The Flavor Apprentice Flavoring Thread

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

My taste buds must be weird he he. I love the watermelon on its own at 15%. Vapeable pretty much right after you mix it..

Bill how long do you steep the bubble bursts? I made 30ml of the grape last night (left out the sweet and tart for now though, just went with the bubblegum). Last night it smelled almost like the creams were overpowering it. Just got home from work and haven't cracked it open yet..

Was gonna make the pink starburst too but damn it, the ONE thing I forgot to order was the cotton candy! Vanilla swirl smells pretty rad, I kinda wanna try it solo he he..

Nude Nicotine sent me some BRY4 with an order of supplies and wow. tobacco tastes pretty awesome without all the other crap in a cig! I'm gonna have to try to mix one soon. Its blowing my mind on the Magma!

As I mentioned, Megan also likes just straight watermelon, and at 15%, so you are on track there.

Should be able to vape the bubbleburst ATM. Better two hours later, perhaps hits total prime within 24 - 48 hours. I liked it just fine ATM. However, if you leave out the sweet and tart, it's just grape bubblegum, which is still good, imho. If the creams seem too much to you, back off 1% or so, but make sure and test them at every step. Smell is very useful, but not always conclusive vape-wise.

Regarding Pink Strawberry, you can probably substitute the cotton candy with Sweetener and be fine. I would lower the percentage a point or so.

Here you on the RY4. Technically, a sweetener, and the level of sweetness determined by the number, "4", in this case. Often used with other tobaccos and good on its own. Many feel that it does emulate tobacco, but not everyone. Thanks for the post!

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I have a question for all you mixing geniuses. I was able to come up with a really great recipe for strawberries and cream, but so far I haven't had much luck with blueberry anything. I was thinking of trying to adapt my strawberry recipe to use with blueberry, like so:

This is the strawberry recipe I'm using, and it's great -- the supporting flavors are the same 16% as the strawberry flavor, and it tastes GREAT:

Inawera Shisha Strawberry 16%
TFA DX Bavarian Cream 6.5%
TFA Vanilla Swirl 4%
TFA Sweetener 3.5%
CAP Sweet Cream 2%


This is what I have in mind for blueberry, and I'm wondering if y'all have any ideas for how I might improve it:

TFA Blueberry Extra 15%
TFA Wild Blueberry 5%
TFA DX Bavarian Cream 4%
TFA Vanilla Swirl 4%
TFA Whipped Cream 4%
TFA Sweetener 3%
CAP Sweet Cream 2%

The blueberry flavors add up to 20%, while the supporting flavors are 17%. It's almost entirely a TFA recipe, other than the CAP sweet cream, which is why I thought some of you guys might see any flaws, or be able to point out how I might improve it. I'm just tired of wasting ingredients on mixes that don't turn out well; must be about a half dozen blueberry efforts by now that haven't turned out well at all.

Andria

Great S&C recipe, Andria. I have a similar one. Great job!

I think you may have too much flavoring in the blueberry. I would try and tone it down about 10%, because the flavorings are all there, but a little too high, which can work against us, just as too little can do the same. This is just one where you'll have to do a lot of 100DT's to find the right ratios, but I think you have the right flavorings for a great juice. Another great job!

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

Hey all- Making a list for order and had a few questions-

1) What's the difference between Vanilla Swirl and French Vanilla? The desc. for vanilla swirl says it like the vanilla custard without the custard (so vanilla?)
2) How well does brown sugar work as a general sweetener? I love brown sugar in general, but I'm not sure how well it'd go in things like key lime pie, coke, cherry limeade, etc...
3) Is there a huge difference between the Cherry Blossom and Black Cherry? I'd rather avoid cherries that taste like candy or medicine. I've been scouring the forums and people've said both taste authentic and like cough syrup. lol

I'm on a bit of a budget atm and I'm overseas, so I'd rather avoid getting anything redundant and nasty.

Thanks all!

French vanilla emulates the ice cream flavoring, vanilla swirl is the sweetest of TFA vanillas.

2. Brown sugar is a flavoring, not a sweetener. Wonderful in many mixes, particularly pies, danishes, etc. Not for key lime, coke, or limeade....no, no, no....

3. Yes, cherry blossom is a fragrance and black cherry a flavoring. Black cherry is very good, but tricky. I most often use the cherry extract. None of the TFA cherries is exactly to my liking though, but you can still make great juice with them in very small percentages (1 - 2%). Maraschino is possibly the strongest TFA flavoring ever...I don't recommend it.

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

Well, one of my failed efforts was with the blueberry flavors swapped; I think I find the b-berry extra more realistic, but the wild adds a lot to it.

Andria

I agree. I think you want to keep these at 14 - 16% and in the same ratio as you have them. Maybe try adding some vanilla cupcake to the mix. Always works for me and my blueberry mixes.....and, a bunch of 100DT's, though you're closer than you think, I suspect.

 

[purelyscientific]

French vanilla emulates the ice cream flavoring, vanilla swirl is the sweetest of TFA vanillas.

3. Yes, cherry blossom is a fragrance and black cherry a flavoring. Black cherry is very good, but tricky. I most often use the cherry extract. None of the TFA cherries is exactly to my liking though, but you can still make great juice with them in very small percentages (1 - 2%). Maraschino is possibly the strongest TFA flavoring ever...I don't recommend it.

I found Vanilla Swirl to be more 'in your face' than french vanilla. They are miles apart in terms of flavor. I use the french as more of a complimentary flavor instead of a base note because it can get purfumy in high amounts. I disagree with your description though, I think that vanilla swirl is more similar to ice cream and French is more similar to the vanilla flavor one would get from a vanilla blunt wrap.

To me Cherry Blossom tastes nothing like medicine or any other of the cherry flavorings. It is sweet, floral(in a good way), and not perfumey whatsoever. I recommend it. I've never tried black cherry, but I've tried LA cherry and Maraschino cherry. As Bill said, Maraschino cherry is very strong. Defiantly stay at 2% or under. I don't know about everyone else, but when I went above 2% I got this really weird feeling on my tongue when vaping it. It was almost as if it is caustic at 3%+.

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I found Vanilla Swirl to be more 'in your face' than french vanilla. They are miles apart in terms of flavor. I use the french as more of a complimentary flavor instead of a base note because it can get purfumy in high amounts. I disagree with your description though, I think that vanilla swirl is more similar to ice cream and French is more similar to the vanilla flavor one would get from a vanilla blunt wrap.

To me Cherry Blossom tastes nothing like medicine or any other of the cherry flavorings. It is sweet, floral(in a good way), and not perfumey whatsoever. I recommend it. I've never tried black cherry, but I've tried LA cherry and Maraschino cherry. As Bill said, Maraschino cherry is very strong. Defiantly stay at 2% or under. I don't know about everyone else, but when I went above 2% I got this really weird feeling on my tongue when vaping it. It was almost as if it is caustic at 3%+.

Remember, that taste is subjective, so we can each experience the same flavors in different ways, and that so very often happens if you just read this thread. Not only do we get different tastes, but even when we agree on tastes, the percentages can also vary, sometimes dramatically. I believe I said vanilla swirl is the sweetest of the vanillas. TFA also describes the flavor this way.

I haven't tried cherry blossom yet, and don't plan to. I abhor the maraschino, and found it way too strong at 2% as you suggest. Anything over 1% is way too strong for me. Again, tastes vary, percentages vary, preferences vary, even our perception of all these vary. I can only describe what I experience, and am always interested in hearing how others experience the same flavors and juices. As I've always said, I can provide recipes that work for me, but I know that everyone really needs to adjust them to suit their own preferences. That is the way of a juice maker, and provides most of the fun for me. It is, however, so very helpful when others point us in the right direction, so we can play mad scientist with this vape thing that we all seem to love. By the way, I have no idea what a vanilla blunt wrap is.??? Ciao!

 

[AndriaD]

Great S&C recipe, Andria. I have a similar one. Great job!

I think you may have too much flavoring in the blueberry. I would try and tone it down about 10%, because the flavorings are all there, but a little too high, which can work against us, just as too little can do the same. This is just one where you'll have to do a lot of 100DT's to find the right ratios, but I think you have the right flavorings for a great juice. Another great job!

Ok, that does seem reasonable; I was thinking I might bring the bavarian down a good bit, since it does have a strong "rich" flavor, so maybe only 1% for it, instead of 4%; and then bring each of the others down by 1% -- that would be a total 9% reduction, pretty close to the 10% you suggest. Thx! I think I'll give that a try today!


Andria

 

[AndriaD]

I think another problem I may be having with some of my mixes is an unrealistic "calibration" of 'drops per ml' -- I've just left my calculator set at the default 20 drops per ml, and as several 'round here have noted recently, that's really not true, and definitely depends both on dropper size and viscosity. I cleaned up my 10ml plastic grad. cylinder last night, the only cylinder I have that goes down to 1ml, so today, before I do any mixing, I was planning to actually test my usual droppers in that, to get a REAL idea of drops-per-ml.

This calibration problem became very clear to me when I did the Chocolate Cream Pie mix; since I only mixed a 5ml test batch, I added all the flavors as drops, rather than measuring them in a syringe, though I did add the PG/VG/nic via syringe -- and the mix came out good, but very weak; I added 1 drop more of each of the flavorings to the 5ml, and that seemed much better. Once I can get a REAL idea of how many drops per ml I'm dealing with, with the droppers I commonly use, I should be able to use drops as a better measurement.

Otherwise, that Choc Cream Pie is GREAT -- the only change I would make is just because of my obnoxious sweet tooth -- probably about double the percentage on sweetener.

Andria

 

[b.m.]

I don't know about everyone else, but when I went above 2% I got this really weird feeling on my tongue when vaping it. It was almost as if it is caustic at 3%+.

Haha,yeah,imagine my surprise when i first got that flavor.I got it to make a cherry version of Bill's starburst recipe,and had no idea where to start the cherry at since his recipe was the strawberry version.I used the cherry at either 5% or 6% i can't remember for sure,but wow,my tongue was burning and tingling,throat felt raw,it tasted just how i imagine a spoonful of vaporized robitussin would taste haha.I learned very quickly to avoid the maraschino cherry at all costs,to this day i'm still scared to even think about trying another cherry flavor,that day still haunts me haha.I have small samples of the cherry extract and black cherry,one day i'll build up the courage to give those 2 a try,but for now,they shall remain in the deepest darkest spot in my box,hidden until that day comes haha.

 

[purelyscientific]

By the way, I have no idea what a vanilla blunt wrap is.??? Ciao!

A vanilla blunt wrap is a flavor of cigar aka "blunt" wrapper. Blunt wraps are sold individually(usually flavored) for use as cigar wrappers. You'll see them in any convenience store being sold along side analogs.

Just so you know, I wasn't trying to tell you that you're wrong per se. I was merely expressing my own subjective opinion on the flavors in question. All too often tone can be misinterpreted in posts and I just want to make it clear that I wasn't blatantly dismissing your subjective opinion and claiming that mine is 'right'.

On another note, I just received some Cinnamon Danish swirl flavoring in the mail and hoped on to check your blogs for a recipe. You post good stuff man, don't get me wrong. (Y)

You should really give the blossom a shot. It is nothing like the other cherry flavorings. It is not medicin-y whatsoever.

I think I'll start by mixing up a test batch as follows(Based off of one of your recipies)-


Cinnamon Danish- 10%
Cream Cheese Icing- 2%
Bavarian Cream- 2%
Double Apple- 2%

Thoughts?

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

A vanilla blunt wrap is a flavor of cigar aka "blunt" wrapper. Blunt wraps are sold individually(usually flavored) for use as cigar wrappers. You'll see them in any convenience store being sold along side analogs.

Just so you know, I wasn't trying to tell you that you're wrong per se. I was merely expressing my own subjective opinion on the flavors in question. All too often tone can be misinterpreted in posts and I just want to make it clear that I wasn't blatantly dismissing your subjective opinion and claiming that mine is 'right'.

On another note, I just received some Cinnamon Danish swirl flavoring in the mail and hoped on to check your blogs for a recipe. You post good stuff man, don't get me wrong. (Y)

You should really give the blossom a shot. It is nothing like the other cherry flavorings. It is not medicin-y whatsoever.

I think I'll start by mixing up a test batch as follows(Based off of one of your recipies)-


Cinnamon Danish- 10%
Cream Cheese Icing- 2%
Bavarian Cream- 2%
Double Apple- 2%

Thoughts?

No worries, my friend. Just like to keep the tone friendly on here. I like your posts too, and appreciate when you share your views, recipes and "takes" on different flavorings. I do like the cherry extract, and I've mixed a couple of juices with it that I like. I'm not sure TFA has the best cherry flavoring out there, though. Seems like I vaped a lot of store made juice when I started in 2009 that was way better than what I get with TFA. Maybe it's just a faulty memory.

Thoughts? That cream cheese icing is strong stuff! I like it around 1%, provided there's a lot of flavoring in the mix to dilute it, though it is one of my favorite non-TFA flavorings. Looks like you're headed toward a dutch apple pie, one of my all-time favorites!

Thank you for the vanilla blunt explanation. Never was a cigar smoker myself. Good to know.

 

[b.m.]

Cinnamon Danish- 10%
Cream Cheese Icing- 2%
Bavarian Cream- 2%
Double Apple- 2%

Thoughts?

Definitely interested in hearing how the cream cheese icing works with the cinnamon danish,in theory it sounds like a good combo.Like Bill mentioned,it's definitely a strong flavor,but thats ok since it's a good one haha,plus it will mellow out some over time.I made a mix a while back with the cci and tfa red velvet,and that recipe has the cci at a whopping 6%,at first it completey overpowered every other flavor in that mix.It was good then,but everything else was just a very faint taste.I forgot about it as i started trying other recipes,so it sat for a few weeks.When i found it,i decided to finish off the bottle,and found that the red velvet had made a comeback and was now right there with the flavor of the cream cheese.It now tastes exactly like a piece of red velvet with the cream cheese icing,good stuff right there haha.One day i will make it again,and try dropping the % on the cci a bit,but on that one i dont mind a bit of steep time as it was fantastic when i went back to it.

 

[MasteroftheVape]

I always use 2% CCI with my cin danish. It's delicious

 

[Nic-holio]

Hey all- Making a list for order and had a few questions-

1) What's the difference between Vanilla Swirl and French Vanilla? The desc. for vanilla swirl says it like the vanilla custard without the custard (so vanilla?)
2) How well does brown sugar work as a general sweetener? I love brown sugar in general, but I'm not sure how well it'd go in things like key lime pie, coke, cherry limeade, etc...
3) Is there a huge difference between the Cherry Blossom and Black Cherry? I'd rather avoid cherries that taste like candy or medicine. I've been scouring the forums and people've said both taste authentic and like cough syrup. lol

I'm on a bit of a budget atm and I'm overseas, so I'd rather avoid getting anything redundant and nasty.

Thanks all!

I haven't mixed anything with my French Vanilla yet -- almost did yesterday. But I referred back to one of Bill's recent posts where he mentioned that Vanilla Swirl is the sweetest of the vanillas. When I mixed my first try of the Snow Day knockoff, I mixed it exactly like the After Dinner Mints recipe I had found called for, and it was missing any sweetness at all. The taste was pretty much butter and peppermint, but there was a great big hole in the flavor. Having used the Vanilla Swirl in the grape bubbleburst recipe, and remembering Bill saying it was the sweetest of the vanillas (and keeping in mind my wife didn't want anything overly sweet) -- I thought, hmm, well this could use a bit more of a vanilla flavor and definitely needs some sweetness. So I cut the sweet cream from the original recipe 10% to 5%, and added Vanilla Swirl to make it up. It took care of the sweetener and got us in the ballpark for the flavor I was trying to match. Did not have to add any sweetener to the recipe at all to get the flavor where my wife was interested in it.

The black cherry is good -- I mixed up a bottle sort of winging it a bit from Bill's grape bubbleburst recipe. (I posted what I mixed up some pages back). It didn't have a cough syrup flavor (and I wouldn't like it if it did!!!) -- but I can imagine it would not be hard to end up there depending what you mix with it. I'll have to defer to the real garoos here for better recommendations but I can say that the TFA Black Cherry isn't a cough syrup flavor, at least how I've mixed it thus far (once). I look forward to buying some more of it and trying some other things.

 

[trueagle]

I have never gone over 2% with cci, I also like to mix it in first when using magnetic mixer. It tend to be more forgiving when I add stuff to it. Some say it doesn't matter the order or if it's just all poured together and shaken. I like the blending one at a time method. Seems to have less issues

Any one wanna share their mixing procedures

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I have never gone over 2% with cci, I also like to mix it in first when using magnetic mixer. It tend to be more forgiving when I add stuff to it. Some say it doesn't matter the order or if it's just all poured together and shaken. I like the blending one at a time method. Seems to have less issues

Any one wanna share their mixing procedures

I've looked at the magnetic mixers and would love to have one! I don't understand how the order of the mix would affect the juice at blending, but perhaps you could shed some light on it. When I was making a lot more juice than I am now, often ten large batches at a time, I yearned for those mixers. Now just a couple 500 ml batches every other weekend or so, and I'm doing pretty well. I haven't been in the vape lab at all for a couple of months on anything new, but it comes and goes. I'll get in a mood and maybe obsess for a while, and that's always a fun time.

The extent of mixing is that I use either open mouth beakers or reagent bottles for the mix. The key to me is surface area. This allows for the air bubbles to leave the mix quickly, generally two hours or less, aerates the mix, and then I will stir for 30 seconds with a glass stick, then cover after the bubbles are all gone, or move to a reagent bottle if I've used a large beaker. That's it for me. Since I mix ATM, my juice can be vaped immediately, is very good after a couple of hours, and completely blended and steeped within 24 to 48 hours. This is how HFM differ from LFM and long steep time (low and slow). All I can add.

 

[MasteroftheVape]

I put the completed bottle on the stove. Get a skillet, put an inch of water in it and put the burner on low. Should be hot but not too hot you can't put your finger in it. Warms the vg just enough to have a pg consistancy after a few min. Then I cap and give it a quick shake.

 

[dereko135]

8% Fruit Circles
5% Berry Crunch
3% Bavarian Cream

How much sweetener would you typically add to a mix of this sort?

 

[NGAHaze]

. That's it for me. Since I mix ATM, my juice can be vaped immediately, is very good after a couple of hours, and completely blended and steeped within 24 to 48 hours. This is how HFM differ from LFM and long steep time (low and slow). All I can add.

Huh? I've been mixing my own juice for awhile but I don't recognize the abbreviations used here ... is there a decoder ring somewhere I can get?

I was also curious as to what DT100 meant that I saw referred to a few posts back?

TIA!

 

[kathi17]

Huh? I've been mixing my own juice for awhile but I don't recognize the abbreviations used here ... is there a decoder ring somewhere I can get?

I was also curious as to what DT100 meant that I saw referred to a few posts back?

TIA!

ATM means you vape it at the time of mixing, HFM means high flavor mix, LFM is low flavor mix, 100 DT is 100 drop test.

That's how we've been mixing here, so we know how the flavor tastes as soon as we mix it, rather than letting it steep and not knowing what adjustments it needs until a week or two later.