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Bill's Magic Vapor

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I think the decision to use diketone free flavorings is a personal one, and should be based on careful research. Since acetoin and acetyl propionyl are found in broccoli, milk, cheese and a host of other foods that we all eat all the time, I am less concerned about these chemicals than say something as toxic as nicotine. At low enough levels all of these chemicals are relatively harmless. In excess, all of these chemicals are harmful. Nicotine is one of the few substances on Earth, for example, that will kill every living organism on the planet, and, as such, is a popular fumigation agent. So, where we draw the line is a personal choice. For me, a 3 PAD smoker for 35 years, I'm hardly worried about a few chemicals in my flavors at such low amounts, that are also in the food I eat every day. Even, diacetyl, which has only caused a single death to an employee in a factory where the diacetyl was in powder form and air-borne, is the only known case of anyone ever dying of this chemical. In very low amounts, it also exists in our daily foods, and is harmless. But, this is a "to each their own," kind of decision. So, if it makes you feel good to avoid certain chemicals in your juice, great. For me, I'm not in the least bit worried and will continue to vape my wonderful creamy desert type flavorings! :toast: :D

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Slots

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Does anyone have experience or opinions on RTS Vapes VG made from coconut?

Vegetable Glycerin is an all natural liquid generally extracted from plant oils, in particular, soy, coconut oil, and palm oil.
I've bought it from several places, including RTS, and it all tastes the same to me, so flavor wise, can't help you
Coconut oil is super common in the making of VG, also approved by the FDA.
I can't tell you which one (soy, coconut, or palm) has the sweetest taste, so can't help you there either.
But there are NO concerns because it contains coconut oil ... that's one of the main ingredient it's made from.
Actually .. given my choice, I would take the coconut oil over the others.
Just enjoy :p
 

Monotremata

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So I wonder, is there a difference in viscosity between VG made from soy, coconut, or palm? The VG I had from Nude Nicotine was rather thick and kinda hard to mix. I ran out and started using the liter I got from Essential Depot and it seems to be much thinner and mixes ALOT easier.. It barely even sticks to the top of the bottles after a good shake and comes right back down..
 

Nic-holio

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+1 on the diketones discussion. I did order some DX versions of flavorings with my last order but I'm not so sure trading diketones for butyric acid is a win-win, since butyric acid is also documented as a potential lung irritant. There does seem to be some concern over what can happen to some diketones at very high wattages (I don't vape at very high wattages and can say fairly confidently at this point that I never will) -- and apparently this risk is going to become part of the strategy for the feds to jump in and regulate (tax) the e-cig device industry. You know, "we have to save the children" etc. ad nauseum.

They don't mind letting thousands of known-harmful chemicals be in cigarettes as long as they get their tax revenues.

But like Bill said, at the end of the day it's still a lot better for you than smoking cigarettes.
 

Bill's Magic Vapor

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+1 on the diketones discussion. I did order some DX versions of flavorings with my last order but I'm not so sure trading diketones for butyric acid is a win-win, since butyric acid is also documented as a potential lung irritant. There does seem to be some concern over what can happen to some diketones at very high wattages (I don't vape at very high wattages and can say fairly confidently at this point that I never will) -- and apparently this risk is going to become part of the strategy for the feds to jump in and regulate (tax) the e-cig device industry. You know, "we have to save the children" etc. ad nauseum.

They don't mind letting thousands of known-harmful chemicals be in cigarettes as long as they get their tax revenues.

But like Bill said, at the end of the day it's still a lot better for you than smoking cigarettes.
You are correct, my friend. We don't seem to care about the water we drink, the air we breathe, the overwhelming amount of electromagnetic pollution, processed foods, black mold, GMO foods, pesticides and insecticides, etc., but a few chemicals that occur naturally in our daily foods, after smoking thousands of known carcinogens for years, thirty-five years in my case, and we appear to be over reacting to the whole diketone issue, which at worst appears to be an irritant, and most of these other issues leads to inflammation and a host of catastrophic illnesses. I have enough to worry about. Additionally, given that all of these concerns are prioritized based largely upon political considerations, and, most often, political correctness, coupled with profit making from big pharma, etc., I just find this issue relatively "light weight" in the long list of issues to try to protect myself from. But that's my personal decision, and not one that I would recommend, in any way, for another. We all need to decide where to draw the line, and launch our own personal crusades. If vaping helps us to quit smoking and remain smoke free, by comparison, vaping is harmless, relatively speaking, and I'm a big advocate of it. I don't see vaping for the rest of my life, the human body is amazingly resilient, and I remain completely unconcerned about this issue. I happily support others who see this differently, but just want to add some perspective to this discussion, and an alternative view point, notwithstanding that YMMV! I wish all well in their VapeQuests! Good luck! :toast: :D

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clnire

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Well said both Nic-holio and Bill. I fully agree. I am aware of the issues but I don't vape diketone containing juice all day, every day. I am a self proclaimed low wattage tootle puffer (a name coined on another thread). I have no current desire to vape low ohms and/or high watts, as I see that as more of a danger than a few diketones. I can also taste butyric acid and to me it is not a good flavor. So I will continue to enjoy the flavors I like as my motto in life is "everything in moderation".
 

nopoison

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And one of the many reasons I'm such a big fan of TFA! Nothing that contains Diecetyl! All the other "custard" ingredients "may" turn into Diecetyl under that exact right conditions (very high temps for one). And even if that happens it would likely be to a much lesser degree than actually using it directly in my ejuice, which probably still would not be enough to cause any direct effect to my health, especially compared to inhaling cigarette smoke. So I guess that pretty much shows my stance on the matter. I use anything TFA makes with no concern. To each his own!
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Bill's Magic Vapor

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Well said both Nic-holio and Bill. I fully agree. I am aware of the issues but I don't vape diketone containing juice all day, every day. I am a self proclaimed low wattage tootle puffer (a name coined on another thread). I have no current desire to vape low ohms and/or high watts, as I see that as more of a danger than a few diketones. I can also taste butyric acid and to me it is not a good flavor. So I will continue to enjoy the flavors I like as my motto in life is "everything in moderation".

I like that! I may be a tootle puffer too! :p

Like you, I too vape at a relatively low wattage of 11 watts. I have some very delicate juices using, for example, lemon and peach, among others, that seem to taste best at about 9 watts in my setup. I'm all about flavor, ample vapor to deliver the flavor, and just don't see the need for high wattage, extreme scorching flavor killing heat, at low ohms. I've made plenty of builds now, over the years, and just through trial and error, an open mind, daily needs, etc. found what works best for me. This is not to say that the opposite vaping setup might not be best for others. I didn't read the thread you mentioned, so I may be a tootle puffer, if I understand that term in proper context. The only thing that occasionally annoys me is when I see people vaping clouds as if it's a competition. I see this as detrimental to all vapors as it's more of a spectacle than vaping to quit smoking. Even so, to each their own. As long as we are not bothering others, the sky is the limit as far as I'm concerned. There's just so many ways to enjoy vaping and great juice, it really keeps it interesting, and sometimes confusing for the new members. Live and learn.

My first year was all about the hardware, my DIY was not good, and I only rebuilt coils for my protanks. The kayfun changed all that for me, at about the same time as my juice improved. The second year was all about my DIY and rebuilding. Now it's all about low maintenance, low dollar output, easy and convenient, hassle free vaping. Vaping did not work for me in 2009, or again in 2011. But in 2012, the gear and juice evolved to a point, where it did work. Today, it's magical. Live and learn. I do enjoy helping others, particularly the new members....always have. This stuff can be overwhelming at first, and I remember how I felt so lost, but eventually found ECF, and within a few months, I was on to a good start. I can really summarize what stood out for me, and recommend:

1. Get the best vaporizers you can, long battery life and ease of use are paramount (I prefer APV's, but mechanicals are nice too),
2. Get the best atomizers you can, perhaps a protank, then kayfun, a good dripper, etc. (our gear is just super fun and addicting too),
3. Find an ADV or two. Try sampler packs, visit the local B&M flavor bars, read other's recommendations, check out the many online sites,
4. Learn to rebuild your own coils. Saves big money, and it's easier than it looks, just jump in, and provides a superior vape,
5. Use great wicking materials, either a good Japanese cotton, or similar, to start,
6. Find the best DIY recipes, perhaps 5 - 10 to start and focus on them, you don't need 100 flavors to start,
7. Slowly build up your glassware and Flavors over time, samplers initially, quality discounted sizes as soon as you can,
8. Use the savings from smoking to pay for this journey, no matter how long it takes. Realistically, you won't save a lot of money the first year if you do all the above, but your vape will improve dramatically, you'll have a great new hobby, and it can be rewarding and fun,
9. Participate. Just joining in on any of the discussions will add so much to your VapeQuest, and there's some wonderful folks here, and you'll learn so much,
10. Help others along the way. Pay it forward.

Ok, done with the soap box. I haven't shared in the New Member thread in over a year, and this sounds like those long ago posts, but seemed apropos. Good luck y'all! :toast: :D

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b.m.

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After doing a bunch more reading, I decided to get a few Vaping Zone flavors to complement my TPA flavors. I am still determined to get a good strawberry cheesecake recipe. So, I'm willing to mix flavors from various vendors to do so. I'll let you know how it goes.

I'm starting to chase pretty much the same goal as you.A vendor i have been buying juice from has a realistic tasting cheesecake,so i know it is possible,and they are a very budget priced company,so i really doubt they are using some exotic flavor brand haha,so there is definitely a good cheesecake out there somewhere.Same with the strawberry,i like the capella,but i think there may be better,so based on Andria's suggestion,i just ordered that shisha strawberry she has mentioned a few times,also ordered a few flavors i need to try out her smoky cappucino,that sounds very good,so gotta try that one too.As for the cheesecake,i may try mixing the plain cheesecake with the cheesecake/graham crust and see if that may get it close.
 

Bill's Magic Vapor

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I'm starting to chase pretty much the same goal as you.A vendor i have been buying juice from has a realistic tasting cheesecake,so i know it is possible,and they are a very budget priced company,so i really doubt they are using some exotic flavor brand haha,so there is definitely a good cheesecake out there somewhere.Same with the strawberry,i like the capella,but i think there may be better,so based on Andria's suggestion,i just ordered that shisha strawberry she has mentioned a few times,also ordered a few flavors i need to try out her smoky cappucino,that sounds very good,so gotta try that one too.As for the cheesecake,i may try mixing the plain cheesecake with the cheesecake/graham crust and see if that may get it close.
Totally agree that we must look outside TFA for this little jewel. I think I've tried just about every way I can think of with TFA, and I was not able to get there. I'm still hopeful, though. Perhaps you, or others, can figure this out. I would love to hear about any brand's flavoring that would do the trick and would happily add this to the flavor stash. Please keep us posted and let us know if you crack this one! Good luck! :toast: :D

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DarthEmma

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I'm starting to chase pretty much the same goal as you.A vendor i have been buying juice from has a realistic tasting cheesecake,so i know it is possible,and they are a very budget priced company,so i really doubt they are using some exotic flavor brand haha,so there is definitely a good cheesecake out there somewhere.Same with the strawberry,i like the capella,but i think there may be better,so based on Andria's suggestion,i just ordered that shisha strawberry she has mentioned a few times,also ordered a few flavors i need to try out her smoky cappucino,that sounds very good,so gotta try that one too.As for the cheesecake,i may try mixing the plain cheesecake with the cheesecake/graham crust and see if that may get it close.

I tried one recipe in which I tried cheesecake/graham crust and another with TPA cheesecake. It was not very good. I think it may be the strawberry as well.

It makes sense to me that some juices may require flavors from more than one vendor. My cap cheesecake and strawberry should be here tomorrow. The VZ favors should be here next week. I'll try several combinations with my TPA favors to see if I can make something good. I'll keep careful notes and let you know if I have any successes.
 

BigLungs

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So I wonder, is there a difference in viscosity between VG made from soy, coconut, or palm? The VG I had from Nude Nicotine was rather thick and kinda hard to mix. I ran out and started using the liter I got from Essential Depot and it seems to be much thinner and mixes ALOT easier.. It barely even sticks to the top of the bottles after a good shake and comes right back down..

Pure vegetable glycerine, or glycerol, is given a viscosity rating(at a certain temp). That rating is the same whether it is made from soy, coconut, palm, or animal fats.

The problem is that some retailers will dilute their vegetable glycerine down to make it last longer.

Bulk Apothecary is a great place to get PG/VG from. They have excellent prices and their VG has always been the purest I could find.
 
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trophyfish711

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Trophyfish711 - I've "borrowed" your Honey Tobacco (too much to quote from original post, so excerpt here:)

"This is my Honey Tobacco.. not heavy on the tobacco or honey but a sweet creamy vape ..
RY4 8%
Almond 7%
Honey Tobacco 3%
Marshmellow 2%
Vanilla Bean gele 3% "

I accidentally grabbed my LorAnns Almond instead of my TFA :shock: WAAAAAY too much of LA Almond! However, I was able to tone it down with about 0.5% CAP Wild Cherry, and sir, you have landed me at something that completely reminds me of a pipe tobacco that my Dad used to smoke.... Thank you for reviving that memory of him.... I've wanted to find something along this line, but I've been leery of tobacco flavors - I don't like the floral/grassiness, and I don't really want the ashy/smokey background that I've found in the few tobacco juices that I've previously tried. This is what I want :)



BBMom, I'm SOOOOO going to whip this one up. I LOVE butterscotch. I've tried a "Claim Your Throne" clone, and it was o.k., but this one looks so much better!

Borrow anything you want :) its all about sharing and I hope it works for you.. I too don't want that "ashy" taste but I have found out I like the "leafy pipe " taste..I have thought about a little experiment myself with like peach and cherry tobacco :) I have another little funny story.. reading these threads ( im on page 485) I had a friend come into work.. he had a juice from a shop... " Dude , this stuff is awesome" .. I vaped it for about 10 minutes.. I was like ..ok.. I very taste lite cinnamon, creamy kinda bakery , a little banana..is that waffle also ? .. so that night I went home .. didn't even do 100DT .. made a 10ml bottle of what I thought it would taste like.. Brought it to work the next day.. new cotton and clean tank.. filled it.. have it to my buddy.. he tasted it.. BAM!!!!! I was so close to the original I even surprised myself.. matter a fact.. it was better .. the guys loved it.. will be playing with it a little this weekend.. Bill has rubbed off on me.. it was good.. I want it to be great.. :) thank you guys for all the info yall post.. here it is.. now this is just a thing I threw together.. but you can play around with it..

60 VG/ 40 PG
4 MG nic
Cin Danish 8%
Van Bean Gel 5%
Ban Nut Bread 3%
Waffle(regular) 3%
Brown Sugar 2%
Butter 1%
Whipped Cream 4%

I called it "Good Morning"
 

trophyfish711

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I mixed some of this up last week and just got around to testing it today. It is excellent! At first I thought I tasted the strawberry more, no it's the peach, no it's the strawberry, lol. And underneath it all the champagne is a solid base. Good job!


Thats AWESOME !!! I have thought about playing with it.. it is a very nice mix ..and yes.. I too seem to taste different flavors each time :)
 

AndriaD

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Thank you Bill.
I really want to avoid using any flavors listed as having diketones.
Sweet Cream: This product contains Acetoin: >1%
Bavarian Cream: This product contains Acetoin: <0.5%
Granted, it shows small amounts and only uses Acetoin.
Hoping the Dx bavarian cream, Vanilla Swirl and Vanilla Bean Gelato will be a good place to start.
And I'll add some French Vanilla Creme.

Capella's Sweet Cream is diketone-free, AFAIK -- and that's one that tastes very good; one or two drops into a mug or glass of 2% milk makes it taste just like whole milk.

Andria
 

AndriaD

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Vegetable Glycerin is an all natural liquid generally extracted from plant oils, in particular, soy, coconut oil, and palm oil.
I've bought it from several places, including RTS, and it all tastes the same to me, so flavor wise, can't help you
Coconut oil is super common in the making of VG, also approved by the FDA.
I can't tell you which one (soy, coconut, or palm) has the sweetest taste, so can't help you there either.
But there are NO concerns because it contains coconut oil ... that's one of the main ingredient it's made from.
Actually .. given my choice, I would take the coconut oil over the others.
Just enjoy :p

Hmm... I wonder if there's any way of finding out if there's any coconut oil in it? If my son ever decides to start vaping, that could be *critical* info for him; he's deathly allergic to coconut-*anything*, goes anaphylactic at the slightest exposure.

Andria
 

clnire

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"tootle puffers" came from the itty bitty mods thread. The sub ohmers looking for 100watt + mods to run high wattage for clouds and such called those of us who run low watts (10-15 or less), using toppers like protanks, T3s, non-sub ohm tanks (including Kayfuns and the like building around 2 ohm coils) looking for small size and battery life only "low wattage tight draw tootle puffers". It was funny and we just adapted it. Some of us like a more airy draw....
 
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AndriaD

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I'm starting to chase pretty much the same goal as you.A vendor i have been buying juice from has a realistic tasting cheesecake,so i know it is possible,and they are a very budget priced company,so i really doubt they are using some exotic flavor brand haha,so there is definitely a good cheesecake out there somewhere.Same with the strawberry,i like the capella,but i think there may be better,so based on Andria's suggestion,i just ordered that shisha strawberry she has mentioned a few times,also ordered a few flavors i need to try out her smoky cappucino,that sounds very good,so gotta try that one too.As for the cheesecake,i may try mixing the plain cheesecake with the cheesecake/graham crust and see if that may get it close.

I changed that last recipe I posted for the Smoky Cappucino -- the one with malted milk entirely replacing the sweet cream. After vaping it for a while, I started picking up an odd taste... hard to describe, but something like a cross between plastic and perfume. So I changed it, to 4% sweet cream, 3% malted milk, and THAT turned out very well. I still left the sweetener very low, and I do think I like that better, for that particular flavor.

This is how it ended up:

Inawera Cappucino 2%
Inawera Coffee Tobacco 2.50%
Inawera VA TA 2.50%
CAP Hazelnut v2 2.50%
TFA Vanilla Swirl 2%
TFA Milk Chocolate 3.5%
TFA Dbl Chocolate-Dark 3%
CAP SweetCream 4%
TFA Malted Milk 3%
TFA Sweetener 1.50%

I *slightly* increased the chocolate flavors, also, to very good results. To most people, this would be a rather sweet vape, though to me it's not terribly sweet. It's very subtle, hard to decide in each puff if you're tasting tobacco, coffee, chocolate, or cream. It's REALLY good after meals; sort of a cross between an after-dinner smoke and after-dinner cup of coffee. :D And although I normally vape only 9mg in my Magma or get a spinning head, ATM I've got some of this Smoky Cappucino, 10mg, in the Magma, and that is an excellent first-thing-in-the-morning vape! I've also found it's an extreme coil-gunker; it's a very dark juice anyway, and after 4-5 days, when I opened my kayfun chimney, OMG EVERYTHING was black!! If one used dbl choc-clear instead of dark, it might help somewhat with that.

Andria
 
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