Trolls and our emotional attachment to our decisions

[wonner]

Trolls are everywhere, and the net will never be rid of them....

THIS IS THE INTERNET! It's a hybrid between the Smithsonian and biker bar.

Go to any special interest forum and it is the same thing all over agin. It could be knives, cars, pens, tractors, or computers......

 

[Diogenes]

If you notice, the bulk of the trolls and argument inciters have a low post count.

Now before anyone gets upset about people pointing out post counts, I understand there are veterans here with less than a hundred posts, which is fine and dandy, and some have been vaping longer than they've been posting.

However, I've noticed a sharp increase in the amount of new posters, which in and of itself is a good thing, more people are vaping than smoking. But as ECF grows, it's going to collect miscreants, trolls, and all-around unpleasant people. Many are not familiar with the netiquette on this board, nor the rules. This forum is snowballing, and hopefully the mods will keep things under control.

But no, it's true, the number of troll threads on this forum is growing exponentially.

"What's worse is that everytime a "troll" post hits the boards, we all see it coming....like a train wreck....and yet not only do we have to look, we have to participate. I'm guilty of this as well."

We can look, but we most definitely do not have to participate. It seems you came to this conclusion at the end of your post.

I agree with the low post people starting more passionate or unpopular threads, but I can't agree that it's only low posters acting as trolls. I've seen people with over 1k and 2k counts acting the same, if not worse than the noobs. Christ, I've even been made fun of because I had a different opinion, and stood behind it when others stopped standing behind theirs.

Vaping in public seems to be one of the hot topics. Looking through the threads, they all pretty much end up the same way, two separate sides lobbing insults at each other. If we want threads like this to stop, we all must step up to the plate and do something. If not posting is the answer, then don't!!

 

[diggyb]

** cleaning up **

Not only is that completely tasteless - but it's a terrible analogy.

 

[bluecat]

Not only is that completely tasteless - but it's a terrible analogy.

Since my wife is a special ed teacher (we call it learning disabled) and my kids and I volunteer at all the Special Olympics in our area, his comment is way beyond that. Nothing like seeing a child's joy, who has a disablility or not, win. It is priceless.

Most reason we have troll's is because we can't settle this the old fashion way and our nanny state that gives people the perceived right to emotionally harass a person and when that person retaliates it is called assault.

Thus is born (especially on the internet) people like bern.

 

[MrStik]

The human race thrives on drama and conflict. It allows us to go on with our lives on a daily basis. Ever notice how reality shows are so popular and there is sooo much drama in those damn things?

 

[p.opus]

This will probably offend someone.....

Mission Accomplished....

 

[cramptholomew]

I liken this to computer geeks. You have Mac fanboys, Linux/Unix fanboys, and the OCCASIONAL Windows fanboy (God only knows why). I use a Mac Pro as my work computer, and a MacBook Air for my mobile. I like Macs. I think they're sturdy and dependable. After almost 20n years in IT, I don't want to have to fiddle with my daily driver all the time. With a Mac, I don't. That said, Both Windows and Linux are the best options for certain applications. In my years of experience: I choose Linux for any and all web services, but Microsoft Active Directory cannot be beat as an organizational platform. Almost everything can authenticate against Active Directory, and it's super easy to maintain (I know this for a fact, because I've had to deal with an OpenLDAP platform for several years, and it just flat-out sucks). I use Citrix XenServer for my VMs, because of the price/options factor. So, I guess what I'm saying is that EVERYTHING has it uses, and everything has its pros/cons. Use what works best for how you want to vape - whether ease of use is what you're after, performance and clouds, size and aesthetics, expense, or whatever other reason you may have.

 

[CommaHolly]

my problem is that I have a tough time telling in just one OP, if someone is a troll or not,,,,,,,

after a few posts, it's pretty easy to dig out,,,,,,,,

but the opening post? not always,,,,,,,,

 

[CommaHolly]

deleted.

ten char.

 

[Diogenes]

I liken this to computer geeks. You have Mac fanboys, Linux/Unix fanboys, and the OCCASIONAL Windows fanboy (God only knows why). I use a Mac Pro as my work computer, and a MacBook Air for my mobile. I like Macs. I think they're sturdy and dependable. After almost 20n years in IT, I don't want to have to fiddle with my daily driver all the time. With a Mac, I don't. That said, Both Windows and Linux are the best options for certain applications. In my years of experience: I choose Linux for any and all web services, but Microsoft Active Directory cannot be beat as an organizational platform. Almost everything can authenticate against Active Directory, and it's super easy to maintain (I know this for a fact, because I've had to deal with an OpenLDAP platform for several years, and it just flat-out sucks). I use Citrix XenServer for my VMs, because of the price/options factor. So, I guess what I'm saying is that EVERYTHING has it uses, and everything has its pros/cons. Use what works best for how you want to vape - whether ease of use is what you're after, performance and clouds, size and aesthetics, expense, or whatever other reason you may have.

Mac, Linux, and Windows stink. BeOS is where it's at!!!!

 

[CommaHolly]

This was written by my dear friend and fellow admin on a ball python related forum that we co-own. Seems appropriate for this thread! Posted with permission.

The Care and Feeding of Trolls

The first step in caring for trolls is to make sure they have been properly identified. There are many forum species that might LOOK like trolls at first glance, but are actually quite different. Let's take a look at some of these similar species first:

Grammar Butcher -- These folks don't spell well, have no sense of sentence structure, and rarely make use of punctuation. Sometimes this is due to genuine deficiencies in education and should not imply that their motives are bad...just that they had a bad start in life. Sometimes it's due to pure laziness, but even lazy people can be warmhearted and kind.

The Child -- Not always easy to identify when all one has to go by is text on a screen. Some children may be mistaken as Grammar Butchers because their education simply hasn't progressed far enough yet. But some children can spell and write just fine. Their emotional responses will often come across as immature, confrontational, or even hostile. This is almost always due to nothing more sinister than a lack of life-experience in which they learn how best to get along with others. The child may sometimes be difficult to deal with, but they are usually sincere in their desire to be an accepted member of the group.

Anti-Diplomat -- These guys will speak without thinking. They feel it is of the utmost importance that their opinion be expressed (often loudly) no matter what anyone else thinks about it, or how it might make anyone else feel. Some anti-diplomats have a gentle heart, but they simply lack the skills to express themselves in a productive manner. They have little sense of tact or decent timing. They frequently come across as confrontational and sometimes downright mean. But at the same time, they are exactly who they say they are. They may not be nice to deal with, but their intentions and reasons for being involved are just what they say.

The Foreigner -- Often mistaken for a Grammar Butcher because they are trying to communicate in a language that they did not grow up with. Also, different cultures have different customs for expressing things like respect and gratitude, so such niceties are often lost in translation. But no matter where someone is from, or what language they were born to, their motivations are just as likely to be as warm and sincere as anyone else's.

Drama Royalty -- Emotional. That is the key word to describe this group. Sometimes referred to as "drama queens" but that is a misnomer, because there are just as many males as females of this species. They take everything personally. Disagreements are usually seen as personal attacks. Frequently, they have a compulsive need to share every event of their life that causes an emotional ripple. They do best with lots of patience and a deft hand at diplomacy, but are harmless to the community.

Antagonist -- This species is the bane of the drama royalty. Sometimes they ally with the anti-diplomat, but are just as likely to poke sticks at them as well. They simply enjoy watching other people squirm and are greatly entertained at the effects of gasoline on fire. This is an unpleasant species to have in the community, but they are also just as likely to be valuable contributors. The smart ones establish their credentials before they begin their antagonistic games. The less than smart ones are often mistaken for trolls when they first show themselves.

Txt Typer -- Too lazy to type out full words that they are perfectly capable of spelling, this one is just plain annoying to most who like to read in complete sentences. They show a general lack of respect for the community they are participating in, but at least they are usually honest about who they are and what their intentions are.

The Needy -- This species needs their hand held over every little detail. They disdain search engines and scoff at reading anything that isn't typed out for them specifically. They often need multiple answers to the same question...just to make sure they got it. They will ask a new question or even start a new thread for each step of whatever process they are trying to grasp. While they may try the patience of those helping them, they are at least sincere in their need for help.

These are just a few examples of species that are MISTAKEN for Trolls. And when any of them are put into the same environment most reserve for trolls, the results can be disastrous. Now, let's take a look at what a real troll is:

THE TROLL -- The Troll may or may not exhibit any combination of the traits listed above. One must take the time to identify the KEY characteristics of a Troll over and above the surface features. Trolls are rarely ever who they say they are. Trolls have the sole purpose of disrupting the community. They don't want to learn anything or fix anything or be nice to anyone. They may start their own thread topic, but are far more likely to try and disrupt other threads. A troll will go after the weaker members (drama royalty, anti-diplomats, antagonists, the child) with a gusto, but they will also sling their barbs at any target that presents itself, including community leaders. It's rare that a genuine Troll can participate very long before giving in to the need to gloat and flash their true face at the community.

So what should a community do when they finally identify a Troll within their midst? The answer is not an intuitive one and instinctive reactions to Trolls lead to a great many mistakes that cause more harm than the Troll could have inflicted on its own.

Common Mistakes in Handling Trolls:

1. The MOST COMMON mistake is to call a Troll a troll. While doing so may make the "hunter" feel smart, all it does is make the troll giggle. And if the hunter has misidentified the troll, they can cause serious damage to both their target and to the site's own reputation for friendliness and acceptance.

2. Arguing with a Troll. This is exactly what the troll wants you to do. The more you argue, the harder they laugh. They don't care one whit about how logical or how smart their target is. They got an argument, and they will go to town playing with it.

3. Turning on allies. This is a Troll's greatest goal. A truly supreme example of this nasty species can get a community to turn in on itself and start taking its own members out. When there is blood in the water, and tempers are raging hot, it is critical that members be both able and willing to back out and take a long, hard look at who is truly the enemy.

How to Properly Feed a Troll

Trolls will wander into any community from time to time. The larger and more diverse the community, the more likely they are to appear...AND the harder they are to properly identify. Once they appear, they must be dealt with in such a way that both protects the community at large and mitigates the damages the Troll can cause before it moves on.

1. Number One Rule - BE NICE! Kill it with kindness. If all the members are kind and patient with the Troll, then it receives no nourishment and gains no foothold with which to establish itself. It may scramble a little harder after being hit with a round of sheer niceness, but eventually, it will feel starved for real entertainment and move on to riper fields. This action also has a critical added benefit of making sure the similar but innocent species get the help and acceptance they need and builds the overall good reputation of the community.

2. Ignore them. This can be very difficult, but for some, it's the only alternative to the impossible task of being nice. If the trolls are ignored, that will also contribute to a quick sensation of starvation that will have them quickly moving on. And, at the very least, if one isn't poking sticks at the trolls, then one isn't at risk of accidentally poking an innocent with the same stick.

3. PRIVATELY alert the Community Leaders. If one suspects a Troll, the best way to express that is in private to any of the community leaders. They have tools at their disposal that the rest of the community does not have. They can, and will, use these tools to both identify, and root out if necessary, any genuine trolls.

FEED THE TROLLS!!! Feed them kindness, patience, and compassion. They can't stomach it and will quickly move on to other hunting grounds. Any other food source, even the war-cry of "Do Not Feed the Trolls" is not only pure enjoyment for them, it is, in the long run, harmful to the very community it wishes to protect.

damm that was good!

 

[Robino1]

Dusty missed one.....post #29 has the quote. Holly, can you delete the quote? It (the quote) really is in bad taste and shouldn't continue to get attention.

 

[diggyb]

Uhm - I thought the post was classless, but was it worthy of deleting and editing other people's posts? Which forum rule did it break?

 

[Robino1]

Uhm - I thought the post was classless, but was it worthy of deleting and editing other people's posts? Which forum rule did it break?

Offensive posts are deleted. When the only person that thought it wasn't offensive was the person originally posting the post, I think deleting it is in better taste than it continually offending more people as they come along and read the thread. Do you really want to see more people quoting it and have this thread go from talking about trolls to what that post said?

 

[CommaHolly]

woops, sure thing, I'll delete it!

 

[diggyb]

Offensive posts are deleted. When the only person that thought it wasn't offensive was the person originally posting the post, I think deleting it is in better taste than it continually offending more people as they come along and read the thread. Do you really want to see more people quoting it and have this thread go from talking about trolls to what that post said?

It was a fitting post for the conversation, I think. Very meta.

"Offensive" is a very general and subjective word. I guess I would prefer to believe that I am in the company of adults that can look or read past things that they find objectionable without having to censor it.

Mostly, I take offense to my posts being edited...and not understanding where the line is, so I can avoid that.

 

[Robino1]

woops, sure thing, I'll delete it!

I PM'd Dusty also! Thanks sweetie!

 

[Dusty_D]

It was a fitting post for the conversation, I think. Very meta.

"Offensive" is a very general and subjective word. I guess I would prefer to believe that I am in the company of adults that can look or read past things that they find objectionable without having to censor it.

Mostly, I take offense to my posts being edited...and not understanding where the line is, so I can avoid that.

What you need to understand is that while some people may find certain topics acceptable, others may not. As an adult you should also be accepting of that fact and not have any objections to censorship..

Back to the topic at hand.

 

[Robino1]

It was a fitting post for the conversation, I think. Very meta.

"Offensive" is a very general and subjective word. I guess I would prefer to believe that I am in the company of adults that can look or read past things that they find objectionable without having to censor it.

Mostly, I take offense to my posts being edited...and not understanding where the line is, so I can avoid that.

There are some things that just don't go over well. When we know someone or have kids that are learning/disabled/autistic/etc....yes, we are sensitive to how our loved ones are perceived by the public. Walk a few steps in those shoes. How you are treated will become very apparent in a very short time.

 

[LDS714]

This is all kid stuff compared to some of the Harley/anti-Harley and Ducati/anti-Ducati threads on the motorcycle boards.