That is probably my fault. I wasn't too clear about it not actually passing. I panicked myself at first so I should have been a little more clear. Sorry!
UPDATE: US Senate Panel Approves FDA Tobacco-Regulation Measure
- Thread starter Smokin'Sandy
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TB, you are correct that this bill does not directly apply to the e-cig as the FDA has designated it a 'drug' product. But, if SE and NJoy's injunction and subsequent lawsuit prevails, designating the e-cig as a tobacco product and outside the jurisdiction of the FDA, the passage of this bill just puts it right back into the jurisdiction of the FDA. It is absolutely within out best interests to see that this bill fails.
And don't get me wrong. Even if I weren't a staunch supporter of vapor's rights, I still would be against this bill, because of two really big reasons. Tobacco regulation by the FDA makes absolutely no sense at all (considering the reason behind why the FDA was established), and most of the main provisions of the bill (keep cigarettes out of the hands of minors, stop smoking campaigns, etc..) are already in place with other legislation.
Ivisi
Yep, if it gets out of the senate... we are screwed
This bill has died many times on that floor, I will remain hopeful.
No Sandy, you did fine! I just don't understand too much about politics. This is the biggest reason I don't vote, nor am I registered to vote. No, I'm not communist, I just don't believe that people that don't understand the process or watch all the debates to keep informed should vote. Otherwise, that's like asking a kindergatener (I know I spelled that wrong huh?) about fixing a car, it doesn't make any sense.
I also agree that if the FDA gets control of the tobacco industry, in turn they will gladly say that an e-cig qualifies as a tobacco product and they will get rid of it IMMEDIATELY.
Also, it is a joke for the FDA to get control of an industry that kills. For the reasons the FDA was formed, they would be obligated by morals alone to completely ban the products! Once and for all. Which we know will never happen, there is too much money to be made. But if a drug was killing people left and right, the FDA may piddle-poop around on it making a decision, but they will eventually get rid of it. Tobacco has been around since the beginning of man...it won't disappear over night, it's impossible to make it disappear all together. But by moral obligation, wouldn't the FDA have a responsibility towards consumers and other people that back the FDA to just stomp on tobacco immediately? I guess what I'm saying is, it's just a joke...it will make a mockery of the FDA...nobody will trust them anymore, with their name all over tobacco and everything...uh-uh...I don't believe that will fly for long!
Once again, I'm saying that it would be wrong to ban tobacco after so long, I'm saying I don't wish for it to be banned, but just under the principles in which the FDA was formed, it would seem obligitory for them to discontinue products...all of them. Which is wrong, hence why they shouldn't be given control over tobacco industries.
Once again vapes, I agree with you.
One thing I did read though is that the FDA's name won't be on any packaging of the tobacco products. From what I read is that they don't want people to think they are endorsing the products.
This is why more of us need to get involved IMO. They know it's wrong just by stating they want to keep it from people. You can no longer say you aren't informed.
(Not that I am. I really wasn't until this last election!) They do so much that no one person could ever stay informed of all it and what it all means. And, they milk that.
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I do understand, Ivisi. I've read the bill, and watched the hearings. It's a tobacco bill. As for SE, IMO it has a chance only on technicalities of notification. Its "this is a tobacco product" argument is laughable and will be dismissed. Again, IMO. I cannot take that as a serious argument, the FDA doesn't, and I doubt even Judge Judy would. Njoy's involvement is evidence only of desperation.
And, yes, the bill does affect us indirectly as a new technology for nicotine delivery. I was intensively interested in this for personal reasons of using snus and dissolvables, but saw an accurate measure of how hated tobacco is and the future is full of "not one more generation hooked on tobacco" rhetoric. I heard it in those hearings.
Some have been grabbing at any false hope for a long time, so I guess we can cling to the notion that the full Senate will come to its senses and vote down the bill. To me, things must be viewed realistically, however. Project today's trend lines. What you will see is further regulation of tobacco and nicotine, restricted and ultimately limited availability of tobacco and nicotine, and a rejection of all new methods -- reduced harm or not -- of nicotine delivery.
That's why I'm depressed after viewing the hearings.
But at least the uncertainties disappear like fading smoke day by day.
And, yes, the bill does affect us indirectly as a new technology for nicotine delivery. I was intensively interested in this for personal reasons of using snus and dissolvables, but saw an accurate measure of how hated tobacco is and the future is full of "not one more generation hooked on tobacco" rhetoric. I heard it in those hearings.
Some have been grabbing at any false hope for a long time, so I guess we can cling to the notion that the full Senate will come to its senses and vote down the bill. To me, things must be viewed realistically, however. Project today's trend lines. What you will see is further regulation of tobacco and nicotine, restricted and ultimately limited availability of tobacco and nicotine, and a rejection of all new methods -- reduced harm or not -- of nicotine delivery.
That's why I'm depressed after viewing the hearings.
But at least the uncertainties disappear like fading smoke day by day.
Ok, so do you think it is correct to say that they are really hiding this bill a bit. I noticed in the post that started this thread, the link doesn't say everything about the bill. It just states that ads will be forced to be changed, etc. They don't say anything about changing the makeup of a cig, they don't mention banning certain nicotine products (the things they spoke of in their meetings on tuesday and wednesday), and they didn't mention getting rid of flavors (as they mentioned in the meetings). It's almost like they are putting blinders on the citizens...making them think this is a totally good thing, only marketing will be affected. They don't state how it will effect the economy and how it might get rid of some of smoker's favorite products...and in the end, maybe our e-cigs.
Then again, that is usually how they do things, with as little real knowledge as possible. I'msure you have all noticed, you ever happen upon a site that says, vote for this and this is why...or a commercial says vote against this for this reason...they never mention all the possible consequences of a bill. They don't give full info. Bills always have bad and good, but they always hide the bad...so nobody really has a chance for an informed decision. It kinda makes me queasy thinking about it.
Then again, that is usually how they do things, with as little real knowledge as possible. I'msure you have all noticed, you ever happen upon a site that says, vote for this and this is why...or a commercial says vote against this for this reason...they never mention all the possible consequences of a bill. They don't give full info. Bills always have bad and good, but they always hide the bad...so nobody really has a chance for an informed decision. It kinda makes me queasy thinking about it.
I don't really see how the FDA can ban e-cigs.
The suppliers will just have to call it a personal vaporizer just like the thousands of common vaporizers most used for for pot are sold legally.
Top Rated Vaporizers @ GotVape.com
Since they an be used with other substances it's not an FDA regulated item. I believe you can vape loose tobacco in any of these as well.
Now the juice on the other hand, will eventually be controlled as either a tobacco product or a drug. Either way the government is going to regulate it or at minimum tax the heck out of it. It's going to happen so all we can do is try to get it under one classification or the other.
If the nicotine is derived from a tobacco plant, and not synthetically produced it should fall under tobacco product.
The suppliers will just have to call it a personal vaporizer just like the thousands of common vaporizers most used for for pot are sold legally.
Top Rated Vaporizers @ GotVape.com
Since they an be used with other substances it's not an FDA regulated item. I believe you can vape loose tobacco in any of these as well.
Now the juice on the other hand, will eventually be controlled as either a tobacco product or a drug. Either way the government is going to regulate it or at minimum tax the heck out of it. It's going to happen so all we can do is try to get it under one classification or the other.
If the nicotine is derived from a tobacco plant, and not synthetically produced it should fall under tobacco product.
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Totally agreed! The device may fluctuate in availability...but they can never take it away. I stand by the fact that we can all just convince the suppliers to change the intended use. It could be a fireworks lighter, or it could be a cigarette lighter, or it could be an air leak detector, or a handheld fog machine, or a "single-bean cooktop" (that one was just a joke of course). The product will be available. But it might come down to us brewing our own juices...which could lead to people getting hurt, not paying attention to nicotine content...which could lead to more negative press. But e-cigs will live on. I trust that.
Can you imagine DEA storming a house for having a bottle of nicotine liquid? OMG, what will this world come to? If it comes to that, I am moving into the mountains, going off grid, and shutting myself off from the world the rest of the way...there are more important things that Americans should be worrying about, drugs, drunk driving, etc.
Oh, and don't get me started on "turning the tobacco industry over to an organization that kills people every day"
random ROFLMAO
Because they know we as Americans don't pay attention and can't be bothered with the details, most of us don't even vote.
If it finishes up and passes through the complete senate, I believe they said it could happen as early as June...but I could be mistaken. Maybe they meant it could complete passing by June.
Very true, they know if they say to vote for something, we won't question the wording or the other information in the bill...we will do it...because we were told to. See, it's that whole mindset that we have...no wonder we get pushed around and are losing our freedom to do things like smoke a peach cigar...because we don't care and we trust the government to babysit us! OMG
Disclaimer:I am not against the government in any way, I just think that we need to become more educated and become more involved...I know I should at least. This is really the first think I've ever truly followed for more than an hour, lol.
Sandy: That's an old bill's wording, with old dates. There's a link somewhere to the complete new bill, with new dates. About the best we can hope for in the Senate is that the cufoff date is advanced to the day this legislation becomes law. That's would be a big help for new harm reduction products.
OMG...*slaps self on the head* Thanks Bob, I'm taking it off.
Oh, could you also explain what you mean by the cutoff date being advanced? My brain is AWOL.
It's like these elected bums are begging for us to resort to building ecigs at home and pulling the nicotine out of tomato plants.
All out of desperation to keep themselves well funded with tobacco taxes -which ecigs are a threat toward.
Plainly put, the government would rather us all die so long as their precious tax money keeps rolling into their pockets.
All out of desperation to keep themselves well funded with tobacco taxes -which ecigs are a threat toward.
Plainly put, the government would rather us all die so long as their precious tax money keeps rolling into their pockets.
Nevermind...I was being a dork again.
You are not being a dork. You are trying to understand what others are trying to force on you and that's a good thing! You would be a dork if you just sat back and acted all complacent about what someone else is trying to enforce upon you.
This whole thing is not cut and dry and very confusing. There are so many different players involved and the way Congressional rules are laid out, holy lord! One thing is for sure, we are all getting a real lesson in how bills go through Congress. It is a history lesson we will surely never forget.
And TB -
Thanks Lacey. I needed that. Also, I just got word from my daughter's 4th grade teacher that she (my daughter) just won Best in Show for her art piece in the state fair junior art exhibit! I'm sooo happy even though I won't get to see it until next September.
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