The Flavor Apprentice Flavoring Thread

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I use bases all the time and I can mix to any nicotine level on any of them. I can also make a VG base that includes the nicotine. By adding the flavoring and PG to 30% and the VG/Nic to 70%, I can make juice by mixing just two bases. This is not hard in the least. I used to make bases then later add the VG and nicotine to different strengths, though always at 70/30 VG/PG, and it saved enormous amounts of time. Try mixing 1,000 bottles and then tell me that bases don't make sense! Been there, done that! Good luck!

 

[LynnNC]

Thanks Bill! I can't do 70%vg though. Anything over 60-65%vg sends me running for an inhaler. That's why I mix my base at 50/50. The pg will increase with the addition of pg based nic and flavorings but the vg won't so I'm good!

 

[DingerCPA]

@LynnNC, is your nic PG-based? Like Kenna, I just treat Nic like another flavor. I "think" in 10ml increments. I use 60mg/ml nic (and usually am somewhere between 9-12mg in a finished bottle. So, if I want a 12mg mix in a 30ml bottle, I need 6ml of 60mg/ml nic on top of flavors. THEN I top with unflavored base (VG in my case)

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

Thanks Bill! I can't do 70%vg though. Anything over 60-65%vg sends me running for an inhaler. That's why I mix my base at 50/50. The pg will increase with the addition of pg based nic and flavorings but the vg won't so I'm good!

The percentages can all be tailored. Doesn't matter what the VG/PG ratio you prefer is. Just mix your bases to 50% VG and add VG and VG Nicotine at 50%. You can make both into bases if you like and then mix them equally. Easy peasy! Good luck!

 

[LynnNC]

@LynnNC, is your nic PG-based? Like Kenna, I just treat Nic like another flavor. I "think" in 10ml increments. I use 60mg/ml nic (and usually am somewhere between 9-12mg in a finished bottle. So, if I want a 12mg mix in a 30ml bottle, I need 6ml of 60mg/ml nic on top of flavors. THEN I top with unflavored base (VG in my case)

LadyD, my nic is pg based. 100mg. I do 1.8ml for a 30ml bottle and 3.6 for a 60ml one.

 

[jwitfield]

@Bill's Magic Vapor
I tried your root beer float..

Did a good job making it.. BA man.. BA..

 

[hittman]

I finally got around to mixing a test batch of Andria's strawberries and cream. It's pretty darn good. I mixed it at 50/50 and put it in a new phantom tank. I'm thinking now that I should have went 70/30 vg/pg but will on the next batch. The new tank I got runs best at pretty high wattage and I lose some of the flavor after a few hits when the tank get's hot.

 

[Kenna]

Somebody help this girl! I am having a difficult time understsnding Bill's 100dt method. I really want to learn to do this, but I am a bit dyscalculic. Like numerically dyslexic. I need bit of a picture in my head. No telling what is blocking me from getting this down.

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[clnire]

Each drop =1%. So if you are using 3% of a flavor, it is 3 drops is the 100 DT. 5%=5 drops. Clear as mud, eh? I am sure someone will give a better explanation.

 

[JCinFLA]

@Kenna - If you'll PM me...I'll give it a try. I'm a retired teacher, so I've done my fair share of step-by-step instructions!

 

[clnire]

@Kenna - If you'll PM me...I'll give it a try. I'm a retired teacher, so I've done my fair share of step-by-step instructions!

See, I told ya!

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I have a blog on the subject that goes into detail. Think of the recipe in parts. Flavor, PG, VG and Nicotine. If the recipe has 25% flavoring, as an example, that would be 25 drops. TFA flavorings are almost always in PG, so 25% or 25 drops is also 25% PG. If one wants a 70/30 VG/PG blend then we have 70 drops of VG and 30 drops of PG combined.

Flavoring is 25 drops (above example). Add 5 drops of PG for 30 drops, or 30% PG. If using 100 mg/ml VG nicotine, as I always do, and assuming 6 mg/ml of nicotine, then that's 6%, or 6 drops of VG Nicotine. Last, since we want a 70% VG mixture, we add 64 drops, or 64% to the 6 drops, or 6% nicotine, for 70 drops of VG and VG Nicotine. This example looks as following:

Flavoring - 25 drops, or 25%
PG - 5 drops, or 5%
VG - 64 drops, or 64%, and
VG Nicotine - 6 drops, or 6%

Added together equals 100 drops, or 100 percent. Do not worry about drop sizes, etc. Just use the same dropper sizes throughout. Viscosity is not an issue, flavor and taste is. Close is what we're seeking, not mathematical perfection. This is about speed and getting the recipe/formula roughed out.

If you are using nicotine, in a strength other than 100 mg/ml, then you have to convert that strength to percentage, and then to drops using a mixing calculator, if necessary.

Hopefully, this helps. Ask questions relative to this example, and I'll try to help in any way I can. Good luck!

 

[JCinFLA]

@Bill's Magic Vapor - I thought I'd volunteer...but was secretly hoping you'd pop in here!

No one can explain it any better, nor easier, than the 1 who actually came up with the method! Wanted you to know that every time I make a new recipe and use it, I thank you for it, too. Has helped me tremendously!

 

[hittman]

I like some flavors fresh mixed so I use the 100DT all the time. Thanks Bill!

 

[Kenna]

@Kenna - If you'll PM me...I'll give it a try. I'm a retired teacher, so I've done my fair share of step-by-step instructions!

Thanks JC, I'd like to do it here if it's ok. In case there are others who might not understand & be reluctant to ask for help. I've been reluctant to ask, myself, & have tried for months to figure it out on my own. I'm 61, you'd think I could understand it. But this has been a thing my whole life. I go along & get it just fine, then suddenly none of what I just had makes sense.
I get the 1 drop = 1% of flavor. How do you know how much base to add? I am so thankful for calculators of all kinds...[emoji12]

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[Kenna]

I have a blog on the subject that goes into detail. Think of the recipe in parts. Flavor, PG, VG and Nicotine. If the recipe has 25% flavoring, as an example, that would be 25 drops. TFA flavorings are almost always in PG, so 25% or 25 drops is also 25% PG. If one wants a 70/30 VG/PG blend then we have 70 drops of VG and 30 drops of PG combined.

Flavoring is 25 drops (above example). Add 5 drops of PG for 30 drops, or 30% PG. If using 100 mg/ml VG nicotine, as I always do, and assuming 6 mg/ml of nicotine, then that's 6%, or 6 drops of VG Nicotine. Last, since we want a 70% VG mixture, we add 64 drops, or 64% to the 6 drops, or 6% nicotine, for 70 drops of VG and VG Nicotine. This example looks as following:

Flavoring - 25 drops, or 25%
PG - 5 drops, or 5%
VG - 64 drops, or 64%, and
VG Nicotine - 6 drops, or 6%

Added together equals 100 drops, or 100 percent. Do not worry about drop sizes, etc. Just use the same dropper sizes throughout. Viscosity is not an issue, flavor and taste is. Close is what we're seeking, not mathematical perfection. This is about speed and getting the recipe/formula roughed out.

If you are using nicotine, in a strength other than 100 mg/ml, then you have to convert that strength to percentage, and then to drops using a mixing calculator, if necessary.

Hopefully, this helps. Ask questions relative to this example, and I'll try to help in any way I can. Good luck!

TY, Bill! I read your blog on this & got that part. How do you do it to test a new flavor? I have a flavor combination in my head & want to taste test the individual flavors to find a starting point for each to begin a recipe.

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[Bill's Magic Vapor]

TY, Bill! I read your blog on this & got that part. How do you do it to test a new flavor? I have a flavor combination in my head & want to taste test the individual flavors to find a starting point for each to begin a recipe.

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I use the same PG/VG ratio in all of my mixes and recommend starting there. So, for me, I use 70% VG and 30% PG for a 70/30 VG/PG ratio. That means that I'll be using 30 drops of PG and 70 drops of VG. That's my start. This also means that I almost never use more than 30% flavoring, as the flavorings are in PG. Again, that's "my" given....30% PG or 30 drops of flavoring and PG combined.

With that start, I then will always use 70 drops, or 70% of VG. In my case that 6% nicotine (VG) and 64%, or 64 drops of VG, for a total of 70 drops (70%). I hope this helps, but I sense you may have questions beyond this. I need to understand where I'm losing you. Please think in terms of:

1. PG
2. VG
3. Flavoring
4. Nicotine

Now, can you tell me where we're losing you? Please help me understand, so that I may better learn to explain this for you and others. I'll wait!

 

[Kenna]

I use the same PG/VG ratio in all of my mixes and recommend starting there. So, for me, I use 70% VG and 30% PG for a 70/30 VG/PG ratio. That means that I'll be using 30 drops of PG and 70 drops of VG. That's my start. This also means that I almost never use more than 30% flavoring, as the flavorings are in PG. Again, that's "my" given....30% PG or 30 drops of flavoring and PG combined.

With that start, I then will always use 70 drops, or 70% of VG. In my case that 6% nicotine (VG) and 64%, or 64 drops of VG, for a total of 70 drops (70%). I hope this helps, but I sense you may have questions beyond this. I need to understand where I'm losing you. Please think in terms of:

1. PG
2. VG
3. Flavoring
4. Nicotine

Now, can you tell me where we're losing you? Please help me understand, so that I may better learn to explain this for you and others. I'll wait!

I think I just got it! I was stuck at forgetting that it's all either pg or vg, no matter if it's flavoring, nic, or what ever. The goal is 100 drops of pg or vg with something (or nothing) in it. That's the way my brain translates it. I just needed to simplify one more step.
THANK YOU, BILL! Gonna shoot for this Honeydew, Cucumber, mintofsomekind, maybesomelimeormojito thing I've got in my head. I may need a cure.

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[Slots]

I want to taste test the individual flavors to find a starting point for each to begin a recipe.

I don't know if this will help ya Kenna, but ...
I test each flavor by it's self, when I first receive it.
What I do is make a (solo) 2ml sample of that flavor.
I use the e-juice-me up calculator, and drops.
I try to read reviews to give me a suggested % to start with.
Most of the time I end up guessing
So, because I'm guessing, I start with a low %.
When I vape it, I can add a drop of flavoring at a time until I like the flavor, or ... I can dilute it if it's to strong.
I keep a small unflavored bottle of my pg/vg base (with nicotine) for diluting purposes.
I do this to see how strong, weak, or sweet the flavor is on it's own.
From this, I can judge what it will contribute to a recipe, and about what % I will need.
Works for me, and (forgive me Bill ) but, I even find some flavors are good solo, and don't need anything else ... not that I don't play with them anyway
With my taste buds this works for me.

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

I don't know if this will help ya Kenna, but ...
I test each flavor by it's self, when I first receive it.
What I do is make a (solo) 2ml sample of that flavor.
I use the e-juice-me up calculator, and drops.
I try to read reviews to give me a suggested % to start with.
Most of the time I end up guessing
So, because I'm guessing, I start with a low %.
When I vape it, I can add a drop of flavoring at a time until I like the flavor, or ... I can dilute it if it's to strong.
I keep a small unflavored bottle of my pg/vg base (with nicotine) for diluting purposes.
I do this to see how strong, weak, or sweet the flavor is on it's own.
From this, I can judge what it will contribute to a recipe, and about what % I will need.
Works for me, and (forgive me Bill ) but, I even find some flavors are good solo, and don't need anything else ... not that I don't play with them anyway
With my taste buds this works for me.

Nothing to forgive. In my previous explanations, I said nothing about flavorings, other than a total percentage (25% in my example). I also taste test all my flavors and have provided a chart that allows me to do that ferociously quickly, without having to start over each time. While I don't have a single juice that is only one flavoring, I do believe that about 5%+/- of TFA flavorings are good on their own. But that's not that much. Additionally, I have found flavor combinations that work well for me, and, if you study my recipe book, you'll see the patterns in my flavorings. Because I used to make juice for the marketspace, I have some good experience with understanding what other vapers like, and have tried to make juices for those spaces, sometimes regardless of my own preferences. My favorite juices were never the marketspace's favorite juices, but that's a whole different story.

Slots, I have valued your posts since their inception and find that your own preferences have never stopped you from sharing your own experiences, whether they were different or not. You have done so with grace and generosity and I have always appreciated them, and look forward to them. Not everyone is as generous and respectful with their views, and I just wanted to take a moment to thank you! Best to you and good luck!