packaging requirements for a consumer item.
If the liquid is limited for sale only to a recognized manufacturer/wholesaler for processing to make a final, consumer, product, it would be treated as an unfinished product. There might be records reviews to verify that sales were to actual manufacturers and not general consumers.
If the liquid is limited for sale only to a recognized manufacturer/wholesaler for processing to make a final, consumer, product, it would be treated as an unfinished product. There might be records reviews to verify that sales were to actual manufacturers and not general consumers.
Yes, it would be unwise to assume nic will be available to us as part of the post-May deadline. I know that. In fact, it may be unwise to think it will be available to us next week. I'm just curious if it is a definite yes or no under Deeming (for consumers). Seems there is no definitive yes or no, but perhaps a maybe. I find it a little odd how we definitively know gear and juice are squarely in the sights of Deeming regs but not nic solution. But then again, no one has ever accused the govt of knowing what the hell they are thinking either (if they even are thinking).
Years ago I dropped from 24mg to 3mg nic strength over a period of months. I'm still there and my daily MTL juice consumption is about 8ml (two 4.2ml Kayfun tanks).
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