The Rattlesnake Effect- Why the Cheapo VV [Exception Itaste MVP] Don't Vape the Same as a Provari or DNA20D
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Thank you Ladiekali for the lead on best price I've seen in U.S for the innokin VV3
I put the link to the unit to make it easier to find. Joye eGo Rechargeable Batteries [This is the right Link Ecig Forum Server Renamed it]
I saw the Pbusardo review on the Itaste VV 3 and was curious about it. Went into my local Vape Shop and was impressed as heck with it. The only flaw I could find was that when you shake it it rattles.
I took my Voltage Meter and tested it out with a tank and the voltage is rock solid. No fluctuation whatsoever. I had to see it with my own eyes.
What really impresses me about this APV is that in the 3rd revision they made the connector a Micro USB. This make it the ideal starter unit, upgrade [To Ego] or Backup.
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As long as the battery isn't completely drained [Just like a Cel Phone] it works as a pass through. A beginner could just buy the unit by itself and put any ego or 510 cartridge or clearomizer on it. With the pass through ability, even though the battery is only 800Mah, you could charge it with a long cable while driving, at home while watching T.V etc..
One other feature, I've noticed that Innokin uses a quality charging componentry. When the unit is charged it turns off. Period and nothing more goes to the battery.
The Ego on the other hand uses hit and miss Battery Chargers.
Darned it no choice, just doing one last search for lower price and I'l hit the button and buy one. I need a stealth device.
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Only thing a rattlesnake is good for is killing, skinning, and eating. Not for vaping!!!!!!!
AND boots!! dont forget boots. and maybe a cool hat
And the knife. Got to have the knife.
Only problem with the DesertVapes iTaste VV is that it doesn't include the USB charging cable.
Solution...You're going to LOVE your iTaste VV and will want another one. (I, so far, have 3.) So buy your next one at FastTech ($24.88 with FREE shipping). It does include the USB charging cable and you can then use it with both of them.
$24.88 Authentic iTaste VV V3.0 Variable Voltage / Wattage 800mAh Rechargeable Battery - w/ charging cable at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
EDIT: The picture on the FastTech site is an old picture. I got my iTaste VV's from them and they all have the Micro USB connector.
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Fasttech has been having some shipping problems lately which makes their already slow shipping from Hong Kong even slower.
Spend the extra 5 bucks, buy it from Vaping Town 2013 on Ebay and get it in two days. Plus you'll get one of the six rivet versions which addresses some of the issues with the bottom sometimes being pulled out if the USB connector is to tight.
Itaste VV 3 0 Starter Express Kit Authentic Guranteed The Latest wth More Rivets | eBay
Spend the extra 5 bucks, buy it from Vaping Town 2013 on Ebay and get it in two days. Plus you'll get one of the six rivet versions which addresses some of the issues with the bottom sometimes being pulled out if the USB connector is to tight.
Itaste VV 3 0 Starter Express Kit Authentic Guranteed The Latest wth More Rivets | eBay
Well, if you don't already have a bunch from other micro USB powered devices, like cell phones, you can also order 10 of them from monoprice for $10 (plus shipping), one for each room of the house, one for the car, one for the office, plus backups for your backups.
I'm not sure if this has been discussed so I apologize in advance. Regardless of what some people say about the vaping experience using a 33hz device there is an electrical difference; it's called impedance.
A coil in a DC circuit is treated as a resistive load. However, a coil in an AC (33hz) circuit, is treated as an inductive load.
Impedance is to AC as resistance is to DC. Impedance is directly proportional to the frequency and inductance.
Since the frequency is set at 33hz, the only way to change the impedance is to change the inductance.
The inductance can be adjusted by the number of turns of the coil and the diameter of the coil.
Play around with your coils and you should be able to find that perfect vape.
Sent from my GT-P3113 using Tapatalk
A coil in a DC circuit is treated as a resistive load. However, a coil in an AC (33hz) circuit, is treated as an inductive load.
Impedance is to AC as resistance is to DC. Impedance is directly proportional to the frequency and inductance.
Since the frequency is set at 33hz, the only way to change the impedance is to change the inductance.
The inductance can be adjusted by the number of turns of the coil and the diameter of the coil.
Play around with your coils and you should be able to find that perfect vape.
Sent from my GT-P3113 using Tapatalk
I'm not sure if this has been discussed so I apologize in advance. Regardless of what some people say about the vaping experience using a 33hz device there is an electrical difference; it's called impedance.
A coil in a DC circuit is treated as a resistive load. However, a coil in an AC (33hz) circuit, is treated as an inductive load.
Impedance is to AC as resistance is to DC. Impedance is directly proportional to the frequency and inductance.
Since the frequency is set at 33hz, the only way to change the impedance is to change the inductance.
The inductance can be adjusted by the number of turns of the coil and the diameter of the coil.
Play around with your coils and you should be able to find that perfect vape.
Sent from my GT-P3113 using Tapatalk
buuuuut
it is not an ac signal it is a pulsed dc signal - big difference. from 0 to 6 v at 33hz.
while the attempt is noteworthy - almost every mod uses PWM, the discussion at hand is why are the mods like provari and semovar better at doing it. which comes to the higher PWM rate they use. while filtering and regulating the end signal almost flat so on a scope they appear as close to a dc signal as possible.
the problem is even though it is a millisecond it is overdriving the coil all the way to 6 volts causing an uneven heating effect. there is no negative signal (ac sinewave)
which is why some perceive a burnt taste, we may not consciously be able to perceive it but the fact is the coil is being driven past the set voltage.
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An electric heating coil will not react instantaneously to the application of current. If you doubt this go to a cold burner on an electric range. Turn the burner to to high and see how long it takes to glow orange.
The same thing happens to a heating coil in our atomizers. They don't react instantaneously to the application of current. It isn't voltage or current that vaporizes juice, it's heat from the coil.
No, the coils in our atomizers are not turning hot to cold every time the coil power is pulsed on and off. Instead they reach an average heat output while being pulsed. There is no variation in heat output that can vary the vapor quality.
The rattlesnake is simply a sound, not a pulse in vapor output or quality.
I hear the rattlesnake sound when vaping a 2.0 ohm single coil at 6 to 8 watts on my 33.3 Hz Sigelei Zmax. The sound always comes from the carto, not the Sigelei. I don't hear the rattlesnake when vaping a 3.0 ohm coil at the same power. Maybe if I was more subject to suggestion I could imagine a difference in vapor quality.
The same thing happens to a heating coil in our atomizers. They don't react instantaneously to the application of current. It isn't voltage or current that vaporizes juice, it's heat from the coil.
No, the coils in our atomizers are not turning hot to cold every time the coil power is pulsed on and off. Instead they reach an average heat output while being pulsed. There is no variation in heat output that can vary the vapor quality.
The rattlesnake is simply a sound, not a pulse in vapor output or quality.
I hear the rattlesnake sound when vaping a 2.0 ohm single coil at 6 to 8 watts on my 33.3 Hz Sigelei Zmax. The sound always comes from the carto, not the Sigelei. I don't hear the rattlesnake when vaping a 3.0 ohm coil at the same power. Maybe if I was more subject to suggestion I could imagine a difference in vapor quality.
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Hey guys, basically, across my entire experience on this forum, I've gotten harsh, dry tasting vapes from my devices on my Twist-type battery, and I couldn't explain it. Once upon a story, I used Phil's proof to make the arguement that lower end devices have a wider pulse range, yet I was shot down in that theory, thought I was simply wrong, and moved on.
Along to this experience, I often make the claim that at my local vaping shop, all of the cheapo CE4's taste fantastic, solid, and smooth, even at higher voltages, while I've tried the exact same CE4's they have, using the same exact techniques I did for their devices, and get a horrible vape.
Then I remembered - for their CE4 samples, they USE A HIGHER END MOD THAT MAY HAVE A BETTER PULSE RATE!!!!!!
Could this really be the problem all along? I feel like I sit down and study and test my devices better than %75 of the users here (no offense to anyone, but you gotta admit, a lot of people just don't care about extensive testing, nothing wrong with that, I'm just saying I do test things extensively!) and by all scientific conclusion, I can't pinpoint one single other problem it might be. There's no other way to describe the effect I've gotten across a SPAN of devices other than "harsh" and "burns instantly." - it's not bone dry wicks either. It's as though the juice is literally "frying" to quickly, even at low temperature vapes. Could this really be the mystery??? Could the way my battery fires simply be "different" from the way the stores mod does? I personally ALWAYS notice a taste difference between silent vapes and loud vapes, and on my battery, well, it turns coils into fireworks!
I can't describe the store's devices as anything other that "way more solid" tasting than my vapes. At the store, it's as though electricity is running smoothly through the coil, heating everything up evenly, giving a great taste. On my devices, it tastes like a schizophrenic. The taste, temperature, and experience is like a bunch of bad and good things thrown together - I never get solid, tasty vapes. I finally did once with a 3.5ohm atomizer!!! It literally took a 3.5ohm atomizer to handle my battery!!!
Yet, general voltage tests show that the battery is working fine as any other - may be a pulse rate thingy, who knows. I just know, yes, this battery I use turns anything into a loud vape.
I guess the big question is: does a Twist battery have the same output as a Vmax? Cuz Phil say the vmax pretty much volts span average (or something) an entire volt over what it says it's doing, if I'm understanding him right. It may describe why 3.5ohm atties are the only ones that taste good on my battery.
Along to this experience, I often make the claim that at my local vaping shop, all of the cheapo CE4's taste fantastic, solid, and smooth, even at higher voltages, while I've tried the exact same CE4's they have, using the same exact techniques I did for their devices, and get a horrible vape.
Then I remembered - for their CE4 samples, they USE A HIGHER END MOD THAT MAY HAVE A BETTER PULSE RATE!!!!!!
Could this really be the problem all along? I feel like I sit down and study and test my devices better than %75 of the users here (no offense to anyone, but you gotta admit, a lot of people just don't care about extensive testing, nothing wrong with that, I'm just saying I do test things extensively!) and by all scientific conclusion, I can't pinpoint one single other problem it might be. There's no other way to describe the effect I've gotten across a SPAN of devices other than "harsh" and "burns instantly." - it's not bone dry wicks either. It's as though the juice is literally "frying" to quickly, even at low temperature vapes. Could this really be the mystery??? Could the way my battery fires simply be "different" from the way the stores mod does? I personally ALWAYS notice a taste difference between silent vapes and loud vapes, and on my battery, well, it turns coils into fireworks!
I can't describe the store's devices as anything other that "way more solid" tasting than my vapes. At the store, it's as though electricity is running smoothly through the coil, heating everything up evenly, giving a great taste. On my devices, it tastes like a schizophrenic. The taste, temperature, and experience is like a bunch of bad and good things thrown together - I never get solid, tasty vapes. I finally did once with a 3.5ohm atomizer!!! It literally took a 3.5ohm atomizer to handle my battery!!!
Yet, general voltage tests show that the battery is working fine as any other - may be a pulse rate thingy, who knows. I just know, yes, this battery I use turns anything into a loud vape.
I guess the big question is: does a Twist battery have the same output as a Vmax? Cuz Phil say the vmax pretty much volts span average (or something) an entire volt over what it says it's doing, if I'm understanding him right. It may describe why 3.5ohm atties are the only ones that taste good on my battery.
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REALLY??? The possibility of it being an issue with what might very well be a very cheep Chinese "spinner type" battery.
DO YOU EVER GO BACK AND READ ANYTHING YOU WRITE OR RESPONSES GIVEN TO YOUR INCESSIVE RAMBLINGS??
Just in case you don't I'll remind you that aside from your contentless review I posed the question as to what type of "spinner type" battery you were using because Pulse Width can have a great effect on vapor production. But you never responded, you have gone on for 100+ more posts expounding your superior intellect in one while asking basic questions on another then jumping to another thread offering up advise like you know "all there is to know".
Here, just so you don't have to go offering up $100 bets while you ramble on some more about how you don't like being the smartest person in the room and challenging people to find where you said something or something was said to you -
See there, waaay back on November 24th I asked about your "spinner type" so that people on here who happen to know a "little about PWM" (that's the acronym for Pulse Width Modulation) might be able to help you figure out some of your problems.
Yes I'll admit my response in it's context in that thread was snippy, harsh and very pointed but I only responded to you in the same manner you responded to another post asking for more information.
So yes, in 7 words - Your battery is one of your problems....................................
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I remember that exact post and I really thought you were simply asking the brand of my battery to make sure it wasn't a cheap Chinese knockoff (something many people would just equate with "sucking" even if there's no logic behind it), which it actually isn't, it's Vision, from one of the most trusted vendors we have around here. Unless it's an perfect clone.
But the question is do these types of Spinner batteries (or clones) have this "harsher vape" problem like the Zmax, where the actual volts can be just crazy high in some odd way that seems to burn up coils? If they don't, it wouldn't matter if it was Chinese or Canadian, and if they do, then there I go, I asked about this topic like 3 days after joining up.
It'd also explain why all the coils I slap on my battery turn to micro-coils in literal seconds of firing, even when wet. I never thought that was a normal phenomenon. At all. I've heard of coils doing that like after a week of vaping. Not in a span of a minute.
(And I offered $100 to anyone who can show me a post where I was rude to someone who wasn't rude to me first. I don't tolerate rudeness nor do I approximate with it. I'm not rude to people and I don't expect to be treated that way. I'm an extremely respectful person and I never have a single negative, sarcastic attitude toward anyone who doesn't have one toward me, that's not who I am. We're all human and we all will say a thing or two that could be stretched or misunderstood. I don't go around attacking people's horrible grammar and I don't expect people to go around critisizing that I make unendorced, unimportant, ultimately forgettable forumn blog reviews on the interwebz.
Seriously, if anyone here sees me as someone who believes I'm high and mighty, try owning a website or two, get some balls, realize that it's OK to hold yourself to higher esteem than what you might actually be. Not that I'm doing that, because I really never claimed to be some genius or reviewer superstar, but I'm certainly not going to go around on this forum saying "Oh, stupid me, I must be filling my clearomizer through the air hole because I'm a newbie and I'm getting a burnt taste, save me one of you enlightened few." Lmfao I haven't been vaping for 4 years to act that way. I'm going to review crap and ask crap in a generally straight-forward, human-level, dignified fashion. Doesn't mean people have to accuse me of being high and mighty on myself. I'm simply smart enough to know better than to believe I'm stupid, and I'm smart enough to to know that somewhere down the line, something with my products is crappy. Been asking about that crap since day #1.)
-Questions I've asked on this forum:
1. Safest way to clean my Cisco atty (imo, probably one of the most complex actions across the span of the history of vaping, so don't blame me...)
2. Is my battery vaulty/ outputting voltages that a regular checker can't check?
I actually can't think of anything else. Can't think of anything else I don't actually "know" already, to a general extent, and for the purposes I vape to. For both those questions, I said before I asked them, "I'm pretty much am still an idiot on something, help me." Can't get any more selfless than that.
But the question is do these types of Spinner batteries (or clones) have this "harsher vape" problem like the Zmax, where the actual volts can be just crazy high in some odd way that seems to burn up coils? If they don't, it wouldn't matter if it was Chinese or Canadian, and if they do, then there I go, I asked about this topic like 3 days after joining up.
It'd also explain why all the coils I slap on my battery turn to micro-coils in literal seconds of firing, even when wet. I never thought that was a normal phenomenon. At all. I've heard of coils doing that like after a week of vaping. Not in a span of a minute.
(And I offered $100 to anyone who can show me a post where I was rude to someone who wasn't rude to me first. I don't tolerate rudeness nor do I approximate with it. I'm not rude to people and I don't expect to be treated that way. I'm an extremely respectful person and I never have a single negative, sarcastic attitude toward anyone who doesn't have one toward me, that's not who I am. We're all human and we all will say a thing or two that could be stretched or misunderstood. I don't go around attacking people's horrible grammar and I don't expect people to go around critisizing that I make unendorced, unimportant, ultimately forgettable forumn blog reviews on the interwebz.
Seriously, if anyone here sees me as someone who believes I'm high and mighty, try owning a website or two, get some balls, realize that it's OK to hold yourself to higher esteem than what you might actually be. Not that I'm doing that, because I really never claimed to be some genius or reviewer superstar, but I'm certainly not going to go around on this forum saying "Oh, stupid me, I must be filling my clearomizer through the air hole because I'm a newbie and I'm getting a burnt taste, save me one of you enlightened few." Lmfao I haven't been vaping for 4 years to act that way. I'm going to review crap and ask crap in a generally straight-forward, human-level, dignified fashion. Doesn't mean people have to accuse me of being high and mighty on myself. I'm simply smart enough to know better than to believe I'm stupid, and I'm smart enough to to know that somewhere down the line, something with my products is crappy. Been asking about that crap since day #1.)
-Questions I've asked on this forum:
1. Safest way to clean my Cisco atty (imo, probably one of the most complex actions across the span of the history of vaping, so don't blame me...)
2. Is my battery vaulty/ outputting voltages that a regular checker can't check?
I actually can't think of anything else. Can't think of anything else I don't actually "know" already, to a general extent, and for the purposes I vape to. For both those questions, I said before I asked them, "I'm pretty much am still an idiot on something, help me." Can't get any more selfless than that.
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I'm FAAAAR from an expert on this (but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express once) but a lower pulse width will have put high voltage to the coil for a longer period of time. Now in a perfect world with perfectly wrapped coils using perfect resistance wire there would be little difference. However, if the coil, wrap, wire isn't absolutely perfect a lower pulse width will exaggerate any hot spots making the vape harsh, burnt, terrible.
As an example, I have an RSST that I followed P Busardo's lead on my coil with it. It's an amazing vape but the other day while cleaning the deck and refilling it I bumped the coil which unknown to me at that moment caused a hot leg at the positive post (knocked the leg out of the capture washer/spring). I was running it on my 134 which is a VV/VW PWM mod. I fired it and damn near hit the floor it was so burnt and awful. I pulled the top, fired it again and couldn't see the problem so I switched it to a mechanical mod and fired it again. Sure enough, right where the leg was making half ... contact with the positive post it glowed bright red almost instantly. I recaptured the wire in the washer/spring, put it back on my 134 (VV/VW PWM Mod) and it was pure vaping bliss again.
So with the slow PWM of the 134 it was hitting it with a high enough voltage to burn the juice yet not long enough to show where the problem was. Switching it to an unregulated mod and holding the fire button showed the problem. Now since I don't have one of the VV/VW mods with a much higher PWM I can't say for sure if this would have presented itself the same but I'm inclined to believe it would have been a lot less harsh as the time the coil spent at 6.0 volts would have been a lot less to achieve the voltage need to produce the wattage I was shooting for.
A Vision is a great little VV/VW battery but it uses a slow PWM to achieve the lower voltages/wattages and as such anything attached to it that doesn't have perfect coils, wraps, wire etc. will have a better chance of presenting a problem with the flavor. My wife uses 2 Vision spinners while at work, she runs Kanger Mini PT2's on both but I have to rebuild the stock coils for her to prevent the burning throat hit.
And just an FYI, unless you know your supplier 110%, there are copy Vision batteries out there that can't be differentiated from the real ones. We were in town last night at our trusted B&M vape shop and they got an entire shipment of batteries that looked identical. However someone was having performance problems and not until they opened it up (breaking it) did they find that the internal parts were not the same. They're regular supplier had run out so they went to a secondary supplier in an attempt to keep inventory up only to find the second supplier wasn't sourcing from trustworthy suppliers.
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You have two questions that remain unanswered? yes you really CAN get more selfless than that.
And a final observation before I get a time-out and sent to the corner, why do you think as people progress in vaping they often switch to mechanical mods?? I have switched because the power delivered to the atomizer is pure, straight from the battery, no magic electron manipulation, just pure, clean electricity. Then I build my coils to achieve the results I look for whether it be flavor, cloud thickness, or throat hit (all different types, sizes of coils).
Goodnews aside, (just a happy coincidence) I did actually have a question about this... (and it surely has been addressed before)
Why do mods differ on this? I have a vv/vw3, and an MVP that have the flat signal, and a sigelei Zmax mini, and a Smok zmax that do not. JUST got a VTR (another innokin device, and higher priced than the other two, not to mention the zmax) and yet it still has the modulated signal? so it would seem that it's not just about cheap vs expensive? Also, I'm primarily a tanked carto user nowadays, and the rattlesnake "volume" seems to vary greatly from carto to carto. I have a 2.0 (2.2 per the ohms reader) smok on the zmax mini, and no rattlesnake that I can hear. Switched to a 2.0 (2.1) boge, and rattlesnake like crazy. It honestly doesnt bother me, and I notice no difference in flavor or vapor between the two, I'm just curious. I'm only at 4 months in my vaping journey, not 4 years, so there is a lot I actually don't know. ;-)
Why do mods differ on this? I have a vv/vw3, and an MVP that have the flat signal, and a sigelei Zmax mini, and a Smok zmax that do not. JUST got a VTR (another innokin device, and higher priced than the other two, not to mention the zmax) and yet it still has the modulated signal? so it would seem that it's not just about cheap vs expensive? Also, I'm primarily a tanked carto user nowadays, and the rattlesnake "volume" seems to vary greatly from carto to carto. I have a 2.0 (2.2 per the ohms reader) smok on the zmax mini, and no rattlesnake that I can hear. Switched to a 2.0 (2.1) boge, and rattlesnake like crazy. It honestly doesnt bother me, and I notice no difference in flavor or vapor between the two, I'm just curious. I'm only at 4 months in my vaping journey, not 4 years, so there is a lot I actually don't know. ;-)
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