I wonder if it would help in PG. I have a couple of tobaccos stewing in all PG right now. Maybe next time I'll try it with 10% - 20% water and see if it makes a difference.
The impatient newbie strikes again...
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There are several different thoughts on how the extraction process should work. I have done a considerable amount of research on the subject and this is what I have found:
Alcohol, Vinegar and Water
These are the traditional liquids/solvents used to extract flavors and properties from plants. These liquids/solvents have been used for THOUSANDS of years to make extractions. The resulting extraction from using these liquids is called a TINCTURE.
Why were these liquids used? They are all solvents of one degree or another and were readily available. The alcohol and vinegar are also PRESERVATIVES. If you use alcohol or vinegar as a solvent medium your resulting extraction will last for about a year before going bad. (Think about the time before grocery stores and refrigeration.)
The downside of using alcohol is that it is too strong of a solvent. It destroys the entire plant, cell walls and all. You get a lot of undesirable plant matter in your extraction, especially when you plan on vaping this extraction. There will be a lot of atty clogging particulates in your extraction.
The downside of using vinegar is that it tastes bad when vaping.
The downside of using water is that it is not a preservative and your extraction won't last very long before bacteria and/or mold start to grow in it.
Vegetable Glycerine VG
Purified VG has only been used as an extraction medium for about the last 20 years or so. The benefit to a VG extraction is the shelf life of the final product is several years. The VG percent in the final product must be a minimum of somewhere between 60% to 70% for that several year shelf life. VG is a rather weak extraction medium by itself. Water is usually added to the VG to boost the extractive power of the VG. Extractions using VG are called GLYCERITES. You need to use some type of heat to really make this work with VG.
Propylene Glycol
In all my research I have not encountered anyone use PG as an extraction medium. That doesn't mean that it can't be done though. You can use almost any liquid as an extraction medium.
Clear as mud?
Questions?
Pete
I have no idea weather PG is used as an extraction medium. But it's frequently used as a carrier. The baking flavors I have bought all use PG as the primary ingredient. This does off-course not mean that the extraction itself have been done with PG, but it does suggest that it is an excellent carrier of flavor, and thus might be used for extraction.
I guess time will show etc.
Regarding the RYO in alcohol, PG and VG. -All the liquids have become more yellow/brown. The PG a bit less so than VG, but it looks promising.
BTW: I plan on using more heat later on. At the moment they stay at the top of an aquarium light-fixture that gets hot during day and cools down at night.
Any ideas for preservatives if one uses water?
Just add pure VG/PG?
WTH!? Did none of my previous posts 'count'? And what about the coffee thread(s)??!!
Guess I'll go throw out all my superb pg extractions then.
Bostonsnboxers,
I just meant that I really didn't find any information outside the ECF concerning the use of PG as an extraction medium. I really did not mean to offend you and sincerely apologize if I did.
Some of the things happening here on the ECF are cutting edge and haven't really been done before. I was just stating that I didn't find the use of PG in the established extraction industry.
I too have read about the coffee extractions using PG and want to try it. I believe that it works, and works great.
Sorry I wasn't more clear about that.
Pete
I think Cyrus Vap mentioned that he boiled most of the water off his mix and then added VG and slowly simmered the VG/Water mixture until most of the water had boiled off. The VG has a much higher boiling temperature than water so the water will boil off first.
He did this on a stove, and the time it took to make his extraction was only an hour or two start to finish.
Pete
No problem Pete, honest. I obviously misunderstood, and I apologize sincerely for doing so. Had myself going for a minute there!
Peace
Patti
After successful ginger extraction decided to use the same method, chopped Cohiba Esplendido from my (ex) aficionado collection. I use PG because it worked very well to extract ginger (crushed ginger+PG), I used that extract to mix with some FA -cinnamon, clove, cardamom but it actually tasted lovely on its own, just like ginger bonbon.
Any suggestion how long should I wait? Week?
BTW. Did not chop entire Esplendido (the damn thing cost 30 Euros), smoked the rest to realise that cigar smoking is not that much fun for me. Me, who used to smoke at least one a day and while in Cuba, few a day. While I still love some of it, same time hate the burning "side effects", vaping works so much better for me.
Any suggestion how long should I wait? Week?
BTW. Did not chop entire Esplendido (the damn thing cost 30 Euros), smoked the rest to realise that cigar smoking is not that much fun for me. Me, who used to smoke at least one a day and while in Cuba, few a day. While I still love some of it, same time hate the burning "side effects", vaping works so much better for me.
Update.
My curiosity made me try a bit today. Interesting, it is the most "analog tobacco" juice ever tried, but just like any cigarette or cigarillo, no trace of that special Pinar del Rio rich flavour bouquet of Cohiba Esplendido. Do I like it? Not more then my various FA based blends. When I think about the experience of smoking real Esplendido the day I made the extract, I actually enjoy the "synthetic" blends , vaping more then smoking even finest cigar. This is interesting and funny, is tobacco smoking is so much previous millennium ? Might be the case, at least for me . Will see how the extract will work in few days time.
My curiosity made me try a bit today. Interesting, it is the most "analog tobacco" juice ever tried, but just like any cigarette or cigarillo, no trace of that special Pinar del Rio rich flavour bouquet of Cohiba Esplendido. Do I like it? Not more then my various FA based blends. When I think about the experience of smoking real Esplendido the day I made the extract, I actually enjoy the "synthetic" blends , vaping more then smoking even finest cigar. This is interesting and funny, is tobacco smoking is so much previous millennium ? Might be the case, at least for me . Will see how the extract will work in few days time.
Asking me? Last Tuesday cut around inch from Cohiba Esplendido, chopped, put into 20 ml PG, heated it for 3-5 minutes (in pot of boiling water). Meanwhile the liquid became nicely brownish. Vaped some more today, same impression - never vaped anything so close to analog tobacco but nothing of the extraordinary Cohiba flavours, just regular decent cigar or cigarillo. Comparing to e cig juices the closes would be Flavourart Virginia.are you going to fill us in on how and what you extracted good sir?
i guess it wont get much better, next will try with fresh leaves. Asked already some Cuban friends, unlike cigars that will be no big problem to bring, now have to wait for someones family visit.
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Part II . Doing the same procedure but with VG. Will see in a week what the difference might be.
Update- seems like VG was quick to extract colour but hardly any taste as compared to PG. Same amounts, same procedures and very different results.
Seems like there is some conflicting data on the efficacy of PG for extraction, if you look back in the thread
Only one way for me to find out!
Only one way for me to find out!
I think we need real chemist input (who will probably have a big laugh reading about our experiments). i tried vaping the VG extract and it is nothing, hardly any aroma, even less taste. The PG is OK, as I mentioned already, tastes closer to real cigarettes then anything else I ever tried. I tried mixing PG+VG extracts, brings nothing really. All VG extracted is the colour- the liquid is very, very dark, liked tea cooked for half an hour. The strongest taste in that VG extraction is the taste of VG itself. Will experiment a bit with the PG extract, mix with some FA, the VG will be probably disposed.
Next step will be extracting from tobacco leaves as soon as I get them from Cuba and this years balcony deco will be tobacco plants. Apparently April is ideal time and Frankfurt area very suitable for tobacco grow, will be trying to get the plants from somewhere, do not trust my gardening skills to start with seeds. Hopefully by August/September will have my own tobacco .
Next step will be extracting from tobacco leaves as soon as I get them from Cuba and this years balcony deco will be tobacco plants. Apparently April is ideal time and Frankfurt area very suitable for tobacco grow, will be trying to get the plants from somewhere, do not trust my gardening skills to start with seeds. Hopefully by August/September will have my own tobacco .
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